Lab. Opens his largest campus to date in india. Company is to capture the thecompany is to capture the ecommerce market and in coming years. Now, to our top story as the trade war rages on, seems like apples ceo might be making progress in getting the president s ear via phone calls. That is what President Trump told reporters. Thats before he departed for kentucky. Take a listen. Pres. Trump he is the one that called. That is why he is a great executive. Because he calls me and others dont. Others go out and hire very expensive consultants. Tim cook called donald trump directly. I would take their call, too. Hes the only one that calls me. He calls me whenever there is a problem. Emily President Trump, talking about tim cook there. To discuss this and more, i want to welcome cathie wood. So great to have you here in the studio. What do you make of tim cooks approach . Cathie i think this is good news for apple, for technology. Emily the president has the denied some of apples formal requests to give a tariff reprieve on the mac pro, for example. How much do you think these tariffs are actually going to impact apple given that starting september 1, we are supposed to see tariffs on air pods, apple watches, etc. . Cathie i am glad there is a dialogue and i think this president wants u. S. Companies to succeed, so i think at the end of the day, this is part of negotiations and just that. It will end in lower tariffs overall. That said apple has so many interesting thing going sport going for it right now. Apple pay, what they are doing in health care. Apple is changing the subject of it. Emily as you consider where to put your money. Are tariffs being factored into your consideration of apple in particular . Others have said tariffs so will never hit apple even though there is a threat. Is this something you are thinking about . Cathie we think about taxes, which is what a tariff is, taxes provide incentives or disincentives. Not having a tax is better than having a tax, but we think the Services Platform that apple is building is going to overcome a lot of this and maybe even speed those services along. Emily lets talk about services. Were expecting one to be unveiled in november, there are new trailers for some of the new trailers for shows, and netflix, the gorilla in the room. Disney coming out with the Service Starting at seven dollars a month, which is fairly cheap compared to the competition. Were not sure what apple will be priced at yet. How optimistic are you about apple tv plus . Cathie having learned they are pouring 6 billion into the content, which is netflix circa 2016. Emily netflix is closer to 14 billion now. Cathie yes. I think they have a good shot. Some of the shows, i know the morning show with jennifer aniston, they are paying a lot for that. Each episode costing more than game of thrones. They are paying a lot of content. Providers are the big winners here. I do think this is going to be not just a one horse race, i think people will take several services. It is problematic for cable and traditional broadcast tv. Emily how much are you thinking about the antitrust issues . The doj opening an antitrust investigation. The ftc looking at facebook. States looking at big tech, there could be more. Cathie we do think about that. We have pulled back on many of the names we had, partly because of this issue, but we think it will be litigated for years and years. It took a long time to break the ma bell into the baby bells. Its not always a bad thing, but the legal hassles, the distractions associated with it could be problematic for some companies. Emily even if big tech is broken up, it is still potentially good for investors. Cathie not necessarily. Sometimes, you are going through the process, like microsoft did, and nothing happens. Its just a distraction. I would much prefer full attention on their businesses and not on these legal considerations. The break above ma bell was not a bad thing. Im not saying i would like to see this. I just dont know sometimes, theres a solution, meaning a breakup like that. Sometimes its just never resolved. Emily given the antitrust issue, the geopolitical uncertainty, the volatility of the market, where are you putting your money across tech . Cathie we are invested in five platforms heavily. They are all focused on exponential growth, which should overcome everything we are talking about here if we are right. That is because the cost of these technologies are falling so quickly. When we talk about dna sequencing, alumina, crispr gene editing, these stocks are not price for the exponential growth we believe they are going to deliver during the next five to 10 years. Same thing with tesla, autonomous vehicles, electric vehicles. They are going to go from 1. 5 Million Units globally last year sold to 26 million in five years. That is almost 20 fold growth. No one is expecting that. Autonomous taxi networks, nobody thinks thats going to happen. We are investing in opportunities that we believe are not discounted in the marketplace at all. In the case of gene editing, shall we say, those three companies together, we are talking about curing disease here. They are valued at only 5 billion . Apple closer to 1 trillion . These are lifesaving companies, so we are not worried about tariffs in terms of the largest holdings. Emily interesting. You mentioned tesla. Every week, there seems to be some new tesla controversy. One company canceled orders because there was moisture in the headlights. Walmart, suing tesla because they rented roofing space. There were multiple fires, seven fires out of 200 different places. You know, obviously you are bullish on electric cars in general, but are you as bullish on tesla if they cannot overcome these issues . Cathie i think what we are seeing here, for example, we hear about every fire in a car that takes place, but you dont hear in terms of traditional gas powered cars how many fires are taking place with those. Many, many more than tesla. Tesla seems to be a lightning rod for publicity. Last week, it was a german rental car company. Teslas response to that is, we dont think thats the issue, we have a dispute a former dispute with them which they are not going to go into, and thats what its more about. They can say all they want. I would be very surprised, especially going to germany, tesla shipping cars to germany and how autooriented they are and designoriented they are, that tesla would have shipped that many faulty cars. There is Quality Control at the end of the day, at the end of production. And walmart, those solar panels were put in place when solarcity was a standalone company. They will probably have to replace them or pay for pulling them out or pay some compensation as well. Its a oneshot deal. When i talk about electric vehicles going from 1. 5 million to 26 Million Units, that is going to be much more important impact on tesla especially if it continues to maintain its share. We think they will lose up to two thirds of their share in the 200 to 6,000 bear and bull price target. They have been sustaining their shares. It is outstanding. Emily cathie wood, thank you so much. Switching to ecommerce, shares of target set an alltime high today. The retailer, boosting their earnings forecast. Target reported Digital Sales were up 34 . Coming up, President Trump says he is the chosen one to take on china. We will discuss the ongoing chinau. S. Trade dispute with a former ambassador. Why tariffs are not working. This is bloomberg. Pres. Trump i am the chosen one. Somebody had to do it, so i am taking on china. I am taking on china on trade. And you know what . We are winning. Emily President Trump, earlier wednesday talking about taking on china in regards to treat. In regard to trade. The ambassador took his disputes to the l. A. Times in an oped writing if as a result the Chinese Companies no longer compete in the u. S. Market, it would push china to clinch market leadership elsewhere. With more than three decades of Diplomatic Service around the with, i have to start there are many president s who have dealt with china and had to deal with china. What is your reaction to President Trump calling himself the chosen one on china . Charles i try and stay out of politics. Obviously, the president is very sure of himself. He is trying to point out how essential he is to decisionmaking on this. In that, he is right. Emily you dont think tariffs are going to work. Why . Charles i go back to the original objectives. The president started this whole process with an investigation of Technology Policy for foreign direct investors first. Investing in china. He put the first group of tariffs on because he found, as others have found, that the chinese required technology sharing, licensing, coinvestment, all kinds of discriminatory things for Companies Interested in investing in china. So, the president said, well, this is a denial of our rights and unfair trade practice. In fact, the president and the administration really did not support the u. S. Companies investing in china. It seems to me that the original purpose of this trade war wasnt really the real purpose. The real purpose is to detach the u. S. Economy from the chinese economy and somehow to rectify the bilateral trade deficit. Emily so in your view, as a trade dispute, trade tension is playing out, who wins or loses it . Charles no one wins in a trade war. You basically take both sides down when there is action and retaliation. The barriers go up between the two trading partners and all the other countries in the system win. Emily so, how do you believe this will play out . We talked about the unpredictability, you never know what will happen the next day. Given your understanding on how the Chinese Government operates and what we are seeing from the president , how does that impact emerging technologies . Charles i think that the chinese are digging in for the longterm and they are open to an interim agreement with the president. They know from the statements the u. S. Officials have made that were most sensitive about the farm products, farm exports to china, which have been cut off by the chinese and retaliation. They are going to demand a very high price in terms of reduction of our tariffs on chinese goods in order to give us that benefit. It is going to be sticking, it is possible they do a half a deal, but i dont think we will see in the next between now and the next november of 2020, that we see a big reduction, a return to the status quo, before this ratcheting, retaliatory sequence started. Because you cant see the interest being benefited. The result is going to be that the competition in hightech and other areas will take place in the rest of the world. And that is where you have to worry. American companies depend on chinese components to be competitive all over the rest of the world, and the big game now is for hightech, 5g networks and the rest of the world. This will hamper American Companies in the rest of the world. Emily speaking of 5g, huawei has become a pawn in the u. S. China trade dispute. Right now, we do have other players in 5g, but many experts say they dont compare to huawei. How does that position the u. S. In terms of leadership or not on 5g . Which is going to be a very important emerging technology . Charles it certainly is. It is early days in the 5g race. I remember how motorola dominated the early cell phone competitive landscape, 20 plus years ago. The first mover doesnt necessarily win. So there is that. Digital mobilehe market, the socalled secondgeneration mobile market, that the Global Market mattered. There were two competing systems, the european system, gsm, and the american system. People think the american system was better technically, but gsm won, and it was the european system. It was on the gsm system that nokia and erickson became Major Players in mobile telephony. It was because their systems were available and used in more countries all over the world. So apple adopted it. I think that is what is going to happen with 5g. You cannot look at it on a country by country basis. The successful players will be global players. Emily ok. Ambassador charles ries, thank you so much for joining us. Coming up, a social media double standard . That is what china is accusing facebook and twitter of. Why social media is drawing chinas ire. That is next. This is bloomberg. Emily Jpmorgan Chase is preparing to shutdown their smartphone payout. Is the third reversal in as many months. Customers will still be able to use chase pay on the websites and apps of retailers that accept it. Two days after twitter and facebook announce a closed accounts backed by the chinese that attempt to manipulate news and hong kongs, and beijing is heading back. An editorial in the peoples daily newspaper saying this is a full display of double standard in action, saying one thing while doing another. They suppress peoples voices but not motivations to reveal the truth. What does the Chinese Government mean . Sarah i think there is a lot going on. First of all, the editorial said there was no evidence given for the fact that this influence came from the Chinese Government. There is a little bit of evidence if you look at twitters blog post. They say some ip addresses were unblocked from using the cap the app from the countries, the editorial also doesnt say that twitter and facebook are blocked by the government for all citizens. And so, this is the kind of thing, they were just told they cant advertise on twitter anymore. This is a tense moment. Meanwhile, shelly and i have reported that twitter, the company has been training Chinese Government officials behind the scenes on how to use twitter and helping verify them. Emily lets talk about this. Twitter employees are helping Chinese Government officials get their word out, get their message out on twitter. Sarah if you think about it, it is like they would for any other public official. If there is a celebrity or an athlete or an actress, they are going to be helping that person learn how to use twitter. The weird thing here though, is that this is a government that has blocked twitter for years. It does seem a little bit strange. To be training those government officials to be using the platform to get their message out to people in other countries. Emily twitter is a global company, based in the u. S. How do they navigate or even justify the aspect goal complications of this when it is a government that is present that does not necessarily share American Values . The argument here is that all officials should be treated the same way no matter if it is trump or bolsonaro. It doesnt really matter. Emily they will help anyone . Sarah they will help anyone just like facebook will help anyone with their account. We reported a couple of years ago that facebook has been training the philippines how to use facebook, and in india. Just think of it in terms of content. Are these people who have a following, that people are going to want to see what they have to say . If so, if they will say it anywhere, might as well train them to say it on our service. Emily what is twitter saying about this . Sarah the company has not really been commenting on this, but we are confident in our sources here. Emily twitter has in the same week decided to block date run state run media from advertising on twitter. So they are taking a stand in a sense there, a political stand. Sarah in a way, because now they have the tricky job of defining what state run media is. They already said they are going to exclude the taxpayerfunded and independently operated entities like the bbc and npr, getting some federal funding here in the u. S. But they have not said exactly which Media Properties they will be removing from advertising capabilities. So, we know they will be removing the ones in china and they have removed the ones in russia, but this kind of opens up the opportunity for them to decide on a casebycase basis if they see a big propaganda initiative, what they want to cancel. Emily sarah frier, thank you. Great scoop. Coming up, amazon is betting big on india. Really big. How the company will go headtohead with walmart in the emerging Retail Market with the largest campus ever, next. This is bloomberg. Emily the is bloomberg technology. Im emily chang in san francisco. Amazon is doubling down on india. The ecommerce giant opened its largest campus to date as it battles walmart for one of the fastestgrowing Retail Markets. Walmart spent 16 billion last year acquiring indian retailer flipkart. Jeff bezos previously pledged 5. 5 billion for the company boss operations in the country. Joining us to discuss his brad stone is brought down, offer of a book about amazon called the everything story. You have traveled to india to report on amazon. Why put the largest campus in india . Brad amazon has a lot of employees in india. All the Tech Companies do. Amazon has i think over 60,000 employees there. Already a big presence, housing them altogether probably a smart move. I think the biggest part is that they are making such a big deal out of this. Its one office building. Theyve been trying to grow inside india in an unfavorable Regulatory Environment for five years. The Modi Government made it difficult for them to run their conventional retail website in india last year. They have to behave more like a marketplace for other sellers, so putting a big stake in the ground, some shovels in the ground literally, helping with modis economic development. Emily the Amazon Office in seattle holds 5000. This office will hold 15,000. Brad i think they are growing in india quite fast, not just engineers that service other parts of india, but trying to grow that ecommerce business. My colleague in india has reported that amazon is looking at potentially acquiring a food delivery business. Theyve been looking at making investments in lots of brick and mortar Grocery Store chains, so india can be the kind of lab for the rest of amazon, and they also need to hire workers to help them grow in the country. Emily how is amazon taking on walmart in india . Who is winning . Brad the Company Walmart acquired last year had a head start. There was some kind of internal chaos. Walmart came and bought them. The founders have left. They are doing well, but amazon prime is taking off. They dont release numbers, but they say membership is doubling. They are probably both doing well because this is a rapidly expanding market. It is a country of 1. 3 billion people, rising middle class, Internet Penetration going up, so its a case of a rising tide lifting all boats. Emily walmart offering a service with free streaming and bollywood in india is huge. Talk about that strategy. Brad amazon has shown that prime video brings people into the amazon ecosystem and gets them ordering. Walmart cannot necessarily do that in the u. S. Where you have so many players spending a lot of money, but the india streaming market is a little less developed. Youve got to go discover it in a dropdown menu, but flipkart thinks this is a good way to cement loyalty of its users. And in second and third tier cities or maybe the wealthier urban customer already has a prime or netflix subscription, walmart is finding ways to bring them into the flipkart ecosystem. Emily amazon does not have huge exposure to china, but the last few weeks, weve seen walmart and target report strong results, weve seen alibaba report strong results. I wonder if there is something about ecommerce that is more immune to geopolitical uncertainties that we are facing now and that other Companies Might be brad i would say amazon does have some exposure. China is kind of the breadbasket. So many of those sellers on amazon sell from china. They are in shenzhen, and factories making companies for sale and some of those companies will get hit by the tariffs as they are put in place by the trump administration. India, you would think might be a recipient of some of the capital that is leaving china, but the political environment has been unstable. I mentioned the ecommerce rules went into effect last year. I think the political environment may be a little more stable now, so we will see how it will impact you know, the trade war will impact india, but it has not historically been the greatest place for foreign investment. Its very bureaucratic. Emily meantime, amazon also announced it is expanding in portland today, this on the backlash of its q2 in new york, still moving forward as planned in Northern Virginia and tennessee. They cannot really keep expanding in seattle and the united states. Are we going to see a more dispersed amazon . Brad you wonder if those Long Island City politicians are kicking themselves because every day, there is a new press release about amazon expansion. They encountered some political headwinds in seattle. They started growing across the lake in bellevue. They had problems in Long Island City. They are doubling down on their location in virginia, and now portland. Amazon is an expanding company. I cannot remember the numbers, but Something Like 600,000 or 700,000 employees. Theyve got to focus somewhere. Emily more than 3500 fulltime jobs in oregon since 2010. Brad they are a company that has bet again and again on urban areas, attracting young workers, and they are looking for places that want them. They seem to have found that in portland. Emily Senior Executive editor of global tech, brad stone. Thank you for stopping by. Sticking with amazon, the victory of Cloud Computing now face a threat that is literally at the edges of their networks. More people and Companies Using computer power goes to them, not at remote centers, and that means huge opportunity for wireless carriers building Fast Networks to handle the job, but it will also put pressure on the big three to team up with the wireless companies. Our next guest wrote a report on the topic. Can you describe to us in laymans terms, what is age computing . What is this need for computing at the socalled as . Sure. If you look at the traditional way of Cloud Computing, amazon, google, and microsoft have data centers around the world. You have these Resources Available at the edge or very close to the consumer, so this edge could be something there a neighborhood or Metro Data Centers or some other kind of median data centers people are starting to build. The idea is instead of a data center which is hundreds of thousands of miles away, it could be only a few miles away. Emily who does this give an advantage to . Does it put amazon, microsoft, google at a disadvantage with their Cloud Business . A think it does put them at a certain disadvantage. The Cloud Business is pretty straightforward in the sense that you build a data center and make it available for developers. For the edge business, you really need to partner with players who have real estate assets at the edge. They have to string together a number of these partnerships around the world to make the best Fabric Developers like where they can access new applications at the edge, but this also means newer players will enter the ecosystem, not just the top three or top five of the Cloud Computing guys that will dominate the ecosystem. I think given the distributed nature of the entire framework, you are likely to see many more players in every country emerge and work with the ecosystem and developers to provide Edge Services to a newer set of applications and services. Emily how does the conception of the cloud or what the cloud is change, lets say, five years from now . I feel a lot of the Data Processing that happens in the cloud will definitely move at the edge. A lot of data modeling that takes place in the cloud will move toward the edge. Cloud systems will primarily be used for data storage or longer models that take many hours, but the rest of the computing will move toward the edge wherever it is needed. I think we will see the architecture of the network as well as the internet take place over the course of the next five or 10 years, and that is what is exciting about the opportunity, and that is also the challenge of the industry, how you string together a platform constructed for developers so they do not get lost in the complexity. Emily fascinating. Thank you. Coming up, a shakeup at googles ai lab. Why the man who cofounded deep mine is no longer at the house. That is next. This is bloomberg. Emily the Trading Division at Goldman Sachs is going on a hiring spree. Heres the catch only coders need apply. Goldman wants to add more than 100 engineers for techrelated roles. Out ares will help build marquis of the management platform. And speaking of tech jobs, there could be a big one of for grabs up for grabs at google. Google has placed the founder of its deep mine ai lab on leave following controversy over some of the projects that he led in the u. K. , for example, with data privacy watchdogs saying deep mine was illegally given access to 1. 6 million patients medical records. First of all, remind us what this is and all the controversy around it. It is a lab out of the u. K. That started in 2010. Google bought them in 2014, sort of set off this renaissance in artificial intelligence. We have the Computing Power of these new algorithms that can do things with pattern recognition and Image Recognition we have never been able to do before. They are working on what they call artificial general intelligence, which is to make machines as smart as humans. Theyve shown more progress than arguably any other company, and the software was working on their applied research. Theyve been exploring other work in the u. S. , and as you noted, that has had some big privacy backlash in the u. K. In particular, and it certainly had a lot of residents here with the u. S. Around ethics and ai. Deep mine has talked a lot about how their data is so powerful you will need some ethical constraints. They built up this ai ethics panel, but the actual negotiations and work they are doing is unclear. Emily this u. K. Situation happened two years ago. Why now and what happened in between . We are not sure. Has been the boy genius founder of the company. And the other has been the Emotional Intelligence in silicon valley, the more practical fees. Emily do we know how much ai we know ai is being incorporated into google. They talk about it on every earnings call. They are very optimistic how ai will improve the product and also the bottom line. We know how deepmind is being integrated into alphabet and google . Mark they talk about a couple of different projects. One is around data centers. They talk about making search more efficient. My sense is they want to work on the research. The work they are trying to solve is making machines as intelligent as humans and i have a pretty long leash. Emily so who takes over . Mark im not sure someone necessarily takes over. A lot of the work has been shifted to google. Emily meantime, there is an update to your youtube kids story, which we talked about yesterday, that there are a number of competitors trying to fill the gap youtube kids might not quite be able to serve, right . Mark the story look at Video Services who have been pushing themselves as if you are a parent, you are a parent, youre nervous about youtube for a variety of reasons. If you are a regulator, youre nervous about it for privacy reasons. Youtube is in a settlement with the ftc about if they have been compliant with privacy rules. Emily so, who are the competitors . Im a parent. I want to know. Mark a British Service called super awesome has a new video Service Called ruckus. There is a service in the u. K. Called highbrow, which you can get. It is subscription based, very curated. Roku is when we mentioned briefly, but earlier this week, they put out there kids and family service. They talked about that is being edited. Roku is i think over 30 million people, so someone could have more reach and put a probably bigger dent into youtube. Emily anything to give us a rate from paw patrol. Thank you. Still ahead, we continue our conversation over tariffs. This is bloomberg. Emily the cinematic future of one of Marvel Comics most beloved characters is up in the air. Bloomberg has learned that a feud between sony and disney is threatens to end their coproduction of spiderman movies. Disney wants a much bigger share of the profits. A tech platform connecting shippers with owners, operators, and small fleets is used for freight booking, which in the logistics world relied mostly on phone calls and faxes. Next is making this easier to set up through an app. Theyve raised 120 million through investors including Sequoia Capital and has recently been valued at 500 million. While business is good for now, the tension between china and the u. S. Threatens to impact the company. Joining us to discuss some of the ceo. Thank you so much for joining us joining us to discuss, the ceo. Thank you for joining us. First of all, has your business at all been impacted, or what trends are you seeing in shipping in the midst of this trade dispute . The Logistics Industry overall is very seasonal. Second half is usually our peak season, but last year at this time, we actually saw a surge in volumes because a lot of shippers were trying to push in the volumes before the tariffs kicked in. Especially in southern california, terminals work congestion and there was a severe shortage of truck drivers, warehousing capacity, and this year, we also see some shippers trying to push in volumes before the peak season because of the uncertainty on tariff situations. Most of the issues surround capacity. They are wondering what they will do next year, if they will stay profitable with the tariffs. Emily what happens then during peak season if this trade war is still in the state it is in were potentially a new round of tariffs on september 1 and again december 15 . We will see more uncertainty for sure. Right now, we see different behavior from shippers compared to last year at this time. Shippers are really reacting to the different tariff threats. Its very different compared to last year and very different for Trucking Companies to react to it. 90 of Trucking Companies are very small and thoses Small Business owners are struggling to help employees put food on the table right now. Emily tell us a little bit more about the role you play in this relationship between vendors and customers and trying to get goods from point a to point b across an ocean or two. Sorry, can you repeat the question . Emily tell us about your relationship and your position in the relationship between vendors and customers and the ability to get from point a to point b, maybe across an ocean, across a continent as well. We are the first marketplace connecting shippers with small Trucking Companies. Were in the forefront of international shipping. We give our shippers transparency. They can really streamline the whole process, and they can really track and trace their loads in real time. They can build their buyers a lot earlier and increase cash flow, and for carriers, we really wanted to empower the drivers with technologies, especially small Trucking Companies, allow them to take more loads, become more efficient, drivers make more money because trucker shortage is really the number one problem of our industry right now. Next is in power to come back to the industry so we can really help the industry balance supply and demand. Emily if the trade war continues to escalate, are you concerned . We have also got protests happening in hong kong. Are you concerned about impact to your business . We do have consumption needs in the country, and of course, the Biggest Issue is really the volatility and fluctuations of the flow of the goods because last year is very different from this year, and also shippers are trying to adjust to the situations and also tariffs and also the hong kong situation, but as you have today, shipping costs are delayed at ports, and the cost front emerge and apply to end consumers like you and me. Emily you are saying the hong kong protests in particular have not had any impact at all . Right now, we have not seen any yet because the largest support overseas is probably shanghai, not necessarily hong kong, but we probably will see some situations happen later. We have not seen an impact at this point. Emily thanks for sharing your perspective with us. That does it for this edition of bloomberg technology. We are livestreaming on twitter. Check us out there and follow our Global News Network at tictoc on twitter. This is bloomberg. 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