Patient organization focused exclusively on policies to lower drug prices. We dont take money for from anybody who profits from the development or distribution of Prescription Drugs. We collect patients stories and amplify them to policymakers and elected officials and were building a community of patients and allies that can be mobilized in support of policies to lower drug prices. I started patients for Affordable Drugs because im a cancer patient. I have an incurable blood cancer, its called multipy my leona my loama. Its incurable but treatable for some period of time, unknown. With very expensive drugs. In fact, im taking drugs right now. I took my first drugs today by mouth and when i leave here, ill go for about three hours of infusion, they plug me in and pump drugs in. My drugs carry a price tag of 650,000 a year. And my journey as a cancer patient taught me a very important fact and that is, drugs dont work if people cant afford them. I will die of my disease sooner than i want to if they dont invent some new drugs for me. Ill run out of options. Thats why it kills people. Drugs stop working. And so i care deeply about innovation and new drug development. But we have to make sure that were balancing the innovation were getting with prices that make drugs affordable and accessible. Thats why were doing what were doing. Host i suppose youve heard the argue frment Drug Companies that will say its the cost of that r d, that development that ultimately factors in the cost of a Prescription Drug. What do you make of that argument considering you what just said . Caller there is no core guest there is no correlation. Many studies show this, between the cost of research and development and the price that is assigned to a drug. Drug companies have monopoly Pricing Power in our country. And so they set the prices as high as they can. The fact is that all 210 drugs approved by the f. D. A. From 2010 to 2016 are based on science paid for by taxpayers. Through the n. I. H. The National Institutes of health are the single largest funder of Biomedical Research in the entire world. Were paying for that. And what n. I. H. Does with those wonderful drugs is it gives them to a drug company that can then set any price it wants. We believe that we need to restore balance, lets get that innovation, but lets make sure, especially with taxpayer funded drugs, that we are getting the prices. I might add one more thing. And that is that Drug Companies dont spend as much as they want you to believe on r d. They spend many of them more on advertising and marketing than they do on research and development. Host when it comes to the n. I. H. , theyve worked a couple of vehicles in congress designed to look at this topic of Prescription Drugs, is there something you endorse . One does deal directly with the idea of n. I. H. Funding. Guest yeah. Two weeks ago, a bill was introduced by democrat senator chris valueof maryland and republican senator value holen van holland van hollen and a republican senator, when we as taxpayers contribute to a science that leads to a new drug, that we get prices that are affordable for that drug. This is critically important, you know. We have these wonderful, incredible drugs coming to market. Therapies that are being priced at anywhere from 400,000 to more than 2 million. There are 400 Clinical Trials under way right now for new cell and gene therapies. If they come to market each at 1 million, were going to break the bank. Were going to break families banks and were going to break our countrys bank. Host our guest with us here to talk about the cost of Prescription Drugs and if you have questions for him, you can call on the line, if you live in the eastern and central time zones, its 2027488000. If you look in the mountain and pacific, its 2027488001. You can always post on our twitter feed cspan wj and make your thoughts there as well for David Mitchell. As far as the actual prices of drugs, aside from the legislative aspect, how do Insurance Companies factor in or other ways that people get discounted drugs, how do those factor into the cause youre behind . Guest we have an absolutely impossibly complicated system. And its one that is very hard to reform because everybody in the system makes more when the list prices of drugs goes up. Drug Companies Make more. But so do the pharmacy benefit managers. Theyre the people who manage our Prescription DrugInsurance Programs. They make more. Hospitals and doctors mark up drugs based on list price. So everybody downstream from the Drug Companies makes more money. We need to reform the system to set prices that are appropriate at list and then ensure that downstream we are setting up benefit structures that make drugs affordable to people. You know, people the Drug Companies like to say people only care about outofpocket costs. Thats not true. Patients talk to us all the time and there are surveys that show that people care deeply about what they have to pay out of their pocket, but they understand that if things are more expensive, their insurance premiums are higher and their taxes are higher to pay for the Public Programs that provide health care. So we really have to get at the price. Just changing insurance design to lower outofpocket wont do it. Host youre calling for elimination of all the middlelemen then . Guest no. We need greater transparency. In the way drugs are provided down stream. For example, pharmacy benefit managers are paid by Drug Companies based on getting a rebate. Based on the price of the drug. Its actually a kickback. In fact, theres a safe harbor under law for this kickback. So as a patient, i cant know if the preferred drug on a formulary, thats the drugs that this health plan offers, whatever your health plan is, i cant know if the preferred drug on a formulary there because its the best drug, its the most effective drug among im sorry, if its the least expensive drug among equally effective options, or if its there because the p. V. M. Was paid a big rebate by the drug company. We think thats a bad way to run a railroad. And its all secret. All these rebates are secret. We need to change the way that operates and there are bills in congress right now that are moving in congress to provide greater transparaphernalia transparency in the the way the whole system works. Host could you tell us what the difference is between the price you pay for your drugs and the list price of those drugs . Guest enormous. I am able, because the main drugs i take right now, the two main cancer drugs that have a list price of 650,000 a year, i can buy a Medicare Part b supplement that costs me 2,500 a year and it pays all my ow of out of pockets. If i was on an oral drug under part d, i could have out of pockets that would run to 15,000 a year. Right now im lucky because im taking the infused drugs and i can buy the supplement. But for many, many people on Medicare Part d, who are taking very expensive drugs, they can have out of pockets running to 15,000 a year. Theres a bill in congress to fix that. That people should know about. It was passed out of the Senate Finance committee about three weeks ago on a bipartisan vote. It would do two big things. It would cap increases in drug prices in medicare at the rate of flanges of inflation. They would not be able to increase prices more than the rate of inflation. And number two, it would lower the maximum outofpocket cost that anyone could bear to 3,100. A year. I said that out of pockets can run today 15,000 a year. So its a very important bill and people should call the enate at 2022243121 and tell them to enact the grassleywyden bipartisan bill to lower drug prices. Host before we take cause, theres been, as you probably calls, theres been, as you probably have been following, large extensions discussions about extending the role of medicare. How would this handle Prescription Drugs and could the Current System accept that kind of expansion when comes to the cost of those drugs . Guest we dont get involved in coverage issues. We stick to our lane and deal with drug prices. But i will say that under medicare, we should allow medicare to negotiate directly with the drug s can. In our country, there is a law that forbids the government from negotiating directly with the Drug Companies to get lower prices. Every other country in the world negotiates. We dont. And the result is that we pay two to three times what all those other countries pay. We need to allow the government to use its purchasing power to negotiate with these Drug Companies that have monopolies and drive down the prices. Host this is the first call for you. This is rachel from vermont, with David Mitchell of patients for Affordable Drugs. Richle, go ahead, youre on. Caller hello. While i appreciate and understand that the Consumer Needs to be taken into consideration and that prices in this country are overly astronomical, i dont deny that, necessarily agree that medicaid furel is the answer either. I am currently on medicaid myself because i am disabled and i am still not able to get what i need on it. I would still, if i were to have if i were to become, you know, infected with cancer or if i were to become infected with some other disease, i have done research and i have found that i still would not be covered in the ways i would need to be to be able to afford outofpocket because i only work part time. Theres no way in heck i could afford the costs that come with that based on what im currently getting from medicaid. Guest im sorry about the challenge, your challenge, like those faced by millions of people in this country. The fact is that people are cutting pills in half, theyre skipping doses, theyre literally mortgaging their houses. We have patients who have gone bankrupt. And the tragic theres so many tragic elements to all of this. But people taking insulin, for example, have died because they try and stretch their insulin because they cant afford to take the required dose. And this is something that should not be happening in this country, should not be happening to you or anyone, which is why we at patients for Affordable Drugs are working hard to try and help enact reforms that will lower prices and make them be within your reach. Host this is amy in orange park, florida. Hi. Caller good morning. I was just really touched when i heard that you said that you had multiple myloma. My husband passed away from multiple myal mombings a in myaloma in 2016 but he didnt actually die from the cancer. If you have it you know how it affects some your bones and how your bones disintegrate. But my husband actually died because of ailure the calcium in his blood. T destroyed his kidneys. We were told he would have to start dialysis but he could probably live at least 10 years on dialysis. He was 52. So we were in the hospital and they were going to contact the Insurance Company and we were going to do the surgery for his port to get on dialysis and the doctor came back and basically said, you know, sir, you are at the end of your life. Were not the surgery is too risky and were not going to do it. So but thats after first telling us that the surgery was going to be doable and i really believe that it was the cost of the drugs that the Insurance Company didnt want to keep paying me for because he was doing well, his numbers were low as far as the drugs he was taking, they were suppressing the multiple myeloma. O he died from kidney failure. So, you know, if that ever happens to you, if you ever start having kidney problems, you fight. Dont let the Insurance Company tell you theyre not going to help you. Host ok, amy, thanks for sharing your story us. Well let our guest respond to that. Guest amy, im so sorry about your husband. Thats way too young. You just hit me right where i live. My kidneys are working ok. Im relapsing right now, amy. My blood we havent figured out how to arrest it, but we will. Its my second relapse. But, may i amy, i know what youre talking about. The way they diagnosed me is that i one day fell down and couldnt move. And its because cancer ate through my t11 vertebra, it was crushed. And then they did xrays of my whole body, i have holes in my skull and forearms and pelvis. The fact that im talking to you today is a medical miracle. Myeloma can be a really nasty disease but we are fortunate that there are drugs that can extend our lives now. I wish they were this had been there for your husband. Theyre just too damn expensive. Host this is a viewer off of twigger. Doug saying, are you taking into consideration of cost of drug manufacturers for the liabilities they pay for outrageous settlements . Guest i believe that the Drug Companies, including all the settlements that they make, are profiting handsomely with the prices they set. Many of the settlements that have been reached lately have to , you things like fraud. Ow, blocking competition the Drug Companies factor in their settlements for behavior they should not have engaged in and theyre making a lot of money. Theyre doing fine. I dont worry about the Drug Companies. In fact, we need to lower the profitability of Drug Companies in this country. The Drug Companies have profits that run roughly two to three times the average of the s p 500. Host the administration has made a pitch to import drugs from canada. The secretary for h. H. S. Was recently on one of the other networks talking about this idea, want to share what he had to say abogs here in the united states. Host mr. Mitchell, what do you think of those proposals . Caller i think its significant guest i think its significant that the administration cracked open the door to importation. But lets be clear. A, its the notice of proposed rulemaking. Rules take a long time to make, if they are ever finalized. Second, anyone who would want to import under that new rule would have to apply, that will take time. Third, many drugs are excluded from this plan that the secretary outlined. Fourth, its a demonstration project. So it would only affect Little Pockets of the country. Fifth, canada has 10 of the population of the u. S. Cannot possibly supply our drugs , enough of our drugs, at those lower prices. So, anyone expecting that this proposal means help is on the way, is wrong. Unfortunately. It starts the process. It may lead somewhere. But its years away and its only for a small proportion of drugs and people. Host here is kay from new york. Hello. Caller hello. Thank you for taking my call this morning. I hope im on topic and im a little nervous because ive had so much experience with drugs. My husband was diagnosed with cell, ur large diffuse bcell, nonhodgkins. And i saw him through his cancer treatment. And i had an excellent Insurance Program at the time. And a drug plan. And i was able to get all brand name drugs that he took orly for a very low cost. He ultimately did not die from nonhodgkins. My concern is that the f. D. A. , i may be wrong, but i believe that the Drug Companies provide a great deal of support to the. D. A. And im very worried about generics. I personally am taking one prescription now that costs 25 under my employer plan a month. And under part d, its now 1,000 a month. As high as 1,000, maybe as low as 600 a month. Because i can only take brand. I cannot take generic. And my understanding is the f. D. A. Ran a Pilot Program where they did unannounced inspections of the factories in india and china and then all sorts of horrors were discovered about the dangers of generics. And that Pilot Program was canceled. I feel generics are totally unsafe and not being properly regulated. And im losing my train of thought. Im so sorry. My husband ultimately died because he took a new high Blood Pressure medication and within eight hours he couldnt breathe. I obtained a form, turned it into the f. D. A. , letting them know that the result of this drug was his death. Because he couldnt breathe within eight hours of taking it. I spoke with a young doctor who had ferbed his residency finished his residency in a hospital and he said that he saw over and over and over again that this drug resulted in heart attack, stroke, heart attack, stroke, this loop. And death. And that the f. D. A. Actually knew this. I turned it in but they already knew that this drug should have been taken off the market. Host thank you very much. Thank you for sharing your story. Guest kay, im very sorry about your bus husband. The f. D. A. , in my view, has a critical job to make sure that drugs are safe and effective. That doesnt mean sometimes mistakes dont happen and im sorry if one of those led to a bad outcome for your husband. I do believe that generics are very important in order to help drive down the price. One of the bad things thats going on right now in this country is brand Drug Companies use a variety of legal ploys to block generics from entering the market and driving down price. One example is a drug made called h humera. They entered into deals to delay the entry of competition until 2023. In the European Union they have competition for this drug and the people in the European Union are paying 20 of what we are paying in