Over the past several months, this committee has held numerous hearings on the ppp and heard from borrowers and challenges theyve faced in accessing the program. Ive travelled through the districts to speak with Business Owners about how they faired through the pandemic. And ive heard some of the successes and challenges they face with the ppp. And uncertainty about what the future holds. From borrower who is eventually access the loan, the Committee Heard concerns about complicated and conflicting Program Rules and other requirements associated with loan forgiveness. Lenders also expressed a great deal of frustration over the needlessly complicated rules and reported feeling unable to adequately help their borrowers through the forgiveness process. Through it all, borrowers simply wanted to ensure they were using loan for proceeding consistent with the law so they could qualify for full loan forgiveness and effectively convert the loan into a grant which was the congressional intent in the c. A. R. E. S. Act. Loan forgiveness is a centerpiece of the Paycheck Protection Program, especially since the expectation by many borrowers and lenders was that the loans would be fully forgiven. Less than full forgiveness where a large body of loans could have serious unintended consequences for borrowers and lenders who have developed business plan. Treasury recognized how challenging the initial lone forgiveness application was and released an ez application form. Unfortunately, borrowers and lenders alike have reported no material differences between the forms and calls for streamlined application for the form where streamlined borrowers have increased. In the meantime, lenders have remained leading to great anxiety and helplessness among borrowers who just want to do things the right way. I need clear and simple rules from sba and treasury to do so. And finally we have some data to corroborate what the Lending Community has been reporting anecdotally this week, the Government Accountability office, gao, published a new report showing that of september 8th, only 56,000 forgiveness decisions from lenders and representing just over 1 of the over 5. 2 million ppp loans outstanding. This figure substantiates what the Lending Community has been reporting anecdotally. First borrowers are struggling to simply understand the terms and data needed to accurately complete the form. And second, lenders are limited in their ability to provide Technical Assistance to borrowers completing the forms because of the insufficient guidance. So, as we enter the forgiveness period, it is timely to conduct this hearing dedicated specifically to loan forgiveness so that our subcommittee can assess the issues faced by borrowers and lenders and weigh proposals to provide relief for borrowers who need it. And i look forward to the discussion today and look forward to taking the time to testify before us. I yield to the Ranking Member for his opening statement. Thank you, mr. Chairman. And thank you for holding this very important and timely hearing. Small businesses across this nation from my astate of oklahoma to the chairmans district in unanimously nj have been disproportionately devastated by covid19. When it reached our country, congress acted fast. Numerous programs were created and amended to provide assistance to the American Public and our economy. One of these programs was the Paycheck Protection Program. In a matter of days outlined rules and regulations so lenders could assess Small Businesses from coast to coast. The federal government moved quickly and i would like to commend them for that. One of the top sba officials in charge testified yesterday and presented Important Information to our committee. Todays conversation will build on that hearing and well focus on the critical aspects of pp loan forgiveness. As a Small Business owner and founder of a Community Bank in oklahoma, i can see how difficult this process can be for borrowers and lenders alike. My goal and i would like to think of it the same for my fellow Committee Process is to get this process as simple and efficient as possible. We ask our lenders to carry a heavy burden and our Small Businesses are being crushed under circumstances out of their control. We owe it to them to discuss further ways to streamline the process. Unfortunately, road blocks continue to hinder how congress can provide more assistance while improving the program. Just this week, we tried and failed to get a vote on congressman Steve Chabots 8265 that would improve and extend the popular program. More work needs to be done and that is why this hearing is paramount. Small businesses and lenders need full rules of the road in order to make everyday business decisions. Changing guidance has presented challenges we need to Seek Solutions to so this process can be improved. I look forward to exploring many of the topics today with our witnesses. However, i know there were some concerns that a witness put forward about a specific member of the house and the way their office conducts business. Even though this member is not here to defend himself. This however is not how we conduct business in this committee. We routinely strive to work in a bipartisan manner. Its important that we do. And we do not attack one another for political gain. And i amex tremely disappointed that my colleagues would allow this testimony to be on the record. Truthly, many of the problems our witnesses bring up today could be solved if the majority could recommend the bill to come for a vote. As most of them, if not all, would support it. All of them have the opportunity to allow this bill to come for a vote by signing the discharge petition for 8265 which was filed by representative jamie herrerabeutler earlier this morning. So, i urge my colleagues to take action to help the Small Businesses, each District Across the country, by signing the discharge petition on the common sense legislation which they all support behind the scenes. I would also like to say this is the second time ive been disappointed by the majority selection of a witness, and i hope this is not a signal the committee is becoming. Thank you, mr. Chairman, i yield back. Thank you mr. Hern. I appreciate your comments. I would like to take a moment moment to explain how this hearing will proceed. Each witness will have five minutes to provide a statement, and each Committee Member will have five minutes for questions. Please ensure that your microphone is on when you begin speaking and you return to mute when you are finished. I would like to introduce our witnesses. Our first witness today is ms. Lynn ozer, president of the fulton bank in lancaster, pennsylvania. Sheing manies all of the sba lending which covers my home state of new jersey, maryland, pennsylvania, virginia, washington, d. C. And 249 office locations. She graduated magna couple laud from the university where she earned a bba degree majoring in accounting. She served as the first female chairwoman of the board of directors of the National Association of government guaranteed lenders, and she is presently cochair of the issues committee while serving as instructor for the administration. Our second witness is amy bonfig. When so few ppp borrowers had applied for loan forgiveness, ms. Bonfig has also started an Informal Network of fellow Child Care Centers in minnesota to help them work through the forgiveness application process. Ms. Bonn fig, we look forward to hearing your feedback on the loan forgiveness application process as a borrower. During his career he has produced hundreds of multilingual documentary programs for corporate and nonprofit clients. He has also faced serious obstacles with the ppp forgiveness process, and we look forward to hearing his perspective on the issues as well. Thank you for joining us today from the new jersey third congressional district, mr. Parker. I would now like to yield to the Ranking Member, mr. Hern, to introduce our final witness. Thank you, mr. Chairman. Our next witness is pete patel. Mr. Patel is the ceo and president of Promise Hotels, a company he founded with his wife 12 years ago. Promise hotels is a Hospitality Business group that runs a dozen hotels in the tulsa, oklahoma, area, my district. With 25 years experience, mr. Patel is a current board member of the Oklahoma Hotel and lodging association and the tulsa lodging association. Hes also a former board member of the Tulsa Metro Chamber of commerce. Mr. Patel, we are grateful you can take the time away from running your businesses to talk with us this morning. We know that you and the other witnesses are very busy, so we appreciate all of your time. Welcome, and we look forward to your testimony. Thank you, mr. Hern. Were going to start with the witnesses here. So, ms. Ozer, you are now recognized for five minutes. Thank you. Thank you for inviting me and good morning everyone. My bank made nearly 2 billion with ppe loans serving 11,000 Small Businesses that were desperate. And lenders nationwide stepped up to implement this congressionally provided lifeline. We should applaud the countless Success Stories of businesses saved and employees retained. But it hasnt been easy. There were front end issues, especially with eligibility and lenders roles and simple nocost fixes are needed in any future program extension. We must learn from what didnt work. When it comes to forgiveness, significant concerns need to be addressed now. Piecemeal guidance continues to create confusion. There is still no guidance for major issues. And without answers, i cannot help my borrowers. We have no idea how a guarantee will be honored with a business is permanently close to file bankruptcy. We have no idea how were expected to service those loans long term. For borrowers requesting permission to sell to new owners, we have no idea how to help them. More importantly, borrowers are confused by the forgiveness process and panic that the loans they believed would be grants if they followed the rules may become burdensome debt because they cant muddle through the paperwork. Borrowers remain confused about the covered period and how to document payroll expenses. Theyre concerned about safe harbor calculations to help qualify for full forgiveness. I quote, i have tried and read many instructions regarding the forgiveness application, but i still find it very confuse. I have even listened to multiple webinars. I would love someone to be able to translate that for me, end quote. This borrowers not alone. Virtually all brorers share this concern. To add to tborrow this must be prescriptive or well wind up with another ez form which isnt making anything easier. Simplification will provide enormous e leaf. Congress must clarify the lenders role in the process. Identify a gai is a major problem. We would be conduits for delivering federal assistance because we had the network and capacity the federal government did not have. Other than providing the capital quickly, our role, as lenders, was to be limited. Only after we madal manies of loans did banks learn we would have to verify the accuracy and that forgiveness could hinge on this. We have gone from being a continue with it to being deeply involved in an ill defined process. At the heart of this issue is that the lenders role as defined by the agency creates an inherent conflict of interest. Lenders lend. We should not be the arbiter of who receives from the government especially when our decisions determine whether our own funds will be reimbursed. I urge you to clarify the lenders role in the process. I also encourage you to include a harmless section to better define lender responsibilities in verifying borrower provided documents and certifications. Lenders are on the front lines in delivering this crucial aid and we must fully understand our role to be comfortable helping our borrowers. Until the many issues are addressed, many lenders will be reluctant to embrace or expand a new program. Most agree we need to fully understand how the forgiveness process will work, how fda will honor guarantee, and what the guidance can say before we can consider participating in extensions. Otherwise, finally, a reminder that the best tool to assist americas Small Business long term in good times and bad has always been the regular 7a loans. We need the same temporary 7a enhancement provisions like c waivers and guaranteed percentages lifted that we make that have worked previously so well in tough times weve experienced before. They will work again. Supporting the 7a loan Program Means extending the section 1112 debt relief payments which are hugely stabilizing and have been for this existing portfolios and also encourage new lending. Funding remains for these 11, 12 payments, and i cannot think of a better tool to provide meaningful assistance to Small Business. Thank you so much, and i look forward to your questions. Thank you so much for your statement there, appreciate it. Were going to turn it over to ms. Bonfig now. Youre recognized for five minutes. Over to you. Good morning. Thank you for giving me the time to share my experience. My name is amy bonfig. Im the owner of Little Saints Academy, a licensed Child Care Center in st. Joseph, minnesota. Im honored to have been chosen to speak to the committee today on behalf of myself, our lender, and 30 fellow Child Care Centers in central minnesota. I have been working with the director of the minnesota Central Region sbdc to gather and share information as it becomes available. Our local sbdc office has been a vital resource for Little Saints Academy over the last ten years and on the cans navigating through this hardship with us. During the start of the pandemic, Child Care Centers were asked to remain open and care for essential workers children. With no guidance, we gathered together seeking information creating a safe space to ask questions, feel supported and make decisions as a group for the children we care for, our staff and our businesses. With little to no financial aid, suddenly the Paycheck Protection Program became available and i was grateful to receive a forgivable loan. Through this process, i have kept myself and our group aware of changes. I created a spreadsheet for the group because it was a very lengthy forgiveness application process. I met with them via zoom to help make sense of it when i could barely make sense of it myself. I spent much of my time over the days and several months focused on the success of our ppp loan and the forgiveness. It was incredibly time consuming. And at the end of our covered period, the forgiveness application finally appeared but with a new term, owneremployees, which was completely mind boggling because we had to be counted as fulltime equivalents on our loan application, and then we couldnt count ourselves in the fulltime equivalent count for safe harbor. Because of that, i was unable to spend my entire loan in eight weeks. Extending two weeks of the payroll, i can benefit from the entire loan. But we didnt find out about the extension option until we were in our eighth week and had exhausted most of our funds. After my cover period, i had no choice but to lay off staff. With the uncertainty of covid19 and the ability to stay open or even meet the fulltime equivalent safe harbor criteria, i was too afraid to choose the 24week option. Now the rules have changed again, but the sba is not giving my lender needed information to submit by application. Without forgiveness, the reality is i currently have an unforgiven loan that was used to pay my staff with benefits they should have been able to collect through the minnesota unemployment program. The child care directors and owners i bring with me today have expressed similar fear of failure regarding forgiveness. Many do not understand the rules, the application, and most do not have the luxury of time to sort it all out. With that being said, i want to steal a moment to advocate for the recognition of Small Business in the child care industry, especially after watching my brave and resilient colleague step up during this time of sheer uncertainty and chaos. Please understand that we need your support. We need peace of mind knowing that our loans have been forgiven as we look to the future Financial Stability of our programs. We run our daily businesses on tight budgets with our fingers crossed well make it the next day. Weve done this in the old normal and the new normal. We would like you to consider other expenses that may be relatable to forgiveness such as ppp, they are mrmometers, even professional cleaning services. Presenters bho dont qualify for the usda food program would help tremendously. I would like for you to consider making this a simpler process. The ez form needs many of the calculations in the long form to fill out the application honestly and accurately. Six unrelated to pull reports and gather required information from is way too complicated. Please do consider some degree of automatic forgiveness or at least a forgiveness process with fewer criteria. On behalf of my fellow child care providers, i thank you for allowing me to speak to you on behalf of our organization as we move forward with decisions about the ppp loan forgiveness. Thank you for sharing your expe