Independent voters to stay home. Believe independent voters to stay home. I believe the only worry President Trump has right now are that these indictments are chipping away at his money that he is raising at a very hefty pace. He is spending more on legalfees hefty pace. He is spending more on legal fees that most of his rivals are actually raising and a quarter. So that is one thing that i think your reviewers need to take a look at it and watch over the next three months. In the end, the lawyers, the strategists, Donald Trumps family, can sit back and devise what they think is the best step by step strategy to defend donald trump from all of these allegations. There is only one person that is going to make that decision on how to proceed and that is blue. My interactions with President Trump were very positive over the time that i served with him. But in my opinion he is the most undisciplined, the most undisciplined politician that i have ever had a chance to work with. So he is quick to lash out in every way. That is going to be his strategy. What he thinks should be said is going to be set on truth social or other social media outlets. He is going to tell him to tweet this and it will come out in the whole world will read it and report on it. That is why you will not see a codified strategy from anyone in this orbit. It is going to be hit or miss based upon what he sees being reported in the media every day about him and his case. And that is very dangerous for him, i think in the criminal case, but we will see what happens. The i think in the criminal case, but we will see what happens. Will see what happens. The spring that carl nasman will see what happens. The spring that carl nasman who will see what happens. The spring that carl nasman who is will see what happens. The spring that carl nasman who is still that carl nasman who is still outside of the courthouse for us. Again we have been following proceedings for us all day. Just listen to our panelists, give us an idea of what comes next now for the president Going Forward. President Going Forward. There is many more president Going Forward. There is many more Court PresidentGoing Forward. There is many more Court Appearances i president Going Forward. There is l many more Court Appearances and potentially other indictments on the horizon. Of course in terms of this particular case, we note that the next court date is set for august 28. So towards the end of the month. That will be presided over Byjudge Chutkan and thats when we think we know when we will get an actual start to this trial. We should get a date in which we know that this trial will start and that will just join the many, several of their court dates that are facing donald trump and becoming weeks and months. And between all of these Different Campaign events and different primaries coming up in the election cycle, we also know that there will be plenty of court dates from Civil To Criminal to state to federal and this is not the third of course federal arraignment, this is not the third of course federalarraignment, indictment that federal arraignment, indictment that the federalarraignment, indictment that the former president is facing. Karen washington, dc outside of the courthouse that has seen many other January The 6th cases. There were no cameras allowed in the courtroom of course because it is a federal courthouse, but there were some reporters including our very own who was allowed inside the courthouse. Take a look. You were inside, one of the rare people inside taking a look. Illshare the rare people inside taking a look. Ill share with us was the demeanour of donald trump himself . He was very calm and quiet. He did not say he was very calm and quiet. He did not say much, he just responded very quickly not say much, he just responded very quickly to not say much, he just responded very quickly to questions been answered. He gave quickly to questions been answered. He gave his quickly to questions been answered. He gave his name and he was asked his age he gave his name and he was asked his age he he gave his name and he was asked his age. He said he was 77, and his word his age. He said he was 77, and his word but his age. He said he was 77, and his word. But other words there was no Probe Reaction even when the day been Probe Reaction even when the day been possible possible penalties were right been possible possible penalties were right out. Very little on his face were right out. Very little on his face spent were right out. Very little on his face spent most of time with his hands is face spent most of time with his hands is front of him hunched over the table hands is front of him hunched over the table. He seemed to be not reacting the table. He seemed to be not reacting much. Not visibly anyway showing reacting much. Not visibly anyway showing any emotion. Reacting much. Not visibly anyway showing any emotion. Described as the moments showing any emotion. Described as the moments that showing any emotion. Described as the moments that the showing any emotion. Described as the moments that the former the moments that the former president entered his plea. He stood u. President entered his plea. He stood u and president entered his plea. He stood up and thats president entered his plea. He stood up and thats the president entered his plea. He stood up and thats the front president entered his plea. He stood up and thats the front of president entered his plea. He stood up and thats the front of the president entered his plea. He stood up and thats the front of the room l up and thats the front of the room and he up and thats the front of the room and he kind up and thats the front of the room and he kind of mouth the words not guilty and he kind of mouth the words not guilty as is and he kind of mouth the words not guilty as is lawyer entered the plea on his guilty as is lawyer entered the plea on his behalf but not much reaction and he on his behalf but not much reaction and he did on his behalf but not much reaction and he did not seem at all worried or irritated. And he did not seem at all worried or irritated, just very direct. He mustve or irritated, just very direct. He mustve prepared for this moment well ahead of time. You could tell it was well ahead of time. You could tell it was very well ahead of time. You could tell it was very procedural for him as wett~ it was very procedural for him as well. ~ ,. ,. , ,. , well. We understand that this is a very modest well. We understand that this is a very modest courtroom well. We understand that this is a very modest courtroom and well. We understand that this is a very modest courtroom and not. Well. We understand that this is a i very modest courtroom and not very large, 70 people inside. Cages paint a picture for us of the court house and what the atmosphere was like. The court room itself was very, very small. The court room itself was very, very small. Very the court room itself was very, very small, very limited space. So there were small, very limited space. So there were attorneys, court staff in there were attorneys, court staff in there a were attorneys, court staff in there. A Few Dc District Judges who had been there. A Few Dc District Judges who had been dealing with January The 6th cases, sitting in the room. We saw a 6th cases, sitting in the room. We saw a view 6th cases, sitting in the room. We saw a viewjanuary 6th cases, sitting in the room. We saw a view January The 6th cases, sitting in the room. We saw a viewJanuary The 6thFirst Responders in the courthouse as well, responders in the courthouse as well, but responders in the courthouse as well, but the actual room was a very tiht well, but the actual room was a very tight space well, but the actual room was a very tight space and everyone else was in overflow tight space and everyone else was in overflow rooms where you can watch proceedings on Big Screen Tv Set Up on the proceedings on Big Screen Tv Set Up on the walls. That is where i was for example and there it was a little for example and there it was a little more informal, people were speaking little more informal, people were speaking. Courtroom itself seem very serious speaking. Courtroom itself seem very serious and everyone very quiet very serious and everyone very quiet but very serious and everyone very quiet. But no fuss for any commotion of any quiet. But no fuss for any commotion of any kind quiet. But no fuss for any commotion of any kind of any kind. Also some interesting scenes because of any kind. Also some interesting scenes because the of any kind. Also some interesting scenes because the special of any kind. Also some interesting | scenes because the special counsel Him Smalljack Smith entered the room. I believe even before donald trump if that is correct. He sat down in the very front row and there were some maybe not big interactions, but donald trump and jack smith, they were certainly aware of each other in the courtroom. Aware of each other in the courtroom. ,. ,. , courtroom. They certainly were and eve one courtroom. They certainly were and everyone was courtroom. They certainly were and everyone was kind courtroom. They certainly were and everyone was kind of courtroom. They certainly were and everyone was kind of looking courtroom. They certainly were and everyone was kind of looking for. Everyone was kind of looking for that in everyone was kind of looking for that in particular. I would Sayjack Smith that in particular. I would Sayjack Smith seemed to spend a lot more time looking focused, looking towards time looking focused, looking towards donald trump than not the judge towards donald trump than not the judge. Donald trump convinced him occasionally, but otherwise seemed to be occasionally, but otherwise seemed to be purposely avoiding any sort of gtances to be purposely avoiding any sort of gtances in to be purposely avoiding any sort of glances in his direction or gestures in his glances in his direction or gestures in his direction. You could tell there in his direction. You could tell there were in his direction. You could tell there were tension in the 8 10 feet space there were tension in the 8 10 feet space between the. There were tension in the 810 feet space between the. There were tension in the 810 feet space between the. Donald trump was waitin for space between the. Donald trump was waiting for around space between the. Donald trump was waiting for around 20 space between the. Donald trump was waiting for around 20 minutes space between the. Donald trump was waiting for around 20 minutes for waiting for around 20 minutes for thejudge to arrive waiting for around 20 minutes for the judge to arrive do we have any idea on why the delay was or why it did not start exactly on time . I did not start exactly on time . I cannot say exactly why the delay happened. We were waiting for the judge happened. We were waiting for the judge it happened. We were waiting for the judge it for quite some time, as he mentioned that i was the one time that you mentioned that i was the one time that you could kind of feel the tension that you could kind of feel the tension in that you could kind of feel the tension in the room and in the courthouse. Donald trump himself tooked courthouse. Donald trump himself looked a courthouse. Donald trump himself looked a little irritated at having to wait looked a little irritated at having to wait it looked a little irritated at having to wait. It kind of built up tension in the to wait. It kind of built up tension in the room to wait. It kind of built up tension in the room which was very palpable even in in the room which was very palpable even in the in the room which was very palpable even in the overflow room. Gne in the room which was very palpable even in the overflow room. Even in the overflow room. One of the few reporters even in the overflow room. One of the few reporters actually even in the overflow room. One of the few reporters actually allowed | the few reporters actually allowed inside the courthouse of course as i mentioned there were no cameras allowed inside of the room, a very small area, allowed inside of the room, a very smallarea, only allowed inside of the room, a very small area, only three benches but there were some journalists will stop he was one of them allowed inside of the courthouse taking a look and following along todays of todays arraignment, not a long proceeding around 30 minutes. And oddly familiar, be have seen this play out before with donald trump in terms of the actions that took place inside of the courtroom. They very shortly afterwards he went back out a private extra to his motorcade that was waiting for him and he drove back to the airport and he is already back in newjersey. So this was a fairly quick day, not very many addresses by him, just the brief address that that we saw earlier in the airport. So a little different from the arraignment we saw in florida. However still becoming very familiar process in terms of how these rooms play out. Thank you very much for that. We were seeing the images of the court renderings, sketches that have not been released from what happened in the court today. You can see all that and get latest information and also the experience on the courtroom on our website bbc. Com. These are images right here of the highway in newjersey. That is the former president s motorcade as he has heading back to his golf club where heading back to his golf club where he headed from earlier today. It all happen fairly quickly, flew in from bedminster directly to dc into the Court Arraignment and that left, a short while ago and now has landed and is heading to the golf club there in Bedminster Newjersey where he will be. But as carlson, like the previous indictments and arraignments come this was a very quick procedure that took place in washington to say and as we are looking at pictures and the highway lets bring back our panel. Sarah to start with you we were hearing carl our correspondent talking about the different dates Going Forward and said something you and i have discussed on the programme before as well. I heard it being called air traffic control, trying to sort these Different Cases and trial dates. Helpful is not going to be from a legal perspective to see these two trials as we know so far, soon to be possible three before the election . This so far, soon to be possible three before the election . Before the election . This is extremely before the election . This is extremely challenging, before the election . This is extremely challenging, for| before the election . This is i extremely challenging, for the judge, for the Prosecution Team and the defence team. They barely had to navigate all of these different schedules and figure out how they interplay with each other. So i have been involved in matters that have had where a defendant has had other criminal proceedings perhaps in the state, perhaps anotherjurisdiction state, perhaps another jurisdiction and state, perhaps anotherjurisdiction and even navigating that relatively simple situation can be very complicated. So i think it will be difficult for all of the folks to handle that in particular the judges in these cases. And they may need to co ordinate among themselves a bit to sort of navigate these waters. fin to sort of navigate these waters. On the to sort of navigate these waters. 0n the back of that the congressmen have been talking about the fact that Donald Trumps legal team has spent a lot of money on fees so far, of course 21 million of legal fees just in the first half of 2023 alone. What kind of impact does that have on the former president and his team . ,. Have on the former president and his team . ,. ,. , team . Has a huge impact. Right now does not team . Has a huge impact. Right now does rrot seem team . Has a huge impact. Right now does not seem to team . Has a huge impact. Right now does not seem to have team . Has a huge impact. Right now does not seem to have a team . Has a huge impact. Right now does not seem to have a financial does not seem to have a Financial Impact does not seem to have a Financial Impact on does not seem to have a Financial Impact on him. We are all forgetting that even impact on him. We are all forgetting that even though he has burned through that even though he has burned through a that even though he has burned through a lot of this political money, through a lot of this political money, the 40 million to defend himself, money, the 40 million to defend himself, he could always turn out the spigot himself, he could always turn out the spigot for himself a step he is a billionaire, he has resources that probably a billionaire, he has resources that probably very few people have ever had been probably very few people have ever had been they on up against federal government. Its sort of level out the governments advantage so his birth to the governments advantage so his birth to 40 million and he will burn birth to 40 million and he will burn tomorrow but if you never get desperate burn tomorrow but if you never get desperate situation donald trump will do desperate situation donald trump will do what he hates doing, he hates will do what he hates doing, he hates it will do what he hates doing, he hates it. He will write his own check hates it. He will write his own check to hates it. He will write his own check to stay out of this. Arena is not appear check to stay out of this. Arena is not appear he has to. Not appear he has to. Interesting oint not appear he has to. Interesting point there not appear he has to. Interesting point there i not appear he has to. Interesting point there. I want not appear he has to. Interesting point there. I want to