for me. >> so fascinating. people in my circles have done ayahuasca retreats. i read about a guy in chicago took mdma who was a virulent while nationalist and it changed him. it topapped him into love for t first time. >> and that stuck with him after? >> yeah. there is a story out of the bbc on this. i think we are just beginning to understand what these things, how they interact. >> was that a structured setting? >> it was. it was a university of chicago research project. >> that makes a difference, too. it's not just taking this recreationally. it's taking it with the lead up, the preparation and integration on the back end and making sure that it's done in a mindful manner. >> someone leading you to that point. it's someone leading you through. >> absolutely. >> you are not just experiencing it on your own. >> a guide is talking to you and bringing you out of it? >> yeah. we had the guide. in the case of these medical professionals on this retreat, i went up to a nurse who dealt