Transcripts For BBCNEWS This 20240704 : vimarsana.com

In it, it matters to the world. Now, in india, there are dozens of Political Parties in this country, but two really dominate the bjp and the congress. Before we get there, though, lets take a look at the election in numbers. 968 million eligible voters. 1. 2 million Polling Booths across the country. 15 million election workers. That is almost the populations of both london and new york combined. Ok, so speaking of numbers, get this one. A poll that tracks the popularity of Global Leaders put Prime Minister Narendra Modis Approval Rating at 78 . By comparison, a domestic poll in the uk put Prime Minister rishi sunak� s Approval Rating at 48 . 50 ten years on, how is it that mr modi remains so popular . A Triumphant Tourfor Prime Minister Narendra Modi, finally making good on a decades old promise. To bring the hindu god ram back to his birthplace here in ayodhya. Translation ram is the faith of india. Ram is the foundation of india. Ram is the thought of india. Ram is the constitution of india. Those are the words by the Prime Minister of a secular country, made building a hindu temple. Key to his re election campaign, it has exalted his popularity. Sitting next to mr modi, chief of the Rashtriya Swayamsevak sangh, or rss, the right wing Hindu Nationalist Organisation seen as the ideological fountainhead for the ruling party. The rss is entrenched in families, and its a deeply conservative, inward looking militia which was founded in 1925, which mr modi and his party pays obeisance to. Mr modi doesntjust respect the rss. He became a member in his teens. Archive they raise the saffron flag. That brand of Hindu Nationalism was behind the demolition of the 16th century mosque three decades earlier where the ram temple now sits. And across the country, other mosques are under threat from Hindu Nationalism. A court in mr modis Home Constituency ruled hindus can worship in the basement of the gyanvapi mosque. Believers in hindutva feel emboldened, but the local Muslim Community is fearful for their place in Narendra Modis india. Translation im angry. Im frustrated. There is pain, but there is also anger because we are not able to do anything. We have been praying there for 50 years, but we cant do anything to save it. I dont understand. Is this the way our country will run . And for how long will you surprise us . Supress us. I take his concerns to a local tea stall, made famous by the Prime Minister when he visited two years ago. Are you hindu or muslim . In response, my identity was questioned. Translation why only muslims feel offended . | whenever a hindutva word comes, |why only muslims feel offended . I no any other religion. Since this countrys inception, since people have known this| country, since then, it has been a hindu country. But only now has the word hindutva been coined. But we have to answer again and again, whenever a hindutva word comes, what about muslims . Away from the city and the politics of divide, indias agricultural heartland. Part of mr modis popularity has been the success of his so called welfare schemes. Sanjay prajapati shows me his crops, and he tells me that he gets money and rations for free from the government, a great financial benefit for him. And for mr modi, it means votes. Translation i was a congress supporter, but then Narendra Modi came with his ideologies, his way of working and the way he connects to the people on the ground. He understands peoples way of thinking and what they want. Now i vote for the bjp. The women in this village just a few miles away get the benefits. But what they really need is better access to water. Translation we get money. We get rice and grains. We got cooking gas, but we are struggling with water. Theres no water, and we have to get it from a well far away. They blame corruption, saying its not the fault of mr modi. A lot of schemes that used to be schemes run by Government Departments are all now being presented and repackaged. Every scheme has been pradhan mantri, pradhan mantri. So everything. Pradhan mantri meaning Prime Minister. So everything coming not from the government, not from the department, not from any other person. Its all coming from pradhan mantri. And its that spin on the messaging that makes mr modi appear unstoppable. Everywhere you go, you see his face plastered on billboards and even on Covid Vaccine certificates, creating an image of a Prime Minister that is larger than life. There is no leader within light years who comes close to Prime Minister modi. Some quarters of the media does the rest of the work for him. Mainstream media, whosejob is to ask questions, Holding Governments questionable, of asking them questions, is not happening. So what happens is that mr modi stands tall. The cult is allowed to build up because you have 500 news channels, you have 60 websites all saying the same thing. Prime minister modis carefully curated image, honed over his two plus decades in politics, is likely to get him his third term. Also making mr modis electoral success a weak opposition. The Indian National Congress Party led this country to independence but now is a shadow of its former self, seemingly unable to capitalise on government missteps. So will these elections be any different . Arunoday this is the man seen as the oppositions hope to take on Prime Minister Narendra Modi. Congress leader rahul gandhi is travelling across the country, asking voters what they want. Translation this is a question you will have to ask yourselves every day. Unemployment, inflation, this is your future. Well, going by the support over here, it seems like a vote of confidence, at least from the supporters of rahul gandhi, for the Congress Party. This is the very significant, politically significant constituency of amethi, which has always belonged to the gandhi family. For 15 years, rahul gandhi represented this seat, before that, his mother, his father, his uncle. So its really remained with the gandhi family, until 2019, in a shock defeat, the Congress Party lost to the bjp here. So can he win them back . An hour away from the noise of the campaign trail, i meet 65 year old shabir khan in the village of chachkapoor in amethi. For generations, his family has voted for the congress. But even staunch loyalists like shabir feel the party is not doing enough. Translation nothing| will change if they dont raise other issues. Rahul gandhi needs to roar, like other politicians. Hes a good man, but thats not enough. If he speaks with more conviction, it will be good for him, for the party and for us. Since indias independence, the Congress Party dominated the countrys political landscape. From 400 seats in parliament in the 1980s, they were down to 52 in the 2019 elections. To counter the bjp� s rising popularity, in july last year, Opposition Partiesjoined Hands to form a united front. Translation if this alliance wins, our country will win. But in less than a year, there are cracks in the alliance. Key partners have left, joining the bjp, and others are bickering over seats. Youre not worried about these differences . Im not worried. These are differences. We have to recognise they are differences. | but a divided house isnt. Its not a house divided. We are a house with multiple voices. But multiple voices of dissent, as well. Not necessarily. Just divergent points of view. These differences, though, are casting a doubt in voters. The most raw yet nuanced political conversations in india often happen at these kind of tea stalls. Its the best way to get a pulse of what people are thinking. Translation since i became eligible to vote, i have only i voted for the congress, but last time we votedi for the bjp. I asked them the bjp has one face, Narendra Modi, but the opposition hasnt projected anyone. Do you think they should . Translations absolutely. Thats what we are thinking. There has to be a face, i that this is our candidate. There is no leader here who can take our problems to rahul gandhi they need to build our road. Whoever builds this road for us, we will vote for them. There is no bigger issue for us than this. This is interesting, because in the middle of all the National Issues that are being debated, for the people over here, something as small as building a road to connect this village to the city is as important to them. And just on the basis of that road being built, theyll vote for the party that gives it to them. Young people here are roaming around withoutjobs, and prices are rising. Do you think religious politics will give the bjp political mileage . They are gaining votes only on the basis of religion. If they set religious politics aside, they wont even get 100 seats in parliament. They should talk about development. They should stop this hindu muslim politics. Carrying on the conversation over tea, i asked them what their message to the Congress Party is. Rahul gandhi should realise he wont get votes just by waving at crowds. He has to find a way to listen to our problems. Just a Cross Country roadshow short of elections is not enough. When you are in the opposition, you need to be hungrier. You need to be bolder. You need to be more imaginative. And above all, youve got to work harder. I think if mr modi is looking like a frontrunner, i think the full credit for this anomaly has to be given to the Congress Party. The opposition says they are up against a lot more. Multiple raids, several arrests and over 140 Opposition Mps suspended in the last session of parliament, all being seen as an act of intimidation. Rahul gandhis show of strength is an attempt to reclaim a space for the opposition. But can these crowds turn into votes and can rahul convert this roadshow into his victory lap . So one thing thats really come out of the piece by arunoday is the fact that, really, congress hasnt been able to manage the message. But thats certainly not a problem for the ruling bjp party. Theyve been really successful at it. Now, whats really changed the landscape also is just how successful the government has been at getting people on the internet. In fact, were actually on the lawns of parliament and you can see them just behind me right now. So lets talk aboutjust how important the digitisation of india is. And i want to start with shruti. Youre with bbc verify. You do a lot of work looking at these numbers. Just what kind of an impact has this digitisation, or getting so many people on the internet, had on the voters . Lets start with 2014,| when the bjp first won the election. The internet penetration. Or Internet Subscriber base that india had stood at around 18 . And in 2015, the government launched the Digital India mission, which was meant. To bring more people online and also democratise the sort of social Welfare Benefits that people get. And cut to 2023. It has now grown to 63 . So that sort of tells you the growth in the way indias Internet Subscriber base and the Digital Economy has grown. I want to throw this next to you, shazia. How has your party really been able to take advantage of that, in getting the message out to voters . Well, the party, janata party, is the largest party, notjust in india, but in the world, if you look at the sheer numbers, and every day we have new members, and as shruti just explained, the active Internet Base is huge. Were looking at more than 800 million internet users. So because a party also has a huge political base, its a cadre based party. So its also. Its also what we have to say, then how we say it, looking at the numbers, and so all the achievements of Modi Government in the last ten years, we are looking at them, talking about them through different platforms, and social media becomes very important to us. Now, gerry, in your pieces for the washington post, youve actually looked at a lot of these. Of tech, really, and the role of tech. What really stands out for you . Yeah, well, samira, you know, what shazia said was absolutely true. The bjp is the Worlds Largest Political Party. And Many Political scientists, i think, that have observed Indian Politics and compared it to other democracies would say that the bjp, arguably, for better or worse, has one of the most efficient, largest sort of well drilled messaging and arguably Propaganda Machines that weve seen sort of anywhere in any country. They dominate the traditional media. But i would argue that what they really have cracked, that no other party in the world really has, is the ability to deliver messages into the pockets of indian voters. As shazia had mentioned, whatsapp in the last decade has become a crucial venue. And many people would say that, yes, while the bjp is very efficient in spreading positive news about its accomplishments, its also been very capable of spreading misinformation, disinformation, that has a corrosive effect on indian political discourse. Shazia, how do you respond to that . All that bjp is talking about and doing is also talking about the various accomplishments. These are facts and figures of what bjp has delivered in terms of governance, and there have been similar charges and some canards, too. For instance, the wire, which speaks against the bjp, had a story on tech fog, which actually they had to retract and apologise for. So there have been those. You know. There have been stories of misinformation, but which have been corrected and retracted later. So i dont think theres this much disinformation you can do where numbers are concerned. You can do it with incidents and events, but were sure Delivery Mechanisms go, bjp tops it all. So what bjps official media handle does is what we would take responsibility for, but not anybody posing to be a bjp memberorwanting to be a bjp member. So were not responsible for all information out there, but only for the official handles that we represent. If i could interject. I mean, what shazia says is true. You know, i spent several weeks last year sort of observing kind of how the Social Media Landscape Works during elections. And what we noticed was that, you know, the bjp sort of. It established social media cells and war rooms in basically every single Voting District in the state, often on the official handles that are sort of run technically by the party. It was mostly positive. These were mostly. Almost all fact based kind of positive messaging, the stuff that you would see in any sort of country. But the bjp is backed by what many would say are hindu nationalist groups, some of which are quite extremist in their views, that sort of prop up and mobilise the foot soldiers of the party. And its within the vast whatsapp ecosystem of these groups that are intermingled with the official whatsapp groups of the bjp. Thats where you see the most virulent material. Its really difficult, often, to sort of separate what is the official bjp material and what is a lot of this other more virulent material that is being spread by its base. But let me tell you, theres a lot of propaganda and disinformation coming from Non Bjp Handles also. Lets also get into it. My name is shazia ilmi. Im a muslim. Im in the bjp. The kind of filth im subjected to day after day. So propaganda happens across the spectrum where all the parties are concerned. So if you want to just vilify bjp and bjp supporters as those spreading the wild word, so to speak, i would disagree. It happens at all levels. I was taking responsibility for the official media. Would i say that the Congress Party is spreading horrible rumours about me and other Women Members of my party . No, because i will not hold them responsible. I would hold congress handle responsible if it were to do it directly. Thats all im saying. Clearly, so much more that we can talk about, but we, actually, have to go and look at some other voices across the country. Here in the central indian state of madhya pradesh, Caste Politics still remains the major deciding factor. Those from the socially and economically marginalised castes, such as the 0bcs, constitute half of the states population. They play a significant role in deciding the election results. The bjp has been trying to entice the 0bcs by giving them more representation in the cabinet. The congress is also trying to play the same political card by demanding caste based census to determine which classes occupying Cream Positions in the government, jobs and businesses. The fate of the candidates and the parties depends