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regret and how professor hill is taking it. not well. first, though, a portion of his video today declaring that he is in. he made what happened in charlottesville the moral keystone of it and made president trump and his conduct in that instant and others the central theme. >> in that moment, i knew the threat to this nation was unlike any i'd ever seen in my lifetime. i wrote at the time that we're in the battle for the soul of this nation. well, that's even more true today. we are in the battle for the soul of this nation. i believe history will look back on four years of this president and all he embraces as an about a rent moment of time. he will forever and fundamentally alter the character of this nation, who we are. and i cannot stand by and watch that happen. the core values of this nation are standing in the world our very democracy. everything that has made america, america is at stake. >> well for, the president's part, he responded with a tweet. he wrote, quote, welcome to the race, sleepy joe. i only hope you have the intelligence, long in doubt, to wage a successful primary campaign. it will be nasty. you will be dealing with people who truly have some very sick and commented ideas. but if you make it, he will see you at the starting gate. it sounds almost like a grudging compliment, a sign the president takes him seriously. as we said at the top, there is breaking news tonight along those lines. jeff zeleny has the latest. he joins us from washington. what are you learning? what does the president think about biden throwing his hat in the ring? >> anderson, good evening. calling him sleepy joe hardly is the full story. we've been talking with several advisers around the president. we do know he has been paying very careful attention to this democratic primary as it unfolds, but to joe biden in particular. i am told inside political meetings the president often asks about joe biden, often asks about pennsylvania. of course pennsylvania is the home of joe biden. that's where he is tonight. it's where he's going to have his final rally of this launch in philadelphia in just two week's time. he'll be there again on monday. so he is focusing on that. the president asks about pennsylvania. of course pennsylvania was a state that the president flipped from blue to red. and that's sort of a benchmark in his mind for how he'll do in the general election. so there is a sense of worry and wonder among some trump aides. anderson, one told me this. he said if he would make it to a general election, yes, he's a problem. but, of course, that is the central question here. can joe biden navigate this complicated democratic primary. the white house says they're not so sure. democrats, of course, who want joe biden to do so are hoping he can, but there is a sense, a question, is he fitting the mold of today's democratic party. but anderson, he came out of the gate trying to elevate this contest, elevate the conversation to make it about defeating donald trump, not about the minutia, if you will, of specific policy proposals. so that was joe biden's one central goal today. >> you also, i understand, have some reporting about president obama and his support of a biden candidacy. what do you know? >> we do. of course we know that president obama is not going to issue an endorsement. and then joe biden said i didn't ask for one. so digging a little deeper into that, talking to several people around both men, they did have several conversations really throughout the last several months or so, not talking about necessarily the specifics of the race, but someone told me that president obama was sort of listening as more of a friend, listening to joe biden sort of go through the pros and cons of running, the stress it would take on his family. but at the end of the day, they both sort of reached a mutual conclusion that an endorsement at this point wasn't a good idea. barack obama said, look, i got through that '07-'08 campaign without big endorsements, and that sort of helped propel him. so there is a sense, and they both know an endorsement frankly probably wouldn't matter at this early stage. the democratic party has to work itself out. but president obama released some pretty glowing words, saying the best decision he ever made was picking joe biden as israel vice president, but they both know that he has to win this on his own. i did ask a close confidante of president obama if he thinks that joe biden can win the primary. he said we do not know, but joe wants to run, and we have to give him a chance to do so. anderson? >> all right. jeff zeleny, jeff, thanks. fortunate enough to have a colleague, someone who has had a close-up view of joe biden, the vice president, the senator and the campaigner, david axle reax. david, were you at all surprised by the focus on president trump? it sort of runs counter to what a lot of the other candidates are saying, this can't just be about donald trump. >> i thought it was an interesting strategic move. when you think about it, what everybody says about joe biden, yeah, he would be a very strong candidate against donald trump, but we don't know whether he can get through this democratic party and these nominating fights. and so what he decided to do was give people a preview of what that battle would look like. and he lifted the stakes in a way that i thought was very, very effective. >> so in a sense, kind of looking past the primary? >> exactly. saying, you know, i think he in a subtle way kind of consigned everybody else to the kiddie table and said i'm coming back to try and make things right, and i'm ready for that fight. >> it also sort of sets an idea of what is the stakes are as opposed to important things like, you know, economic issues or health care or things like that. >> yeah. at the end of the day, i think every election is driven by values, and this was a value-laden statement. and using charlottesville as the centerpiece of it i thought was particularly effective because it is a -- it was a big defining, iconic event. but also, because it speaks to constituencies that he needs to mobilize among minority voters, among younger voters, among activists, voters, some of whom may have some questions about him. >> where does biden enter this race in terms of strengths and weaknesses? >> well, he is a front-runner in the polls. he has been consistently a front-runner. i think his -- >> there is a danger in that, isn't there? >> well, there is a danger that front-runners often don't win, for one thing. but he becomes a target. you know, he is a front-runner in part because of his long career in politics, but his long career in politics also carries with it many, many questions about votes, about statements that were made in a different time and a different place that are not necessarily fashionable in this democratic party. so that's a fraught situation for him. >> one of those issues, of course, is anita hill. we were told -- and his treatment of anita hill during the clarence thomas hearings. his spokeswoman said he called anita hill this month to express regret over, quote, what she endured. hill told "the new york times" in an interview, "i cannot be satisfied by simply saying i'm sorry for what happened to you. i will be satisfied when i flow is real change and real accountability and real purpose." so that -- clearly, he is hoped to put this away as an issue and it's not. >> it didn't work, in part because it's one thing to say i'm sorry for what happened to you, and it's another thing to say i'm sorry for what i did. >> right. >> and he apparently didn't say that this was one of the things that disturbed her. so, you know, this was a good day for joe biden. his video was a solid launch. i think he is going to have some good days in the next few days. he has a roll-out plan. this is not going to be a walk in the park, and he is going to have to fight for this nomination. he will emerge as a stronger candidate if he wins the nomination there, but is no certainty that he will. >> it was interesting in president trump's tweet. president trump, whatever one may think of him, he does have kind of a genius for identifying a weakness or a perceived weakness and just opening it up more and more and more and putting it in people's minds, whether it's beto o'rourke and his hand gestures, whatever. with joe biden, he sent out this tweet, sleepy joe. he said essentially at the end of it, once you get through all this stuff, you are running against all these people with dangerous ideas, and then i'll meet you at the starting line. >> you know what i thought was interesting than, i think what trump was signaling to activists within the democratic party is that biden isn't one you have and perhaps creating mischief for biden. if biden emerges from that process, what trump has certified is he's actually kind of a centrist, which is one of the reasons why i think republicans fear him more than the others. he reaches more into that swing voter who might vote for trump than any of the other democrats, at least right now. >> i want to ask you what biden said earlier today, that he asked president obama not to endorse him. do you really buy that? it's a convenient thing to say because there is understandable reasons why president obama wouldn't want to endorse somebody, particularly at this stage of a race. >> i don't know what passed between them. what i know is president obama's judgment is that his role shouldn't be to try and anoint a candidate and that he -- i think you'll see president obama surface if he believes that candidates are inflicting unfair damage on each other. i know he worries about that, that primaries can become very acrimonious. but, you know, i don't know what conversations they had between them. and, you know, maybe they had that conversation. and if they didn't have that conversation, probably he shouldn't say that. >> david axelrod, thanks very much. more now on the efforts the new candidate made before he entered the race to try to repair three decades old damage back in 1991, a chairman of the judiciary committee, biden ran the supreme court nomination hearings for clarence thomas. you'll remember law professor anita hill testified at the hearing, leveling sexual harassment allegations and came under fire for the treatment that she received that they gave her. today "the new york times" is reporting details of their conversation with professor hill about her recent conversation with joe biden. sharing the buy line of the reporting, she joins us now. so what did anita hill say to you about the conversation she had with the former president? >> well, she didn't want to detail exactly what the former president said to, he but she made very clear that she was not satisfied with the conversation. she said that she can't accept someone saying i'm sorry for what happened to you without engaging in real change and real accountability. she made very clear to me that she does not think that joe biden has fully accepted responsibility for his conduct at the hearing. she faults him for failing to call other witnesses. she faults him for letting the process run off track, as she told me, for allowing republican senators to grill her in ways that were in her view inappropriate. she recalled oren hatch, the senator from utah, waving around a copy of "the exorcist" at the hearing. and in the end, she says she does not feel she can support him for president unless he demonstrates real change that an apology to her is one thing, but he needs to apologize to the other women who he failed to call and to the american public. >> so she said she didn't want to characterize her conversation as an apology certainly. did -- do we know if biden expressed remorse? >> she said that he said to her pretty much what he has said in public, and what he has said in public is that he regrets that he could not give her the hearing that she deserved. so he conveyed those same sentiments to her. she -- i said, well, what exactly did he say to you? and she said you'll have to ask him, and of course we did ask him today after his campaign put out a statement that he regretted the hearings, and they said there would be no further comment beyond the statement. >> so i guess there's no really specifics about what was lacking in their conversation in professor hill's opinion. do we know what she would like to see or hear from biden? clearly it seems like a direct apology to her perhaps, but also examples of real change. >> i think she's, frankly, a lot more interested in real change. she feels that the anita hill/clarence thomas hearing were an example or could have been an example to the public of how these kinds of inquiries should be conducted, of how women who are feeling that they're victims of sexual harassment can be taken seriously. and she does not feel that biden has kind of accepted his own role in failing to provide that kind of hearing. she draws a direct connection between the 1991 hearings of thomas and last year's hearing of brett kavanaugh, who was, as you know, accused of sexual assault by another professor, christine blasey ford. so i think she is very interested in hearing from not only biden, but all other candidates what they are going to do about the problem of sexual harassment and gender violence in our society. and she doesn't feel she has heard that from biden. >> do you know if she plans to continue to speak out? she gave you an interview. does she plan to go on television? does she plan to do other interviews? or was this sort of she said what she has to say. do you know what her next step is? >> i'm not sure. i interviewed her in 2014 in conjunction with the release of her documentary about her. and she told me at the time that she felt biden had done a terrible job. and we were preparing a story about the anita hill hearings, and so i went back to her. >> i see. >> because i wanted obviously to update. and as far as her plans, she says she has many requests. she's not sure what she's going to do, and she hasn't told me whether she intends to speak out any further. sheryl gay stoleberg, thank you very much. next, breaking news on another piece of outreach, a conversation joe biden had with a mother killed at charlottesville. as african americans are responding to his message about what they think about his shortcomings. we'll take a look at that. and later, new word on how far the white house may go to stop former white house council don mcgahn, the man who took notes, from testifying to congress. it's racquetball time. 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most hands republic. the three not raising their hands say they like a lot of the democratic candidates, but will most likely vote for -- >> joe biden, of course, is the native son. >> reporter: here in the sussex county delaware committee headquarters, joe biden's candidacy video was particularly meaningful to this group of african american community leader. >> charlottesville, virginia, is home to the author of one of the great documents in human history. >> reporter: hearing biden take on president trump over charlottesville reassuring to them. did y'all think it was good idea? >> i thought about a lot of things as he was talking this morning. and one of the things that stood out is the love he had instead of hate. >> it was joe letting us know that once again he is going to stand for the rights of all people, not just the rights of some people. >> reporter: these voters tell us one of the reasons joe biden has won election after election in delaware is because of his accessibility in the small state. >> joe is the man. >> i've gotten to know joe biden, and i got to know his grandkids and his son and bo and the whole bit. there is a fondness, there is a relationship that i feel like have i with him. >> he was 29 years old when i first met him. >> reporter: she served in the military. >> i worked with bo. i was in the unit with him. >> reporter: but there are some frank acknowledgments and discussions here about dealing with joe biden's race. >> back in the '70s, joe biden was against bussing which was a way to integrate schools, and he also helped draft the crime bill, which a lot of people felt unfairly incarcerated large numbers of people who shouldn't have been incarcerated. does that trouble you about his past when it comes to civil rights? >> no. because people can change. >> i would more say so he's grown, as we all do. >> reporter: and then there was biden's role in the anita hill slshs clarence thomas u.s. supreme court hearing. the biden campaign just announcing he recently directly expressed regret to anita hill. >> i think he knows that he needs to come out and say that he back then was sorry and he overlooked a lot of what was going on in the hearts and the minds of the people. >> reporter: you called joe biden after the anita hill/clarence thomas hearing? >> oh, yes, during. i called him a couple of times. >> reporter: you called him on the phone? >> yes. >> reporter: and what did you say to him? >> well, some things might not be appropriate. but i did tell him i wasn't pleased with him since he was from delaware, and we put him there. and i made it very plain back then -- i didn't have much stall in my talk. i said we can bring you home, just like we sent you there. >> reporter: what did he say to you? >> well, he listened and wanted to know how he could do better. >> reporter: have you forgiven him? >> oh, yes. >> reporter: everybody here making it clear that today -- >> i feel i know his heart. his heart is right for the people. >> reporter: there are no grudges. gary tuchman, cnn, georgetown, delaware. >> interesting to hear from those voters in that room. three perspective news on this from three political voices, democratic strategist and former congressional black caucus angela rye, who has endorsed kamala harris. also with us democratic strategist paul beg gal lap. cory, what do you make of gary's piece? it's not a scientific sampling, of course. >> you'll find people who appreciate, who love joe biden, who appreciate the fact that he has given up 40 years of his life for service to this country. but joe biden, like kamala harris, like pete buttigieg, like amy klobuchar is going to have to answer questions about his record, which many people found problematic. in 1984, he was working with strom thurmond on expanding 8s forfeiture, the crime bill. these things are very, very important. and because his record of service is so long, he's going to have to answer these questions not with simply value propositions, but with policy points on how he is going to unravel some of the damage that he's done. look, i think that all of us, all three of us on here would proudly wear a joe biden for president t-shirt if he is our nominee. but the point is this is the primary right now. and joe biden has questions to answer, just like every other candidate. >> angela, how much of the affection in that one particular room is actually based on his actual record and how much is based on his relationship to president obama, his name recognition? because as bakari says, he has a very long record, and you can find many things to praise and many things to take fault with. >> sure. and i think so much of what you just said is key. joe biden is a master at relationship building. he certainly has in that very, very friendly room of delaware, which is of course his home state, but also more specifically with the congressional black caucus, which you mentioned of course i was the executive director and general counsel. joe biden when there was associate membership was an associate member of the congressional black caucus. so as checkered as his record may be on a number of racial issues, and people in that room say we need to forgive him, that may be true indeed. but thing are some other big looming things that exist. one, 44 of the last 45 presidents happened to be white men. joe biden happens to be one of those. this is the anniversary of enslaved africans to this country. there have been zero women presidents as we know. so there are some things that are playing against joe biden that he has no control over whatsoever. it does not help that he fumbled the call with anita hill that is certainly clear. it does not help that people are now looking at the way that he engages audiences, the ways in hi has or doesn't have boundaries, physical boundaries of touching folks. i personally like joe biden, but i don't know if my like of joe biden validates him enough to take him over the finish line for this particular race in 2020. >> paul, where do you see his strengths and weaknesses? >> well, he needs to begin with the black community. and this is something i think my republican friends never understand. they think the democratic party is white liberals. if you look at a lot of these candidates running right now in the democratic that. >> seem to think that the whole party is white liberals. the first strategy question james carville and i had with bill clinton in 1991, we said the path to the nomination runs through the african american community, and when doug wilder, the african american governor of virginia decided not to run, we thought we could win. that's how clinton won. that's how barack beat hillary. that's how hillary beat bernie. i'm not for any of these candidates. i'm completely undecided. but somebody is going to figure that out. the heart and soul of the republican party i believe is the white christian evangelicals. they're not the majority, but president trump's remarkable command of that constituency gives him the power of the party. the heart and soul of my party i think is people of color. i have to defer to the other two panel member here is, but i think angela and bakari will back me up on that. >> bakari, angela mentioned anita hill. how much of a fumble is it that on the day he's announcing there's an interview out with her in which she's not going to details of a conversation which, you know, is to her credit, but clearly, it was not the apology she probably deserves or was expecting, however you want to characterize it. >> i think anita hill's deserved this apology for nearly 30 years. and it's pretty transparent when you do it two weeks before you're running for president of the united states. people say oh my god, why are you questioning joe biden. we shouldn't do this. this is going to be a replay of 2016. well, no, it's not. that's the purpose of a primary. and one of my very good friends who is a political consultant, jerry always says the couch is on the ballot. it won't just be donald trump versus whoever the democratic nominee is. it's also going to be the couch. and what we found out is in milwaukee, in detroit, in certain cases in pennsylvania, the couch won out and black voters simply chose to stay home. and some voters who were just disenchanted with the process chose to stay home. so we can't just say that we're running against donald trump. we have to give people some reason to vote for us. and so i hope that joe biden's appeal to black voters is more than barack obama chose me because most black voters i know are asking the question but for barack obama, would i vote for joe biden today. >> angela, certainly he has run for president twice before, and, you know, it didn't go anywhere. so it's interesting that now he is viewed even by people who really probably don't know much about his past record over the decades as the front-runner. >> yeah. i think that front-runner status, if we are to learn anything else from 2016, it should not be an heir apparent. it should not be automatically given. i think that the barack obama bona fides certainly help, but we need to understand there is a lot that has changed. there is a whole cadre of millennial voters who argue that they wouldn't necessarily have supported barack obama. those are audiences he is going to have to speak to, that middle of the road, centrist democratic message is going to be a very hard one to sell during this democratic primary. so i would urge joe biden, as much as that relational loving room of his exists, right, the one that we just saw, he also has to speak specifically to the black community. he has to speak specific to agenda items and how he has pivoted completely. i respect the fact that people change and grow. anderson, hell, i'm different than i was last week. >> me too. >> but at the end of the day if i can't show you good, bakari, if i can't show you some documented proof of things i've done to proactively help these communities, an agenda that speaks directly to them, a rising tide does not lift all boats. we know that, especially if you're not in one. >> got to leave there it. paul begala, thank you, bakari seller, angela rye. in a field this crowded, can he afford any headline-making slip-ups? he's already had some. someone who knows the pressures of being a front-runner, may have some advice for him, ahead. . hmm? yeah, you just go online, or give them a call anytime. you don't say. yep. now what will it take to get 24/7 access to that lemon meringue pie? pie! pie's coming! that's what it takes, baby. geico®. great service from licensed agents, 24/7. you don't always use your smartphone for directions... are we there yet? hey guys, up there. ...or to laugh out loud. ♪ but when it matters most, you count on tracfone to keep you connected for less. ♪ our smartphone plan gives you talk, text and data with unlimited carryover starting at $15 a month, no contract. all with nationwide 4g lte coverage. get top smartphones or bring your own phone. tracfone. for moments that matter. 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>> you know, it's very hard to say. there is 20 candidates. i think the a record number is going to get through the first four. the problem for joe biden is everybody loves him. he is the former vice president associated with the most popular democrat in america, and he is at 27. what's going to get him to 28. >> he is -- it's a long time. >> right. very long time. >> and we forget. >> yeah. >> at this point when you were running, where were you in the race? >> i was sort of in the top six. because there were only six serious candidates. >> right. >> what happened to me is i had a very powerful message -- actually, in retrospect, i realized i ran against the democratic party because they were all voting for bush's tax cuts and the iraq war. and i really surged to the leader of the pack after we outraged john kelly becau ed jo were doing crowd funding before anybody else was. >> joe biden is having a fundraiser at a house tonight. he is in pennsylvania. he is clearly focusing a lot on that. how do you -- >> here's the problem with this race and with joe biden being in the race, and he is a good guy and may well win the nomination. this party is being taken over by 35-year-olds. the people who won the races are 35 years old. and they're mostly centrists. they're not particularly liberals. aoc gets all the press and whom i'm a big fan of, they get all the press. there is 37 people that come from orange county, texas, oklahoma, kansas. that's where we picked up the seats. >> but more centrist democrat? >> they're more centrist, but they're also pro-gay rights. they're pro women's rights. this is a very different party than even the one joe biden ran in 2012. very different. >> how does he deal with that? >> i don't know. that's the big test. look, a lot of people could win this race. there is 20 people in there. i think it's going to take $20 million to get to the starting line. if you can't raise $20 million, you're gone. i think that's going to take care of about six or eight of these folks, and then anybody could win. but it is not the same party that it was five years ago. >> the people in the party who are those 35-year-olds, are they focused on somebody who speaks their values, you know, who holds their opinions and can beat donald trump or is beating donald trump? >> great question. nate silver did a great article on this on 558. hope i'm allowed to say that on cnn. and i don't read these articles, but he backs this up. the fascinate thing is when you poll likely democratic voter that. >> want two things. they want somebody who can beat trump. that's more important than their values, but their values are very important, and they use both. now how that -- look, we are eight months out from the first primary. we have a long way to go. a lot of things are going to happen that we can't possibly imagine. >> it's impossible to predict. >> every race is like this. nobody could have imagined i was going to -- i remember dick gephardt when i announced he'll be gone by new hampshire. dick gephardt was gone by new hampshire. >> how do you think you would do in a race today? >> well, i don't think -- i have to be neutral and i am neutral. but i said publicly before i got the job which is coordinating the dnc data stuff that i thought this race should be run by a 50-year-old, not a 70-year-old. i wouldn't run today because i'm 70 years old. i think we need the new generation. the best thing that can happen is have the democratic party taken over by 35-year-olds. it's happening. now it's happening. now. >> real supply there are a lot of people who aren't 35 anymore who would probably beg to differ. >> unless you can lengthen your telomeres. help them. get them into it. i've run for something, voter of change, latino, there are about 11 groups that do the things that the democratic party used to do, and they do it unbelievably well. run for something recruited 15,000 candidates. they ran for county chair -- i mean county officer and school board. that's how you have to build the party. these young people are doing it just the way they flocked to the polls for obama. the bitter lesson they learned in 2016 is not good enough to just go out in presidential races. and now they have learned that lesson. >> governor dean, always interesting. >> thank you. president trump denies that his own white house lawyer swore was true under oath and he has notes about it. i'll talk with the congressman who says that pushing a lot of democrats into the impeachment camp. we'll be right back. fferent deal every weekday til six pm like endless shrimp monday admiral's feast tuesday four course feast wednesday and more. five days. five deals. fifteen dollars. see you before six. when it comes to reducing the evsugar in your family's diet,m. coke, dr pepper and pepsi hear you. we're working together to do just that. bringing you more great tasting beverages with less sugar or no sugar at all. smaller portion sizes, clear calorie labels and reminders to think balance. because we know mom wants what's best. more beverage choices, smaller portions, less sugar. balanceus.org plants capture co2. what if other kinds of plants captured it too? if these industrial plants had technology that captured carbon like trees we could help lower emissions. carbon capture is important technology - and experts agree. that's why we're working on ways to improve it. so plants... can be a little more... like plants. ♪ at a comfort inn with a glow taround them, so people watching will be like, "wow, maybe i'll glow too if i book direct at choicehotels.com." who glows? just say, badda book. badda boom. book now at choicehotels.com. congressional subpoenas are still boom raining around the white house and landing back on capitol hill with no sign of cooperation. tonight president trump is not ruling out executive privilege to block former white house counsel don mcgahn from testifying. the mueller report revealed that mcgahn said under oath the president ordered him to fire mueller. today on twitter the president denied giving mcgahn the order saying if he wanted to, he could have fired mueller himself. it's interesting that the president is not known for terminating people in the administration on his own. despite what he did on "the apprentice," he seems to not like to fire people face-to-face. the only known face-to-face firing the president has done himself is michael flynn. he usually gets other people to do it or does it over twitter. as for the subpoena fight, elijah cummings is condemning what he calls a massive, unprecedented and growing pattern of obstruction. short time ago i spoke with congressman gerry connolly. >> congressman connelly, the president's assertion that he never told don mcagain to fire mueller, he is basically accusing mcgahn of perjuring himself under oath. >> yeah. i suppose it's possible that donald trump had a henry ii moment, will nobody rid me of this troublesome priest with respect to the archbishop of canterbury, but i downtown it. didn't appear before the special prosecutor. don mcgahn did, multiple times. so he's under oath and at risk of perjury if he lies. and he testified, apparently, that donald trump told him to fire the special prosecutor, which is why this is an issue, because that could be construed and has been as obstruction of justice. donald trump, who was not under oath and has a history of prevarication, as long as the mississippi river, we're supposed to suddenly take his word that this didn't happen, he could have done it on his own. i'll take don mcgahn any day over the world of donald trump. >> don mcgahn, who, by the way, was keeping contemporaneous notes which the president himself took issue with. >> that's right. >> so then the question is yeah, do you trust the general counsel of the white house, who is taking notes at the time and, you know, is an attorney who has taken an oath or the president who, as you said, has the history that he has. yesterday you said that the president's moves have triggered a constitutional crisis. in what? in the way he is trying to block these investigations? >> he basically said we're done with cooperating with any subpoenas, any subpoenas involving any of these investigations with the congress. you don't get to do that as the chief executive of the united states government. you must respect the constitutional checks and balances written by our founders. >> don mcgahn is a private citizen now. even if the president doesn't want him to testify, if he is subpoenaed, does the white house really have any authority over whether don mcgahn testifies, given that they already gave up executive privilege to allow mcgahn to testify in front of mueller? >> i think the white house has no legs to stand on with respect to don mcgahn's testimony. i think you make a great point. number one, he is a private citizen. he can decide to ignore the claim of executive privilege by the white house. he is no longer a federal employee, let alone a white house employee. but secondly, i believe any reasonable interpretation of the willingness of the president to allow his general counsel, his white house counsel to testify not once, but many times before the special prosecutor can be easily construed as waiving the executive privilege. >> if the white house fights these subpoenas, which certainly seems to be what the game they plan to play here, fight everything as long as you can, try to run out the clock on them, i mean, the reality is they're only valid until 2021 when a new congress is seated. >> that's right. i'm a strict constructionist in this matter. we are a separate but coequal branch of government. we have immense powers at our disposal, both real ones we exercise currently and latent ones that we could. and i believe anyone who defies a legitimately issued subpoena by the congress of the united states puts him or herself in enormous legal peril, and that can include fines, contempt of congress, civil pursuit in courts of law, and possible incarceration. but i think it's a very unwise thing to cooperate with an across the board defiance of constitutionally legally issued subpoenas by the congress. >> so you could see a scenario if somebody is refusing to respond to a subpoena of actually trying to put them in jail? >> i believe that that is -- that is one potential option. i hope it doesn't come to that. we haven't done it since the 1870s, apparently, but that is a latent power of congress. we can independent of a court incarcerate somebody who fails to comply with a lawfully issued subpoena. and the consequences can go that high. and so if people want to damage their reputation, lawyer up, have fines that are $25,000 a day is one discussion under way, or put themselves in actually jeopardy of being incarcerated, have at it. but i think trump is putting his own people in grave jeopardy. >> congressman gerry connolly, appreciate it. thank you. >> my pleasure, anderson. well, coming up, someone named trump is on "the ridiculist," but it's not the president. what happened when his daughter-in-law, who of course is a high-ranking campaign official according to the administration went on fox and started riffing on global affairs. stick around. like those from buddy. because stuffed animals are clearly no substitute for real ones. feel the clarity. and live claritin clear. with a lot of other young couples. then we noticed something...strange. oh, could you, uh, make me a burger? 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[ laughter ] -everyone acts like their parents. -you have a tattoo. -yes. -fun. do you not work? -so, what kind of mower you got, seth? -i don't know. some kid comes over. we pay him to do it. -but it's not all bad. someone even showed us how we can save money by bundling home and auto with progressive. progressive can't protect you from becoming your parents. but we can protect your home and auto. progressive can't protect you from becoming your parents. it's nice. ♪ you got this! ♪ woo! ♪ ♪ ♪ tonight we welcome to the list first daughter-in-law laura trump. she made herself a public figure with a public role in the campaign. who says the president can't hire family members. they do it in dictatorships all the time and it works for them. so why not here? we're not that different are we? she's married to the president's son eric. was given a job at the department of housing and development. laura trump's brother was given a job at the energy department. this morning on barney and company, a show on fox business network lara trump was appearing because that's what she does and trazing the trump administration's decision to make it more difficult for people fleeing domestic violence to ask for asylum here in america and also doesn't like all the syrian people that fled the war and ended up in germany and expressed her dislike and concern in a way that proves once again you don't have to be born into the trump family to share the president's remarkable grasp of world history. >> that videotape reminds me of what happened in europe when there was a march across europe by a million people that wanted to get into western europe. angela merkel let them in. open boarders. >> and it was the downfall of germany. it was the one of the worst things that ever happened to germany. this president knows that. >> oh, yeah, no, yeah. the downfall of germany. it was one of the worst things that ever happened to germany. so says lara trump, senior campaign adviser to the president of the united states who she also now says agrees with her belief that refugees are one of the worst things that ever happened to germany. so there's a lot to unpack. number one, germany hasn't fallen. she says the downfall of germany. it's where it's always been. i've been on vacation. it's doing just fine. as for refugees in germany being one of the worst things to ever happen in germany, come on. come on, really. i know she said one of but even that, i mean, look, if you don't know what the downfall of germany really was, here's what you do, you ask a fifth grader. maybe even a fourth grader, a really smart third grader or how about anyone that knows anything about world war ii or the nazis and you don't equate anything else with it. you don't go on cable television and just rif about the downfall of germany, the worst thing that ever happened to germany. maybe just stick to your own make belief newscast on youtube. >> hey, everybody i'm laura trump thank you for joining us to hear all about the president's week. >> real news. that's actually on youtube. that actually exists. that's real. i mean, it exists in the sense that it's real. she's a senior adviser and turns out a tv personality in an alternative universe called real news update. it's a good example of what happens when politics reaches the crossroads of authoritarianism and the cast of dynasty though i'm not sure which character she is. i do highly recommend if you like your campaign propaganda like you like your trump steaks heavy on branding, light on sourcing and available through the sharper image. oh, that was the vodka? you're right. i'm sorry. i mixed up my trump branded products. she does have a background in television. she used to work for the sind kated show inside edition which is now hosted by someone that i know and like a lot. she is wonderful, smart, soal lenlted and i'm happy she is back on air. the old inside edition was hosted by someone else entirely. >> do it live. we'll do it live. >> so that happened. it was classic. anyway, laura trump left that gig and now has this gig. i should also point out she is a vocal advocate for rights for animals, horses, which is great, commendable. it's awesome she does that using her platform to speak out for those that can't speak. awesome. i would just point out human beings are good too and we can debate immigration legal and otherwise but let's not forget there's people's lives at stake. aren't all good people, many of them are and they're in fear for their lives. again you can debate the issues but let's have a common basis point. these are human beings. this administration may at times have you believe otherwise. as a student in history she has a long way to go. she has firmly set up shop on the ridiculist. and sarah sanders holds her first briefing in 46 days. we kncannot wait to tell you wh she said and to whom she was speaking. you might think it's a joke but it's actually real, that's coming up. parts of me i didn't even know. i find out i'm 19% native american, specifically from the chihuahua people. what?! that's... i find that crazy. it traces their journey in the mid-1800s from central mexico to texas. learning about the risks they took for a better life... ...it gives me so much respect and gratitude. it just shed so much light in my past that i never even would've known was there. 20 million members have connected to a deeper family story. order your kit at ancestry.com. woman: this is your wake-up call. if you have moderate to severe rheumatoid arthritis, month after month, the clock is ticking on irreversible joint damage. ongoing pain and stiffness are signs of joint erosion. humira can help stop the clock.
CharlottesvilleVirginiaUnited-statesNew-yorkNew-hampshireTexasAnderson-wellPhiladelphiaPennsylvaniaWashingtonDelawareWhitehouse ♪ ♪ ♪ good evening. president trump doubling down on a falsehood not to mention visiting one of his presidency's all time lows. claiming that there were very fine people among the nazis in charlottesville two summers ago. >> if you look at what i said you will see that that question was answered perfectly and i was talking about people that went because they felt very strongly about the monument to robert e. lee a great general whether you like it or not, he was one of the great generals. i have spoken to many generals here right at the white house and many people thought of the generals they think he was maybe their favorite general. people were there protesting the taking down of the monument of robert e. lee. everybody knows that. >> so just keep that in your mind that people were there were there to protest the taking down or the attempt to take down the monument of robert e. lee and everybody knows that. so the president was responding to joe biden that make similar remarks on charlottesville, the centerpiece of his campaign kick off video. >> those words the president of the united states assigned a moral equivalence between those spreading hate and those with the courage to stand against it. >> clearly biden's video urked the president. is there any reason why the president just chose to double down on his previous comments which to this day are widely condemned and just not really accurate? >> well, anderson, as you know the president is never one to back off of something that he has already staked a position on but if you'll remember those two summers ago the president made those comments about very fine people and then the white house orchestrated another speech in which he layed out more electrical kwen eloquently a response to the charlottesville events of that summer and what happened after that was that privately the president really seemed to regret having made that second speech. he regretted the idea that he had to back down from something he said that he didn't think that was wrong. he's expressing what he believed from this entire time which was that he was being taken out of context and in a similar fashion to how he responded to people that abandoned him after the "access hollywood" video, this moment in his presidency really became a test for him. and his loyalty to people that stook by him told you everything about whether he thought he got that wrong. >> was there anybody that pushes back against the president or could convince him not to say this? >> a lot of people in the white house have taken a very different approach to dealing with president trump. many of them left here simply acknowledged that the president is going to do what he wants. he's going to say what he wants and he's going to tweet what he wants. they don't try to get ahead of it or advise him against it. he's not likely to take their advice anyway. you see a lot of aids that have re-signed to reacting to what he is doing on a day-to-day basis. this is yet another example of something he has thrown on to their plates they would rather not be talking about. 3.2% gdp. the white house would love to talk about that but instead the president decided to take joe biden on over the issue of charlottesville and they would rather do anything but that. >> the president saying he answered questions about this perfectly, it does seem like an alternative universe. >> yeah, you know, perfectly badly. i don't think the president understands how painful this is and how dangerous this is. this is, you know, the worst people in the country, the hate mongers, the violent fringe love when he does this. it's not an academic discussion in a classroom some place, this has political consequences in real time in our country. he's giving aid and comfort to a terrorist part of america. he's got to cut it out. neo nazis, tiki torches. >> it's outrage. >> with him saying this is just about the monument to robert e. lee that's not true. friday night marching to the lee memorial were young men with tiki torches chanting jews will not replace us, you will not replace us blood and soil do you agree? >> i agree with that and so does the president. >> he said the next day there were good people on both sides. >> there's either a disconnect or distortion of the president's words. he has absolutely condemned white nationalists and has condemned those anti-semetic remarks and individuals and we all do. >> he initially denied knowing anything about white supremacy and david duke. he had criticized him. >> but let me just ask -- i think this has really been quite unfair to the president. i think he has condemned that. i think when the initial reporting on this was actually quite fair. there was a distinction when you see the entire statement. his words have been taken completely out of context. this is a president whose son-in-law is an orthodox jew, whose daughter converted to judaism. one of his key advisers-vil is jewish and the strongest ally of israel. to say he is anti-semitic. >> gary cohen threatened to re-sign because of the president's response to this. >> well he didn't and there's plenty of jewish americans serving in the cabinet that see it completely differently. but the president condemns anti-semitism and neo nazis. >> he has a lot of them supporting him and seems to send out messages that keep them happy. >> how many of these people exist in our country? it is a small group. >> no, no. >> this is a small number of individuals. >> no. no. don't do that. >> quit saying that. quit saying that. it's a small number of people. they're a small number of people whose job it was to go around killing white men. i don't think you'd be saying that's a small number of people that decided they want to go and kill white men. why are you so concerned about it. you'd say there's a group of people trying to kill white men, do something. don't minimize this. >> i'm not minimize this. it's the definition of minimizing it. if we're going to have a conversation you make a fair point that there are people that on the merits have a different view of this statute and they should not all be demonized as racists but you go way too far when you take it upon yourself to minimize concerns of people about a terrorist movement in the country coming from me and not for you. my kids and not for yours. don't minimize this. >> when the president says something like this, i'm wondering how it resinate there is. >> well, it simply brings up a lot of very bad memories. look this was not about the statues i was there. i watched that small group of neo nazis. hundreds and hundreds of hundreds of almost entirely young men. some of whom were shouting slogans and doing all kinds of things that were obnoxious. look at the advertising that they put out for that weekend it had nothing to do with the statue of robert e. lee or stone wall jackson. it looked very nazi-like because that's what it was the one that will always stick with me is into the ovens. that's how wonderful and how fine these people were. >> heather heyer was murdered. she was killed by a terrorist in the united states of america and the president of the united states did not respond perfectly. that was not the time to try to have a conversation about american history and to defend the good intentions of somebody else. that was a time to be as forceful as he could and on paper, what was written on paper and has been forgotten what he read on paper actually was fo e forceful but then he erased it. he shouldn't say he had done it perfectly. >> things that were written out for him he couldn't even just read those without adding in his own good people on both sides. he cannot stop himself. he's appealing to these people as if that's a constituent sy. that's not a constituentcy. >> thank you very much. >> thank you. well, plenty more to talk about tonight including a story that you likely haven't heard before about when president obama talked joe biden out of running for president in 2016. later new reporting on a stunning detail from the mueller report, a portrait of a president that had to bring in outside help to do his dirty work and how the guy he asked turned him down. hy-a-luronic acid. it's in here. new from revitalift: derm intensives hyaluronic acid serum with our highest concentration of hyaluronic acid visibly plumps skin and reduces wrinkles. bounce back! new revitalift hyaluronic acid serum from l'oreal. do you battery sound. want a charge? 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>> first of all, remember what had happened memorial weekend of 2015 was that biden son's bo died and biden was overwhelmed with grief and in bad shape emotionally over that as one would expect and obama thought he wasn't in the right emotional space to run as biden eventually said was the case and obama also thought hillary clinton should the nominee and didn't think biden could beat her in the primaries. >> how much did biden regret not running four years ago? >> that goes back and forth. sometimes he talks about it and sometimes it lands on maybe i would have won. those things are always tough to do, bob casey, a senator from pennsylvania that supported clinton but was one of the first out of the gate endorsing biden yesterday said to me it's one of the great imponderables, would he have won. >> he essentially had his long time adviser break the news to biden that he shouldn't run in 2016. he asked him, quote, do you really want it to end in a hotel room in des moines coming in third to bernie sanders? what changed from then until now? that's a possibility this time too. >> one of the things that was going on there is that obama thought that biden was going to get to the decision not to run earlier than he did so obama started exerting pressure on him and sent him to meet with him and layed it out for biden that way. a lot has changed since 2015. first of all, donald trump is the president and biden does feel that this is an exten smom the country and he has to try to get into it. that's how he put it in the video he put out launching his campaign. he couldn't stand by and watch this happen. the other thing that's going on though is that in 2015, the summer went by as he was grieving and he didn't put a campaign together. he was looking at trying to take on the clinton juggernaut at that point on very little notice and very little preparation. now he is getting in obviously later than a number of the other candidates but still pretty early in this race. >> you're also reporting that the whole idea joe biden wouldn't have future presidential aspirations was part of the reason that then candidate obama chose him in the first place. >> if you look back at the clinton white house for example that became an issue into the second term as it tends to be when a president has a vice president. there is a concern of competing ambitions and there were several reasons. he's run for president twice. he is done. we won't have to think about that as an issue. >> do you believe biden -- i mean, he is claiming that he asked president obama not to endorse him, i mean, it's not as if -- we don't know the circumstances of this. it's not as if president obama would have endorsed anybody at this stage. >> journalistic terms that sometimes go around and obama decided that he was not going to endorse early given the size of the field. if you parse it carefully that's obama saying it was my decision and biden saying it was my decision. he asked me not to endorse him. he said he didn't want to win the nomination because obama said that's my guy but it doesn't seem like obama was quite ready to say that. >> thank you so much. more next on the question did president trump obstruct justice? 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now that's simple, easy, awesome. customize each line by paying for data by the gig or get unlimited. and now get $100 back when you buy a new lg. click, call, or visit a store today. the notion of president's aids not carrying out his instructio instructions. the mueller report said he was asked to recap the probe and he knew it wasn't a good idea. this reporting about people not following the president's orders is actually sworn system given to robert mueller. is it consistent with what you saw or heard in your time in the white house? >> i write a little bit about this in team of vipers. there's two types of presidential orders. one is the type that you follow immediately. the second is the type that you kind of see if he brings it back up again later on and most of the times these things were like not the more serious directives. there's a keen in the book where the president says he wants to do the fake news awards. it's the first time he brought that up as a concept. to laughed about it and didn't hear anything about it and brought it back up again and he was more serious about it. and i think it's more often what happens is not that someone disobeys an order but people use whatever power they have to slow walk his directives. i think that's what i saw more often than just direct insubordination. >> slow walk in the fact that he'll just forget about it. >> i don't know if it's just forget about it. they talk a lot about it behind the scenes. that was something that the generals did not feel comfortable with and there's been pretty dramatic reporting about various blow ups and conversations that happened about that but the generals were using their authority to slow walk that decision in hopes of changing the president's mind or providing him with additional information that would maybe get him to change course and sometimes as in general mattis's case with syria, it even actually came to a head and he said i can't implemented this. you need someone that will follow your directive and i have to depart. i respect that about general mat gatt mattis but i never respected when someone would undermine a directive and just not follow through on it and do it in perpetuity. i don't think that's a good precedent to set. >> he told don mcgahn that the president wanted him to shutdown this investigation and don mcgahn point blank said no. and that's something that is again just defying a direct order but don mcgahn knew legally he would get himself and the president would get himself in a world of hurt over that. >> and i think ultimately this is the kind of thing that the president still has the ultimate authority. if he gave someone an order. >> it really came to a head when he said do this and someone says no. >> that's what is so interesting about the mueller report is that you have corey lewandowski that you would think would do just about anything for the president. the president telling him to get a message to sessions to intervene and change the course of the investigation. he said oh, sure i'll do that. doesn't do it. the president asked him about it about a month or so later, lewandowski tries to pawn it off on deerborn. he says i'll deal with it and he doesn't do anything about it because they all know none of them want to be tainted with this. i know that you're in litigation with the white house and can't get into specifics but broadly it is people that weren't government employees. relies on a talk show host for communications advice. >> i do think that there is clearly a constellation of outside loyalists. there's others that fit that description. i never witnessed him outsource a typical government related function to someone outside of the government but i don't think there's any question that he relies on the advice of people for a long time. >> thank you for being back, appreciate it. >> thanks for having me. >> one of president trump's chief antagonists could face the rest of his life in prison if found guilty. we're going to hear from him, next. ♪ here i go again on my own ♪ goin' down the only road i've ever known ♪ ♪ like a drifter i was-- ♪ born to walk alone! keep goin' man! you got it! if you ride, you get it. ♪ here i go again geico motorcycle. 15 minutes could save you 15% or more. at first slice pizza lovers everywhere meet o, that's good! frozen pizza one third of our classic crust is made with cauliflower but that's not stopping anyone o, that's good! like.. pnc easy lock, so you can easily lock your credit card when its maximum limit differs from its vertical limit. and clover flex, for when you need to take credit cards when no one carries cash. or requesting a call to help get a new credit card- one that hasn't followed the family goldfish. pnc - make today the day. you wouldn't accept from any one else. why accept it from your allergy pills? 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>> did i say we'd ride off into the sunset? yes. was it in the context they allege? absolutely not. they figured out they couldn't buy me. they couldn't own me. they couldn't control me. >> avenati is accusing nike of rigging the college basketball recruitment process by bribing them to attend nike sponsored schools. they said it would not respond to an individual facing charges of extortion. 1.5 million for his clients between 15 and 25 million to hire him and his co-counsel to lead an internal investigation or a payment of 22.5 million and no investigation. instead of making a deal with them, nike called the fbi saying it was being extorted. the fbi began recording the meetings. the case came to a head in just under a week after this tweet avenati announcing a press conference. >> what happened after that? >> i was arrested shortly there after. >> were you saying to them pay me hush money, i'll be quite. i'll go away, i'll walk out the door? >> no, never. never happened. >> the accusation concerning hush money is especially ironic considering the case that brought his name into the american consciousness. >> michael avenatti. >> the high flying litigator became a household name when he represented porn star stormy danders th daniels that sued the president of the united states. >> we're committed to making sure that everyone finds out the truth. >> she wanted out of a hush agreement to keep quite about a sexual affair she had with donald trump. trump denied the affair. >> did you think you were going to bring down the president? >> i immediately saw that as an opportunity to do collateral damage to the president of the united states. in that regard i accomplished the goal although not entirely. >> avenatti's thea tricks and legal zingers became a fixture on cable news. after an investigation he referred to the southern district of new york, cohen admitted to a total of nine criminal counts including orchestrating that hush payment to daniels on trump's behalf to effect the 2016 presidential election. >> i don't think his sentence is strong enough by any stretch of the imagination and i don't believe that other people around him that participated in that including donald trump the president of the united states should somehow get a pass. i believe donald trump should be indicted. >> but now avenatti is facing serious charges and potential prison time. more than 300 years if convicted. the very same day he was arrested in new york, the u.s. attorney in california charged him in another separate case. eventually bringing 36 counts including wire fraud, bank fraud, and bankruptcy fraud. but perhaps the most stunning charge, stealing from his own clients. one of them a paman named jeffr johnson. >> your paraplegic client said he did not receive what he was supposed to receive of a $4 million settlement. did you defraud him? >> i'm not able to get into the details of that particular situation because i have been advised about not to do it. if it was up to me i'd tell my side of the story. >> but he did do that using twitter as his bull horn. he posted this document showing a glowing recommendation that he said his client signed a month before the indictment. >> his attorney said what you posted was actually you tricked him into signing something saying you were a great attorney and he was happy with your services. that you stole money from him. how do you respond to that? >> that assertion by the attorney is absurd. >> prosecutors are also saying the same thing. >> prosecutors are saying all kinds of things but that doesn't mean that they're all true or provable. >> that wasn't the only client prosecutors say he defrauded. there are four others including an nba player that wanted to quitely pay monies to his ex-girlfriend for her long time support but nearly all the $2.7 million settlement was alleged used to pay for this, avenatti's personal jet. >> did you own a private jet? >> i had an interest in a private jet, yes, but there's nothing unusual about some of these factors relating to my life style. have i had a privileged lifestyle? of course. have i had a lifestyle that some people would describe as lavish at times, yes? i'm a self-made guy. i put myself through law school and nothing was ever handed to me and i busted my ass for a lot of what i received. >> prosecutors have tied your lifestyle. they accused you of buying that jet with $2.5 million that belonged to a client from a settlement. are they right? >> we'll have facts that are evidence and present that to a jury and a jury is going to decide up or down whether i'm convicted or not and it's their obligation. >> and you usually -- if there's nothing but truth out there and you did none of this, why can't you just tell me? >> because here's the problem, because my lawyers didn't even want me to sit down for this interview. we have had debates about this and the problem is that i have been told to say nothing. >> avenatti rarely shies away from a controversy. >> it's time to come clean. >> stepping into the spotlight with the biggest headlines of 2018. >> he groped me and tried to take off my clothes. >> as u.s. supreme court nominee brett kavanaugh faced sexual assault allegations. >> but i have never done this to her or to anyone. >> avenatti emerged with a second accuser. >> she is 100% credible. >> republicans and some democrats viewed his insertion into the case as an outrageous stunt. >> do you interject yourself purposefully for your own fame and your own fortune in these cases that made headlines? >> do i interject myself? no, i receive a call from a client. >> she never testified. she was accused of lying but her allegations were never investigated. >> when the border battle over child separation emerged, so did avenatti with clients whose children were alone and afraid. in one case he went all the way to guatemala to deliver a mother's most precious gift. and unexpectedly received one of his own. >> as a father myself, it was one of the best days of my clear. i remember it like it was yesterday. he gave me a -- i have it in my briefcase and carry it with me. it was in my briefcase when i was arrested. it's a fabric bracelet that he made me to thank me for bringing him back to his mom. >> would you consider running for the democratic ticket in 2020? >> avenatti began to consider running for president. >> stand up. join the fight club. >> he tested the waters in west hollywood and the crowd swooned. >> president avenatti. >> i sleep better because you're in the world. i'm not kidding. >> what's your name? >> we hit harder from iowa to new hampshire to texas he began fund-raising for democrats but problems with his own financials followed him. a judge ordered one of his firms to pay his former partner $10 million and another $800,000 he owed to the irs. he has yet to pay all his debts. >> are you broke? >> no, i don't think i'm broke. >> well, you know if you're broke or not. are you broke? >> no. >> 100% sure. >> no, i'm not broke. >> okay. are you having money problems. >> no, i don't believe i'm having money problems. there's been challenges along the way, there's no question about that. >> avenatti still had his eye on the presidency. >> michael avenatti is under arrest for allegations of felony domestic violence. >> did you hit, slap, drag the young lady in your departmenapa? >> absolutely not. that's why no charges have been brought. >> after that he bounce bad k in d bounced back into the headlines. >> he said he had given a video tape that showed kelly having sex with an underage girl. >> at first his new evidence in super star r. kelly's case energized a public clamoring for justice. but it wouldn't be long before kelly's attorney would use avenatti's legal troubles against him. >> he is basically saying r. kelly's case has been tainted because of what happened to michael avenatti and the case is rotten. >> it's a desperate attorney for a desperate man. it's absolutely absurd. >> now avenatti is fighting the biggest case of his life. the case against him. >> you're facing potential of 300 years in prison if convicted. will you fight these charges or will you make a plea deal? >> i anticipate fighting all the charges. >> have you thought about the prospect of proten sotentially to spend time in prison? >> there's no question i have thought about that. >> there are some people that are delighting in what they see is your facade being exposed. trump junior mocks avenatti, you might just get to share a cell with cohen. avenatti crash and burns. did you crash and burn? >> no, this is a tough business. we operate now in an environment that's more toxic politically that has we ever have experienced in the history of the united states. >> haven't you contributed to that. >> largely due to social media. >> to the toxic nature of topics? >> i don't think so. i don't think i have trafficked in nonsense and personal attacks for the most part. >> he also made clear why he thinks he's fashion -- >> especially over the last 18 months. >> you're eluding to a conspiracy against you. >> i'm not eluding to a conspiracy. >> you are. >> what i'm saying is the facts are the facts. >> the fact is they have been investigating him for two years long before avenatti ever met stormy daniels. daniels and avenatti parted ways earlier this year. when he was arrested for financial crimes daniels tweeted she was not shocked adding that he treated her extremely dishonestly. he denies being dishonest. >> was it worth it to take on this case? >> if you would have asked me that nine months ago i would have said absolutely. as i sit here today, sarah, i just don't know because the price paid by me and my family and those around me has been enormous. >> you sound like a man humbled by this. is that fair? >> there's no question i have been humbled. regardless of what happens i have had an enormous life. i have had a lot of opportunities that a lot of people can only dream of and i have done a lot of things that a lot of people would never have an opportunity to do. >> are you afraid you're going to lose it all? >> of course i'm afraid. again if i wasn't afraid of that, there would be something fundamentally wrong with me as a man, and as a human being. but i can't have that consume me. otherwise i might as well just crawl into a fetal position and wither away and i'm not going out like that and i'm not planning on going out period. >> up next, this weekend's debut of season 4 of united shades of america. what he discovered when looking into mega churches. last years' ad campaign was a success for choicehotels.com badda book. badda boom. this year, we're taking it up a notch. so in this commercial we see two travelers at a comfort inn with a glow around them, so people watching will be like, "wow, maybe i'll glow too if i book direct at choicehotels.com". who glows? 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ask an asthma specialist about fasenra. if you can't afford your medication, astrazeneca may be able to help. . united states shades of america kicks off its fourth season. for the premiere episode kamau takes us to dallas for a look at big business focused on prayer that many cases earns millions of dollars. the episode that's coming up this sunday is about megachurches, such a fascinating topic. have you spent time in megachurches before this? >> i grew up with a lot of churches with my mom and dad growing up. but these are all several thousand. >> did you have an opinion about it going in, skepticism? >> i always take a healthy dose of skepticism everywhere i go? >> the face of the megachurch is joel 'ol steen, white heterosexual man, dressed in a suit. there's different kinds of megachurches, we talked to a huge church that's in social justice, and pastor neal at the cathedral of hope, the largest lgbtq plus megachurch in the world. >> i want to take a look at some of what you found. >> there's pastors to say i stay out of politics. and other people who say everything but. >> kind of blatant. >> what do you think about that thing, you should not be political? >> well, i mean, honestly i think it's kind of fake to say you're not political because you can't even go to the bathroom without it being political. so then why not have some kind of influence? that is, you know, tryiyou know righteous. i'm pushing for justice. >> how are these megachurches, often wealthy and do have some political capital, how are they using that in politics? >> well, there's this idea that like we talked to pastor ed who's not being political but pastor freddie haynes says everything you do is political, even if pastor ed is not talking about politics, you're in texas, the immigration crisis is going on, but not talking about that, you're saying we can ignore this thing, that's political. the idea churches aren't allowed to go say vote for this candidate but there are megachurches around the country, especially in dallas, building the framework where they say go vote for trump. they call them maga churches. there's this idea to separate church and state. we haven't done that. we should really own up to that and say, okay, if we're going to do this let's at least know where all this money is going. you don't know what's going on with money in churches, they're not like nonprofits where they have to tell you where it's going. the church we talked to with pastor ed, it's worth $11 million. shouldn't we be able to know what you're spending the money you're doing with? >> what would anthony bourdain think about that? such a great shirt. >> i would have loved to do the episode with him and so he could sit next to me and get sick. >> he would have gone to the barbecue part in dallas. >> what other episodes you're looking at? >> this show -- every show there's a new theme that emerges so we make an episode based op that. everywhere i go, airports, coffee shops, white people come up to me and say what can i do, how can i help, can i retweet you more? and so we have an episode called not all white people, that's about white activism, anti-racist activism in this country, the john brown gun club white liberal gun toting people. the mung americans. >> anthony was also obsessed with the secret war in laos. >> i learned the history and their history of the secret war, fascinating episode. >> w.kamau bell, thank you so much. >> thank you. >> don't miss the seen 4 premiere, united shades of america, sunday night 10:00 p.m. eastern and pacific. we'll be right back. to cover the essentials in retirement, as well as all the things you want to do. and on the way, you'll get timely investment help to keep you on the right track, without the unnecessary fees you might expect from so many financial firms. because when you have a partner who gives you clarity at every step, there's nothing to stop you from moving forward. who gives you clarity at every step, if ywhen you brush or floss, you don't have to choose between healthy gums and strong teeth. complete protection from parodontax has 8 designed benefits for healthy gums and strong teeth. complete protection from parodontax. ten detailed acts of obstruction of justice. robert mueller's report lays out a roadmap for impeachment proceedings against this president and challenges congress to do its job. i'm tom steyer and we can't let this president destroy the public trust, break his oath of office and get away with it. congress has to do its job and hold him accountable. please call them at this number. tell them to get going. but allstate actually helps you drive safely... with drivewise. it lets you know when you go too fast... ...and brake too hard. with feedback to help you drive safer. giving you the power to actually lower your cost. unfortunately, it can't do anything about that. now that you know the truth... are you in good hands? 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New-yorkUnited-statesTexasWashingtonIowaLaosHollywoodCaliforniaWhitehouseDistrict-of-columbiaSyriaDallas despite the fact that you think i'm a godless marxist heathen, i went to church a lot as a kid. i don't go now, but it's easy to find ways to fill up sunday mornings like protesting the nfl. a lot of folks are looking for the message of jesus. >> that's the god we serve. that's the first miracle. >> those folks are joining mega churches filling up arenas and stadiums where beaver became born again and pastors begged members to tide for their private jets. >> if i wanted to, you cannot stop me. >> joel osteen got so big, he bought the building where the houston rockets played. if you are thinking evaporate i seen this go badly before? remember jim and tammy fay bakker? >> make a pledge of $5-00. >> he was indicted for wire fraud and he changed his ways and can be found selling meal buckets for the rapture. >> we have been doing what god spoke to me in prison would happen. the last days are coming. >> it has been put on steroids and church leaders are rolling in the profits. to be clear, that's profits with an i. churches with the magnitude wield a lot of power. spiritually and financially and politically. to find out what they are doing with the power, i'm going to mega churches in dallas, texas. dallas is the birth place of the mega church. 200 in texas, dallas is the buckle of the bible belt and the most powerful churches in the country. it's sunday morning outside of dallas and i'm a tenlding fellowship church. >> mega churches have become a pretty new expression in the last couple of decades. they don't want it to look tra digszal. >> i invited my bay area man of the cloth to attend sunday service with me. we met on a high level actist e-mail chain that i have no idea how i got on and his church is down the street from me and we got into trouble together. i like pastor mike's church. the 21st century social justice. >> we had our gun violence sabbath and want to appreciate all of you who participated. >> i have been to your church in berkeley, california. yours is a beautiful church and a little more homey. >> is it wrong when i see places like this, i get suspicious? >> wrong? i don't think it's wrong. this is a method to try and amplify a message. i'm curious about the message. if the message is whack, all of this is really quite problematic, particularly given the moment of time. i decided to take a peek in there. >> not only are you my spiritual back up, but my black back up. >> power to the people. this be like an arena. >> exactly. >> fellowship church is a southern baptist church. it's time america finally learns about christianity. a mega church is defined by the hartford institute as any patriot statue of liberty christian church having more than 2,000 people in attendance a week. process stand is with roman catholic and the orthodox church. process stands that attend baptist and lutheran churches, but fellowship is a big one in a state where everything is big. they have nine campuses and attracted 25,000 people a week with a broadcast reach to millions on line and service in grapevine is for all of his members to see. that means thousands of people get up and get out of bed and get dress and go to church to watch tv. i have 1100 youtube followers. jealous? i have to see how this works. i asked them to take me to the holy command center. >> this is the control room. >> is it like a bible verse? >> i'm going to turn you guys over to pastor derek. >> a preacher's kid, he grew up under the shadow of his father in houston. after playing hoops at florida state and cutting his teeth in smaller churches around texts on, he founded fellowship church and figured out a new way of doing church. >> the message is that god is pro sex. >> it received push back and ed is not in the business of being traditional. he's not only a pastor, but a brand. he has written 15 "new york times" bestsellers and owns casual fishing clothes. his network is $11 million. his relatable messages and stage stunts are pulling in more and more people to walk with ed. >> he calling different camera shots on stage and going through his message. >> amazing. >> nathan. >> you are literally running through the whole program every week. >> every week. >> where do you rehearse? >> in my battle room mirror. >> that's a level of production. this is like doing the grammys. >> this is amazing. >> it's early and i need my coffee. since we are in church, we will take you to a cold pot of coffee in the church basement. k lattes for the lord. >> it's the only coffee shop in a church coffee that i ever had. partake number one however you can get. >> these are all volunteers back here. >> how many volunteers do you have a week? >> so across the board, it's around 1500. every week. >> wow! >> yep, i realized that everybody i had seen had been working for free. the baristas and the people in the control room and the greeters in the door. this guy, that guy. her, them, them, that guy, everybody. i get people volunteer to help their church, but this mocha ain't free. the dvds ain't free. what happened with all that money? >> let's do it. >> how are you doing? >> good. nice to meet you. >> i like the jacket. >> thank you. >> thanks for being here, man. >> touch your neighbor. >> thank you for having us. paranormally i do this and i go through the kind of vibe and the flow of everything. i thought you might want to see some of the stuff maybe that we do. i don't know if it's unique or not. >> unique to me because i never have been on in a place like this. >> i'm not sure if he is pitching a sermon or a marvel movie. >> we have microscopic. >> i appreciate the enthusiasm. >> somebody help me. >> does he go everywhere with that microphone? >> i'm more confused now than when i walked in. >> one second is he is figuring out details on the sermon and next he is live streaming on instagram. >> welcome to instagram live. >> he has a run through. let's go to instagram live. >> and it splits -- >> how close to the first service? >> about 45 minutes away. >> i'm exhausted. >> you got it? >> this is the second one. >> this is typical. every week. we have a saying fc can mean frequent change. >> he's like let's move it. all right. >> my staff quits. >> this show that we are filming right now, all right. fair enough. 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>> i do. i thought it was a rock concert. >> in a good way. >> is this really church? >> good morning, fellowship church, how are we doing? >> i learned how they mega church. >> remember not liking church because you had to dress up. >> i don't think god is worried about how i look. >> what are do you like the most? >> the messages. it's easy to understand. >> after it's over. me and pastor mike are ready for the message. >> how are y'all doing some. >> it's mega church and this ain't your usual marathon. >> today i'm talking about the new testament. 27:56. >> in under one hour, they throws their hands up to three catchy rock songs and he tells us about every book in the bible. >> talking about the disciples. these guys were tough. >> and use pastor mike's line. >> touch your neighbor and say you are a disciple and so am i. say dino might. >> you might want to update your black reference or look like a jive turkey. as pastor mike and i have been seeing as much show business and church business. >> this is part of a performance. >> no doubt his performance and i'm not scared of saying we are entertaining. if you look at the gospels and jesus entertained. i hope you don't come off and hope you don't want it to be. >> i think that people who do not feel invited into the church and one of the things they see with a church like this, why is that where they are spending all that money? >> i never heard that in my whole life. >> the money, do you feel weird about the money? >> you know what, no. i don't, but i understand where you are coming from. when we started fellowship i was making $27,000 a year and lived in a rental house. we brought more than 10% to fellowship. now i make a lot more and we bring well over 10%. don't talk about how much money you have, what are you bringing and giving? give it to god. >> we do stuff from haiti and guatemala and from our camps and the up and out and the down and out. can we do a better job? heck yes. >> how do you make sure you don't go down that jimmy and tammy fay bakker. this requires a lot of money. how do you prevent that? >> you can put boards and audits and still go crazy. >> how does the money get here. they are start and maintained by money given by the kong immigration. the standard is 10% of your yearly earnings. they can take it right out of your bank account. they make up the pile of money spent on construction, mission work, av equipment and coffee shop supplies and salaries. the mega church pastors are on independently run boards. they determine reasonable ways for each pastor on the board. what's reasonable? god only knows. they didn't tell us. >> texas is a very political state. >> do you ever bring up the things going on in a political moment in your services? >> i have done things like what would jesus say it to lebron james or donald trump? what would jesus say to -- >> slow down. what would he say to donald trump? >> get behind satan! >> i try bible in one hand and newspaper in the other. our message is go out and vote. i never endorsed somebody. >> given the polarizing moment where we see white nationalism and racism and tribalism, do you ever worry that the american church has not figure out how to disciple people away from racism? >> yes. >> was jesus a racist? probably not. where is the disconnect? >> when someone is sincerely saved, their eyes are opened and hopefully they live that out. that's the conversation we need more and more. i totally agree with that. >> if we don't love each other, we will tear this earth apart. >> heck to the yes. >> i think these conversations are not just conversation. action. application. without application it is an abomination. i'm preaching more than you are shouting. amen! >> this is our not pastor ed because you are not jesus. that's not jesus either. that's charles manson. >> oh, man! golly! >> i'm happy we got to talk to ed today. even when mike said jesus looked like charles manson and they love him and do good work. >> show us, god, how to have the hard conversations and what it means to live them out, god. >> touch your neighbor, with consent. touch your neighbor, with consent. >> god bless you, man. >> in the bible of texas, it's advised to wash your prayers down with a bowl of chili. you know how texas works. eat, pray, football. >> touch your neighbor. with consent. >> just for clarity, am i supposed to eat this? >> eat it. >> so i should be careful? >> while talking with pastor mike, i couldn't help but think about something. >> does it ever get political? >> i haven't seen it. >> how are you not reckoning with a political moment? >> that is quite a -- to be like jesus and to be like so humble, i want to be like him, except -- except when you start talking about who you get to marry or except when -- >> opening up the borders. >> i want to be like jesus except. >> he was an immigrant and hate on immigrants when they show up. either you are following a jesus of your own making which i would argue many of us are, or you are following a jesus that forces you to have to wrestle with a real what would jesus not do, but what did jesus do. what did he do? we got a ways to go. we got a ways to go. >> i feel like i got challenged. you looked at me like i couldn't handle it. >> don't let the eagle get the best of you, bro. i see the sweat. >> i'm starting to see jesus. he doesn't look like charles manson, so that's good. your ver, your mammoth masterpiece. and...whatever this was. because we make our meat with the good of the deli and no artificial preservatives. make every sandwich count with oscar mayer deli fresh. 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(vo) quickbooks. backing you. i'm craving something we're! missing. the ceramides in cerave. they help restore my natural barrier, so i can lock in moisture. we've got to have each other's backs... cerave. now the #1 dermatologist recommended skincare brand. i still have a lot of questions about mega churches. time to lawyer up. do they have church lawyers? of course they do. >> is church a business? >> is church a business. they have to be run like a business often times. >> matt anthony runs a church law group. >> they have to accomplish their charitable purpose. >> now charities have to report how much they are given. it ends up where you think it's supposed to go. do churches have the same? >> charities have to file a public information tax return. they do not have to file a 990. >> do you think there is a separation of church and state in america? >> primarily there is. there is exceptions and time when the line is crossed. especially when it comes to politics. >> church and politics need to mix, but the way jesus intended. enjoy your holiday. let's get into one of the most controversial topics. the separation of church and state. the phrase separation of church and state was coined by baptists and they department want to be treated like a business, but away from financial ties and no law should respect an establishment of religion and then tax exempt status and then no checks and balances on what's happening in the church. let's be honest, the founders never imagined mega churches as well as a billionaire wants to throw you a flame thrower. they're getting tax free money and funding political campaigns. things have not kprated like this. how does it affect the people in the pews. >> you are not allowed to ask me. >> that's not what they told me. >> i'm at half price books with charmaine. >> could you see yourself as a member of a mega church? >> i went to church a lot as a kid and i go occasionally, but real occasionally. it's what point did you go to church yourself? >> back in 1994 when my sister passed away and i was searching for answers. a friend of mine called me and said i'm going to the potters' house. the church was rocking and he came in and took us home with the sermon. it was unbelievable. i was there for 16 years. i was not as focused and my mind was drifting. what's he talking about? i couldn't remember the sermon later on. one night was channel curving. this was the first time i heard him preach. that was tuning into god's frequency. that was really good. >> like fellowship, gateway church is a multisite mega church in dallas with a weekly attendance of nearly 30,000 people. it's one of the biggest and most conservative in the country. it has revenues of over $120 million. pastor ed looks like the mead the jesus they were talking about. >> what i found was how to have a relationship with god. >> the primary difference is that it's predominantly white. i'm black and got a fro. sometimes i'm rocking it and walking into this predominantly white church and they try to figure me out. i remember going to shake someone's hand. okay, so you haven't touched very many black people. that sort of thing. >> the limp hand shake. >> exactly. >> i'm used to it. >> you don't want to be used to it at church. >> how long did you go to gateway. >> i left after november 9th, 2016th. >> the day after the election of trump. what made you do so? >> robert morris gave us talking points. >> we need to vote biblical principals. >> telling people to vote for trump. he said everything but his name. >> we're will give you a voter guide that shows you the values that each person stands for and then you pray and cast your ball ballots. >> 58% of trump voters were protestant christians. when you have millions of people watching on line and thousands of people attending, they can tweak the message of jesus to align with the candidate they want to you support. >> a couple of weeks prior, there was an announcement we are going to tear racism down one conversation at a time and now you are telling me to vote for a racist. that doesn't jive with me. i couldn't dismiss the fact that we have different political ideologies. we also have different social ideologies. >> what has been the process for trying to find a new church. >> i wrote down the names of churches i wanted to visit. throw them in a ziploc baggy. i haven't found gag is resonating with me. except for the potters'. i may wind up bag there. i don't know. >> like lebron going back to cleveland. >> we have to go there. >> that are would be a big return. >> for would be. >> god works in mysterious ways. >> that's for sure. ll have a st. ♪ your stella, miss. thank you! ♪ wild night, huh? white russian? nah, gary, gimme a stella art-toes. excuse me... good choice. well, changing can do a little good... dude abides. what would i say to somebody keep being you.? keep loving. keep aspiring. keep striving. and ask your doctor about biktarvy. biktarvy is a complete one-pill, once-a-day treatment used for hiv in certain adults. it's not a cure, but with one small pill, biktarvy fights hiv with three different medicines to help you get to undetectable. that means the amount of virus is so low it can't be measured in lab tests. so keep pushing. keep creating. and keep pouring your soul into everything you do. serious side effects can occur, including kidney problems, and kidney failure. rare, life-threatening side effects include a build-up of lactic acid and liver problems. do not take biktarvy if you take dofetilide or rifampin. tell your doctor about all the medicines and supplements you take, if you are pregnant or breastfeeding, or if you have kidney or liver problems, including hepatitis. if you have hepatitis b, do not stop taking biktarvy without talking to your doctor. common side effects were diarrhea, nausea, and headache. if you're hiv-positive, keep loving who you are, inside and out. ask your doctor if biktarvy is right for you. ♪ the bigger the church, the most powerful the church. since churches don't have government oversight, that power can lead to abuses of the worst kind. we heard about it a lot in the catholic church, but it's not just the vatican. >> troubling accusations of sexual abuse at independent fundamental baptist churches across the country. >> virgin is not a sexual preference nor is it your birth right. >> a poet and activist uses her story to confront the church's history of abuse. >> this ends with me. >> inspired by her me, too, emily dropped the hash tag church, too. >> a lot of my stuff is religious stuff, with met tors and stuff. it's the language my brain speaks. >> what was church like as a kid? >> my dad was a southern baptist when i was born. it was the locust of my purpose. as a young person, the church most formative for me in junior high and high school was a non-denominational mega church. there was fog machines and it was my entire special because we were home school and we didn't have school friends. the community was so large, it gave us the opportunity to make lots of friends. >> i think about my grandmother and it was not just a thing you did on sunday, but all week. it was for people to check in with you. if you weren't at church, you find out what was going on. >> and somebody would text me and you thought you had a community. >> my grandmother didn't text. they just stopped by. >> it's so important for so many people. when it betrays you, you almost feel like your whole life is having the rug ripped out from under you. what happened was i was groomed for a romantic relationship when i was 16 by a respected volunteer leader who was in his 30s. the way that predators work is they groom their victims by slowly breaking down one boundary at a time, but it's little. a chip here and a chip here and all of a sudden you have conversations that are way inappropriate. there was a lot of talking about all the things he wanted to do to me and marry me and all of this stuff. at 16, you kind of fancy yourself an adult. no one ever said a 16-year-old can't consent to a man in his 30s, especially a spiritual authority. when it was found out, the church kind of swept it under the rug and my parents blame and punished me. they made me call him and apologize to him. that was the last time i sfoek hi spoke to him. me apologizing to him. that put me in a dark place for a really long time. >> i see that as so complicated. the church i would imagine is i'm supposed to be sharing my feelings with people at the church. >> i'm supposed to share with my youth leaders. harvey weinstein is not justifying his actions with a chapter or verse in the bible. a pastor will do that. i don't know what to do with this. me too happened and i was like should i out my abuser on twitter right now? probably, huh? okay. i'm going to do it. so i sat down and i wrote it out and i pressed the button. by the morning it had gone viral. this was a thing that is resonating. >> did you include his name? >> oh, yeah. and the name of the church. i name names always. sometimes it's not safe. for me it was, so i did. >> how did you feel about the response? >> i was shocked that all of a sudden it was actually gaping traction and people were caring and people were sharing the stories and people were like calling me, wanting to do interviews and all this stuff. y'all care? so many people, so many lovely people have been trying for a long time to get these stories into the public eye and now they are and i'm grateful. >> do you ever imagine seeing the abuser again? those ideas and thoughts and what you would say? >> what i would say? >> yeah. >> i would say you messed with the wrong bitch. there's nothing more important than the education of a young mind. let's go. let's go. let's go. except maybe being first in line to the grand opening of the world's largest rollercoaster. 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(vo) quickbooks. backing you. a book that you're ready to share with the world? get published now, call for your free publisher kit today! with giant cathedrals seating thousands, they all start to look the same. there is more than one kind of mega church in dallas. >> jesus is up there and jesus even when she does drag shows on sunday mornings. >> it's the largest lgbtq church in the world. his mission is simple. change the narrative. >> this is family in 1972. out of the lgbt movement. >> i can tell you were born and raised here in dallas. >> east dallas. i was born and raised in great britain and i came to learn very quickly that the church could be wrong. the church is really a human-made institution and has rules and regulations that often have nothing to do with the one we follow as we call jesus. that was helpful to me as i later came out as a gay man. >> you are doing all the things. how long have you been here? >> 3.5 years. >> all right. >> part of what i wanted to do is to welcome people who have left churches because they can't cope with the hate that is often preached in their churches. i know mega church pastors who would never admit they know me, but the pastors wish they had the courage to preach what you preach. if i do, i envision my pulpit. >> how does this welcome the face of christianity? do you feel a need to compete with that in some way? >> no. i think you live with authenticity. people are tired of unauthentic leadership. we have to take responsibility for what the church has created. the church created racism and sexism and homophobia and transphobia. not because of jesus, but white privilege and power and money. our job is to break those systems of oppression. that includes calling the church to repettance. no social justice ever in the united states has been successful without the church on board. >> you head south of the city, one of the largest mega churches is friendship west baptist church is by freddie haynes. >> they're devalue women and people of color. ageism overlooks the age and those who are differently abled are treated as second class citizens. the improverished are rendered invisible and have no voice. >> for 35 years, dr. haynes served as a visionary and membership has grown from less than 100 members to nearly 14,000 today. the work he does and also because he shaves like a horseshoe. how do you fit into this? >> strange because i have been told that a church that emphasizes social justice can grow and attract people and that has been the emphasis and i think we contradict that. >> a lot of it is connected to wealth. some like nba basketball players. not starting money, but six-man money. doing already. >> that's good money. >> i googled your net worth and didn't find anything. >> that's a reflection of what i have. >> but being in a thblg huge and ornate, people suspect you are in line with the people whose net worth you can't say. >> it's an instrument of service to the community. that's why it's called the friendship worship and conference center. >> this is the back to school block party. we are doing free haircuts and free immunizations. >> we are having a massive career fair. >> we use it for much needed economic empowerment on the side of town that neglected my ministerial hero, martin luther king, jr. what would his ministry look like in the 21st century? that's what we tried to build. >> some say i stay out of politics, but certainly people stand and say everything but. i think you should vote for sbh someone who is making america great again. what do you think about not being political? >> i think it's kind of fake to say you are not political because you can't go to the bathroom without it being political. why not have some kind of influence that is righteous? for me it's like i can't help but be involved in politics because i'm pushing for justice. >> 26-year-old botham john was shot and killed by off duty police officer who thought he was a burglar. he was watching a football game. >> he was in his apartment minding his business and a church worship leader gets shot. i was determined that we take advantage of this moment to make some serious systemic changes. i joined in the marches and the protests. always have been in conversation with the mayor and the district attorney as well as the police chief. >> we are calling for the dallas police department to do everything they need to do to reform that police department. >> we have been involved from talking to those in the suites to those dealing with trying to push for change in the streets. >> so what are you doing tonight? >> tonight is bible study. >> when i think bible study, i think steal cookies and quiet reflection. there is a message to be heard tonight like any given sunday. a choir, choreographed dancers and a cathedral with eager members anxious to hear the pastor tell it like it is. >> betrayal can make you bitter. have you felt betrayed by a country. i'm talking about this one. it happens. i told you all how there is a t-shirt that said don't let [ cheers ] >> y'all are church people. you're not supposed to know about that t-shirt. okay? when you are secure in your walk with god, don't let what they do to you get in you but keep your eyes on the destiny that god has for you and your eyes on that destiny say it's even betrayal can be used to get me where god is trying to take me and i always rise again even when you throw me down. >> coming out of there, listening to pastor fredy haynes. they call it bible study. when i was in there, i wasn't making a tv show. i was just in church. all the stuff he was talking about, stuff i think about and talk to my friend my people about. a lot of americans stop going to church at some point becausie t it's not speaking to them anymore. i'm like wait a minute, this one is talking to me. anyway, i'm glad to know it's here because one day i might need it. 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now i feel i can do more to go beyond lowering a1c. ask your doctor about jardiance today. we're oscar mayer deli fresh your very first sandwich,m... your mammoth masterpiece. and...whatever this was. because we make our meat with the good of the deli and no artificial preservatives. make every sandwich count with oscar mayer deli fresh. the purpose of going into minuistries because you have a calling and want to share it with the people. you have build your church. >> hello. >> how are you? >> good. >> i'm michael. >> nice to meet you. we're about to hop a fence. >> we're hopping a fence? this is real texas -- we're hopping this fence for the lord? you showed me the holy hop. three years ago it was held out of a member's living room and today they fill a high school auditorium and it's one of the fastest growing churches in dallas. he's co-pastor. this is your property? >> it will be in a few months, yeah. >> he's literally looking to break new ground. >> how big is your congregation now? >> if they came all on one sunday, six or 700 and in the neck decade, there will be tens of thousands of homes from here. >> this is an if you build it, they will come. >> they are coming. >> where does the money come? >> we share the vision of what we want to do. we doesn't ask for money. we don't pass a plate. if people believe in what we're doing, they ask. how can we give to this? there is a box in the back. right now they have given enough for us to buy this land -- >> this is all donations from your congregation? >> yeah, isn't that amazing? >> i remember the bible verse, rich men, heaven. i don't remember. you probably got it. >> it in there somewhere. >> rich men getting into heaven. >> harder than a camel -- >> there you go. you see preachers living high on the hog. >> i see that stuff. it doesn't make sense to me. i can't imagine you get into the ministry ever thinking you would be rich. you know, all of a sudden your church grows and if you don't have accountability in place, you think it's about you. we've done everything we can to make sure that's not going to happen because i think the church culture in america is suffering. i think people fall away from the church. why? i know a lot of churches have become, it's like a self-help seminar with a rock show as the opening act. hey, look, that's great free entertainment but you leave saying, man, i feel pretty good. that was good but it's not changing you. >> yeah. >> we go to these buildings one day a week and go home and try to live life. when jesus came in, it was about this. this is church. i need you. you need me. >> we're more than -- two of us are more. >> two more gathered. right. because i don't know if you've noticed, it's tough. >> yeah. >> right? where do you go for answers? you go to your friends. we need to be able to talk and have conversations. how do you do this, man? >> i have a tv show to go talk to interesting people and have those conversations. >> not everyone gets to do that. >> i'm living a privileged lifestyle. this week i'm talking to multiple different ministers and even still, i'm a person as i get older and have more kids, i need to show up back in church again. >> you don't have to go back to a building. you just need to find people to have these conversations with. >> everything you're saying is everything i think people want to hear. >> we want to have everybody come here, not on sundays but like this. >> i love the feeling of standing on this land imagining what is coming next. >> it's exciting. >> can you pray for me right now? can we do that? >> is this okay? >> fine with me. i felt like you were talking about it -- >> let do it. >> can i put my hand on you? i don't want you to feel weird. >> no. >> lord, we love you. this is unbelievable that you have from where he was raised, where he was born, you have him on this platform to speak to the whole world. he gets to talk about things no one wants to talk about, and he can change the world and change for the good. so we ask all those things for your name in jesus name, amen. >> amen. >> can i give you -- >> i'm a hugger, come on, man. >> you touched me, i'm going to hug you. >> thank you, manment. appreciate it. >> i want to come back and see it be the place you want it to be. if you don't know me and you have sun glasses on and a cessna lands and you're wearing a linen white suit. >> you're going to the wrong church, bro. >> your boots will be bedazzled. >> keep checking in on us. >> today the face of christianity is the mega church and if you want a mega church, it up to you. if you want to do good deeds for the community, great. if you want to confront the political system, absolutely. if you're okay with your pastor getting rich in the process, it up to you. not what would jesus do? did jesus do. these churches will power, influence followers and shape the world we live in or. >> $3,700 for three years of food in these beautiful buckets. when we first pitched this show, you should know the whole idea behind this show is that it's a show where a black guy goes places either he shouldn't go or you wouldn't expect him to go. and we're like oh, where should we go? i was like, i don't know, maybe i should go talk to the ku klux klan. that was their reaction. [ laughter ] that was exactly -- hmm. then it got quiet for a long time. but i could tell it was that kind of quiet where they were like that might be good for ratings. but kamau might die. but that might be really good for ratings. [ laughter ] when i pitched the ku klux klan idea i didn't think they'd actually let me do it. you know w
United-statesTexasCaliforniaHoustonTogoDallasHaitiTurkeyAmericansAmericaAmericanDanny-jody joining the democratic field for 2020. you are looking at live pictures from philadelphia where former vice president biden is holding his first fund raisers hours after officially announcing had he is running for president >> if we get donald trump eight years in the produce he will forever and fundamentally alter the character of this nation, who we are. and i cannot stand by and watch that happen. >> as you heard there, biden taking trump head on. also, slamming the president for his response to the deadly white supremacist rally in charlottesville, virginia. this is biden's third run for the white house. and he is the 20th candidate to sberp the race. at 76 years old he is also the second oldest in that field, just behind bernie sanders. but as biden looks forward to 2020 some of his past coming back to haunt him today. day one and the controversy over the 1991 justice clarence thomas hearings back. today biden's team revealing he had a conversation with anita hill tu but it today she fires back saying she would no not qualify that call as a pull apology. jeff zeleny outfront today. big day for the former vice president. kicking off in a key battleground state, pennsylvania. how did it go for him. >> jim, good evening, no question joe biden will have a big focus on all of his record, some nearly a half century in public life. as you were saying there the controversy over anita hill from 1991 certainly was mentioned today. when his campaign let it be known, in fact here on cnn with brokena keeler saying the former vice president had called anita hill recently and left it at that. then anita hill told "the new york times" that she was not satisfied with the phone call. this is something the vice president has yet to respond to. watch in play out in the coming days. this is basically framing the debate to come, jim. no question that the former vice president tried to shake up the race and indeed did by trying to focus the conversation squarely on president trump. in a seering and serious video message, urging americans of all tricep to reclaim the soul of the nation, in his words. but jim, his long record will be scrutinized. we can look at if in a couple of ways. before vice president and after vice president. and before vice president it's nearly 40 years in the senate when the -- when mr. biden was on sometimes a different issue -- a different side of the issue than may be acceptable now in the democratic party on school busing, the crime bill and on anita hill. he wants to focus on the eight years in the white house. but interestingly, he received some kind words from former president obama but no endorsement. the reason for that is i'm told, jim, they came to this sort of agreement together. mr. biden did not ask for an endorsement because he knew he wouldn't get one because they both believed that this would not necessarily help him in the end. he has to win this one at least the primary on his own. >> he has a lot of competitors we know that jeff, thank you very much outfront now former dpkic snar carol mosley brawn of illinois she is among those endorsing the former vice president. biden senator. we appreciate you taking the time tonight. >> my pleasure thank you. >> a field of 20 candidates and counting perhaps. tell us buy widen is your choice. >> well to begin with the old will rogers joke about no organized group i'm a democrat. we have a huge field. that's good news. conversation from a lot of perspectives and a lot of different inputs into this -- into the primary, defining the future of the democratic party. i'm with joe biden. go ahead. >> go ahead, please. >> i'm supporting joe biden because i worked with him. i was a colleague for six years with him in the senate. i have seen up close and personal how he operates. he gets things done. he is inevitably on the right side of history. again, things look different in hindsight. but the fact is his heart has always been there for working americans. he is always on the right foot on civil rights or whatever, you know -- name the issue whether civil rights or women's rights he has been on the right side of the equation. and i've seen that up close and personal. i'm very happy and proud to stand with him and whatever i can do to help him get elected to win in primary and then to go ahead and win the election i'm happy to do. >> well you talk about being on the right side of issues. as you know member of your party saw him through his career at times on the wrong side of the issue, busing decision, anita hill hearings. i wonder how you answer though questions about his record as you endorse him. >> well, remember, i got elected in large part because of the ire of american women, illinois women over the way anita hill was treated. and not to mention the clarence thomas nomination. so i went to the senate really as anita hill on the other side of the table. joe biden was keen to have me serve on the judiciary committee. i'm lawyer to begin with. i've been on judiciary here in my state legislature. and so even though it had been that kind of a fracture issues and knock down dragout battle, the fact is he moved quickly to try to flip the script and playbook make it better. that's still biden's way. he finds something and if it winds up being not in coping with his values he will correct it. and he did. >> a lot as you know has been made of this being the year of the woman, perhaps the year of the person of the color, the year of a younger candidate for president. but i want to ask you this, because the voters you speak with does identity matter to them? identity politics? or is it something else as they look for a candidate in year? >> well, let me say this, back to will rodgers joke, the fact is if you want somebody to get a job done you don't go to somebody who doesn't know what they're doing. you go to somebody who has the experience. and the only way that you can not be open to attack is not to do anything for anybody. joe biden has been helping people as long as i have known him and even before. and that leaves him vulnerable. and so you would get people nitpicking and finding some way to come at him and at his record but the good news is he has one and he has one of actually working for working people. and i'm so proud to stand with thiem for that reason. >> let me ask you in, the president -- president trump has paid a lot of attention to joe biden. we saw that in the tweet today at cnn's reporting that he is asking a lot of questions about him. i wonder if in your view that reveals that president trump seems -- sees himself as vulnerable to a biden candidacy that biden can beat him particularly in the battle-ground states that turned the last election which wisconsin, michigan, pennsylvania. >> i can't begin to tell you what goes on in bozo's head. i'm sorry that president of the united states. but the fact of the matter is that this guy is unpredictable in every bay are way. and so why he would pick on joe biden when we haven't even had the primary yet on the democratic side is a mystery. with you however his calculus comes out i'm confident the american people will reject the politics of division and hate and the kind of separating families at the border, that sort of thing. the american people will reject that. i think will choose the better qualified candidate which is joe biden >> final question, in his announcement video, he took aim directly at the president, mentioned him by name, and at the issue of charlottesville, a defining one for many in terms of the trump presidency. other candidates as you know have not taken that path, deliberately avoiding that, focusing on policy ideas, et cetera. i wonder if you think the former vice president is taking the right tack here. >> i do. i'll tell you he has the courage to say what he thinks, what's on his heart. he has always done that. that's why i think again a lot of in the picking ought to stop. it's okay to have a policy don't. that's the important thing that we do have the debate about policies and positions and issues and not just identity. and so -- and the vice president i think has got a record he can be proud to stand on, and proud to run on. and i think we should all be proud for him for the fact of the matter that he has been out there trying to help people in so many different ways, for so long, and has been successful with it. so i'm proud to stand with him. should he have come out and said the charlottesville thing was an embarrassment and disgrace that the president would say there is fine people on both sides. there is no equivalency. how you can make equivalent clan members with students is absurd to me. and so but again that's what the race is about. and that's why, again, i hope we can come together and support joe biden as the democratic candidate for president. >> and we know the charlottesville incident was personally important to the former vice president as well. senator, a pleasure to have you on the show. >> thank you, my pleasure. >> outfront now dana bash, cnn chief political respondent and david gergen former adviser to just four u.s. presidents. dana laufrmda we've been waiting first controversy right out of the gate, anita hill, in your view did he fumble the apology here. >> you know it's not enough, certainly, but this is always -- was always going to be a top, top, top tier issue for him. having been the senate judiciary chairman back then, having dealt with -- being in charge of dealing with anita hill and fumbling that back then was something he had to deal with if he were running for president as he now is in 2020 through the prism of 2020 norms and what needs to be done in terms of society, and the fact that he is running against people for whom the notion of the way things went down back then with anita hill is just anathema because they are of a different generation. they don't think that way or approach it that way. it was always an issue. but i think broadly the things that he did in the video, the themes that he hit were the right position for him being joe biden, saying i'm the guy who should and could and would. >> right. >> beat donald trump. >> and that really david, is it not, the number one issue for many democratic voters going into this primary is a simple one who can win in the general? >> absolutely. it's a big issue for many independents as well. the video was generally well received today, jim, especially his argument that 2020 will -- the campaign will be a battle for the soul of america. i think that goes -- i think that did resonate with a lot of americans. at the same time, once he got past the video, the rest of the day turned out to be pretty rough for him as a candidate. it's just inexplicable why his campaign coming on cnn would raise the issue of anita hill in the phone call a few hours after the video and create a whole new story with a lot of people saying if he really meant it why did he take 28 years to call? and why did he do it just before he announced? and then to go from there, the first event of the day, is a private fund raiser. emphasizeding the need for money as opposed to the message for america. i would say he had a rough start. it puts a -- i think he is still in a good position. he opens with about an 8-point lead according to the latest poll over president trump. and, you know, doing well among women still as well as millennials. and others. and so he is strong. but i think it puts a lot of pressure on him for the rallies that are coming to show he has a message, that he can drive the narrative. >> and energize the crowds. i mean, dana >> exactly. >> as david mentions, he is ahead in every national poll right now and doing well in a lot of the early sfat polls. what is going the toughest thing for him to do on top of this very crowded and let's be frank, very talented democratic field? there are a lot of commers in this field. >> everything. everything he is going to have to do is going to be tough to stay on top. i mean, the idea that he is -- the idea and the expectation of him, that is what is driving him to be on top right now, not because of what he has said or done in the campaign trail because he hasn't done anything until today. nas really the key. and so every step of the way is a potential minefield for him going against all the other candidates, for all of the reasons we just talked about. i think what david just said about the fund raiser he is doing tonight, it's exhibit a -- anita hill is a big one on a different issue -- exhibit a of how his approach is old school. he wants to raise as much money as he can, because he wants to show that dollar sign at the end of the quarter which is understandable. but he is ignoring the fact that the other candidates are saying, we're only going to do the small dollars, not the big ticket fund raisers. and he is basically banking on the fact that it doesn't matter for him. >> i talked to one of his former advisers earlier today this morning. he made the point saying can he adjust from an old school race to a race in the social media age. >> yeah. >> david, cnn's reporting is that president trump has been asking his advisers a heck of a lot about biden's strengths. i wonder if in your view that reveals the president's sensing his vulnerability to a biden candidacy zboo we know the president is very insecure anyway at his core. he is uncertain. he reads the polls voraciously and sees the numbers are not with him. he just went threw when the numbers turned against him and indeed the voters turned against him. i think donald trump touches right now and everything he thinks about is through the lens of does it help me or hurt me in 2020. he is trying to figure it out. dana's view would be interesting. but i think the best thing biden can do is ignore his tweets. >> maybe that's advice. >> good luck with that. >> try that. >> david and dana thanks very much. >> thank you. >> outfront next, president trump contradicting a key account from mueller's report. claiming he never ordered the firing of robert mueller. why is the president trying to rewrite history? plus exacts digging deep he were in the inner workings of trump's white house now investigating trump's decision to pull out top officials at the department of homeland security. but it trump about to shut them down? after 45 days sarah sanders finally back in the briefing room but taking questions only from kids. what's the white house afraid of? forward when you're ready for what comes next. at fidelity, we make sure you have a clear plan to cover the essentials in retirement, as well as all the things you want to do. and on the way, you'll get timely investment help to keep you on the right track, without the unnecessary fees you might expect from so many financial firms. because when you have a 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have done it myself. let's look at the facts. the special counsel report says the following. quote mcgahn's clear r-was the president directed him though tell rosenstein not only that conflicts existed but also that mueller has to go. mcgahn is a credible witness with no motive to lie or exaggerate given the position he held in the white house. and mueller wasn't just taking mcgahn's word by itself. according to the report again quoting, substantial evidence supports mcgahn's account that the president directed him to have the special counsel removed. remember, that testimony by mcgahn under oath. katlyn collins outfront tonight live outside the white house. kaitlan, you know, i almost want to stop asking this question because the president will often make up his own facts on twitter. but who is he speaking to here? who who is he trying to convince with in. >> what we have seen is this theme emerging not just from the president and dwirt but aides and allies accepting the broad conclusions of the mueller report but attempting to poke holes in other aspects like whether or not the president tried to fire mueller even though as you laid outs, the mueller report actually leaves little down the president tried to do so. now, several other aspects in the president's tweet are just simply not true, including that mueller was respectfully allowed to do hiswork because actually the president was attacking him repeatedly and publicly but also the president claimed again insisting mueller was conflicted even though justice department lawyers cleared him of any kind of conflicts of interest or issues. he stated the mueller investigation was illegal. the president. now we reported the president's ally urge him to drop the mueller investigation and to move on to essentially declare victory and stop talking and tweeting about it so much. but what you see with the president disputing this today is not only airing his grievances toward mcgahn, someone he targeted several times in recent days but also he latches on to the report as an attack on his presidency. even though the allies urge him to let it go, the president doesn't seem to be anywhere near that. >> and he also says the fake news made it up when we were quoting directly from the special counsel report. but anyway. katlyn collins thanks very much. outfront now john dean former nixon white house counsel. dana bash back with me process. john who do believe, the mueller report, sworn penalty under penalty of prison time from don mcgahn por the president's tweet. >> i think to state the question answers the question, jim. it's conspicuous here. mcgahn is not going out and lie. he did go under oath. so it really -- it's a tweet against under oath testimony. also it's clear from the report there is substantial evidence to support him. what's that mean? it means that he probably came back to the office and told others in the office who have now testified about it. he may have made a memorandum for the record. there's probably lots of corroboration. so i think the president is in trouble trying to push in one too hard. >> dana, mcgahn, he is mentioned more than 150 times in the mueller report. i'll quote again mueller rights when this office first interviewed mcgahn about the topic he was reluctant to share detailed information about what occurred and only did so after continuing questioning. and the information didn't just come from mcgahn. mueller writes again quoting here the president made clear to chief of staff reince priebus and mcevoy chief strategist steve bannon that the president was considering terminating the special counsel. two other people spoke to a mueller previous and also bannon seemed to believe the president was trying to fire mueller here. i wonder, you know, what -- who is the president trying to convince here when the evidence is so clearly stacked against him? >> i mean, that's really a key question. i was just talking to somebody in the trump orbit before coming on with you, jim, who was kind of trying to explain the president's thinking here. and that is that when it comes to loyalty, obviously we know he puts a premium on that. but even more so for his lawyers, he has had a lot of relationships with a lot of lawyers over his many decades in business and now obviously in politics. and he considers that kind of an unbreakable trust. and -- but he worked with lawyers who approach things differently. also in the mueller report it says that don mcgahn told the investigators that the president was surprised that he was taking notes. so kind of gives you an insight into his experience in the past versus what don mcgahn was doing as the white house counsel who was responsible for taking notes for history, not just for his client the president. that's really the key here. he is absolutely adamant. and whether or not he said explicitly go fire the special counselor whether he said it in his intentionally nuanced way that so many people around him say that he makes statements like that, that's up for debate. but the intention -- or at least the way florida don mcgahn took it and as you just put up there, the way others there contemporaneously took it was to get rid him. >> reminds me of the comey story. >> exactly. >> he taq it as a direction there. john you of course testified famously publicly against president nixon. cnn is learning the white house may try to cite executive privilege to stop mcgahn from testifying. . he has subpoenaed by congress. of course setting aside what the president is tweeting about the diversions. what wonder what that does to the executive privilege claim. and see a valid excuse here. >> it could be in some circumstances. i don't think in these circumstances for a couple of reasons. first of all there is no attorney client privilege here, because the client of don mcgahn is the office of the president and not donald trump. >> exactly. >> which is a post watergate resolution of that issue. the other thing is that mcgahn -- he doesn't -- he is not employed by the house, not employed by the government. and he is a citizen. only if he wants to hide behind executive privilege is that going to have any effect or if the president gets a court order enjoining him from testifying until the executive privilege question is resolved. that would be a very unusual circumstance. and what it would do, it would force the issue of whether or not -- this is discussion of a criminal activity. and if it's a crime, it's an exception to the executive privilege. so i think he risks if he goes to court that a judge is going to say, this is criminal activity, go ahead and testify it to the congress. >> he might take to the supreme court if he can, i suppose. john dean, dana bash, thanks very much. outfront next, exacts demanding new answers. tonight into frufrp's firings. but are they about to run into trump's stone wall again? and president trump going after reporters while in front of their 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what would you say to your constituents as to what you're after here? >> you know, it's all about trying to get to the bottom of what really did happen, getting the facts, and just see exactly where that leads us. i think it's important that he appear. and it's important that he respond to the subpoena. you know, he's got a -- a legal obligation to do that. it's a constitutional obligation. you know, ethically he should appear. i just -- it's hard for me to imagine anyone receiving a subpoena from congress and not appearing. >> and listen, it's part of your job, of course, to execute oversight of the executive branch. but i do want to ask you, are you -- are your fellow committee members ready to put someone behind bars to force them to testify? >> well, we hope it doesn't get to that. the first question everyone should ask themselves is what is it that they're trying to hide? because if there wasn't anything to hide then they would cooperate. but the very idea that the attorney general might order someone not to appear on questions about the citizenship requirement for the census, to appear at any of our hearings in the judiciary, for anyone to be ordered to not appear just doesn't make any sense to me as a lawyer, as an american. it goes against everything that is a basis of our democracy. we have to ask ourselves first, you know, what are they trying to hide? and secondly, you know, do -- what do we do to enforce our subpoena? do we keep trying to work through this as we've been trying to just by asking them to appear? we issue the subpoena. do we go to court to enforce that? do we hold them in contempt? i can tell you this, that this is just not god behavior. it's not a good example for the rest of the country. it's not a good example for our children that are watching. because no one should be allowed to just totally ignore a subpoena. >> right. >> the rule of law means something in this country. >> sure. >> and it begin was the white house. >> gets to the functioning of government. i speak to democratic and republican lawmakers. they tell me when out on the trail they are speaking to constituents this is not at the top of the constituent's mind not even halfway down the list. they're not asked about the investigations. and i just wonder, do you fine the political appetite for in, as you speak to your constituents or are democrats as risk of going somewhere where the support he is don't want them to go? >> well, i think if you look at -- you know, this is not so much about the polls or the politics it's about the president and what he can do and not do. it's about the separation of powers. it's about the constitution. so this is not about the party or the president. it really is about, you know, the public trust. and i think once we lay it out, do were we do the hearings that are planned and we get to the facts, i think the public will become more engaged and will understand exactly what we're doing. i think there is a lot of support. i'm asked the question as i've been traveling around this last couple of weeks, of course we don't forget that we're working on health care. we're working on lower prescription drug prices. we're working on equal pay for equal work working on a number of other apgds. >> that part of agenda which is part of the agenda that won you mid-terms. >> we don't forget that. >> it's not. >> but we don't forget that. >> okay. i know you don't. but it's not what folks are hearing most of the time. it's not what they're seeing most of the time on the hill. they're seeing a lot of hearing not seeing legislation, not seeing legislation on prescription drug prices for instance. i wonder if you're concerned that the party risks a political price by being seen as a party of investigations? >> well, we'll have to -- you know, we'll have to wait and see. but which is why we have to lay the predicate for it. i think just taking the report and immediately trying to go -- move forward on kpeechment and doing some of the other things may put us in that dilemma. but i think if we lay it out people will understand -- and they will be with us. because i think when you talk about obstruction, corruption, talk about abuse of power, and how that may affect whether or not legislation is passed, whether or not there is adeals and self-dealing and favorism, whetheren the relationships with foreign countries having to do with the tariffs? i mean, those things impact the bread and butter issues that people care about. so we as democrats have to make that connection so that the public can understand why wree doing it. >> congresswoman, i appreciate you taking the questions tonight. >> thank you. >> outfront next, 45 days and counting. that's how long it's been since sarah sanders the press secretary held a press briefing. but today she took questions, only for kids. and north korea billed the u.s. $2 million for the medical care of otto warmier. was that a ransom? 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"i am here." and i aim to say that more. aimovig... a preventive treatment for migraine in adults... reduces the number of monthly migraine days. for some, that number can be cut in half or more. the most common side effects are pain, redness or swelling at the injection site and constipation. aim to be there more. talk to your doctor about aimovig. . new tonight, the white house's press secretary sarah sand esper made her first appearance in the white house briefing room where you are supposed to brief reporters in 45 days, taking questions not from the actual press rather than from children for an off the record briefing during take your child to workday. sanders has not taken questions from the reporters in the briefing room since march 11th, the longest stretch without an official brechg. in fact sanders has only held two official briefing force 2019 lasting a total of 82 minutes impaired to 28 minute's for the kids briefing. outfront now. american urban radio network's april ryan. 45 days without official brechg for the press. . question about the credibility of the white house spoerk person some of which were revealed in the mueller report. do the briefings have a use at this point? >> you know, jim, those brechgs will always have a use. and it's not just about the president giving his statements or his words. when there is not a presidential moment with the press. there is a time that we need to flush out more concretely some items, you know, today, we are talking about otto warmbier, you know, this $2 million that north korea wants for taking care of him, allegedly. while he was in their custody. you have the sanctions that are being talked about for anyone who buys oil from iran. the stakes are still high. you know, you've got the conversation on capitol hill about voter suppression in these elections. you have so much going on in that place. again, everything comes to the white house, from war to peace and everything in between we need to to hear from them. >> and people need to ask questions of the white house. president trump -- so he spoke to children of reporters earlier today at the white house, as you know, and said some things -- well have a listen. we can talk about it. >> yeah, see these beautiful children, products of the media. and i actually like you much more than your parents. they give me pictures always my chin is pulled way in. i look terrible. that's okay. they do that on purpose. often times they report correctry. all the time or most of the time what do you think. >> all right all the time. see. i agree. for purposes of this speech, i agree. >> i see the kids standing up for parents there. why do that in front of reporters' kids what's the point. >> he is the president. this is what he does. but, you know, all in all, he did say -- i was shocked that he didn't go in harder on us. i mean, we have seen how he has dealt with us at rallies and at other places. but, you know, we are the parents of children. you know, you don't talk against the parent in front of a child. but this is something that he does. so, i mean, which we expect. >> shake your head a little bit. april ryan, always good to talk to you. >> thanks, jim. >> outfront next, north korea demanding that the u.s. pay $2 million for the care of an american otto warmbier they held hostage. the man who got the bill will be my guest. and presidential candidate pete buttigieg condemned by a famous evangelical. what happens when religion turns on some of those it zbleevs you feel like your whole life is having the rug ripped out from untd you. my skin... it was embarrassing. my joints... they hurt. the pain and swelling. the tenderness. the psoriasis. i had to find something that worked on all of this. i found cosentyx. now, watch me. real people with active psoriatic arthritis are getting real relief with cosentyx. it's a different kind of targeted biologic. cosentyx treats more than just the joint pain of psoriatic arthritis. it even helps stop further joint damage. don't use if you're allergic to cosentyx. before starting, get checked for tuberculosis. an increased risk of infections and lowered ability to fight them may occur. tell your doctor about an infection or symptoms. if your inflammatory bowel disease symptoms develop or worsen, or if you've had a vaccine or plan to. serious allergic reactions may occur. i got real relief. i got clearer skin and feel better. now, watch me. get real relief with cosentyx. we humans are strange creatures. other species avoid pain and struggle. we actually... seek it out. other species do difficult things because they have to. we do difficult things. because we like to. we think it's... fun. introducing the all-new 2019 ford ranger built for the strangest of all creatures. be right back. with moderate to severe crohn's disease, i was there, just not always where i needed to be. is she alright? i hope so. so i talked to my doctor about humira. i learned humira is for people who still have symptoms of crohn's disease after trying other medications. and the majority of people on humira saw significant symptom relief and many achieved remission in as little as 4 weeks. humira can lower your ability to fight infections, including tuberculosis. serious, sometimes fatal infections and cancers, including lymphoma, have happened; as have blood, liver, and nervous system problems, serious allergic reactions, and new or worsening heart failure. before treatment, get tested for tb. tell your doctor if you've been to areas where certain fungal infections are common, and if you've had tb, hepatitis b, are prone to infections, or have flu-like symptoms or sores. don't start humira if you have an infection. be there for you, and them. ask your gastroenterologist about humira. with humira, remission is possible. you wouldn't accept from any one else. why accept it from your allergy pills? flonase relieves your worst symptoms including nasal congestion, which most pills don't. flonase helps block 6 key inflammatory substances. most pills only block one. flonase. . tonight cnn has learned that north korea presented a bill for $2 million for what it says was otto warmbier's hospital care. north korea insisted the u.s. sign a pledge to make the payment before releasing warmbier who of course was in a coma and ultimately passed away six days after returning to the u.s. the source tells cnn the bill for payment was give ton joseph yun. the special representative for north korea. however a second source cnn that the money hasn't been paid. outfront is the man you heard me mention. ambassador joseph yun. thaengs for taking the time tonight. i know you cannot speak about the moments in that room. it's classified information. but let me ask you this. can you describe what your instructions were when you went there in terms of getting him home? >> thank you, jim. good to be here, and thank you for your understanding. of course i cannot discuss any details of negotiations. i took part as an active u.s. diplomat. but i can tell you that i did go to pyongyang. this was june 2017 under instructions from my then boss rex tillerson, secretary of state, and his instructions were fairly clear. get otto out. now, jim, before going to pyongyang, i wasn't sure. they never told us we could get him out. so, you know, i was there for a few days. and during that time, i did have to negotiate a number of items. >> let me ask you this. the president has vowed many times not to pay ransoms while criticizing his predecessors for doing the same. have a listen. i want to get your reaction. >> we would not pay ransoms or anything else because that creates a terrible precedent. >> our country was blackmailed and extorted into paying this unheard of amount of money as rans ransom. and our president lied to us. >> we paid $150 billion to get prisoners. you talk about a ransom? i'd say that's a pretty good ransom. so those things are not going to happen anymore. >> in your view, was this in effect a ransom? >> this is a tough, tough issue, you know, how to deal with prisoner situations. and, i mean, you look at our history or anyone else's history, and there have been cases where money was paid to national governments who have held american prisoners. and this is common throughout and so i do think it is a tough question, and where you are really depends on particular issues. what i can tell you, jim, is that while i was special representative of north korea policy and we had a number of american prisoners in north korea, we did not pay any ransom. >> fair answer. ambassador, good to have you on. >> thank you. coming up next, when religion and political issues collide. >> the church has created racism and sexism and ageism and homophobia and transphobia. featuring three new dishes that are planked-to-perfection. feast on new cedar-plank lobster & shrimp. or new colossal shrimp & salmon with a citrusy drizzle. tender, smoky, and together on one plank... ...but not for long- so hurry in! the question is... is fast enough? 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"he later navigated northward, leaving... progressive can't protect you from becoming your parents. but we can protect your home and auto when you bundle with us. our mission is to provide complete, balanced nutrition for strength and energy! whoo-hoo! great-tasting ensure. with nine grams of protein and twenty-six vitamins and minerals. ensure, for strength and energy. got it.r pickup order?s and minerals. ran out of ink and i have a big meeting today. and 2 boxes of twizzlers... yeah, uh... for the team... the team? gooo team.... order online pickup in an hour. now get an extra 20% off with coupon. at office depot officemax. tonight one of president trump's most outspoken evangelical supporters is slamming the democratic candidate pete buttigieg for being gay and christian. franklin graham saying being gay is, quote, in his words something to be repentant of, not something to be flaunted, praised or politicized. but in dallas, texas, the birthplace of the megachurch, there is a house of worship where being gay and christian are not mutually exclusive. w. kamal bell spoke with the pastor for the premier of his new season of his new series, "united shades of america." >> i know many church pastors who would never admit they know me, but i know megachurch pastors who say i wish i had the courage to preach what you preach. but if i do, i lose my pulpit, attendance falls. >> kamal here with me now. so buttigieg here challenging the religious establishment in ways that we haven't seen before, not walking away from his religion at all, saying how important it is to him, but challenging the idea that somehow that makes being gay wrong. on the ground, is that working? >> i mean, the thing is he's doing it on a national stage. there are people who are doing that every sunday when they're going to church that are challenging that. the thing that is so insidious what franklin graham is saying is you're actually jeopardizing the health and worth of the youth in your children who are lgbtq. salt lake city, a high rate of teen suicide and a lot that of is linked to lgbtq plus youth feeling the mormon church is unaccepting. >> and then they punish themselves in effect. >> he certainly has gay members of his community in his church who are going to fell attacked this sunday. >> graham, many evangelicals as you know, they embrace donald trump. do they see any irony, any contradiction in embracing him despite his own personal shortcomings? >> you know, the bible is an amazing thing. it kind of says everything and it kind of contradicts itself. if you're just going to look at the bible as words, you can find the words in the bible to justify anything you do. but if you're talking about the spirit of the bible, then it's clear the spirit of the bible is not in the actions of donald trump. and so i think that's the thing. we talk about in the episode with pastor michael mcbride, people are creating a jesus in the image they want. they're not saying -- they're doing what would jesus do instead of what did jesus do. so they don't think it's a disconnect because they are using the words to form the version of christianity they want. >> generational change. is that evident in the megachurch world, in the evangelical world, because young people have different views than their parents on these things? >> not every young person. many do. >> the thing i learned, it's not every megachurch is the same. the face of christianity is sort of the joel osteen version of church. he claims to be little bit agnostic, you can tell where he is voting and what he is thinking about. love the sinner but not the sin kind of thing, or however he puts it. then there is the cathedral of hope which is very lgbtq plus, and dr. freddie haynes who is pushing the legacy of martin luther king jr. forward. if we made those the face of christianity, we'd be fine. but that's not generally what the face of christianity is. >> kamau bell, it's a great series. i'll be watching. "a new season of "unite shades of america slow only here on cnn. thank you so much for joining us tonight. "ac 360" starts right now. good evening. and do you suppose when senator joe biden lost his bid for the democratic national nomination back in 1998, he took comfort in the notion that he'd get another chance more than three decades later? today he is a former senator, a two-time vice president and a favorite right now who is holding a fundraiser in his bid for the united states. we are breaking news on how his entry into the race is being received at the white house. also, his attempt to reconcile with anita hill over her treatment at the clarence thomas hearing he chaired. we talked to "the new york times" reporter who spoke
CharlottesvilleVirginiaUnited-statesPyongyangP-yongyang-siNorth-koreaSalt-lake-cityUtahTexasIranPhiladelphiaPennsylvania despite the fact that many think that i am am godde-- i go church. like a lot of us, i don't go now. i found other ways to get the message. a lot of folks still looking for the message of jesus. >> that's the god we serve. that's the first miracle he does. >> those folks are joining megachurches and record numbers. you know the ones? ones filling kevin hart stadiums or bieber performing. >> if i want to believe in god. you can't stop me. would you pray with me? >> and if right now you are thinking, have i seen this gone badly before? >> yes, remember baker begging for your tie between noon. and jim baker had a sex scandal with jessica hahn and indicted for fraud? today he changed his ways and he can be found selling buckets for the boys. we have been doing what god spoken to me in prison. he says the last days are coming. >> prosperity gospel has been put on steroids. they are rolling in the profit. that's profits with an "i." to find out what they are doing with that power, i am going mega-church hopping in dallas, texas. dallas is the birthplace of mega-church. dallas is the buffalo of the bible and ground zero of some of the most powerful church es in the country. it is sunday morning, outside of dallas, i am attending fellowship church outside of grapevine, texas. >> they don't want to look traditional, they want to look like the mall of god. >> i have invited my man of the cloth, pastor michael mcbride to attend service with me. i found out his church is down tp stre the street with me. i like pastor mike's church because it got the feeling of my deb grandma in the 21st century. >> i appreciate all of us and all of you participated. >> i have been in your church in berkeley, california. >> yours are a beautiful church. a little homie. is it wrong when i see places like this, i get a little suspicious? >> wrong? no, i don't think it is wrong. this is like a message to amplify a message. i am curious of the message. if the message is black -- all it is is really quite problematic particularly given the moment of time. i am excited to take a peek in there. >> you are not only my spiritual backup but my black backup. >> proud to be. >> let's go. >> this is like going to the arena. fellowship church is a southern baptist church. let's break it down real quick. it is time america finally learns about christianity. a mega-church, having 2,000 more people attending. with catholic church and orthodox church. nearly 600,000 residence of dallas are protestants. fellowship has nine campuses across dallas. they attract 25,000 people a week with a broadcast reaching to millions online. that means thousands of people get up and get out of bed and get dressed and go to a church to watch tv. meanwhile, i have 1100 youtube followers, jealous? i got to see how this whole thing works. i asked him to take me to the wholly command center. >> this is our control room. >> is the password like a bible verse? >> i am going to turn you guys over real fast to derek. i am going to connect with him to make sure we are ready for the message. after playing hoops in florida state, hey, that's d-1. ed found the fellowship church with his wife lisa in 1996 and figured out a new way of doing church. >> our message is that god is with us. >> while he's an orthodox, ed is in the business of being traditional. he's not only a pastor but a brand. ed has written 15 new york times best sellers and owns a lot of casual fishing clothes. if you google his network, sources say $11 million. >> ed's occasional stage stunt are pulling more and more people walking in. >> he's amazing. >> you are literally running through the whole program. >> every week. >> where do you run through your verse? >> in the bathroom. >> it is like doing the grammy's. it is still early and i need my coffee. lattes for the lord? this is the best church couffee shop and it is the only coffee shop in a church ever. >> we'll take number one however we can get it. >> these are our volunteers back here. >> how many volunteers do you have a week? >> across the board, i think around 1500 volunteers. >> every week? >> wow. >> yep, i almost didn't take, i realized everybody i seen had been working for free, the baristas and the people in the control room and this guy and that guy, they're all working for free. everybody. i get that people volunteer to help their church stay afloat and serve the community. the dvds are not free, this casual fishing gear is not free. what's happening to all that money. >> let's do it. >> hi kamau. >> how are you doing ? >> i am good. nice to meet you. >> what's up, mike. >> thank for being here. >> thank you for having us. >> no doubt. >> normally i do this like, i go through the kind of vibe and the flow of everything and i thought you may want to see some stuff maybe that we do. > >> yeah. >> i don't know if it is unique or not. >> it is unique to me because i have never been to a place like this. >> i am not sure if ed is putting a pitch for a marvel movie. >> i appreciate the enthusiasm. >> somebody help me. [ laughter ] >> does he go everywhere with that microphone? >> i am more confused now than when i walked in. >> next thing he's live streaming on instagram. >> welcome to instagram live everybody, going through the testament today. >> let's go to instagram live. >> service is 45 minutes away. >> man, i am exhausted. >> you got it from andy. >> this is typical. >> every week. >> we have a saying, fc can meet frequent change. he switches things up all the time. >> all right. >> my staff quits. [ laughter ] >> this show that we are filming right now -- can we do it later? >> no. >> all right. "united shades of america" brought to you by sprint. switch today. ted plan with the samsung galaxy s10e included for just $35 a month. it's a big deal. my haircolor was less vibrant. i had to rescue it. olia. haircolor powered by 60% oils, no ammonia. the color is really rich. it looks healthier than before i colored it. my hair's happy right now. olia. by garnier, naturally. 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means to capture and hold someone's attention for a period of time. i hope we don't come off snick or polished or whatever -- i don't want it to be. >> people who do not feel invited into the church, one of the things they see is why are they spending all that money. >> exactly. >> do you feel weird about the money? >> no. >> i don't but i understand exact li whely where you are co from. >> when i started fellowship church, we were making $20,000 a year. we brought more than 10% fellowship and now i make a lot more than that and we bring well over 10%. don don't talk about how much money you have. what are you bringing? we give it to him. >> we do stuff with haiti and guatemala and from our camps to up and out and down the out. we do a better job? heck yes. >> how do uma i can suyou make don't go down that jimmy bakker. this requires a lot of money? >> no doubt. >> you can put boards and systems and audit os or whateve it is. you can still go crazy. >> how does all the money get here? churches maintaining with money given by the congregation. it is industry standards to tie 10% year earnings to the church and at this point, a gym membership can take money right out of your bank account. mega-church pastor like ed putting it together independent run board. >> what's responsible? god only knows because they certainly did not tell us. >> god is protecting us being a political state. >> do you bring up things that are going up in the political moment in your service spn youss moment in your service services? >> not that much. >> i have done stuff like what would jesus say to lebron james or what would jesus say to donald trump? >> wait, hold on a second, what did jesus say to donald trump? >> our message is going to be going out. i have never endorsed -- >> given the polarizing moment where we see white nationalism and racism and triablism, do you worry that the american church has not figured out how to disciple people away from racism? >> yes. >> is jesus racist? where is the disconnect? if someone sincerely saved, their eyes are opened and hopefully they live that out. >> that's a conversation we need to have more and more. >> yeah, we do. >> i totally agree with that. >> if we don't love each other, we'll tear this earth apart. >> exactly. >> heck to the yes. >> these conversations, they're not conversations. >> information without application. it is not an abomination, i am preaching better, amen! >> this is our pastor ed, you are not jesus. >> that's not jesus either. >> that's charles manson. >> come on man, golly. >> i am happy i got to talk to ed today. he let us ask questions and he did not get defensive and even when pastor mike said jesus looks like charles manson. >> show god how to have these hard conversations and what it means to live out what we talked about. amen. >> let me hear it. >> touch your neighbor with consent. >> you know -- >> it is good. >> thank you. >> god bless you, man. >> the bible of texas, it is advised to watch your prayers down with a bowl of chilly after service. you know how texas works? eat, pray and football. >> oh, touch your neighbor. >> just for clarity, am i supposed to eat this? >> yes. >> eat it. >> okay, okay. >> talking to pastor mike about fellowship, i could not help to think about something. does it get political? >> how are you not reckoning a political moment. >> i am tempting you that's quite, you know, to be like jesus. so humble and holy, oh, i want to be like him except -- [ laughter ] >> except when he starts talking about who you get to married or opening up the border. >> yeah, i want to be like jesus. you can't serve jesus like an immigrant and behaving like an immigrant when they show up. either you are following a jesus of your own making which i would argue many of us are or you are following the jesus that forces you to have to wrestle with a real of what will jesus not do, but did jesus do. >> what did he do? >> we got a way to go. >> yeah. >> yeah. >> i feel like i got challenged. you looked at me like i could not handle it. >> don't let it the best of you, bro. >> i see the sweat. [ laughter ] >> you do not look like charles manson, that's good. [music and singing in the background] [music and singing in the background] it's nice. ♪ you got this! ♪ woo! ♪ ♪ ♪ who wanted to get away who used expedia to book the vacation rental that led to the ride which took them to the place where they discovered that sometimes a little down time can lift you right up. flights, hotels, cars, activities, vacation rentals. expedia. everything you need to go. time to lawyer up. do they have church lawyers? of course, they did. is church a business? is church a business? church has to be run like a business oftentimes. i am here to talk to matt anthony who runs a church law group here in dallas. >> they have budget and things like that. >> i know charities have to report how much money they given ends up where they go. >> churches don't have to follow a 990. >> i think primarily there is, there is exceptions and there are lines to cross especially politics. >> church and politics need mix, they need to mix the way jesus intended. enjoy your holiday. let's get to the most controversial topics out there, the rights to bear arms and separation of church and state. the phrase was coined in 1802. they did not think it should be treated as a business. congress should make no law respecting establishment of religion then along came tax exempt status and no real form of checks and balances of what's happening in the church. the founders of this country never imagined mega churches the same way they imagine a billionaire want to sell you a mega flame thrower. things have not separated like the virginia plan. how does this affect the people in the pews. let me ask you this. >> wait, you are not allowed to ask me. that's not what they told me. >> okay. >> i am at half price books. >> good to see yourself as a member of the mega church. >> i am one of those going to church occasionally. tell me at which point you decided to go to church yourself. >> back in '94 when my sister passed away unexpectedly. i was searching for answers then a friend of mine called me, i am going to the potter's house, you know t.d. jakes? the church was rocking and he just came in and took us home with the sermons. it was unbelievable. i was there for 16 years. >> did you enjoyed it? >> overtime i started to see, i was not as focused and my mind was drifting. okay, what is he talking about? i could not remember the sermons later on and that sort of thing. one night i was channel surfing and i heard of gateway. i was tuning into god frequent si, that was the message. wow, that was really good. >> like fellowship gateway church led by patrick morris is a multi church in dallas with weekly attendees of 30,000 people. its revenue is over $120 million. suddenly pastor ed looks like one of the meat jesus was talking about. what i learned at gateway was how to have a relationship with god. >> what's the difference? >> primary difference is it is predominantly white. i am black, i got a fro. sometimes i am walking into a predominantly white church and they're trying to figure me out. >> i remember going to shake someone's hand. so you have not touched very many black people, you know that sort of thing. >> the lifting of the hands. >> yes, exactly. >> i am used to it. >> you don't want to be used todd the church. >> no, you don't want to be used to it at church. >> how long were you at gateway? >> i left promptly. >> the day after the election of trump. >> yes. >> what make you do so promptly? >> talking points. >> we need to vote biblical principles. basically telling people to vote for trump. he said everything but his name. >> we are going to give you a voter guy that shows you the person each person stands for. >> 50% of trump voters were protest tent christians. churches can tweet the message of jesus and sway elections. >> just a couple of weeks prior to that or so, there was an announcement that we'll start tearing racism down one conversation at a time. now you are telling me to vote for a racist? >> that does not go with me. i could not dismiss the fact that we had different political ideolo ideology. >> what has been your process in finding your journey? >> i wrote down the names of some churches that i want to visit. put it in a zip locked bag and pulled it out. this is where i am going. i have not found anything that resonated with me except for the potter's town. i may wound up back there. >> oh wow. >> it is like lebron going back to cleveland. >> oh gosh, do we have to go there? >> that would be a big return. >> yeah, would be. >> god works in mysterious way. >> that's for sure. 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[ applause ] >> a lot of my poetry is about religious stuff. >> what was church like for you when you were a kid. >> my dad was a southern baptist youth pastor when i was born. i would say church was the speaks. the church was non-denominational hall. there was a lot of lights and fog machines and little orders and my entire social life because we were home schooled. we did not have school friends. being apart of a church community that was so large gave us the opportunity to make a lot of friends. >> when i think of church and my life, i think of my grandmother. >> it was also people checking in with you. if you were not at church, you find out what's going on with you. >> and somebody would text you, oh, i have a community that cares where i am at. >> it is so important for so many people. when it betrays you, you almost feel like your whole life is having the rug ripped out under you. >> essentially what happens was i was groomed for a romantic relationship from a volunteer leader. they groom victims breaking down one boundary at a time, it is little, a chip here and here and all of a sudden, you are having conversations that's way inappropriate. there were a lot of talking about all the things he want todd do and how he wanted to marry me. at 16, you fancy yourself as an adult. no one explained to me a 16-year-old cannot consent their relationship with a man in his 30s. when it was found out, the church swept it under the rug. my parents blamed me and punished me. they made me call him and apologize to him. that was the last time i spoke to him was me apologizing to him. it was extremely painful and put me in a really dark place for a long time. >> i see that as, it is so complicated for the church because i imagine it confuses you about, i am supposed to be sharing my feelings with people at church. >> yeah, my youth leaders. you are not going to see harvey weinstein justifying his action with the chapter of a verse in the bible? but you will see a pastor doing that. so i was like i don't know what to do with this. >> me too happened. >> yeah. >> should i out my abuser on twitter right now? probably yeah. >> okay, i am going to do it. >> yeah. >> i sat down and i wrote it out and i pressed the button. by the morning, it had gone viral. this feels like a thing that people wanted to talk about. >> did you include his name in it? >> yeah, and the name of the church. >> oh wow. >> name names and some people don't. people were calling me and wanting to do interviews. y'all care? so many lovely people that i know have been trying for a long time to get these stories to the public eye and now they are. i am really grateful. >> do you imagine seeing the abuser again? do you have those ideas or those thoughts or what you would say? >> what i would say? >> i don't know, i am just wond wonderi wondering. >> i would say you mess with the wrong -- [ laughter ] you need a hair smoother.? get fructis sleek & shine with moroccan argan oil hair is super sleek, even in 97% humidity. no parabens. fructis sleek & shine by garnier, naturally! (indistthat was awful.tering) why are you so good at this? had a coach in high school. really helped me up my game. i had a coach. math. ooh. so, why don't traders have coaches? who says they don't? coach mcadoo! you know, at td ameritrade, we offer free access to coaches and a full education curriculum- just to help you improve your skills. boom! mad skills. education to take your trading to the next level. only with td ameritrade. >> tech: at safelite autoglass, we every chip will crack.. this daughter was home visiting when mom saw a chip in her windshield. >> mom: honey is that a chip? >> tech: they wanted it fixed fast so they brought it to us. >> mom: hi. >> tech: with our in-shop chip repair service, we can fix it the same day... guaranteed. plus with most insurance a safelite chip repair is no cost to you. >> mom: really? drive safely. all right. ♪ acoustic music >> singers: ♪ safelite repair, ♪ safelite replace. but allstate actually helps you drive safely... with drivewise. it lets you know when you go too fast... ...and brake too hard. with feedback to help you drive safer. giving you the power to actually lower your cost. unfortunately, it can't do anything about that. now that you know the truth... are you in good hands? forget about vacuuming for weeks. the (new) roomba i7+ with clean base automatic dirt disposal empties the roomba bin for you. so dirt is off your hands. if it's not from irobot, it's not a roomba. there is more than one kind of mega church in dallas. >> i am just a jesus who's up there. a jesus, everyon when she does g shows. >> pastor harris, his mission is separate. change the narrative. >> i can tell from your accept that you were born here and raised in dallas. >> yes, very east dallas. >> i was borned a and raised in great britain. i was 18 when i came. the church can be brought. and, church is really a human made institutions and often has nothing to do with the one we follow as we call it jesus. >> yeah. >> that was helpful to me as i later came out as a gay man. >> you are doing all these things. so how long have you been here? >> three and a half years. >> all right. >> part of what i wanted to do is welcome people who have left churches because they can't cope with the hate. i know mega church pastors who would never admit they know me. i know mega church pastors who say i wish i had the courage to preach what you preach. >> how does this become the face of christianity? do you feel a need to like compete with that in some way? >> no. you live with authenticity. people are tired of unauthentic. >> and so our job is to break those systems of depression. that includes calling the church to repenitence. no social justice ever in the united states ever successful without the church on board. >> we head south to the city, one of the largest mega church in dallas, friendship west baptist church founded by dr. haynes. >> ageism overlooks the age and those who are differently able are treated as second class citizens, the impoverished are rendered. >> dhe has served and gained 14,000 today because of the work he does. >> how do you fit into this mega church universe? >> strange because i have been told that a church that emphasized social justice can't grow and attract people but that's been our emphasis. i think we contradict that. a lot of it is connected to wealth. there is some people who makes nba basketball money, you know? >> which was good money. >> i googled your network and i didn't find anything. >> maybe that's a reflection of what i have. [ laughter ] >> being in a billiuilding that huge and beautiful and ornate, do you feel you are in line in the network? >> no question, it is an instrument of service to the community. that's why it is called a friendship worship. >> this is our back to school community block party, we are doing free haircuts and free immunizations. we use it for much needed economic and empowerment on a side of town that's neglected, my hero is martin luther king jr. and what would king's ministry looked like in the 21st century? that's what we try to bill. -- build. >> there are certainly people who stayed in the pool and say everything but. >> i think you should vote for somebody making america great. >> it is kind of blatant. >> what do you think of it? >> i think it is kind of fake to say you are not political because you kants can't go to t bathroom without being political. >> why not have some kind of influence that's righteous? for me it is like i can't help but be involved in politics because i am pushing for justice. 26-year-old botham jean was shot and killed in his apartment where the officer thought he was a burglar. he was watching a football game. here is a young man in his apartment miening his business and he gets shot. >> i was determined that we take advantage of this moment to take some serious systematic changes. i joined the marches and the protests and also had been in conversations with the mayor and the district attorney as well as the police chief. >> we are calling for the dallas police department to do everything they need to do to reform that police department. >> we have been involved from talking to those and dealing with trying to push for change in the streets. >> yeah. what are you doing tonight? >> tonight is bible study. >> when i think of bible study, i think of church basement and quiet reflection, not at the west. there is a message to be heard just like any given sunday. >> there is a choir and choreograph dancers. the pastor tell s it like it is. >> maybe i have been betrayed. betrayal can make you bitter. have you felt betrayed by a country? i am talking about this one. it happens. i told you all -- there is a t-shirt says don't let your president. y'all are church people. you're not supposed to know about that t-shirt, okay? when you are secure in your walk with god, don't let what they do to you get in you, but keep your eyes on the destiny that god has for you and your eyes on that destiny says even betrayal can be used to get me where god is trying to take me. and i always rise again, even when you throw me down. >> just coming out of friendship-west listening to pastor freddie haynes. they call it bible study. just felt like preaching. when i was in there, i wasn't making a tv show, i was just in church. all the stuff he was talking about, stuff i think about, talk to my friends about, my people about. i think a lot of americans stopped going to church at some point because it's not speaking to them anymore. i actually was like, whoa, wait a minute, this one's talking to me. anyway -- i'm glad to know it's here. because one day i might need it. ♪ usic] bonvoy. bonvoy. bonvoy. bonvoy. bonvoy. bonvoy. discover the new language of travel. marriott bonvoy. 30 hotel brands. endless experiences. rewards reimagined. you wouldn't accept an incomplete job from any one else. why accept it from your allergy pills? flonase sensimist relieves all your worst symptoms, including nasal congestion, which most pills don't. and all from a gentle mist you can barely feel. flonase sensimist. do you battery sound.eel. want a charge? yeah battery charging. ♪ ♪ thank you so much. battery charging. ♪ the purpose of going into ministry is because you have a calling and you want to share the message with the people. so if you talk to god and he gave you a message, you got to build your church. >> hello. how are you? >> good, how are you doing? i'm michael. >> kamau, nice to meet you. >> good to meet you, man. >> we're about to hop a fence. >> we're hopping a fence? >> this is like some real texas. so we're hopping the fence for the lord. you show me the holy hop. >> three years ago, the well church held service out of a member's living room. today the congregation fills an entire high school auditorium and is one of the fastest growing churches in dallas. so this is your property? >> it will be in a few months. >> i think if they all came on one sunday, i don't know, we have 600 or 700 people maybe. >> okay. >> in the next probably decade, there will be tens of thousands of homes a half a mile from here. >> so this is if you build it they will come situation. >> well, they're coming. >> where does the money come from from this? >> we just share the vision of what we want to do on this piece of property. >> mmm-hmm. >> we don't ask people for money. we don't pass a plate. if people believe in what we're doing, they ask us, hey, man, how can we give to this? there is a box in the back, put your money in it. if they don't believe it, they're not going to give. right now they've given enough for us to buy this land. >> wow. this is all donations from your congregation? >> isn't that amazing? >> i remember that bible verse about rich man, heaven. i don't remember exactly -- you probably got it. >> it's in there somewhere. >> rich man getting into heaven. >> harder than a camel through the eye of a needle. >> there you go. preachers living high on the hog. >> i see that kind of stuff. it doesn't make sense to me. i can't make you would get into the ministry ever thinking you were going to be, like, rich, but all of a sudden your church grows. if you don't have accountability in place, you start thinking it's all about you. we've done everything we can to make sure that's not going to happen. >> okay. >> because i think the church culture in america is suffering. i think people maybe fall away from the church. why? i know that a lot of churches have become -- it's like a -- it's like a self-help seminar with the rock show as the opening act. and, look, that's great free entertainment, but you kind of leaving saying, man, that was good, but it's not changing you. >> yeah. >> we go to these buildings one day a week and go home and try to live life. when jesus came, it was all about this, you know? if we're doing this, doing it the right way, this is church, right? >> yeah, yeah. >> i need you. you need me. >> what was it, we're -- two of us are more -- >> two or more are gathered. there he is. there it is right there. i don't know if you've noticed, but it's tough, right? >> yeah. >> where do you go for answers? you go to your friends. we need to be able to talk and have hard conversations. like how do you do this, man? >> the way i do it is by having a tv show where i get to go and talk to interesting people and have those hard conversations. >> not everybody gets to do that. >> i get that. i'm living a privileged lifestyle. this week i'm talking to multiple ministers. even still i'm a person who as i got older and had more kids i'm like, maybe i need to show back up in church again. >> you don't have to go back to a building. you just need to find some people to have these kinds of conversations with. >> everything you're saying is i think everything people want to hear. i think people think churches aren't doing anymore. >> we want to have everybody come here, not on sundays, but just like this. >> i love the feeling of standing on this land imagining what is to come next. >> well, it's exciting. >> can you pray for me right now? can you do that? >> is this okay? >> it's fine with me. i feel like you're talking about it and i want to -- >> let's do it. can i put my hand on you. >> please do. please do. >> i don't want you to feel weird. >> no, i don't feel weird. >> lord, we love you. i thank you for kamau. this is just unbelievable that you have from where he was raised, where he was born you have him on this platform where he gets to speak to the whole world. he gets to talk about things that no one wants to talk about and he can change the world and change it for the good. so we ask those things for your name, in jesus' name. amen. >> amen. can i give you a hug? >> i'm a hugger. >> if you're going to touch me, i'm going to hug you. >> thank you, man. i appreciate it. >> thank you. thank you. i want to come back and see it be the place you want it to be. mostly act like you don't know me and got sunglasses on and a cessna lands right there and you get out and you're wearing like a linen white suit. >> linen? oh, man, you go to the wrong church, bro. >> and your boots will be be dazzled. >> keep checking in on us. >> today the face of christianity is the megachurch, and if you want to megachurch, how you megachurch is up to you. if you want to do good deeds in your community, great. if you want to confront the political system we live in, absolutely. and if you're okay with your pastor getting rich in the process, i guess that's up to you. but it's like what pastor mike said. not what would jesus do? what did jesus do? we need to get the message consistent with the dude. these messages will shape the world we live in. otherwise -- >> $3,750 for seven years of food all in these beautiful buckets. she was hit by a drunk driver. i don't think my family's ever going to be the same. >> i drank every day a pint of whiskey, you know, for breakfast. >> they had to do surgery to save her life. >> i don't remember much at all. >> i really want her to see the damage that was done. >> i know there's going to be some difficult questions. >> i carry the burden from her mistake, and that's a very, very tough thing to swallow.
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