Hey welcome to the stream indias government now has direct control over kashmir but what does the end of the territories semi autonomy mean for People Living that if any ok im really could be a god send us your thoughts on whats happening in kashmir through twitter and you tube. It is now 3 months since indias government sent thousands of extra troops to Jammu And Kashmir and ended 7 decades a special status now the region has been divided to border under federal control the government says the new Union Territories of Jammu And Kashmir have a Bright Future but many civilians in the muslim majority region are still living under lockdown with their movements tightly policed and the internet and some Cell Phone Service is cut off hundreds of kashmiri politicians and activists have been arrested with many still in detention over the last few weeks theres also been sporadic violence on tuesday one person was killed and dozens hurt in a grenade attack in the Regional Center of srinagar for more on this were joined from london by natasha cole she is associate professor of politics and International Relations at the university of westminster shazia ilmi is a spokesperson for indias ruling but are not a party b j p she is in new delhi. And i josh is a writer at business standards and Indian English language daily d he joins us from can or in the southern indian state a town on hello everybody d good to have you here i want to start hello i want to start where Prime MinisterNarendra Modi on the very day that jameer kashmir law that became officially part of the federal part of india and administered from new delhi he was both buoyant and then also quite fierce about what this meant for india have a listen. New highways new Railway Lines new schools new colleges new hospitals will all take the people of Jammu And Kashmir to new heights of developments because. The big battle on iraq we will defeat every attack on the unity of our nation we will give it a job breaking response any attempts to break the countrys unity will never be able to withstand big Democratic Values and strong public sentiments. So here we are that speech but it felt a little bit like the carrot and the stick and the stick felt pretty stiff there im just wondering from the beach a. P. Perspective is this is this a good movie is this not now you solve this issue about whats happening in kashmir whats happening. And now you say youve solved it its been going on since 97 ill be done Mission Accomplished so thank you so much for having me i think thats a great and there was need to do a wee bit. And. You know an article that just 370. 00 which actually says that. Special status to people of kashmir but actually takes away the basic rights which actually got into it under the Indian Constitution so this was meant to be a temporary transitional provision and it sosas as it is written down that it can be done away with it by. Ordinance and this has been thought of the b. G. P. The ruling parties many face to so it is really not a surprise to people who belong to be just be who know what the ruling party stands for thats one and 200 most importantly article 370 became like a festering sore you know a bone of contention like a soul so to speak to keep the people also Jammu And Kashmir eliminated from the rest of india so i think instead of calling fresh meat as in being a stage of pedal this is it that this is it i think is pretty much the other way around i think the shmuley is finally out of peril finally its bill not be used by the separatists and the stooges who done to the tune of pakistan and the military establishment which we all know how has the multitudes of the left sort of side by the home of israel which i have seen and who have been indulged and for years and years this calling to insurgency and cross border infiltration and terrorism because of it what to do with house then indian civilians and gosh media citizens including many muslims have been killed in the face of kashmir in the last 3 decades. Not just that the media pundits which is another. Of my nodded to me has been totally has been cleansed and the 15000 bush meeting i learned will have to be thrown out of the valley so shes here let me just push you to do and ill just cause youre sort of killed wrong let me just pause and. Allow me to have a conversation with you let me just post you from an article 317. 00 is the part of the Indian Constitution which case special status to kashmir thats right. Yet it did so when. I got a point jazzy out its a conversation just how tight from what i know what and what has so much to say go ahead please thank you so let me begin by saying that i am not disappointed at all if you had to be good be spokesperson introduce the discussion with reference to which did come out what with no mention of except. This is very typical of the script yes the article loved it and reply just going to release them but i really hadnt you were listening the article was placed there quoted reason and that is because of the political dispute something that the current government especially to recognize and all of this is being done for the benefit of fish movies which is actually challengeable at every possible then why im allowed to say anything about it which is a pretty basic question why do look a need to be silenced for something that useable lubin done wont be a benefit why im they be allowed to speak about it as well as the fact that this is not how brains any better then this is this is just complete you know im sorry to say but this is just rubbish we have been 3 months now natasha that is a point that so many people in our community have re is that voices were not included in this theyre not at the table i want to share this tweet from those of who says it would have been a badge of honor for india and indians if the people of kashmir would have been asked for today its nothing but for more occupation by a powerful nation of a marginalized Muslim States would cite the idea of being asked that is at issue with many people including one who sent us a video comment i want you or whole to have a listen to. A ph d. Candidate at Ryerson University in canada and shes written about this topic heres what she told the string. There is an Indigenous People whose rights in transit in the United Nations to question on the rights of Indigenous People to india china pakistan are all signatories your years have given no consent to the unilateral changes that were made retaining them by india and what this means is that christian areas will continue to refuse colonial domination and subordination. Indians who want to exclusive use of similar traits force and repression and in the International System in order for there to be a peaceful resolution to this conflict with their International State arcturus have to do is demand that there be a softer nation and the most transition after the worlds most militarized place in the world so i dont get that one to you because i talked to has already mentioned that point but youre youve been covering this issue is this one of the main concerns youre hearing from just marys who say this has not involved us but it is about us. Yes that is true it has to be borne in mind at every stage when dealing with kashmir that article 370. 00 was a constitutional guarantee that was provided by the government of india to kashmir and kashmiris as a condition for joining or exceeding to india it was a constitutional promise that was given to the kashmiri people and if we would draw from that promise and to be fair it has to be said that that promise has been diluted by successive governments between 47 and today but if india were to withdraw from that promise it could only be with the consent or at least the consultation of the kashmiri people now the problem with this entire movie is not that article 370 was revoked because article 370 had been reduced to an empty shell in any case the problem was that it was effectively scuttled without even the face saver of consultation it was. You know in the opinion of every kashmiri that i have spoken to a humiliation to kashmiris and fresh meat and it was sort of a signal the feel by the new Delhi Government that they could drop the question maybe noses in the mud whenever they wanted but the problem is that you know when Prime Minister modi promises development and you know a new life and a new future to the people the question that has to be asked once how was article 370 coming in the way up to this development in any case it wasnt article 370 was not blocking any development or any papers that were to be given to me so this is it this is an argument that doesnt stand scrutiny and the fact is that whichever way you slice it the question the reason the question people should have been cancelled. Natasha can you tell us a little bit more about what is happening to kashmiris right now i know that schools have been out for some time some people saying hey were not even to open the shops this is our civil disobedience because we do not like what is happening to us can you take us through a little elements of daily life surrounded stan what it is like now kashmir is going to be administered from new delhi. Well let me let me tell you that its not just a question really is our question it is not of their who are saying this is well documented by every single Fact Finding Team that is that independent Fact Finding Team of indians who has gone there and that have been for me in a poor experience by indian women who are going in and then went on there and all of the reports of i like it the same thing the extreme miseries that are made of people because you can open the schools but but the childrens life is not secure so theyre not sort of classrooms out and deep that they have documented shortages of medicines doctors who cannot have been whisked away on camera there is 8 you know this really is not policed in this i dont mean really a good situation where if these speak up then it would be seen as a sign of if they continue to live there night then that is enough to get some kind of a consent and if they dont then what are they to do except except bearish and you know some of those reports highlight the saddest things with one of them. Were in a village that was the small girl who was the better part of the like on the i mean given to her father and brother right now and you look at the 2nd instances documented by all of that aborts and all of the lead guys have been detained or put under house arrest i mean on this shore earlier this year i was with. Me who had you know we have got the indians of the Civil Service this and then quit to join politics he after speaking to our dock was the i mean we can go where you look at it whether somebody is a growing new english really or you know opera but its not legally or the nationalists all of them have been made irrelevant and treated so badly. So on that point i want to bring in a couple of comments from online but i do want to note that the connection to shazia ilmi has dropped so were trying to get her back and reconnect with her bring her into the back into this conversation but i want to go here picking up off of what you were saying natasha doctors you nade on twitter is actually replying to a tweet that you sent just a little while ago he writes there is heavy snowfall events total blackout no electricity nothing living helpless with constant fear no contact from outside world while the u. N. Sleeps to they have enough food water medicine fire to keep themselves warm all questions that he doesnt have answers to but someone replied to him right away but a towel says what a cold blooded liar you are as a species for as never before has electricity and all other basic facilities people are free to move around and enjoy their lives tourists have started to arrive all is well and the region is truly integrated with india now unfortunately varying accounts here to varying accounts but i want to give people the reason for it and its because of severe restrictions on getting information into or out here that comes to us via a video comment house the country while she is a assistant professor of south asian history here in the u. S. Heres what she says so india has not allowed any International Observers to push me in with the exception of siena phobic islam phobic parliamentarians from europe aside from International Observers from human rights organizations or elected officials from the u. S. Or other countries have not been able to give access have not been given access to cash made which really begs the question what is india trying to hide if meanies are indeed happy with these recent developments and why cant the World Community see that for themselves why is there a communication clampdown and a complete lack of access to the region. Shazia ilmi is joining us now via the phone charles i want to get that comment to you people are saying that theres a lockdown and information is not able to get out what is india trying to hide thats a comment have said what would you respond. You know do you have unfortunately collected the opinions of those who stand for the separatists and this 2 djs because the dead have been a lot of International Reports of the day on Indian Television there are there are a plethora of channel channels who have the reporters visiting freshmeat yes there was the internet to log down and that was and there were political detentions and which is unnecessary and they were preventive measures to ensure a low and although in fact that you mentioned that the casualties were done by the terrorists against whom the administration and these. Folks who is acting as if its to ensure all peace so theyve been spied specially needed but all the fish media mike and theyve risked killed in kashmir gun dowie and violence by the terrorists who came would come from other side infantry and also i would like this lady not to be a butt in and also would like to interject and probably she could not hear me but i talked about the muslims who had been killed when i talked about 15000 which me funded the thought that acts at talked above that such media of muslims who have been killed by the by these terrorists. And you know the other day even the schools have being that they have had people throwing grenades at the school who are now meat who was just killed only because you opened the show it was filled by the by the bullets all the terrorists and not all of the does security personal so i think that is some misreporting and i think its deliberate and i think the dominant another to that is being bandied around shows the perpetrators of violence as the victims of violence the call freshmeat is this not about this community muslims yes media muslims who suffer happen you punted well the muslim right and evaluate the liberals who are. They were all brooklyn well im new to all the muslim well let me assure the parcel that it is not the be and remove that im talking about but all and i know you had not let me but let me put it just as well as he has he has had. A im not that i wanted that and so yes i understand how we only have a limited amount of time off just just give him the 2nd ok you have to rebut the speaking on the other side like you have. And the plaza and all the way through the show just finish your point because youre his real time to complain about the time. That get my point of view over to actually these represent can you give me thank you finish for the book listen the dogs are actually celebrating the little that will grow up community that everything the women the meeting the number of women who would have lost their life then and are in heaven and because of the we are the problem then the reason that there are actually happy because they can marry anybody outside the faith to shazia i see you and you and you represent a very important perspective here because obviously this is a big move i hear it still has to be a conversation natasha go ahead yes i just want to say that the level of discourse that has just been in the street is not is not the price they convert everything that is a political question into an existential question and i dont of course and will who is who doesnt agree with then i start you know i dont know sort of argument the fact is that in you at the moment in relation to me it is acting as an end by masquerading as a democracy it is colonial because there is no one sense being thought of the center love to be expressed that which we do not being humiliated they are arbitrary and i did not do well at the moment im going to sign you know it would be going to. Work just yet i am here i need to be out to hear natasha so that i can hear what you want to say back to her but i cant do that if you talk to the beating her therapist not reapplying to very rational chance i salute that is for me to decide hold tight for a moment thank you d. Im sorry this made no beans the book will be good science and subjugate and it is a bad thing to go cold war the only way this are going to be barbecued in india is by not allowing the may feel indian media to cover it if this is not being done for the benefit of fish maybe they havent got to be in the net they havent got the law and if we want to we want to push ahead because of all the people who are online who also want to be possible conversation i j i actually want to bring you back into the conversation via this video comment on what this actually means for the future of the region so we got a comment from 10 very atman hes an independent researcher and hes coming to us from kashmir or pakistan administered kashmir heres what he told the string. Musicians states and also during the intifada by the conflict management module and during his night in 47 this is the purpose of the open up space