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I had a conversation a few years africa aboutaharan human sexuality. Were deeply into it. Theiristened, sense of betrayal you have to let yourself be touched by that. You cannot reject it as a direct s an ignorant view. Part of the dialogue is a dialogue that has great pain. We must let ourselves be hurt. Because i with it like all of us i dont like to be hurt. I dont like to feel pain. I go a long way to avoid it, emotional pain particularly. Does that make any sense . Very much. Tom im afraid we have to close it down now. The archbishop has to be leaving. One final thought. We have been talking a lot about issues climate change, migration, violence better handled by secular institutions. Do you see any challenge, danger in the church becoming too secularized by its focus on these institutions . What you mentioned is very important. The importance of not soft peddling. Archbishop welby i think there is. Us,ink making people like we can end up saying the wrong thing about everything. N

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