Transcripts For WRC Dateline NBC 20160521

He said i grabbed her like this. An old case blown wide open. I said, we cant let this go. Two women teaming up for the truth. If they think im going to walk away, theyre mistaken. Uncovering an astonishing twist. Attacheds with a photograph of heidi allen. It had a code name, Julia Roberts. A teenager with a secret identity. Did she also have a secret enemy . Theyre going to want to shut her up, permanently. Im lester holt. And this is dateline. Heres Dennis Murphy with the informant. Reporter tonya priest never wanted to be a star witness, least of all in a longago abduction and murder investigation. But after that guy blurted out what he did, she felt she had to come paurd. Would you live with it . Could you live with all of that . Reporter and she found herself on the phone talking to a District Attorney in upstate new york. Reporter tonya believed she knew whod done it. Whod done that terrible thing at the Convenience Store on an Easter Sunday morning many years ago. That store clerk abducted and never seen again. And it probably only took maybe 60 seconds to do what they needed to do. Reporter what tonya reopened was a wound that had never really healed in Oswego County, new york. I cant let it go, and i wont let it go. I will die trying and fighting for her. If they think im going to walk away, they are mistaken. I am not. Reporter even today just say the name heidi allen, and a swirl of memories come back. Some of them fuzzy now. It was 1994, that missing girl. The van, was it blue, was it white . And didnt they get the guy who did it and send him away . Tonya was a teenager back then. Did yoll school . I knew about that they were looking for a van. Thats basically all i knew at that point. Reporter heres whats not in dispute about that snowy Easter Sunday morning. 18yearold heidi allen, taking the early shift for a coworker, opened the Convenience Store about 5 45 a. M. It was a parttime job for her, a way to defray some of her Freshman College bills. Lisa buske is heidis sister. She was sassy and energetic and a risktaker. Reporter she liked school . Oh, she liked school because she was smart. She didnt have to study. She was one of those. Reporter one of those kids, huh . She was one of those. Reporter so what was the job at the Convenience Store . It was close to home, and our friends owned it. You know, so mom and dad felt safe. Reporter before the earlybirds started showed up for their newspapers, ciggies, maybe a few gallons of gas at the pumps, heidis boyfriend was there with her to help get things up and running for the day. He would take her so that she know, like, the traffic was picking up. And then he would go. Reporter and thats what happened that day. Right. Reporter Richard Thibodeau, a regular, lived a few miles down the road and saw heidi that morning. I asked her for two packs of basic cigarettes, paid her. I said, have a nice day. Reporter a few more cars pulled up to the d w. Reporter john obrien of syracuse. Com. Some customers had come in and didnt realize she wasnt there until theyd been there for a while. They flagged down a deputy and no heidi. Reporter heidis sister lisa woke up that morning to very bad news. And my aunt was on the machine. And she said, lisa, heidis missing. Reporter missing . We saw her the night before when she delivered our easter baskets and in her usual goofiness. It was shocking that an 18yearold girl could just disappear like that on easter morning. Reporter the Convenience Store was strung with crime scene tape by the time heidis sister arrived. I just really felt like i was just watching a movie. Reporter inside the store, not promising. They had found heidis purse. Her car keys. Money undisturbed in the register. No signs of a struggle. And her car was parked in the lot. I just remember sitting and just watching. I didnt know what to do. Reporter the community made a find heidi volunteer command center at the Old Firehouse while the authorities readied their first news alert. We have an 18yearold girl named heidi allen who lives here in new haven who was the clerk. Reporter someone listening to that bulletin was Richard Thibodeau, who, of course, recognized heidi from the Convenience Store where hed shopped earlier. He turned to his girlfriend teresa and said as much. And richard said, well, my god, he said, i was there. I bought two packs of cigarettes. So he picked up the phone, he called. Reporter called the sheriffs, and set in motion a sequence of lifechanging events he could not stop. Other callers that morning offered tips about a suspicious van at the store. Reuel todd, now the sheriff, was undersheriff at the time. They noticed somebody driving very erratically wrestling or struggling with somebody in a van. Reporter this van, sheriff, did you get a make, model, color . Anything useful . Different color, white, light blue, that type of stuff. Reporter but in those early hours, in the days before smartphones and ubiquitous security cameras, nothing was coming together. Volunteers searched. The National Guard was called out, but heidi was gone and stayed gone. We followed up on every lead. We had no major people. Reporter weeks went by without an arrest, without answers. And then a couple of months passed. They had brought in a criminal profiler with the fbis behavioral science unit, someone who would later correctly profile the Oklahoma City bomber. But in this instance, Clint Van Zandt was the agent in the unit who got assigned to the heidi allen case in upstate new york. His take look for someone with a history of violence and someone obsessed with the case. The person who committed this is somebody who was really interested. I mean, the community was interested in the case, but this is more interest. Reporter obsessed. Could not let it go. This is somebody wholl be saving newspaper articles. Reporter and there would be many newspaper articles, decades of them, in fact. The case of heidi allen was just getting started. When we come back, clues to the mystery. Who would grab an 18yearold girl . Our theory then was probably a sex crime. And then, unbelievably, the killer seems to out himself. He says, yeah, i killed this girl. He gives it up. He gives it up. For three generations. Mm. Heaven. Real ingredients. From a real place. Thats how were working to bring out the best. And now, try new hellmanns organic for an irresistibly creamy taste. Late friday and early saturday. And take 50 to 60 off swimwear for the family. 40 to 60 off sandals for the family. And 50 to 55 off sonoma decor and outdoor furniture. Everyone gets kohls cash too kohls. Lergies with nasal congestion . Find fast relief behind the counter with claritind. [ upbeat music ] strut past that aisle for the allergy relief that starts working in as little as 30 minutes and contains the best oral decongestant. Live claritin clear, with claritind. Wait, you shot that . She calls it, onions. Its beautiful. Put this on our homepage now. Can i have three tickets for onions please . This was like seeing the onion on a molecular level. This is talent. Why are we not representing it . tan bonitas 4k on an iphone, wake up people and the winner is. Onions. [cheering] heidi, the teenager behind the Convenience Store counter selling sunday papers and cigarettes had vanished that easter morning. Sheriff reuel todd. Who what was your working theory . Whod grab an 18yearold girl . Our theory then was probably a sex crime. Reporter abducted, and after weeks of fruitless searching, presumed murdered. Shes the 18yearold girl that had her life taken from her. She was a good kid with goals. Reporter but the Sheriffs Department was pursuing a promising lead. And it concerned a guy who had bought cigarettes in hide they did the cops on the phone start to ask you questions . They sent someone over to the house and asked me a bunch of questions. Reporter investigators, it turned out, were suspicious of him from the getgo. Theyd even put him under surveillance. The reason . Thibodeaus was the last transaction recorded on the register that morning and Richard Thibodeau also drove a white van, one that seemed to match a vehicle described by a witness at the scene. At first it was blue. It changed to white as time went on. But he did say in the end that van, the thibodeau van, that was the van. Reporter the witness reported seeing more than one man, so investigators also brought in richards brother, gary, for questioning. The brother said he was home asleep that morning and his girlfriend vouched for him. But Gary Thibodeau didnt have a spotless record. He had an outstanding warrant on a minor drug charge in neighboring massachusetts. They extradited him to massachusetts, which was an odd thing on a drug charge. Reporter in the county jail, thibodeau struck up a conversation with a fellow prisoner. Him and gary are sitting in there shooting the breeze, and they get talking about Something Like all of them do. He says, yeah, i killed this girl from oswego. Reporter he gives it up, though . He gives it up. Reporter brother gary eventually is said to have told two prisoners about his involvement in the crime. That he and heidi used drugs together and that she feared gary was going to screw her over in a drug deal. And with that jailhouse confession, investigators now believed they had their case. The two brothers, drugs, an abduction and murder. I was waiting for my school bus to come. Reporter this is Richard Thibodeaus stepdaughter, amanda. She was just 11 at the time. And police cars came pulling into my driveway. I dont know how many, but they just came shooting right in and stopped quickly. Reporter both brothers were arrested and charged with kidnapping in the first degree. A major break in the heidi allen case. Reporter whats the motive, sheriff . Them in their van and being at the Convenience Store . Do you know what motive is . Opportunity. They stopped in there to get the cigarettes, and that was the opportunity. Reporter its about abduct this young, cute girl, huh . Appears to me. Reporter there would be two separate trials for the brothers. Two separate juries to decide their fates. And in the summer of 1995, the first of the two, gary, went on trial. Joe fahey, now a retired judge, was garys defense attorney. He says the case was forensically and circumstantially light. There was no indication that gary had ever been near the d w that morning. Reporter gary testified that he was home asleep that morning. And the jailhouse snitches who got him indicted were flatout lying. He figured they must have been angling for favors from the prosecution. The only thing they really had to contend with were the two guys from massachusetts. They said gary kind of boasted about they were looking for me, but theyll never find her. Reporter but they were statements a jury apparently believed. It took just four hours to render a verdict. How do you find the defendant on count one kidnapping in the first degree . Guilty. Reporter brother richard, owner of the van, the one who bought the cigarettes and placed himself at the store, went on trial a few weeks later. His stepdaughter, amanda, was certain hed be found guilty as well. It didnt make sense for them not to find him guilty because they found uncle gary guilty. And theyre saying that uncle gary did it with him. Reporter richard was, without a doubt, heidis last customer. And witnesses testified theyd seen a van like his at the scene. Richards van, however, showed no trace of blood or anything connected to heidi. This time the jury deliberated eight hours. And we find him not guilty. Reporter two trials, two so heres the strange thing about the two brothers, it seems, sheriff. Youve got richard, whos acquitted. And yet, he is the one that says, yeah, i was in the shop. And his brother, who doesnt put but dont they have to be in cahoots together for this to make sense . I would say so, but it still doesnt matter. And thats what happens with different juries. Reporter do you believe good arrest, good conviction . Absolutely. Reporter heidis family wasnt quite sure what to make of the two trials. Heidis first cousin is missy searles. It was confusing to have basically the same evidence just different jury and then you end up with two different verdicts. Reporter and there was something that always bothered cousin missy about the trial. The jailhouse informants testified that it was a drug deal gone bad. Didnt make sense. She wasnt a drug user herself. She didnt participate in that. Reporter Clint Van Zandt, the fbi profiler, was also left scratching his head. His profile predicted the person responsible would be an obsessive stalker type. Did you think you maybe missed something in your evaluation . He missed. You know, was it something that i didnt know about, that i didnt have a handle on . Reporter the years went by. A fading sign at the center of town was the lingering reminder that once thered been a girl named heidi allen whose life was taken from her. Heidi allen has been huge in everyones mind for years. I mean, because shes never been found. Reporter and there was a lingering feeling in the town among some people that just maybe there was more to the story. I didnt know what to do. It broke my heart. It destroyed me. Coming up a chance encounter and the shock of a lifetime. He said to us, you really want to know what happened to her . Are we about to learn heidis fate. Haddy said i grabbed her like this. Eaddy said i grabbed her like this. Ddy said i grabbed hee this. Y said i grabbed her like this. Y said i grabbed her like this. 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And installed a wood fired grill to make you a steak seared to smoky oak perfection . Only at applebees. Whatcha gonna do when you get outta here . Im gonna have some fun what do you consider fun . Fun, natural fun yeah, we rocking right now. Theres a party over here. Hey, im in heaven. Heres how t feels to have americas fastest lte network. Heres how it feels to get fifty percent off most so, imagine how it feels to switch to sprint and buy an iphone 6s and get another one free when you add a second line. Plus, try us out for 30 days. If youre not satisfied, well refund your money. It was an odd conclusion to the heidi allen case. One brother convicted. The other brother, the one who admitted to being at the store, acquitted. And even though Richard Thibodeau was found not guilty, in some peoples minds hed simply had a lucky day in court. Stepdaughter amanda. Growing up, we were known as the kidnappers kids. We were known as the murderers kids. We werent treated nicely. Reporter for the allen family, it was an unsatisfying result. They still didnt know what had happened to heidi. And her body had never been found. Shes out there somewhere and somebody knows. Thats right. And someday were going to know. You cant give up hope on your missing loved one. Reporter even after the dust settled, the case stayed in the news for years to come. Some young people like tonya priest never really forgot. Nothing like that had ever happened in our area before. So yeah, it stood out. Reporter a fde rolled by. Tonya was now in her mid20s. One day while visiting a friend named vicki, the tv was on. Up popped a story about the heidi allen case, an anniversary report. When the news flashed about heidi, i said to her, i wonder what happened to heidi. And she said, yeah, me too. Reporter it wasnt really a question, just an outloud thought. But someone in the room decided to answer. It was the friends boyfriend, a guy nicknamed thumper. He said to us, do you really want to know what happened to her . We were, like, okay, yeah. Reporter and this next version of that easter morning is one that needs close attention. Because it didnt involve the thibodeau brothers at all, but put thumper himself and two young buddies at the epicenter of heidis abduction. He said that they pulled in right up by the doors with the vehicle running. They left the back doors open. And he said, i grabbed her like this. He said, we dragged her out of the store. And then he laughed. Van, we hit that van hard with her. Reporter could he be serious . I mean, is this a guy just flexing his biceps for the girls . No. The more we didnt believe him, the angrier he became. I said, okay, well, how did the white van get involved . He said, we just got lucky. One showed up before we did. I said, thumper, there is an innocent man in prison. He said, not my problem. Reporter so did she run to the police then and there . Scream out to anyone who would listen . It wasnt that simple. Tonya, why didnt you go to the Sheriffs Office at that point, say, i got a story to tell you . Well, he lived a mile down the road from my house. Reporter tonya says she was paralyzed by fear of thumper. I went home and cried. I didnt know what to do. Reporter but she never forgot about that chilling conversation. She tried to cut off contact with her friend vicki and the boyfriend, and eventually tonya moved out of state. She was an 18yearold girl. It broke my heart. Reporter the turning point came in 2010, three years later. Thats when tonya learned some sickening news. In a domestic dispute, thumper had shot and killed her former friend. Did you then think he was capable of having done that think to heidi . Oh, of course. Reporter a domestic. Of course. Reporter thumper, real name james steen, was convicted and sentenced to life in prison. Tonya says that conviction and a tragedy in her own life, the death of her husband, galvanized her to finally speak up. She picked up the phone and called the county prosecutor, a guy she once knew. This is tonya from high school . This is tonya from high school. Reporter greg oakes had risen through the ranks to become Oswego County District Attorney, now running that same office that had gotten the Gary Thibodeau conviction years earlier. And, of course, he remembered the case of the missing girl. I was home for easter. And i remember that being on the news. Reporter so when tonya priest called him with a suspects in heidi allens abduction, he listened carefully. I know the truth, sir. I have nothing to lose and nothing to gain from this. Its just my conscience. Absolutely. Reporter the d. A. Flew tonya up to new york to hear more details. And together they discussed how to verify her story, and there was one detail that seemed promising. In the story told by thumper that day, he said theyd taken heidi in the van to the home of a young woman named Jennifer Wescott. He screamed, if you dont believe me, go ask jennifer. What we wanted to do is try to follow up to see if there was any truth to that. Reporter Jennifer Wescott was a girl tonya knew from high school. The d. A. Encouraged her to get in touch by facebook. They exchanged telephone numbers, and then it was time for a phone call. They plugged into my phone, taped the whole conversation. Hope shell answer. [ ringing ] hello . Reporter it had been years since they last spoke. Tonya made small talk at first. And then eased into the story shed heard, the murder of heidi all those years ago. He just told me that they grabbed her from the store and they brought her to your house. I really in my own head dropped that. Right. I dont know, probably about ten years ago. Reporter jennifer didnt deny a thing, but she wasnt saying much either. Why did they even involve you or even do this . I dont know. You dont know which one killed her, though . No idea. I had to keep throwing stuff at her. And finally, she would bite. Did you even know that this was heidi that they brought there and that is what they were going to do . You think. Uhuh. You had no clue . That they just showed up with her . Yeah. They didnt even bring her in the house. Reporter it sounded as though jennifer had real information. Had just delivered the d. A. The evidential goods. It bothers me to talk about it, i wont lie to you. Reporter tonyaad going to the police . I would never open a can of worms like that. God almighty, im not doing the investigators job. I dont get paid enough. At first i felt sorry for her. The more i talked to her on the phone, and the more i realized she had no remorse. Based on the conversation that takes place, we had concerns that maybe there was some truth to tonyas claim. Reporter 20 years, 20 easters had come and gone since heidis disappearance. And now with tonyas story, everything old was new again. Coming up the d. A. Starts looking into the evidence tonya helped gather. And when the investigator talked to Jennifer Wescott, she explained that my statement is too hard to prove somethings not true. What will that mean for the case . Big is exciting. Daring. For everyone. Pets dont just make life better they make it bigger. Purina. Live big. What happens when an allencompassing brain scan is followed up with an allembracing hug . What happens when the worlds latest Surgical Technology is combined with caring for the worlds newest mother . What happens when you match cuttingedge Clinical Trials with a gentle touch . You get extraordinary medicine and remarkable care. Are proudly partnering to bring better care to every patient. Greg oakes had grown up not far from where heidi allen and now as District Attorney of the county, he was tentatively this is Gary Thibodeau, an old 61 with gimpy legs and a bad lung. Did you abduct heidi allen . No, i did not. Reporter and then kill her . No. Never abducted or killed anyone. Reporter he says those jailhouse snitches lied, and their testimony was the only real evidence against him. Did you tell those two theyre never going to find the body . No. Reporter youre not doing drugs with heidi there . No, no, no. Reporter thibodeau has been inside for 21 years. Hes always la resigned to the way life turned out for him. Do you say, why me . Ive gone through all of them feelings and emotions and thoughts over the year, but i kind of believe that you are where you are in life because thats where youre supposed to be. Whether it has anything to do with innocent or guilty or reporter but yours is more than 20 ars now in the new york state correction system. Yeah. Reporter for a crime you say you didnt commit. No, i didnt. Reporter back in 2013, when tonya priest stepped forward, gary had no idea the case was being given another look. He had exhausted his appeals. The other brother, richard, the one acquitted of heidis kidnapping, says his life has been filled with anxiety. Ive been afraid for the past 20 years actually going anywhere by myself. Reporter so you have really been traumatized by this whole thing . Oh, yeah. Reporter and he has also regretted coming forward as the good joe who told investigators that hed been in the the worst mistake of your life, richard, picking up that phone . Yeah. Reporter calling the cops . Yes. They had to convict somebody. Why us . Because i had a van . Reporter are the two brothers selfpitying, saying, why me . Theyre together as like one. Like, why did it happen to us . Reporter neither brother was aware that a woman unknown to them was banging on the authorities doors to get thibodeaus case reopened. Prosecutor oakes was investigating, and he asked tonyas old friend, the woman on the phone who seemed to know more than she should they didnt even bring her in the house. Made her sit in the van. Reporter to come down to the station for a talk. What do you know about the heidi allen case . I dont know anything about the heidi allen case. Reporter the investigator asked her about that recent phone call with tonya, omitting the fact that they had it all on tape. Did you make reference saying that they brought her to the house and that you they kept her out in the van . No. I never said anything to her about a van. Reporter well, in fact, she had. Thats when they told her the call was recorded. I really dont i mean, i was this [ bleep ] lady. Where does she even come up with what is this about . And i said, i dont know anything about them taking her in a white van. No, thats not what you said. I just thought i was shutting her up. I guess i was confessing i had heidi allen at my house. When the investigator talked to Jennifer Wescott, and she explained that, look, my statements to tonya priest simply werent true. I was trying to get her off the phone. I was trying to appease her. Reporter the d. A. Tracked down thumper, a. K. A. James steen, and the other two men. Each said that the Tonya Jennifer story was baloney. Investigators also contacted the jailhouse snitches from back in the day, and they stood by their testimony. More importantly greg oakes said they got nothing for testifying. So as you reviewed them, you found them credible . I did. Reporter why do you believe we have to look beyond just do we believe somebody or not. Is there information that they can provide that can be backed up by other independent evidence . Reporter the d. A. Didnt think he could believe anything Jennifer Wescott had to say, and he came to question tonyas credibility, too. I dont believe in tonya priest and her story. She said that had heard these admissions back in 2006. And i asked her, why didnt you immediately come forward to the police . And her response was, i simply didnt believe him. Reporter and after reviewing all the evidence, he decided there was no there there. I was convinced that they had had the right person. Reporter what would the motive be for these two thibodeau brothers . Unfortunately, dennis, there has been no obvious motive for all these years. Reporter months had gone by since tonya first called the d. A. s office. Now she got a phone call. I was told that there would be no further investigation. Reporter what, case closed . Weve got the thibodeaus for this thing . Yep. Yep. I started crying. Had she given it her best shot . Time to go home . Well, youd think so. If they think im going to walk away, they are mistaken. I am not. Coming up a secret document and a stunning revelation. Heidi allen was a young woman with an alternate identity. Code name Julia Roberts. Why this case might just be blown wide open. 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She said a man nicknamed thumper had confessed to her that he and two buddies had abducted and murdered heidi allen back in and she was devastated when the prosecutor checked out her story and ultimately chose not to believe her. I was doing it because i was a good person, and thats how i felt. Reporter but tonya wouldnt give it up. She was convinced an innocent man, Gary Thibodeau, was in prison. She made calls and was eventually put in touch with a new york federal public defender named lisa peebles, someone who had ties to the defense lawyers whod worked on thibodeau failed appeals. Tonya felt as though things were amiss by the time she called our office. Reporter lisa, the lawyer, listened to that secretly recorded phone call tw came away with a different take than the d. A. I would never open a can of worms like that. God almighty. That was, like, jaw dropping. Reporter what do you hear on that tape . A woman confiding it took her a long time to get the images out of her head. I heard her say they made her sit in the van. She also said that she would never go to police. Reporter did you believe tonya priest when she came forward . I absolutely did. I said, we cant let this go. Reporter lisa called up her friend, john obrien, a reporter with syracuse. Com. She says, you know, youve always told me to call you when i have a good case. And i got one. Reporter lisa had a morsel that intrigued the reporter. This was the first time in 20 years that anyone said they knew anything about what happened to heidi allen. Reporter one of the early doors the reporter knocked on was Richard Thibodeaus, the brother whod been accused back when but acquitted. Oh, my god, finally. It was unbelievable. Finally, someones come forward to help my brother get and i just said, you know, if you have anything that might help here, you know, let me know. He said, well, i do have these seven boxes of documents in my garage. Reporter holy cow. Hes got the whole thing. I would absolutely like to see those right away. Reporter for two decades, richard had kept every scrap of paper related to his trial. Was there something buried in there that the other lawyers had missed . Something that might help his brother . For lisa and the reporter eagerly digging through those boxes was like opening presents at christmas. And i thought, what is this stuff . The whole thing was so bizarre to me. Reporter there was something buried in the box, something forgotten that almost glowed it turned the out to be so important for their quest. What they fished out was an internal memo from the Oswego County Sheriffs Office that put heidi allen in a whole new light. Heidi allen was a confidentialor reporter telling us who is selling acid on school grounds, whos dealing dope . Right. Reporter shed been issued a 3x5 informant index card. It had her name, fingerprints, even a secret squirrel informant alias. It had a code name, Julia Roberts. It had all of her personal information on this card. Reporter saying this woman, code named Julia Roberts yep. Reporter is a drug informant for the county Sheriffs Office . Yes. Yeah. I was thinking, how did this not come out during the trial . Reporter the discovery of heidis informant status offered up whole new theories about her disappearance. It certainly would have opened up the field to many other possible suspects with motive to harm her. Reporter turns out, thumper had said as much to tonya. He said that thats what happens to rats. She was a rat. She was going to turn some big, big guys in and thats why they did it. Reporter as thumper tells it, shes a snitch. Shes a snitch. Reporter lisa peebles immediately got on with Gary Thibodeaus Trial Attorney from 1995, joe fahey. He says back when he did hear rumblings that heidi might have been working with the Sheriffs Office but was told there was no file, that it simply wasnt true. I didnt know anything about the card. I didnt know anything about Julia Roberts. Reporter so who did know . As it turns out, heidi allens i. D. Card wasnt locked away in a sheriffs filing cabinet somewhere. A deputy actually carried it around with him. And, one day, two years before she disappeared, he lost it, dropped it, in the parking lot of the d w Convenience Store where heidi would one day become a cashier. The i. D. Was later found. Its essentially like outing an undercover officer or a protected witness. Yes. Yes. The idea that its out there, that they believe shes an informant is a problem. Reporter what was important for lisa peebles about the discovery of the heidi Identity Card was that even though it was in the brothers case file, it had apparently never been given to Gary Thibodeaus defense team. She argued that was something prosecutors are required to turn over any evidence that might help the defense. Lisa filed a motion to have garys conviction throw out. And john obrien broke news, writing the first of many heidi stories to come. It just took off, and people are devouring it. Reporter a rock had been kicked over. The reporter was now getting hundreds of tips and leads. Jailhouse informants from the trial. Robert baldasaro, and recorded the interview. The mans story had changed somewhat. Your testimony came out that he confessed to it. I never said he confessed to anything. I just said, you know, he never come flat out and told me that he killed anyone. Reporter and a coworker of heidis, said in a sworn statement, that shortly before heidi went missing, shed said been afraid because the Sheriffs Department wanted to nail her for dealing coke. But heidis sister lisa was having nothing to do with the new theories. You believe that the conviction of of or do you think theres more to be told . This means that we trust our Law Enforcement and we trust our d. A. Reporter you had confidence in their professionalism then and you do now i think youre saying. Of course we do. Reporter the judge looking at the new evidence decided to hold hearings. Youre saying to the court theres new evidence, give him a new trial or cut him loose . Yes. I think there has been a huge injustice and its been a huge mistake. Reporter are you in a better place now . I feel relieved. I finally got somewhere. Reporter but all of the fervent interest outside the walls over the fate of gar thibodeau seemed to wash right over the man himself. Can you imagine life on the outside now . No, no, no. Id like to go fishing with a can of beer. Yeah. That would be nice. Sitting on a bank fishing, having a can of beer. Coming up the question that provoked this response. Are you out of your everloving mind . In g n Something Like that . Why . And then another victim steps forward. He was dragging me backwards with his hand over my mouth. Will her story reveal heidis true killer . 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For effortless shiny wow nails so you can step out with that amope confidence and shine on the electronic nail care system from amope. Find it in the footcare aisle. In january 2015, a judge granted a hearing in the matter of Gary Thibodeau, the man i want the truth to come out. I want to know what happened. I want my uncle to be home. So even though i went through all this crazy crap, if he gets to go home in the end, ive done whats right. Reporter heidis family was there but not expecting much. Theres nothing new today. Its just sensationalized. Reporter the narrow issue at this hearing was whether or not prosecutors years ago unfairly and illegally failed to turn over a key document to the defense. That i. D. Card of sorts indicating that heidi had been recruited as a teenage sheriffs drug informant. District attorney greg oakes argued that the state had, in fact, turned over the confidential informant records before trial. They did receive this information. They did know about this. Reporter but beyond the sh evidence when was another layer. The prosecutor said it didnt really matter. Heidi allen didnt really work as a confidential informant as you would expect. Really her activity was limited to giving some High School Information to the deputy. Reporter there was not a contemporaneous investigation about to go down . Around the time of her disappearance, no investigation that she was involved with. Reporter so if heidi wasnt naming names and turning in drug dealers, then the prosecution argued there was no foundation to this new theory that bad guys had killed her in revenge for being a snitch. The nowsheriff vehemently denies the defense innuendo that the deputies were somehow responsible for getting heidi killed. Did you guys carelessly bust her identity, sheriff . Are you out of your everloving mind . Why in gods name would we ever do Something Like that and jeopardize a girls life or career or anything . Why . Reporter accidentally. You know, this resulted in a girl being vulnerable. How did she become yes, her i. D. Card was dropped in a parking lot but was returned to the office right away. Only the store owner saw it. But Something Else was going on in the hear. Lisa, the defense attorney, was also acting a little like a prosecutor. She was about to introduce evidence about those three men identified as the socalled abductors and killers. All i have to do is say, hey, there is this new evidence and had it been available it would have created reasonable doubt for a jury to acquit him. Reporter he called other witnesses who, like tonya had heard stories of these three men killing heidi and dispose of her body. And that girl from the phone call, Jennifer Wescott, she changed her story again. Telling authorities on tape that she did know what happened. All he said to me was heidi was in a wood stoefb and taken care of in a van. Reporter and then the men themselves. First, there was thumper, real name james steen, doing life for murder. I have nothing i can tell you maam that will save that man over there. Nothing. Reporter he claimed not to know about heidis abduction nor did potential suspect number two, his buddy roger breckinridge, another guy with a record. And then there was the third guy from tonyas story. His name was Michael Bohrer. He lived a mile from the Convenience Store and had heidi make him a sandwich most days she was working. What made bohrer stand out among the three was his admitted obsession with the heidi allen case. Had told investigators as much months earlier. I knew one day im going to pop in the picture somewhere. You seemed so preoccupied with the case. I was obsessed with it because it just freaked me out. Reporter turns he had a shoebox full of old news clippings hed kept for two decades. In court, bohrers testimony was was videoed, but he admitted years back hed been a drug dealer, and he became very he started crying when it came to questions concerning his obsession with the case. And he kept driving by the sign that says, wheres heidi. And he thought about her six times a day. Reporter strange. And remember that profile drawn up by the fbi agent, Clint Van Zandt, today a contributor to msnbc . Back then hed predicted heidi was killed by someone who would later appear obsessed with the case. Its going to be someone who knew the victim. Its somebody who will follow this crime very closely, who will gather newspaper clippings, articles. Reporter and there was Something Else the fbi profiler had predicted. What i suggested was, this is so bold, theyre going to have other type of offenses in their background. You may see stalking, you may see other type of kidnappings. Holy cow. He just profiled Michael Bohrer. Reporter the attorney tracked down this woman, Catherine Schmitt, who says she was attacked by bohrer years before heidis abduction. She told us he tried to push her into a car. Had me in a chokehold and was dragging me backwards with his hand over my mouth. And, i mean, i couldnt breathe. Reporter she managed to run away with minor injuries. Bohrer pleaded guilty to unlawful imprisonment. But the judge wouldnt allow Catherine Schmitt to testify at this hearing ruling her story about Michael Bohrer was not relevant. He is absolutely very curious. I think hes mentally unstable. Reporter or he knows what happened to heidi and he feels remorse all these years later. I dont believe thats the case. Reporter so the judge took it all under consideration, dismissed the hearing and said hed have a ruling in due time on whether thibodeau should get a new trial. Weeks went by, then months. Its given me a reason to live now. Reporter and when it finally came, the ruling was dropped with little fanfare, just an entry in the docket. The judge ruled first there had been no socalled brady violation, no proof that the state did ha drug informant status. And he agreed with the d. A. That it wasnt legally relevant anyway. Its all speculation. Its irrelevant. Its hearsay. Reporter and as for those alternative suspects put on by the defense . Interesting, but in his opinion too speculative and remote to warrant overturning the jurys verdict. None of the three has been charged with anything related to the heidi allen case. I cant let it go. And i wont let it go. Reporter lisa peebles and, most of all, Gary Thibodeau and his family lost that day. As long as garys alive, im just going to keep on fighting for him. Reporter lisa is appealing to an even higher court. And as for tonya . What do you do . You just keep fighting. Reporter oddly maybe, those two families, the thibodeaus and the allens, divided as to guilt and innocence, both all these years later have the same question what did happen to heidi, and will we ever find a shallow grave . Eventually somethings going to happen. Someones going to say something. I might not know on this side of heaven. I might have to wait. But i will die trying and fighting for her. Reporter she went to work early on an Easter Sunday morning and was never seen again. Thats all for this edition of dateline. Well see you again sunday at 7 00, 6 00 central for on assignment and then for dateline at 10 00, 9 00 central. Im lester holt. For all of us at nbc news, good night