Good afternoon everyone. Of thee director roosevelt house Public Policy institute. I see get used to saying good afternoon because we have been increasingly hosting afternoon programs. Nextore special than the than the previous. It is a special privilege and honor to be introducing the program today. We had to say what guest would we want to have at roosevelt house, the home of eleanor and franklin roosevelt, with the words of the four freedoms on the wall. Natan sharansky, we are so pleased to have him. I am not going tos not going to spend time rita striving a biography that is so wellknown and all of our minds and hearts for all he endured in the name of freedom. It is one of the moving stories of the 20th century. I can just say we are honored to have him. Friend, ateful to our ,reat journalist, publisher member of the Roosevelt Roosevelt house board of advisors and most recently, a teacher in our human rights program. Peter osnos, for inviting his halls andour persuading him to come. I am delighted to introduce for this conversation our friend peter osnos and our friend natan sharansky. [applause] i am pleased to see how natan can draw a crowd in the midday. This entire conversation for which we have roughly an hour is an introduction, so i am not going to do one, but i will say met in theand i summer of 1994 in moscow. He was introduced to me as the spokesman for the dissidents. I looked at him and said you are the spokesman . He was not exactly what you would call at that time. He was 26. I thought to myself this is going to be a formidable enterprise but little did i know was arrested,an charged with treason, send to the gulags for nine years. When he came out and went to israel and joined his beloved colleaguent with my who was then, the founder of the human rights watch. We went to israel and persuaded natan with a check to write his memoirs for us, his prison memoir. We published it as fear no evil. It is one of the great books of its kind because it represents in so many ways, one persons ability, one persons ability to take on a system as formidable as the soviet union was at the time. When natan was arrested and taken to prison, charged with treason, stripped naked, nobody was more defenseless than he was and the thought that went eyrough his mind was th cannot humiliate me, only i can humiliate myself. For the next nine years, he outsmarted the kgb and when they told him that they were going to atlantic,m across the they said you are going to get out of the car and walk in a Straight Line over to the other car. What did he do . He zigzagged. He has been zigzggin zigzagging in israel ever since. There are three phases in natan s adult life. One was present. Two was prison. Two was politics. Three is the Jewish Agency which he has been the executive director of. For the last nine years. Each of those things. Prison, nine years in politics and nine years in the Jewish Agency. We will go over that and then have questions. Can you reflect on all of these years later . What does it mean to you what did it mean to you to be in present test in prison . In prison . Zigzagged from the kgb car. I am here because peter osnos was my accomplice in my sentence and i have to respect my accomplice. When i am reading about roosevelt and his wife, it is so appropriate. The main thing is, freedom of worshipthe second is to the god in which you choose to do it. The third is the needs of the people and the fourth is to be free of fear. Fromrom fear of god but fear of people. That is what i think we are discussing and fighting for. Thank you for inviting me here. Eleanor roosevelts declaration of human rights. One of those things that they were printing and disturbing her on the people was to remind them of what their real rights are. Thank you for inviting me. To speak about these years, by far the easiest. Because there, you only have physical hardships. , it iss of moral life , it is sople, pure easy to keep your integrity because all you have to do is keep saying no to the kgb. Jews have a very demanding religion. 613 commandments. The philnt to yourself, you have to fill 613 commandments. In prison, everything comes to one thing. You say no to the kgb and that is it, you have the filled everything. You have obligations to your wife, family, to your country, to your people, to your history, you did all that. Cells,t you in punishing cold. It is all physical. Understood. The only thing that really belongs to me is my inner those are the only things i have to keep, the things i am responsible for. But they cannot take from me my freedom if i do not agree to give it to them. After you overcome the first , you overcome the physical fear which you feel every time of a firingyou squad. Sometimes they do it during interrogation to remind you then. You have to overcome this feeling of almost automatic fear from this world but it only took a couple weeks but the moment you overcome it and the moment changed,of all what you go into the struggle of the people who believe in freedom and you felt your self a very important part of the struggle being a chain connected to this row of dissidents. They move you a few miles to the other place, but all of this will continue and all the people who continue their struggle, maybe now you are more important than before, and from this point, youre not ofne and all of this feeling rediscovery of your history of believing in and the image of god creating man, all of this stays with you. The moment you feel that you want not alone, it is your inner freedom. Commentary s complement to. That was the easiest time. While i was enjoying my nine years in prison, my wife, none she thought issue doing enough, maybe there was something she had to do. Every moment, you have to do why youre not doing everything that you can, so i was thankful. I did everything, i have filled all of my commandments and obligations. But the moment they take you berlin,son and through straight to my wife, then to israel. That was the end of a vacation, because then you are responsible for every choice. , to have thesek people as your friends or your enemies. Are they really wishing you well or not . Theher you as a member of whether your government is doing the right thing or the wrong thing. I came into politics after prison. Peter i want to point out that i recently learned that natan is one of only four nonamericans to receive both the president ial medal of freedom and the congressional gold medal. The others were mandela, john paul and mother teresa. ,hen i mentioned this to natan he pointed out that it was not at the congressional medal of both received the medal. He was the only one in that group of four who had a successful marriage. [laughter] i think that particular test of mind is what has given to do the veryy many things that he has done. The ability to see the world in that kind of respect that when you are in prison and then when you are in israeli politics. Talk a little bit about what you learned in nine years of israeli politics. I will tell you. Israel democracy has so many things. It is so interesting. It is so overwhelming and so challenging. Day, you have to make very. On the usually people have to think about good and evil during a major crisis or during a war. Israelis have to think about it, every moment. It, peopleget about from the neighboring party will immediately remind them, what you are doing is evil. To the country evil to the country. It is very vibrant. For me, it was difficult. Dissent is always about ideological not compromising ideological positions. You have to be ready to make compromises every minute. The moment you are not ready to make compromises, you better resign. I told my prime and i did not resign. To politics to succeed. You will not find a history of america or any other country, a moment where 20 of the population are joining the country that did not speak the language that is part of the country. That happened with israel. Integration was so successful. Average level of life is little bit higher than in israel and all the hospitals and academies and everything. Reasons was very quickly, we understood you must hold political power in order to be equal. Newcomers became members manye parliament, and then deputies mayors deputy mayors of the city again people who did not speak hebrew well. That accelerated the process of integration. You have to make decisions and compromises with all of your partners. He helped with his advice. , i felt we hadnd to go straight and we were zigzagging. I have to say, politics is not a comfortable place for dissidents. If youre fudgy is not to compromise, better not to go into politics. I felt that my main reason for reaching into politics was very successful. I dont think it is for me. Have told my connection my position of close connections is not something that is understood. Be a rightwing sibling because it was and it was writing and speaking against will it help him to defeat hamas much easier than we would do . I said if you will be building peace, the fact that he will do everything that his people will hate us because that is the only way for the hate to survive is if they have an enemy. I spent nine years in this position. Later when i put in the document there waspeter the question of giving away for peace. The deaths of democratic persuasion and it is laughed out by right and left. Thosethe right said in the left said if you want to make peace, you are not asking. We are very close in the government to giving away both and insisted that he estimate everything and was ready to give imagine later when we have all that happened in syria, if you did not give him all of these. The chemical weapon would be on the shores. You cannot disconnect the Peace Process from Civil Society and they laughed at us. I think i was successful other. Olitician ite other people will say. As ridiculous i dont believe in peace which will not be built on Civil Society. The third thing, peter i want to follow up with one question. , said youan thought you were a more successful prisoner, a very successful prisoner because of your ability to resist and to maintain internally, integrity. Saw inthink that you israeli politics the integrityz that integrity was sustainable . Integrity in are mac israeli politics than american politics. Did i see a lot of it . No. Peter we did not invite you to criticize. [laughter] politics is all about compromise, every day. Politician who stops making systemise, the 202 7488000 cant survive 202 7488000 202 7488002 the politician who stops making compromise, the system cant survive. In 2000, i was explaining to many leading journalists that peace is so close to the middle east and everything is so good and it is only because of israel and then they give them these integrity. Rms of here are four names. I give them that is why there is hope. Has only shown that he is open to compromise on nuclear weapons. Our only problem is netanyahu. He is elected. If only he would agree. Then there was the arab spring. I say now, what is the number one problem . All the same. If only netanyahu. Saying feel comfortable there is a lack of integrity. There is much more integrity in israel policy than any other countries that many other countries in europe and even in america. You had six peter grandchildren when you left israel. You are going to be three score in. What in your view, when you look back on it now, can you say, are there people who have endured in your mind as models of integrity in a complicated world . Natan king david and my wife. [] laughter [laughter] peter well said. Questions, lets talk a little bit about the Jewish Agency. Not what it does but this current challenge we will call the Israeli Community of juice and the American Community of choose and thee of jews aerican community of jews has issue of who gets to pray where at the wailing wall . Talk about how you confront the issue and where it stands. Natan going back to the integrity of people. I feel very strongly about this order, my wife and then king david. Two very important people who because of their Important Role in this world, my teacher. He had tremendous influence on me and where i am. President o have the and Prime Minister. Man, even if you disagree is president reagan who called the soviet union evil in spite of the fact that all of his advisers or explaining to him what is politically correct. Now you have a president who will call it evil, the soviet empire. Second, he brought a lot of brought a lot to american israeli relations. Is integrity and approach to international relations, for this specific question was extremely important. Peter now for something simple. Natan the Jewish Agency is an organization. Before the creation of israel, there was a jewish israel government, connecting israel with the jewish communities and three and a half million juice jews came. When i came to the Jewish Agency, i made the shift which was made long ago in the jewish world. Institutions are always changing. Making a special emphasis on building bridges between israel and jewish communities. Many good and important things we are doing. We are the only form that i know where representatives of the and the leaders of jewish federations around the world and leisure leaders of the reform and conservative movement are sitting together, discussing and debating together and making decisions together. By when a long history israel was created. Formula. T part of this thinking in terms of creating one jewish community. One language, one culture. Why do we need all of these differences . The idea was nobody knows why it was different. ,obody recreated the nation broke hundreds of different pieces. People lived in different cultures and then they come and become one nation again. I am critical of some of the things they did, but nobody except from him succeeded for thousands of years. Developing and who cares if they are socialist or toitalist and they dont go conservative or reform school. Very interesting society, and it wants to be the home for every jew. Rabbist for him but his or her rabbi and their community, so they have to feel comfortable in israel, to live, to stay, to pray and so the Jewish Agency became the center of this dialogue because there is no other way to connect or they could have an organized meeting between the members or leaders of the reform movement. The Jewish Agency has these distinctions and in fact the because of these unique powerful displays, i dont think other nations have. Number one national symbol. Nation whichrtant is the returning of the exiles to one of the most important religious places in the nation. Pray. Ve a place to it became very important in terms of recognition. Infighting. Lot of ame minister asked me Prime Minister asked me bringing all sides to the Administration Table and i brought them to the negotiation table and we had four years of negotiations and the Prime Minister put a lot of effort in it to succeed and it succeeded and we found compromise. It was a very Important Message for jewish folks. Here i definitely have some. The Prime Minister looks at it as a tactical issue. We need to fight iran, we need to fight this. That is why we need our coalition. Ministers resign and join. Peter once a dissident, always a dissident. There is a cspan camera here. Mics. E mikes we have if you have a question, please address it to the mic. Lets begin. I thought there might be a hand or two. Right here. Hand or two. Right here. My name is dr. Edward powers. I am a Hunter College student. My question, what do we know about the russian chinese thatction that is reported was controlled by a quote unquote russian banker that Vladimir Putin is leasing farmland in siberia to the chinese and that the chinese are going to populate that area with the second child who as you know has no status in chinese society. I will finish by saying, i asked Henry Kissinger and his comment to me was that the chinese view siberia as their land and they are going home. Peter you have 30 seconds to apply. [laughter] natan i have no concept of the Chinese Government or even president putin. You6 i was in siberia and my wife grew in siberia. I can tell you i was in siberia and my wife grew in siberia. Friendship and we were singing songs about russia and anda friends forever participating in demonstrations against the chinese embassy. There were different stages. Are huge empty lands in siberia along the border with china. You can go for hundreds of miles and see a hundred people here or there. Border,ther side of the there are whole populations of chinese people. Forink the potential russia, which is keeping every square meter to give away. They are so big, why do they need these for islands . For russia, it is against the nation are nature of the history of the country to give it away but look at the physics. The most empty lands, one meter out of this is the most populated most populated. More opportunity for russia. If russia would decide to keep the territories, it is not very important. To lease to china, who knows . Maybe that is a great opportunity. I think that would be a very unstable station. Peter another question. Right over here. I am a student here at the honors college. My question is, what do you think is russias role in the middle east, today, especially given what is going on in syria and with america kind of leading the picture and also given the painful history between russia and its jews, what is the appropriate relationship that israel should have with russia . Hand, this one is easy for me to speak about putin as a dissident. Putin is a former kgb officer and is not a big fan of democracy. On the other hand, it is difficult for me to speak negatively about putin as a the one vists, as for the choose who are living because of putin for the jews who were living because of putin. Putin is the first the first nonantisemite in russia in thousand in a thousand years. I can say a lot of bad things about putin. He is permitting or supporting the development of jewish communities. He has created no problems for us, the Jewish Agency, to help those who want to migrate or build communities. At the same time, the same pruden is very problematic for isocracy in russia putin very problematic for democracy in russia. Authorities, corruption, you name it. Many of my