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heard that decisions are much different when you sit behind the desk in the oval office. a hasty withdrawal would create a vacuum that terrorists, including isis and al qaeda, would instantly fill a core pillar of our new strategy is a shift from a time based approach to one based on conditions. >> president trump now promising to pump additional troops in the war torn country, not specifying how many and not naming any particular benchmarks for success. >> the major policy reversal for donald trump who in the past urged the united states to get out of afghanistan. >> how many troops are going? >> well, the answer to that i think will be based on conditions on the ground. >> one thing is to be a candidate and talk about what you think the other thing is to be a president and talk about what you know. >> in some ways it was his most courageous speech because he told the truth at the very beginning. >> largely stuck to a script last night. americans will wait to see what they hear from him this evening when he heads out west for another campaign style rally, this one in phoenix. >> mike pence will join the president at his rally but the state's republican governor won't be attending. >> at war with the two senators who are not attending. >> that is the last place in the world you would want the guy to go if you wanted him to follow up on the momentum of last night. >> the investigation is taking a new twist. could the ship and possibly others in the navy's fleet have been targeted by hackers? >> the divers were able to locate some remains in those sealed compartments during their search today. >> the malaysian navy also has found some remains at sea. >> navy officials have ordered a temporary halt of all operations worldwide for a global safety check. >> after years of criticizing america's involvement in afghanistan, you heard president trump say the view is very different from the oval office and that a hasty withdrawal from afghanistan would create a vacuum for terrorists to fill. the president then proceeded to layout his new strategy for america's longest war now in its 16th year. >> conditions on the ground not arbitrary timetables will guide our strategy from now on. i will not say when we are going to attack but attack we will. we are not nation building again. we are killing terrorists. i'm a problem solver and in the end we will win. >> okay, now, while promising victory, the president gave very few details about the new strategy for afghanistan. it did involve increased troop levels but gave no specifics and also set no end date or made no benchmarks for success. it does involve putting diplomatic pressure on pakistan and india, they have been at war, nuclear powers been at war since the day they were invented in 1947. now let's talk about troop levels a bit. right now there are 8,400 american troops in afghanistan. in 2010 there were 100,000. president trump has already approved sending an additional 4,000 but we're not quite sure that this is the number that he's talking about when he's talking about additional troops. america and american families have paid a heavy cost in afghanistan, 2,388 american service members have been killed in afghanistan. by the way, more than 5,000 afghani civilians have already been killed this year alone. president trump is now the third consecutive president to send u.s. troops into afghanistan. what he said last night marks a reversal from what he's been saying dating back to 2011. >> president obama has been the one who has been in the process of extri indicating us from the two wars he inherited. why do you call him incompetent in that regard? >> i think he could have gotten out a long time ago. these wars are a disaster. what are we doing there? we're spending hundreds of billions of dollars trillions on this nonsense. are they going to be there for next 200 years? at some point what's going on? it's going to be a long time. we made a terrible mistake getting involved in first place. >> we're on track now to spend -- listen to this, $6 trillion, 6 trillion. could have rebuilt our country twice. >> now though faced with the realities of being president, that reversal and this morning we're following reaction to the president's plan. >> what president trump has made clear that conditions on the ground, the drive towards a stable and peaceful afghanistan, will drive american policy and will drive american decisions in the region. >> i'm pleeszed with the decision. i'm pleased with the way he went about making this decision. what i heard from the first time, i think i heard a new strum trump strategy, principled realism is i think how he described it. >> i'm very pleased, inspiring speech and i can assure you a lot in congress will be behind the president. >> last voice was lindsey graham, who has been a frequent critic of the president now praising him. another frequent critic john mccain said i commend president trump for taking a big step in the right direction with the new strategy for afghanistan. joining me now is former state department senior adviser, dean of the school of advanced international studies at johns hopkins university and latest book is "the dispensable nation", american foreign policy in retreat. good to see you again. >> thank you. >> let's talk about the president's comment, we're not nation building we're killing terrorists. it's something he campaigned on and something that a lot of conservatives and libertarians like to hear. the bottom line, how does that work in a place like afghanistan? >> this is actually an idea that vice president biden had during president obama's discussion to send troops to afghanistan. he disagreed with the u.s. military who wanted a fully resourced counter insurgency that you not only fight terrorists but secure the ground and build a economy and drain the swamp. and vice president biden said we should go in to kill terrorists. it looks like president trump signed onto the military's request for afghanistan but pushed back further than president obama had and essentially signed up to what president vice president biden asked for. it will work but the question is troop numbers, it's not the way in which the military has always approached afghanistan. but you know, this strategy is the first time it's being implemented and we shall see if it will work. >> i've got to safghanistan not functioning government in decades, we thought he had one in karzai. that didn't work out well. it's not an entire power vacuum like there are in some other middle eastern countries but there's quite a power vacuum in afghanistan. if the united states doesn't want to help fill that political vacuum, are there others who will? >> no, actually, that's the contradiction in president trump's statement. you cannot expect the afghan government to function and be a partner and do all of the things he asks without doing nation building. you cannot ask a government that doesn't have institution, is barely functioning, doesn't have enough education, is rid of corruption to actually step up even if he wants to be able to step up without help and that help is called nation building. if he doesn't want to do nation building, he should write off the afghan government and say he's going to go in to say terrorist and kill or capture mission like the way we killed osama bin laden without the help. if he wants the government engaged, we needs resources to get the afghan government to a place where it can be a partner. >> president trump and presidents before him have talked about this being a regional strategy and having regional partners and allies help out in the whole thing. there's mention of india and pakistan, they are both at war with each other. not an active war but declared war with each other. and afghanistan -- pakistan has been unusual. we have coddled and supported pakistan for a long time but they don't necessarily share our interests in afghanistan. >> i think the biggest problem i saw with the president trump's strategy, the same problem with president obama is that it's long on military solution and short on diplomacy. other than saying others should help, he didn't layout that diplomacy will matter and who is going to be in charge of getting neighbors and actors together. how are you going to engage these nations? at one point he said he's not even interested in the political deal with the taliban, that will come sometime in the future, which was a debate that also happened during the obama administration when my boss asked for a much greater emphasis on a political sentiment in afghanistan. i think that the interesting thing is that if president trump really doesn't want to go there and really wants to get out of that war, he has to support a political solution rather than a purely military one and has to layout a vision that the rest of the region can coalesce around. that was lacking other than exorting them to do more, he didn't layout a plan. >> former state department adviser for afghanistan and pakistan and writer of books that you should read to make yourself smarter in the region. >> thank you. >> joining me now retired lieutenant colonel john nagle, he wrote an army manual on counter insurgency and author of "knife fights." good to see you. the president said he studied afghanistan from every angle and someone who wrote the book on counter insurge enltcy, what do you make of the conclusions he came to? sfwl i >> i'm pleased he adopted a counter insurgency strategy. it's not what he campaigned on and not clear he really believes in it. when your enemy is conducting an insurgency your only real option is to conduct a counter insurgency campaign, that involves not just killing terrorists but building up local government and police and army forces and doing the hard diplomacy in the region that's necessary for that nation building that he disavowed but that is the core to succeed. >> you've written an article where it lays out pretty well, the options you pointed out are quit, conduct a scorch ermg campaign that destroys everyone or commit to counter insurgency. yours involves nation building or state building as you've said. how does counterinsurgency in a place like afghanistan work? for those of us never on a battlefield, they don't have battlefields in afghanistan, it's a very different way of fighting. >> there are occasional battles but most often the taliban won't stand and fight if they stand and fight against afghan forces backed with american advisers and air power and artillery, they will lose. instead you see war in the shadows. you see assassinations at night. you see the taliban gaining political influence and gaining control of villages and town s and gradually taking over. defeating that requires working with the local mayor and local pro vince chaleters a s -- t different kind of war that the american military is traditionally conducted and different kind of war i think than what the president thinks he means by war. but it's the only way ultimately to allow an exit of american forces while retaining an afghan government that will support american interest and not provide a safe haven for terror. >> let me ask you about this, when the iraqi army cut and ran when faced with isis, america figured out a different way and better way to train that army and they are now able to do better than they were able to before. is that what we're talking about here? americans training afghan police and soldiers to do better in their counterinsurgency and at some point in the coming years or decades backing out? >> that will be one of our main lines of effort. we'll continue to conduct kill capture operations against identified insurgents and terrorists, every chance we get the chance to take one of them off the battlefield we'll do it and do that with our special forces and in partnership with our nato allies but the long-term key to success in these operations is building afghan forces who can do that on their own. you're going to see i believe -- and i expect and very much hope an increased focus on em bedding american forces inside afghan units, going to the battlefield with them on front lines, in the villages and in the mountains and valleys, working to increase the capacity and the capability of afghan security forces so ultimately they can protect their own country and people. >> this war is often compared to vietnam. do you see that as a parallel or is that superficial? >> i think there are many similarities, they are both rural insurgencies and both had corrupt governments that gradually improved over time and local forces that gradually improved over time. in 1972 the vietnamese military was able to beat back a conventional offensive. after watergate and resignation of president nixon we no longer supported vietnam and they fell in 1975 after a 30-year u.s. effort. if america remains committed to the afghan government with advisers and with air power, the afghan government will stand and i believe we're about halfway through what's likely to be another 30-year commitment to feed a rural insurnlge entcy. >> good to see you. >> always good to see you, ali. >> coming up next, remains of navy sailors have been recov recovered. how could an accident like this happen? i'm going to speak live with the former commander of the "uss cole. but as you get older, it naturally begins to change, causing a lack of sharpness, or even trouble with recall. thankfully, the breakthrough in prevagen helps your brain and actually improves memory. the secret is an ingredient originally discovered... in jellyfish. in clinical trials, prevagen has been shown to improve short-term memory. prevagen. the name to remember. it's our back to school beeone cent evente. at office depot office max. 10 pack pens, one cent. composition notebooks,scissors, and plastic folders all one cent each! hurry to office depot office max. ♪taking care of business. tragic new developments on the ten missing sailors, divers recovered some remains and they are working to confirm the identity of potential remains located during their search efforts at sea. >> four of the five sailors injured were medically evacuated by a singapore navy helicopter to a hospital in singapore for nonlife threatening injuries. we will conduct a thorough and full investigation into this collision. what occurred, what happened and how it happened. >> joining me now is retired commander kirk lipold, a former commanding officer of the "uss cole" and commanding officer when it was attacked and bombed by al qaeda terrorists during a refueling stop in yemen killing 17 u.s. sailors. sadly you have some experience with something going wrong on a naval vessel. based on your experience, when a ship gets close to a destroyer or a naval vessel of some sort, what happened? how do you know it's about to happen other than visually? >> first, thoughts and prayers to the families who loved their loved ones. when you're at sea as commanding officer you have standing orders and typically those will say any vessel going to come within 10,000 yards or five nautical miles of your ship, that gets plotted and you know from which direction it's coming and course in speed so you know whether you need to maintain your course in speed by the rules of the road out there how ship s operate at sea or maneuver to pass around that, either behind it in most cases, occasionally head of it so you stay safe and don't end up with a collision like this. >> we spoke to a commander yesterday who said in straits and channels and busy harbors where -- we think of the sea as the open sea and there's lots of place to steer around anything. in places like this, do all ships follow the same procedure so you always know if someone is getting close or they are signaling the right way? >> pretty much everyone has to follow what are called the rule -- nautical rules of the road. they layout how you maneuver where you go and course in speed you have to follow when you're in a narrow channel. you'll typically stick to the right side and know when the ships are passing and keep an eye on them and visually plot that by relative motions it's indicative of a collision. you maintain that picture both visually and on radar and paper plot and down in the combat information center to ensure you don't allow ships to get close and have a tragic collision like this. >> there are reports that it may have lost steering control prior to this incident. the navy is investigating things like -- they are not saying it was hacked, they are saying that's one of the things on the table they are looking at. what do you think are reasons why a ship would lose steering control. if you were in command, what typically happens? >> typically what will happen, if you have a major engineering casualty, the first thing you do indicate to other ships and inform them that you are not under command, you're unable to steer and have a very difficult time. let's not forget even when you lose ability to steer the ship you still have engines that you can use. nonetheless, they'll indicate either by flags on the vessel or sounding six warning blasts that indicate danger to other ships plus they've got radios, they'll be in communication. typically channel 16 on bridge to bridge to inform other ships they have a problem and to let them know that they need to give the john s mccain or any ship with a casualty like this a wider berth so you don't have a collision. >> we think of this as a big ship and it's not actually. the ship it collided with was three times its size. obviously if you determine too late you lost steering control, the tanker may not be able to maneuver. >> that's very true. you are talking the loss of gross tonnage and when you have something that is that big, it does not maneuver quick and does not stop quick. therefore it needs more time and distance. but again, the john s. mccain has engines to twist and control somehow where the bow is pointed so it can avoid a collision if necessary. >> if they knew they lost steering control, typically would you make a call -- you were talking about six blasts. would the sailors have come to their battle stations as opposed to being in their sleeping crews as we heard they may have been. >> loss of steering would not be considered that kind of an emergency where you would declare general quarters and notify the crew and get them out of the racks in the middle of the night for something like this. the captain would be notified maybe even the executive officer, but the key is going to be that there should have been and i think the investigation will bear out there were addictional watch standards so people knew. you don't go through the strait having transited it myself. it is the busiest sea way in the world. there are a lot of ships coming and going. these type of casualties do occur in the civilian and military world but nonetheless you want to make sure you're prepared for just these kinds of incident. >> thanks for joining us. >> thank you, ali. >> stand by, everyone, when things go south for president trump, he holds rallies in friendly places. tonight it's phoenix, ground zero for the hard stance on immigration. we'll dig into that next. at 5:05 p.m. eastern time, donald trump will tour the yuma arizona customs border protection station and holds a meet and greet with marines and then he'll head to phoenix for the phoenix convention center 10:00 p.m. earn time. you' eastern time. boost. it's about moving forward, not back. it's looking up, not down. it's being in motion. in body, in spirit, in the now. boost® high protein it's intelligent nutrition with 15 grams of protein and 26 vitamins and minerals. for when you need a little extra. boost® the number one high protein complete nutritional drink. be up for it finding the best hotel price is whoooo. now a safe bet. because tripadvisor searches... ...over 200 booking sites - so you save up to 30% on the... ...hotelock it in. tripadvisor. is everything ok?adt, i could hear crackling in the walls, and my mind went totally blank. all i remember saying was, "my boyfriend's beating me" and she took it from there. when a fire is going on, you're running around, you're not thinking clearly, so they called the fire department for us. and all of this occurred in four minutes or less. within five minutes. i am absolutely grateful we all made it out safely. it's kind of one of those things you can't even... you cant even thank somebody. people you don't know actually care about you. to protect what you love, call 1-800-adt-cares and i am a senior public safety my namspecialist for pg&e. my job is to help educate our first responders on how to deal with natural gas and electric emergencies. everyday when we go to work we want everyone to work safely and come home safely. i live right here in auburn, i absolutely love this community. once i moved here i didn't want to live anywhere else. i love that people in this community are willing to come together to make a difference for other people's lives. together, we're building a better california. welcome back to "velshi & ruhle." ruhle is back tomorrow but then i'm going to be off. we'll be back at "velshi & ruhle" on thursday. this hour, president trump is set to leave the white house for a campaign style rally in phoenix, arizona, the event announced a day after his news conference last tuesday at trump tower during a week when he struggled several times over his response to the deadly domestic terror attack in charlottesville on august 12th. that prompted the mayor of phoenix to write an op-ed asking the president to delay the rally and calling for cooler heads to prevail the healing process. >> we cannot remain a force for peace in the world if we are not at peace with each other. let us find the courage to heal our divisions within. >> now this morning vice president pence spoke with matt lauer defending the president's initial response. >> man, i know this president. i know this heart and i heard him. i heard him on the day when he denounced hate and violence in all of its forms from wherever it comes. i heard him on that monday and heard him as well on tuesday like millions of americans did, where he condemned the hate and bigotry that was evidenced there. >> now, a new abc news "washington post" poll finds barely more than a quarter of americans approved of the president's response to the situation. that's a point not lost on other republicans. >> i think in my view that the president's comments about both sides were a mistake. they shouldn't have been said and i certainly wouldn't have said with them and don't agree or adopt them. >> i do believe he messed up in his comments on tuesday when it sounded like a moral ambiguity when we need extreme moral clarity. >> he will meet the president but not attend the rally nor will jeff flake or john mccain. for a deeper look at the president's visit, i want to bring in former resident of charlott charlottesville, ron hanson. thanks for joining us here. what are you hearing from the community in phoenix about the president rally and how it will be perceived? >> there's a fair bit of apprehension in the community today. there's some sense that there's a lot of anxiety after what happened in charlottesville. and there's concerns about what the president might say, especially with regard to former sheriff joe arpaio and how people might react to that. there are concerns about people's safety and i think that people are probably going to get through the day without any great incident but the fact they don't just know that is fairly troubling for them. >> you mentioned joe arpaio. there are reports that the president may pardon the former maricopa county sheriff. he served as maricopa county sheriff for 24 years before losing his re-election bid just this past november. just for viewers, in 2013 he and deputies were found to have engaged in racial profiling during immigration sweeps. last year a judge found him guilty of criminal contempt for violating an order to halt the sweeps. the president has praised him at past rallies and had the sheriff introduce him in the past. arpaio told nbc just last night he hasn't been invited to the rally, not sure what the president is going to do. what are you hearing? >> the same, there's still some unanswered questions as to what will happen. i think that there's been a push and pull as to whether this is the time for that sort of thing and how it might be received and especially after the president's remarks last night, i get the sense the white house would like to turn the page and change the conversation and strike a more appropriate tone for the office. granting a pardon on the road in phoenix here might be something that would be well received in the convention center but could stoke passions outside in downtown phoenix. it's a question of whether that would be appropriate and whether this is the time for that in any event. i think that there's some unanswered questions for the moment. the sheriff has indicated he has not been invited but with donald trump, we don't know. >> right, that's true. >> let's talk about the rally. it's a campaign style rally and the president has a history of holding these rallies and history of doing them in phoenix. he had five during the election cycle. listen to me during a sample of them. >> every once in a while i'll see a rally and it's put up by the mexican government in my opinion. people come in, so perfect, like central casting. once i get into office, we will make great deals but not with massive amounts of countries. you do them one at a time, folks, one at a time. they want to see people that love our country come into our country, not people that hate us. >> we take anybody, come on in. anybody. just come on in. not anymore. >> our country doesn't win anymore. we don't win with isis. we don't win with trade. we don't win with borders. we're going to start winning again, folks. >> so, ron, in the same way that west virginia is really good for the president when he's talking about coal and energy, phoenix is good for him when he's talking about immigration and the wall and the border. but is it really? is it a hot bed of support or can he fill an arena in phoenix? >> i think that it is a good issue for him. there's a vocal and significant fraction of people here who for whom this remains a hot button subject. i expect that the rally should be relatively well attended. what will be interesting is how many people show up outside standing in the heat tonight that should also be interpreted as a sign of how widespread there are different views and immigration, the border wall, those sorts of things make for nice applause lines in phoenix and the president feels comfortable in this environment. i don't know that you can make the case that that's a unanimous sense here in arizona. >> good to talk to you. thank you so much. ron hansen. >> thanks so much. >> president trump's son-in-law jared kushner traveling to the middle east. what's he doing there and who's he meeting? we'll have a live report from the white house and we're watching the markets. the dow is up 147 points. that's two-thirds of a percent. we'll talk about that on the other side of this. you're watching "velshi & ruhle" live on msnbc. ♪ there's nothing more important than your health. so if you're on medicare or will be soon, you may want more than parts a and b here's why. medicare only covers about 80% of your part b medical expenses. the rest is up to you. you might want to consider an aarp medicare supplement insurance plan, insured by unitedhealthcare insurance company. like any medicare supplement insurance plan, these help pick up some of what medicare doesn't pay. and, these plans let you choose any doctor or hospital that 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trump unveiled a new plan for afghanistan last night, calling for increased troop levels but gave no specific on troop numbers or end date. navy divers recovered some remains of sailors. the malaysian navy has also found potential remains from their search at sea. a high speed train crash near philadelphia injured 40 passengers overnight. it collided with an unoccupied rail car. four passengers are in critical condition. new word from the white house this hour. president trump's son-in-law and senior adviser jared kushner is traveling to the middle east. the president assigned the 36-year-old a portfolio including peace between israel and palestinians. peter alexander is live at the white house. what's on his agenda? >> reporter: let's give you a sense of what we know. we know jared kushner, son-in-law and ambassador as relates to all things in the middle east traveled on sunday night with a series of stops scheduled this week, saudi arabia, jordan, egypt, united arab emirates and tomorrow night expected to arrive on israel and he'll meet with benjamin netanyahu and mahmoud abbas. he'll try to focus attention on the effort to create a long lasting peace deal. the president has indicated in the past both the palestinians and israelis will have to negotiate together but the president wants the white house to be the conduit for that to happen. it follows a series of meetings that had taken place, including the secretary of state rex tillerson who is not the one leading this effort. h.r. mcmaster, national security adviser as well as other individuals here at the white house right now. jared kushner in that region leading the charge for the white house, not the first time he's been there but continuing this effort to try to support a peace process in that region and crackdown on extremists. >> peter, separately, we understand there are new treasury department sanctions that are aimed at north korea? >> reporter: that's exactly right. we learned this information breaking whn the last hour from the treasury department. they announced sanctions on 16 chinese and russian entities as well as individuals that they believe that they insist have been aiding the north koreans right now. it includes three chinese companies that the administration said were responsible for importing about a half billion dollars worth of north korean coal and russians were providing oil to the country. on the screen right now, here's part of the statement from the treasury secretary steve mnuchin, who said it is unacceptable for individuals and companies in china to enable north korea to generate income used to develop weapons of mass destruction and stabilize the region. all of this follows the tough talk fire and fury as the president warned that he was considering in an effort to try to crackdown on north korea and whatever intentions it may have in terms of its nuclear capabilities. >> north korea has just issued -- issued a little while ago yet a new threat against the united states good to see you, my friend. stand by, everybody, johnson & johnson has been ordered to pay one woman nearly half a billion dollars over its popular talcum baby powder and allegations it causes cancer in women. have they known about potential cancer risks all along? an uplifting story out of italy, a 7-month-old baby boy pulled from the rubble after an earthquake hit a resort near naples. his 11-year-old brother was also saved. e you're watching "velshi & ruhle" on msnbc. coney island has been around for a long, long time. reminds me of how geico has been saving people money for over 75 years. hey, big guy! come on in! let me guess your weight! win a prize! sure, why not. 12 ounces! sorry, mate. four ounces. i've been taking the stairs lately. you win, big guy. sorry, 'scuse me! oh, he looks so much more real on tv. yeah... over 75 years of savings and service. get your rate quote today. you push yourself every day... tempur-pedic helps you recover every night. tempur 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where you are. surround yourself with the team of breast cancer experts at cancer treatment centers of america. visit cancercenter.com/breast appointments available now. johnson & johnson is forced to pay a record $470 million in the latest lawsuit involving its popular baby powder and cancer. its the largest verdict yet against the company. a california jury sided with a hospitalized woman who claims the talc gave her ovarian cancer. they maintain the products do not cause cancer. they are appealing the case along with several others where damages have been awarded. a st. louis missouri jury awarded a virginia woman diagnosed with ovarian cancer, $110.5 million. $70.1 million and $55 million. if not overturned the combined total of these verdicts including this latest record breaking one, reach more than $724 million. more than 1,000 more people have filed similar lawsuits with various outcomes and nbc's joe fryer took a deeper look. >> do you have any fear you might die here? >> yes. >> eva says she used johnson & johnson talc based baby powder more than 40 years. she sued the company saying it failed to warn companies about talc's possible cancer risks. her emotional video deposition recorded in february was played for the jury. >> i thought i was going to die for christmas. >> her attorney says she was too ill to attend the trial but monday learned a jury awarded her $417 million. >> my client i think today has done what she wanted to do. she's going to die. she's losing that battle. but she's so happy that she won the battle for the other women in this country. >> johnson & johnson is facing thousand it's of lawsuits from women who claim the company ignored studies linking talc to ovarian verdicts and plans to appeal monday's decision because the company says we are guided by the science which supports the safety of johnson's baby powder. the company did win a trial in march, while another suit was thrown out by a new jersey judge. >> you don't put a cancer warning on a product that doesn't cause cancer. >> reporter: bart williams, a lawyer for johnson & johnson, spoke with nbc news before this week's verdict. the company argues the most credible research proves baby powder is safe, pointing to government agencies including the national cancer institute, which wrote in april, the weight of evidence does not support an association between perennial talc exposure and increased risk of ovarian cancer. >> the notion that johnson & johnson would sell that product, knowing that it causes cancer in women, is just outrageous. >> and nbc's joe fryer joins us now from los angeles. joe, this is a big deal. these are huge numbers. for a guy like me, who follows business, we don't see rulings like this. are we expecting more verdicts based on the trends so far? >> you know, it is hard to say. ultimately depends on the juries. we have seen a bit of a wide range so far. only a few of these cases have actually gone to trial and most of the cases the juries have ruled against the company. but the company said it plans to fight all of these trials in court, in march. it did win a jury, decided, in favor of the company, ruling against a tennessee woman who claims that there was a link between her use of talc powder and ovarian cancer. at the same time, we have seen a wide range of dollar amounts handed out. there was a woman from south dakota who won her case, but the jury in the end awarded her damages of zero dollars. >> i saw some people starting to talk about the fact that this -- this recalls the tobacco verdict, where the allegations are that companies know about these things and aren't as clear as they could be, with respect to warning labels and things like that. what do we know about that? >> it is hard to say. people talking about that. with lung cancer, we know that cigarettes can cause lung cancer. at this point, there are a lot of people who feel the science is still not entirely clear, including organizations like the american cancer society who say more research needs to be done to know if there is a link between talc powder and ovarian cancer. >> thank you very much for joining us. joe fryer for us in los angeles. let's go to joint base andrews where president trump is set to leave, he'll fly to yuma, arizona, to tour a border patrol station and meet with marines and that rally in phoenix tonight. stand by. we're going to hear from former defense secretary and cia director leon panetta. what's the secret to turning a no into a yes? do you know how to network like a champ? and when is a good time to have some fun in the office? i'm j.j. ramberg. i've got some great answers to all of these questions, which might help you run a better business. check out the "your business" page on nbc news.com for an exclusive online video series to help you work smart, grow fast and go further. >> sponsored by american express open, helping you get business done. hate to play devil's advocate but... i kind of feel like it's a game changer. i wouldn't go that far. are you there? he's probably on mute. yeah... gary won't like it. why? because he's gary. (phone ringing) what? keep going! yeah... (laughs) (voice on phone) it's not millennial enough. there are a lot of ways to say no. thank you so much. thank you! so we're doing it. yes! start saying yes to your company's best ideas. let us help with money and know-how, so you can get business done. american express open. welcome back to "vels"velsh "velshi & ruhle." after a memo, more than 60 current and former female google employees said they're joining a class action lawsuit regarding pay inequity. the suit would build on a case brought by the u.s. department of labor alleging systematic compensation discrimination at the tech giant and in the middle of all this, there are still many people who believe the wage discrimination is a myth. but for fact's sake, the gender pay gap isn't a myth. by now you probably heard of the gender pay gap. you look at the statistics, there is no denying it. in 2015, women working full time in the united states were paid 80 cents on the dollar compared to what men were paid. and that 20 cents difference adds up, making median annual earnings for men over $10,000 more than they are for women. these are the figures that were cited often by the obama white house, but many conservative think tanks took issue with the assumptions made, choosing to tweak the variables that narrow the gap to 87 cents on the dollar, or 95 cents. despite the differenting estimates of what the gender pay gap is, most people can agree on this. there is a gender pay gap. some argue choices in education are occupation are what result in women receiving lower pay. it is true that women are concentrated in lower paying occupations like health care, education, and office or administrative support. and statistically speaking, women are more likely to work fewer paid hours, splitting their time between child care, housework and a full or part time position. but comparing apples to apples, women and men with the same levels of education continue to receive unequal pay. male software developers, truck drivers, registered nurses, designers, food service managers, all get paid more than women do. female financial managers make on average 35% less than they're male co-workers. even so, many still argue that women have made great progress because the gender pay gap has narrowed so much since 1960, but that progress has slowed in the last 15 years. and in this day and age, why should women with the same education, experience and job description be earning any less than men. narrowing the pay gap is so important because more women today are the sole breadwinners for their families than ever before. meaning all of us are held back, when wages continue to be unequal. and i'd like to hear what you think about the gender pay gap and the best way to solve it. feel free to e-mail me at ali velshi. we like to talk about this a lot. thank you for watching this hour of msnbc live. i'm ali velshi. stephanie is back tomorrow. i'll see you back here at 3:00 p.m. today, speaking with norman leer, you'll remember him for a lot of things including producing the hit "all in the family." check us out on social media, connect with our show. it is time now for our good friend andrea mitchell and "andrea mitchell reports." and right now on "andrea mitchell reports," about face. president trump abandoning his campaign promise to get out of afghanistan now that he's commander in chief. >> my original instinct was to pull out and historically i like following my instincts. but all my life i've heard that decisions are much different when you sit behind the desk in the oval office. >> coming up, i'll talk to former secretary of defense and cia director leon panetta. back on the trail after sticking to his script last night, today the president is back on more familiar turf, a campaign style rally in arizona, where he's already feuding with both republican senators. >> we expect president trump to do the thing that is the first page in his playbook, which is to go and look for an opportunity to stoke his base and to get them fired up. and the way he does that, he throws the red meat that is controversial and toxic to a majority of americans. >> and tragedy at sea. the remains of some of the missing sailors have been found aboard the "uss john mccain" as the search effort continues. >> one tragedy like this
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