Im going on to hong kong haiti to the u. K. People are out on the streets demanding change the issues are many problems and the Climate Change so as global protests appear to be on the rise we ask whats driving these demonstrations this is inside story. Hello and welcome to the program im Richelle Carey people in different parts of the world are increasingly expressing their discontent with our governments policies its impossible these days for us to report the news without mentioning a protest somewhere in the world many of the specific issues may be different but there are common themes at the core corruption and justice Climate Change human rights are testers for challenging authorities even in places where it was once considered unthinkable to do so but just as the demands are varied so are the outcomes some have found success through their campaigns others have not and governments are divided on how to address what appears to be a global phenomenon of protest movements take a closer look at some of the protests that are happening right now and lebanon crowds are calling for a complete overhaul of their government angry over a crumbling economy hong kong has experienced months of protests against what seen as a growing influence from beijing and catalonia days of marches have consumed the regions streets as the pro and anti secession movements make their voices heard in chile sudan haiti and around the world people are angry and theyre out on the streets on i will slow i am for the reforms i am against the destruction of lebanon lebanon. Has been badly damaged by the politicians for 30 years today their thrones are shaking i am with the reforms an early parliamentarian election what was the if you have a little bit of morality a little bit of nationalism if you have a little bit of love for the country than please hand over the keys because the people cant stand it any longer i ask you to step down step down let the people go we cant take it any longer i think with the specific and social injustices everywhere the minority concentrates hold the wealth this is about how the robot in supermarkets in health care how they profit with our pensions and there have been some a store protest over the past 10 years the arab spring of course took place in 2011 it shook the foundations of countries across north africa and the middle east and the u. S. The killing of an unarmed black man triggered nationwide marches that gave rise to the black lives Matter Movement and 2014 an uprising in ukraine altered the course of that country the recent yellow best move in france and bricks of protests in the u. K. Seek to do the same and Latin America Corruption is struggling economies have triggered mass protests in brazil in venezuela and earlier this year a Global Climate strike rallied support from millions around the world. Lets bring in our panel now joining us and winchester the u. K. Matt clemente senior lecturer in the department of applied social sciences at the university of winchester and berlin john betty skull open a sociologist to receive a doctorate from Yale University earlier this year and in lancaster also in u. K. Melinda misra a senior lecturer the department of politics philosophy and religion welcome to all of you matt ill start with you is it just us or does it seem like that there has been a decade of protests and that the numbers really seem to be increasing at least over the past year or 2. And gasp in a decade of protests as you said really that 2011 was when it kicks off in a quite a big scale not just in the arab world but also i read on to your storage protests in greece in britain over pensions in france acception cetera and the occupy movement in spain so that was quite a big man in america of course and that was quite a big start to it but really its only continued since then. What is one of your observations been is it seems that that every week every month every week there is a new protest and it seems to be varied in its locations theres not a continent it seems that hasnt been touched by this. Yeah i think its typical of protest movements to come in waves i mean in europe experience you see it in 48 and there is an emulation aspect to these movements people see. Other countries are going for these movements and they start you know following the example but i think if you look at what events events unfold at a national level. Its a lot of the time has to do with informal movements and you know the traditional conventional wisdom in the social science studies this is that the social Movement Organizations proceed 1st back meeting resources or they see a political opportunity and then the champion but what you see actually as a new love this case is people react to an event that really causes indignation and anger and this 1st kind of explosion of unrest then encourages people to take for their actions so this is what you see right now in lebanon with. This decision by the government to tax whats up calls which really symbolized i think the iniquity of the lebanese government and prompted a number of people to go on the streets and very quickly the dynamics change and the protest movement takes life on its own i have a great point on the window at id like your thoughts on that too is there some sort of commonality when it comes to. A Tipping Point that really pushes people out in the streets obviously for varying countries in oh theres always different. Underlying issues that it perhaps 10 bubbling up but is there a Common Thread when it comes to a Tipping Point where people to say im not taking this anymore. Well at the heart of this debate or of the heart of this undertaking what we have is something if you see it crossed it will no longer trusting their governments people are no longer saddened that whatever the government is doing on their behalf is for their good and that is one of the reason why people are coming out into the street so the Tipping Point that youre talking about is when people realize that they have to take things onto their own hands to make that change to bring about their transformation and that is exactly what were witnessing from hong kong to. Equador from our spring to what is happening now in chile so there is not only their deficit to trust but people also feel that they can bring about their transformation and they do not need that government they do not need the Office Operators who bring about their plans for medicine so that belief in the power of their own self belief the Community Spirit is properly these movements to the forefront that we have been witnessing in the last one decade or so. Uniting to that when he said death at a deficit. Of trust and that that being the Tipping Point but when you talk about a deficit of trust what are the types of things that contribute to that thats got to be a really extreme thing for people to to feel like theyre theyre almost in a loan and their governments not in it with them. Absolutely but i think thats the point that extremism or radicalism is becoming more mainstream becomes a more normal option for many people to take perhaps in the past would not have considered it this is because the existing arrangements what tara calley told the extreme center talking about the marketplace politics of their liberalism which conduct govern. Economic regimes in all parts of the world is failing the majority population in whichever country you talk about serve thats whats led to the loss of face and then as the last week it was saying as the momentum of getting involved in street protests that masses of people getting together i believe that getting organized is a crowd starts to change the consciousness of those people involved you only have to look at some large hong kong what began as a protest simply about. A threatened dangerous sex traditional but now many of the young people are talking about a revolution in hong kong and ive really expanded that monster thats come out of the experience of of qana fighting together on the streets and organizing together on the streets that process itself has changed that the people themselves as i realize that you know youre not necessarily an expert on on hong kong specifically but you know these issues and im glad you brought that up because i think that one thing that has been really striking about hong kong is the length of these protests and the intensity really seems seems to be there they seem to be extremely organized what are some your observations about the protests in hong kong in particular. Yes i think its been a remarkable level of coordination that you can see the imagination that people show when you look at the ways in which people discards themselves and mask up in different ways so that they dont get recognized by the on that person security cameras the way that they adjust their tactics to try and make sure that the forces of repression cannot kind of beat them off the streets is very very notable in the hong kong case and i think it is a sign of a growing level of radicalization. And then some of the arguments about our the uncompressed is for example pro western and assume simply not true a lot of the complaints been about the policing all this. Thing many of the Senior Police officers actually from the x. Colonial regime are ex british Police Officers in fact sorry i think that you know theyre just talking about organizing for their rights and organizing on a massive scale. And lets go back to 2011 to need said that that can kind of be seen as some as something that kind of set all of this off what what worked in tunisia. Well we can talk about the political transition but 1st id like to go back to the question of where really explains these demonstrations and id like to really offer a counterpoint to the seiji that are really all has to do with a lack of trust thing that many countries where people lack trust in their government but that doesnt mean theyre actually go on into the street to demonstrate because most of the time most people just be paid that other people and theyre going to go and protest so there is there is the really important dynamic in protest movements which is when people were just their expectations when they start to believe that other people are going to go into the streets and in an authoritarian regime as we saw in tunisia and for the arab spring its very difficult because people are afraid of being killed or ending and to get in jail so in this setting where protests are often very unusual the mere fact of having a demonstration in itself can contribute to shattering this idea that people have that other people are going to acquiesce to to to power and which is why it didnt mix of protest groups are really crucial and in the case of tunisia because these protests with president kennedy they also happened to come at a time where social media the influence of social media was really starting to be felt they escalated extremely quickly and they could panic the in the in the government and ultimately the success i mean the we can talk about the organizers tactics but ultimately the success of a protest movement always has to do with the dynamics of who the target group in the case of the arab spring it was authoritarian regimes and will timidly it has to do with its strategic game with you know psychological and social aspect but basically the goal is to convince the target that they have nothing else they can do nothing else but comply and for this and. To see things this way you can understand well issues such as the internal city dirty of the target group. Is crucial so in. In syria because the military and security approaches was united by securing ties and so dominated by whites. They could not envision a situation in which a conceding would actually yelled anything good for them in a manager in tunisia was very different because the military and security approaches was professional and owns the protest reach a certain size they understood that their only option was either to kill a large number of civilians or to turn their weapons against benelli which eventually what happened in the check it happened in egypt so i think the dynamics of we often focus on on the actual protest movement themselves but its very important to take into account the dynamics of the target groups in most cases the state and its elite so im a lot of what about that about when you what does it take for there to to be cracks and the groups that are targeted say that the military you know turning on a leader or Something Like that what is it when these what causes those types of cracks when what we are we testing at the moment is that the knopf of the fall farm in Human History perhaps in the front passenger his ma says feel that they can talk to the policy without any fear that they can march and the whole world will be watching and they will be taken care of that is exactly what is happening if we talk about nonviolent protests from out of spring to hong kong so that is a big thing because in the past the governments code martin what was happening in 91 to them im in square when you have that long individual who was standing in front of a marching tank and he was mowed down so if you look at 90902019 almost 30 s k d kids we see a sea change happening here. So government so much more costly as to how can you not. Let me ask you something about ethanol and i see what youre saying that the protesters feel like you know that if we can get the eyes of the world on us maybe that will give us some level of safety but does that actually in some cases just force the government to use different tactics i mean people get disappeared all the time in jails. Well i mean i can give you a very recent example its too close to expect that for the quitter and the government of lenin moreno who undertook the most of it to measures which was a part of the new liberal program of cause and people went out into the streets the government had to change the capital from quito to got killed and the whole thing went on for 2 weeks finally the International Community that is in niger innis and some of them on catholic charge had to intervene on behalf of the mass of the Indigenous People and the government finally had to give in in terms of for the pulling back on the street the measures that it had introduced so i would so the idea is people are taking this cosmopolitan responsibility seriously so if hong kong protest has been a success for far it is because that cosmopolitan responsibility that has come in will support from all the powers of the masses all over the world so that is something that we have been taught in the past and fortunately that has given the a nice and peaceful protest movement has succeeded because of that now let me ask you we were talking a lot about hong kong because its been such a long as such a sustained movement but part of the hong kong tactics has been i guess you could say extreme civil disobedience and you know one point the airport was partially shut down its its disrupted trains when when move lets take life when they take hold and do they have to plan for not for lack of a better word taking the public off at some point. Well i think initially speaking theres often a tendency just saying can we find a middle path allows allow some degree of compromise that doesnt push things right to the edge because initially protesters are often worried about alienating a passive majority that havent yet joined on the streets who they want at least supporting them if you know active young active at least possibly maybe actively supporting them so initially maybe this pressure towards moderation but as us becomes sustained and they grow in momentum potentially more people join and also like i said people can see that possibly those moderate options dont really work for them and you know if you think about the Extinction Rebellion movement thats been popping up all over the globe at the moment against Climate Change you know that is a recognition that theres this very very little fight in any Institutional Capacity to deliver a rueful even if that capable no willingness to do the reform and therefore its only by the people acting and demonstrating in powerful ways that the pressure can be brought to bear they believe. That the protests that weve been seeing over the past decade they have been in dictatorships and authoritative. Regimes and democracies as well what. Does it take more for people in a democracy to actually go out and protest because maybe they have. A fight in a functioning democracy that is because they have a sense of comfort i mean whats the the difference that motivates people in those different types of situations. Well i think you know i think the barrier for you know the fresh field for activism is much higher in you know 310 sitting because the risks of of you know being killed or being flown in jail on the church much more important obviously i think the biggest challenge that the miss traders have to face in democracies is that i didnt protest our routine ised we have a series of laws that are low protest in a certain conditions and as a result they do not reprise isnt political craziness most of the time they are just part of the normal life of a democracy and as a result they really fail to create among the target group the government most of the time the feeling that there is there is an extraordinary set of events that they need to react to which is why the strategy of occupying spaces which is ugle in most im a christian which started with by wall street and we see now with extensive Extinction Rebellion is actually a very efficient because it breaks these understanding that the protest movement is just like another protest movement and thats crucial i think to forcing government needs to consider the possibility that it will have to compromise and id like to go back to the point that you you roached with the other guest regarding what prompts cracks authoritarian sitting. I think leaving the case of hong kong aside because its its a kind of of foreign occupying power in most authoritarian settings what prompts cracks within the military and Security Apparatus is really a Critical Mass of demonstrators in a capital city you know if it happens in a pro provincial town its its a regional rebellion if its a small pro