jo castro has the latest from washington dc. as we've seen the us taking increasingly a sort of steps and trying to limit that violence. first telling is real, that it must contain this vigilant extreme is settlers violence, then issuing visas earlier last week against travel to the us, of some of the individuals involved in this violence. and now, pausing, at least for the moment, the shipment of 27000 military style rifles that was intended to go to the is really national police. but that is feared by the us, by the administration. and they could ultimately be handed over into the hands of these extremists settlers. and it's notable how this pause occurred because already this shipment was, had cleared, the initial congressional review, passed the committee stage, and it was the by the ministration itself. that said, no, wait, we have to take another look at this, saying that the assurance is received thus far from israel, that these rifles would not end up in the hands of extremes. those assurances just did not go far enough. so until that is done, the us says it will hold onto this shipment. all right, so that brings us towards the end of this show. but the good news is we're back at the top of the hours and now the full, full assume that's coming up with my colleagues. so rahman kind of close does our website out to 0, don't com. you can stay tuned with overlays and stories being following on the lead story children track under the rubble of the deadly israeli strikes. so stream now the a central south challenging place to work from. as a journalist, you're always pushing our boundaries we are the ones traveling the extra mile where all the media goals. we go there and we give them a chance to tell their story. mcdonald's, starbucks dominos, just a few of the companies that have seen their sales nosedive as consumers or calling corporations out for their support of israel's more ongoing. how effective are these white cards? they really hit to brands and israel very hearts out of these boxes. and this is the street the this graphic was put together by the way, cost investments and sanctions movement, which is the voice that we need to be listening to. first and foremost when it comes to all these boycotts and do it. or do you know the starbucks and h m? i live in the moroccan markets. i'm gonna show you how to make up the dream on the menu. you can enjoy them at home without having to spend your money at the. the 1st brand is domino's pizza. i get tickets very, shall wish me money. cool. is a brand start losing money and it's clear why that's forced to make changes the content creator who wants to use her platform. and i don't want to be supporting mika brands that fun genocide in a part time. i don't know what the promo c means um. yeah. full have to do with israel's ongoing war on gaza. does abandoning their products really make a difference in bringing the plight of palestinians to an end? since october, boy cox divestment and sanctions has seen a huge search and global support. the policy and lead movement has been calling for pressure on companies that profit from israel's occupation. what can be the spring about? we'll change. and if so, how? here to discuss this with us, our solid huge ozzy. upon our side free policy coordinator at b. b. s. who joins us from ramallah in the occupied westbank. alice samson, esther pay formerly b u, or p, and campaigns coordinator for the ds, joining us from boston loan. and i'm ed bosh. bosh the founder and developer of the know thinks app is from gaza, but it's currently in budapest. thank you all so much for joining us here on the stream today. i don't want to start with you, you're very much pause. all of this move meant so much so that you create an app. no thanks. that helps consumers figure out which brands to boycott. can you tell us why you actually created this app? the idea of it. uh with to difference the broach. the 1st the broad shit was like, when i was in the store, i wanted to buy some stuff, but like, um, i didn't know which one to play cards, which one, i'm not supposed to buy. so i got to me this idea, but i didn't do anything about it till i and the 31st of november when i lost my brother. and then i was like, okay, i think no, it is the time for me to make something for my country. as i am in a abroad and they don't, i'm not in my country and i lost my brother there. and before that i lost my sister to. so i was like, okay, i think at this time now to do this um the app and make it in their behalf like i try to do work for them. so this was actually going to ration by mass of personal loss. today when you see the off working, do you feel as though this is your way to pay homage to your, to your sister and to your brother? yes, actually i, i, when i so like for example, now i have in the play store around 100, the 19000 downloads. and a lot of people are waiting for the ios version on these things. i feel like i did something to my brother who i lost on my sister. oh, even it is like of us about a small thing about the still count. so thought a be, this is know an organization is, is, is a move and it says is a tactic that has been around actually for some 20 years. can you tell us about the origin of this? how did it all stars? this video started in 2005 by the opposite with majority of products in society in palestine. i'm in force anxiety. it depends on a tradition of the cities for many decades of uh, boycotts, civil disobedience, uh, non violent, uh, a resistance that goes along side uh, all the forms of trying to read those sides of illegal occupation such as colonialism and uh, an apartheid. um. and what it does, it works on the ending complicity by states corporations and organizations and institutions and is really crimes against the senior people, including the crime. a guest reminds you of apartheid. a know the crime of genocide that we are seeing unfolding in, in gaza. so it looks at a company's institutions and states that directly contribute to a desktop, attracting of these crimes against palestinians here, and also enforced exercise by preventing them from the right of return. we want to see the dismantling. the end of this was set up wrong isn't an a plus either against our people. alice, if i can bring you in here. um, what can you tell us about the concrete impacts of these campaigns actually have on some of the brands that are targeted along? um, throughout the years, have you seen any kind of policy change on the part of these brands? so thank you. thank you so much for having me here. it's an honor to be with you. i can speak a specific example, someone based on why i lived in a where i live in and where i'm organize in barcelona, in the spanish state where so huge coalition of civil society for the 2 years. we're asking the boss elaina city council to end its relationship with a positive is wrote with the is really government. and i think what we manage to convey the idea that it is impossible to say that he signed and defensive human rights and have relations as normal with apartheid israel. and i think that that's something very important as well. bts organizing and media campaign does is create this narrative. let's remember that with right now on the world, whether it's such bias in the media defending is really crying just so much misinformation that it's so important. the change in narrative that vs an organizing and solidarity with palestine does conveying the idea that israel is a settler colonial state that applies applied to the palestinian people. so yes, i think that all of this organizing makes it harder for companies to do business as usual. with israel and for states to, oh, i want to bring it back to i'm as for, can i want to share with you all a clip of the app that he created on the the uh, can you tell us a little bit more about how the app actually works so so thus the idea of deb, it's very simple. um, i may look at a family that will take the bought quite different products when you scan it and that will take the brand name of it and we compare it to that boy got the list of the brands that we have. we have already. and if there is a match, it wouldn't get you with the it is in the port got the list and the like. then you have the the choice to buy it or not. um it's um, quite a helpful tool for people who want to join the movement solid i, when i want to talk to you a little bit about the wider strategy here, because as alice mentioned, it's very important to alter the narrative. perhaps there has been one particular narrative that the west has adopted it, and now we're seeing other parts of this story actually highlighted. and we've been talking about a lot about the boy costing of brands. but with this also calls for the boy costs of culture and academic institutions and for the investment and sanctions on israel . can you tell us a little bit about these other tactics and how effective they have been to yes, it's a video as is inspired among other examples uh, by the south african struggling against the part time. and defenders here is that we've been people in power. uh, when you have powerful governments and institutions of siding and supporting with the pressure that it is to people and people of power that we can create a change. and this change can happen by applying the pressure from the grassroots up to mass mobilization. you know that you put the throat video as a, as a movement of millions of people, a union. so civil society organizations, russert groups all around the world that are joining these campaigns and applying the pressure. one is consuming, the blog posts that we've been talking about. the button is the tool is, is, you know, what would fall under the s and b, the sections is the isolating apartheid. just like it was the case. and when there was apartheid in, in south africa, outside south africa was kicked out of the united nations. it was not allowed to be an international forums. it was isolated until the apartheid regime was dismantled . and you had a state that was done been trying to democratic states would, would rights for all the freedom, justice and equality. and this is what we in for. and so yes, you have the, the b and the b b s, which is the by costs which, you know, the consumer campaigns for on the investment, which alice pointed to. and this includes, for example, city counselors divesting from uh is there is documentation, a legal supplements in apartheid. or for example, a saying that they will never contract companies that either complicit then is really crimes always ready to companies. like, for example, the city council of dublin, and then you have major corporations and some of the successes that we've had over the years. it includes, for example, the most recent d, g for us, some of the national security company. uh that, uh, pulls out the visitor. uh uh, before there was uh, french, multi national company, the all yeah, orange and the list goes on. you know, you can visit our website for the rest of successes. and this falls under the deep . it'd be vs. but the, the, the, the main points here is that when you have an apartheid regime is subject to the product, which means that is currently protecting genocide against an indigenous population that you isolate dr. eugene until these crimes and the system off apartheid is dismantled and you're talking about isolation. is it effective on a financial level? is this actually affecting israel's economy in any way to look into the cumulative work? you know, as i was saying, the, this was established in 2005 with many successes to go along with the challenges. you know, those must have refreshing, that is happening and gets the video smooth. and the successes accumulates of named it if you you have also for example, a southern funds like the one in norway. you know, these are massive multi 1000000 funds that have have divested from his role. and we continue to, to work and accumulate. so yes, it does have an impact financially and economically and we hope that it will have more so as we go along, but it also has a political impact of isolating upon side is right. and you know, just most recent that you could see, for example, the voting of the un general assembly when it came to the ceasefire. how the us and his read were isolated when it comes to the rest of it was the same thing. and in terms of, for example, the reaction with the us, vito protecting is, are of most recent 3 and the security council again. so you can see the isolation working, alice didn't do you agree that the political impact is as important perhaps as the impacts on the economy? yes to, to the just to build on what it was saying and was of measurement. nathaniel, who, himself, there was an article recently published in the financial times, which said that he'd spoken to a local is really media saying that they need 3 things on the us, munitions, munitions, and munitions that have been huge demonstrations in western capital that could, that could the concern him because they, this political pressure overseas could threaten the us, on shipments and at the israel had to apply counselor pressure because as being disagreements with the best of its friends. and i think this speaks very clearly when it's israel in 5 minutes. the speaking of this comes to, uh, seeing how mass people power, how is huge mobilizations all around the world are affecting and kind of fit the israel. and i think this is part of what we're saying before about this change of narrative. take one very specific example, it was french company v o your years ago off to huge off to tens of millions of years of losses due to participating in the jerusalem like well, which is a, a rail that connects illegal is ready the central months build on processing and stolen land between them of the sustained pressure all around the world. yo yo had decided to lead units to 2 losses. there were other companies that applied for the bidding. and last minute they decided to to pull back because they even there was an is ready newspaper that said that jerusalem is out of the pale. and i think this is part of what i was saying about this change of narrative, how a salad was saying before, as well as more and more isolated at a political level and economic level. and this is due to the realization all around the world. mm hm. and to go back to the boy coughing aspect of this, consumers are going after companies that are directly complicity in the oppression of palestinians like age be whose technology is actually used by israel to surveil palestinians in the west bank. but people are also boy causing companies that endorse israel's occupation in more subtle ways, like mcdonald's, which handed out free meals to idea of soldiers or starbucks. which suit it's workers' union for posting pro palestine content online. here's just one example. i know you guys don't want to hear it, but starbucks as a company, nothing to do with the workers, which the company deliberately supports identified. so when you're paying to take that drink your dollars are voiding that children killed in palestine. i know you guys don't want to hear this, i mean even if they're on your computer and they've got the government blind. but that's what's happening. and i wanna ask you from what you're hearing from your palestinian friends, perhaps the backend gaza. um, are they see any of this and is it important to them in any way that this is actually happening that people are boycotting these brands or it doesn't really matter at this stage. to be honest is the impact we have talking about is not about the what the my friends are seeing. it is the, the whole point of it is like the support, the bumping that's happening right now and goes so the, the 2nd i'm extends that this a, the, the money that is go, go to is there are you that goes to buy you bombs, buy fuel for the address that i so the people maybe they don't see it, but then we are just, we don't like to share our part with this genocide. that's the whole point of our side. the boys got to like, not to be a part of for this genocide, not to be a part of the financing of these operations. solar bts has faced criticism and an opposition in the past. um with some people claiming that the movement is somehow anti semitic. what do you say to that? i will look at uh be, this is a movement that is based on uh, principals, an essex. we stand against racism in all its forms. uh, a, this is quite crucial because otherwise it would not work. uh, it's a human rights movement. uh that is against discrimination. it's against racism, any form of racism. and actually quite crucial on strong components within the movements. uh, organizations like for example, jewish boys for peace, who have been doing these very inspiring actions in the us. aiming at the ending at the us from 50 and is rose kinds of parts and then genocide against the palestinian people. and we are the movement of intersection of the strong and the basis of this intersection onto you are these principles of justice, a freedom and equality. this is why it works. this is why you have millions of people of all, uh, you know, kinds of black crowns uh, color raise a new city, religion at the moment this bind to that and that's what makes it successful. and you have somebody supporting, it's all around the world. and alice, uh, as we mentioned at the start of the show, we actually saw a significant increase in support to this movement. uh, would you say that this is, this represents a change in the tide here in terms of global opinion of public opinion around the world with regards to how israel treats palestinians. yes, definitely. i think we're seeing a huge new wave of solidarity with palestine was seeing people who had never mobilized for palestine before that are seeing things very clearly. right now i think this being an effort to always portray what happens in palestine is something complex and difficult to understand. one is actually very clear as well as trying to steal palace in your land by so when moving old testing is from this land. and i think that we're seeing work is from all over the world. we're seeing people we're seeing active as we've seen people of conscious we're seeing more and more institutions and companies thing that know in the name that they do not want to be part of it as well as genocide. and i think that we're seeing very clearly a growing gap between what people on the streets a matching for, and a cooling for, and then what institutions are doing. and i think it's important that we remember that change. srp history hasn't happened on its own. it's been people organizing and marching and doing lots of work behind the scenes that has enabled change. and with a long list of bts boy called targets, how do you make sure that the company or institution you're targeting will actually listen. this social media user has some thoughts on the importance of clear demands . so if you're, for example, trying to support the beauty estimates, now they have specific companies and they also have very specific reasons for each of those companies, right. can clearly articulate and, and condition right, or kind of whom i could stop, stay no longer sponsored the is really football leaks are operating in the occupied wes thing. so if you're participating, i'm not boy client, you can say i am not purchasing clothing from to my toll. they no longer sponsor these leads and tell is a really key phrase there. it lets people see that you're being reasonable, that you have a good reason to not be buying this product and that entails the company. and especially for a lot of people say it in this way that there is potential for them to make more money. if they do the right thing, then there is for them to continue to do the wrong thing. goal of avoid talk campaign is to make it easier for the company. 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