Transcripts For CSPAN2 Key Capitol Hill Hearings 20240622 :

CSPAN2 Key Capitol Hill Hearings June 22, 2024

This virus really doesnt care. The more you have no location the more virus production the wider spread can occur. But occur. But we need to be thinking about in the way of security and why this is different than what it has been prior this is the first time in north america we have had a high pack virus travel teefive wild birds to north america, the first time, and it is because it has adapted itself to these dabbling ducks and is moved across the bering strait. It never happened it never happened before. Low path may be, not high path. So what is different now is we at least have to consider bio security where was fine and well and good for what we were dealing with prior to this we must not consider to me after more importantly the density of farms does facilitate the potential for rapid transmission. We are dealing with a contagious virus. We are dealing with a situation where the ventilation fans that are used to maintain the proper environment of the chickens are turned on. Material dust, other material that is coming out of the air will have virus which will travel to some degree. Degree. Not miles and miles but in delaware we might have for five farms and each of those might have 60 to 80000 chickens. They are all contract growers and they are with four different integrated operations. So you have a situation as doctor clifford indicated where you may have these very large single farms layer operations. In other areas of the country you have independent facilities that is essentially the same thing. The travel on office different, when birds are taken to market they are caught, put in cages trucks take them to what we call processing plants or slaughterhouses. They may go by 15 different other farms in the dust and feathers are coming from these live haul trucks. A lot of complexities that we need to think through. That is why and delaware we concerned is not the right word thinking about what might happen. Doctor, a quick clarification. There may be 56 Poultry Companies but there are a lot of locations all right . Sure. There are 20 states we would consider to be major poultry producing states. Were not talking about 56 locations. We are talking about thousands of locations. Correct, correct, but there are areas with higher concentration and others. Got you. Senator. Thank you, mr. Chairman. This years outbreak has had a a deeper impact as i am sure you have talked about. The outbreak has wreaked havoc on farms where producers have faced the devastating reality of sick and dying birds. I am so pleased that we were able to be joined today by mr. Schneider of wisconsin to share his story of his farm and his livelihood. The impact, as we discussed is really brought on farmworkers individuals working at processing and packing plants whose jobs depend on those lines running as well as on the broader Farm Community which depends upon demand for grain, supply, and services. This avian flu crisis is also a community crisis. Wisconsin is proud to play a role as host to Research Labs that are laser focused on the key questions in front of us questions about how the virus mutates howard is harvard and wild birds as well as diagnostic labs that help us track it spread and track viral strains as they emerge. Dr. Clifford, producers in my state have relied upon the tireless work that you do and your team has put in lots of time and energy into addressing this crisis over the past many months. I want to thank you for your of Research Labs responding to this virus spanned several different federal agencies and are supported also by state labs. Madison wisconsin is home to the Usgs National Wildlife Health center and conducts research to determine which wild bird species might carry and spread various viral strains. I want to just note parenthetically that i am quite concerned the labs aging infrastructure is not allowing it to fully perform as needed during this crisis and it is something i have paid great attention to. Dr. Clifford, as you know, this Wildlife Health center conducts research that supports the Industry Focused Research and i am wondering if you could share general comments about the importance of interagency collaboration and Research Investment and coordination on this crisis . I think interagency, a cross agency across across state and industry, the collaboration is extremely important. That was well stated earlier by the testimony of chris curry with regard to the importance of collaboration. We actually collaborate on an ongoing basis with cdc. We work closely with usgs. We work closely with the department of interior as a whole. The money and funding we provide for wild bird surveillance, some of that would get to help support the testing that usgs and others would be doing and collection and testing of samples. We have we work with customs and border patrol, dhs fda. A whole host of food Safety Inspection services. We have an internal mac group within the department of agriculture across all agencies to help address this issue as well as the state agency. It is critically important. Every piece of this is the mine feels there are issues with epa, issues with transportation, issues with a lot of these things. They must be coordinated. There could be issues with availability of water. What we use what we use for depopulation of birds requires water source for farming. You would not think you would want of water, but certainly and small rural areas you very well may not have an effective water source. You cannot take it out of the lake because it has to be filtered water otherwise it shuts down your machines. You have to have carbon sources for composting and things. So so this really is a massive effort that requires coordination. Thank you. Also on the issue of research the university of wisconsin hosts a large team of researchers studying pathogens that endangers human, animal, and plant health. We have pioneers in developing Research Efforts that could potentially help us understand or treat Avian Influenza viruses. However, some of these efforts have been put on hold by a federal pause on gain of function research. This continued research pause is delaying the potential benefits of studying viruses, including research that could protect human, animal, and economic health. When when does the cdc plan to issue final guidance on this research to be able to end the pause . I will need to get back with you with the specifics on that. What i would like to say is that the Public Safety is really important, and public support for research is important. And we take seriously the need to make sure the scientific experiments being done are done in the safest possible way. Influenza Virus Research is critical to make sure that we have safe treatment and effective vaccine and get ahead of viruses before we get the kind of problem we are seeing right now but the avian outbreak. And i know that across government with nih, cdc, fda, the question of the moratorium is important and we can get back with you with the specifics of timing. I would appreciate that. Doctor clifford, i understand the state veterinarians are considering restrictions on the movement of birds and poultry separate from guidance by the usda. I know that i know that i have heard from farmers in my state to have contract to deliver birds across state lines. We all share the common goal of containing and eradicating this viral outbreak. But our but our producers as you have heard, as you know her face a substantial economic strain. These uncertainties, of course, make things even more difficult to conduct business when it is safe to do so. So i am asking doctor clifford, what steps is the usda taking to ensure that quarantine shipping practices are safe and effective while also facilitating these contracts in ongoing commerce . Thank you sen. So within our approach we have what we call an infected zone and a control zone. The control zone is around an infected flock that goes out 10 kilometers. Products that are negative are tested regularly. Nothing can move out of those zones unless we permit the product to move. And there is regular testing requirements for those products within that to be able to be safely moved in and out of those zones. That occurs ongoing. We issued thousands of permits out of those zones to allow safe movement. We share that. We have weekly calls with the industry and state and explain these things to them they know how it is happening. Some states have taken additional action because of concern for because of the live Bird Marketing systems. Some of those have caused issues. We intervene on behalf of states such as wisconsin, iowa, minnesota to try to help facilitate the movement of birds and the states and we do the best that we can. As you know, the states do have often times rights to go above and beyond our requirements. We try to we try to work through that with the industry. Senator harper. Thank you. Great hearing and appreciate you being here. I want to come back and revisit the issue. We have had a Crop Insurance program for a long time. It is a shared partnership which helps subsidize. We changed the fund. It would cover as im sure mr. Clifford remembers fruits and vegetables of farmers want to participate. My colleague from delaware included in the bill the call for maybe trying a Demonstration Program with respect to insurance for poultry growers and other livestock growers. That was in the bill. And i dont know if we have had enough time to get it up and running. Is this. Is that something you are familiar with . Sen. Come i am aware of the discussion, but i am not involved in the specifics. That is outside of my range. Out just ask you for the record. Maybe some of your colleagues can give us an update. And our experience with contract growers and boilers if there is an Avian Influenza outbreak the chickens are owned by the integrators, Companies Like that. The contractors they are indemnified as far as i know as mr. Snyder said, there is cost to bear. I want to go back to something. Ill bounce it over. You mentioned gracious in your comments about the support you gotten from the federal government cant department of agriculture and others. You others. You indicated there is a lot of bureaucracy and red tape that can be frustrating and timeconsuming. There is an effort to try to identify one person. Is that something you are actually doing . One designated person so that you dont call a call center. Do we have that effect . It is actually an effect, but not in the way we wanted to be. That is right now it is one person. Because person. Because of our rotations of personnel in and out of those areas because most of these people come from different parts of the us command we have them on a three or four week that they can go home clicks it would be great if we could figure out right now it is a three or four week turnaround. What we are doing is assigning a a Single Person that will stay with that producer. One of my favorite sayings, if it isnt perfect make it better. You have a good idea better. I i would like to ask a question about Lessons Learned. Doctor clifford. I want to ask, can you take a minute. I have been called worse. Im sure. But the three of you just take a minute and share with us one key lesson that you have learned so far from this outbreak that can better prepare us for further infections should they occur. Sen. , thank you. I have not have not had direct experiences in this current outbreak. We have had some people from experts from the university of delaware travel and participate in depopulation efforts because that happens to be one of our strengths. We help. We helped develop that years ago. I get stories and reports from other individuals. I really feel that bio security is a key issue. That has been repeated several times, an area that bio security is not sexy. It is not something that easily accomplished. It is a challenge and sometimes you dont see results. Certainly we know it is not the entire answer as mr. Schneider indicated. You can do bio security almost everything right and sometimes maybe its an act of god. You have the introduction of the virus. I still think i still think bio security is a really key weapon in this process clicks thanks. Dr. Clifford clicks sen. If i may expand on that, i would that, i would like to hit a few. Do it quickly. First and foremost, the questions foremost, the questions that senator johnson and the chairman was asking earlier about the timeframe of depopulation do to positive testing at our National Veterinary services lab we have already implemented plans quite a while ago to base the depopulation of those birds based on presumptive positives by the non laboratory. We dont require confirmation anymore. That that is one Lesson Learned and one action we have taken. In in addition one of the things looking at his clinical signs we already have virus in the area. On the area of disposal made state and local plans in place that we know will work bio security is based upon new bio security for mayor filtration systems, air handling systems have to have some type filtration to reduce the amount of dust and potential for virus particle standard through the ventilation system itself. Those are just some. Just briefly, one briefly, one good take away the one Lesson Learned. In addition to all of the bio security efforts i suggest that the increase of funding for Agricultural Research service to identify areas that those specific bio security protocols need to be implemented to help us prevent this happening again would be a wonderful place to start. Good. My time has expired. Clicks thank you. Clicks very quickly, i want to get into the insurance, the emergency funding. Is there a program in place to indemnify mr. Schneider as an operator . There is a program in place that pays right now for the owner of the birds. So if mr. Schneider is a contract grower will we have been doing is working with the companies to make sure that payments to go to the contract growers or contract razors. That is something you try and do working with the law that does not contemplate indemnifying the operator clicks actually will we did quite a few years ago it is part of our regulation that requires the contract growers to be paid. The problem is with this particular hike path that particular regulation is written in to the aai rules below path not path, not my path. We paid the owner of the birds. Correct. Mr. Schneider, you got a problem. We need to work with the Ranking Member to figure out what we need to do to address that because demonstrating for the operator, humanely agreement between the owner versus the operator. That is something that needs to be addressed. Doctor clifford you talked about personnel rotation. How rotation. How many usda offices do we have around the country . Clicks Veterinary Services offices are usda offices . You could have a qualified personnel to respond to this. I am this. I am surprised were rotating personnel versus just having we dont have that many trained people to do this. You are talking you are talking about Animal Health technicians and veterinary medical officers. Ive got about 1800 people to serve and Veterinary Services. Im not talking about any usda person. If youre talking about a. Person to manage a case he really needs someone skilled in management not necessarily in the hard science. When theyre working with them and help them develop a flock plan and the Compliance Agreement they not only need to understand the red tape but the science. Again, that could be an interesting discussion. The the purpose is to coordinate an effort with one point person that an owner or operator is dealing with. Train and managing and coordinating the different expertise is. Let me move on. The virus and potential vaccinations. How robust is the flu virus . How long can it survive . Is this virus going to last days, weeks, months . Pretty fragile. The virus wont last that long. The Colder Weather and drier weather permits. Its favorable. Right now were in a quiet time. Talking days . Clicks the issue is to make sure that you have reached everything and it is not going back clicks in terms of the vaccine, concerned about trade, i think swiping genes with other influential viruses. Two of the three h5 strains we are dealing with our these reassortment, high pathogenic h5 Avian Influenza from eurasia that swapped out parts of his jeans with a low pathogenic Avian Influenza that we had here in the us already. So the virus is just constantly changing which makes Vaccine Development difficult. The vaccines the vaccines that we have for humans as well as animals are not as highly effective as the other vaccines, and the virus could mutate away from or escape from the vaccines. There are a lot of balance about the avian vaccines in the Human Vaccines. We do work to prepare vaccine viruses and have stockpiled vaccine against the original age five strains were major those are really preparing for pandemic readiness rather than what we are using every day. I was expecting a miracle. Only going to be a certain percentage effected to begin with. Plus we have a real real problem with vaccine production, do we not . We have a hard time producing enough vaccine sometimes for humans. If we start trying to vaccinate 300,000 chickens with 300 million chickens to leave even have even close to capacity . Ramp it up quickly enough . Let me answer about the Human Vaccine and let doctor clifford respond about avian vaccine. An enormous amount. An 80 percent increase. The plastic as plastic as well as a much stronger infrastructure. But the animal vaccine production works differently the Human Vaccine. This is important. We had a had a pretty robust vaccine production capa

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