Redefine what the European Union is all about hello everyone for france 24 on false hope to god in paris and im melinda crane for dutch of ella in berlin in the European Union health care has always been handled at the National Level so as the corona pandemic swept the continent it was nation states that were calling the shots even between close e. U. Neighbors borders were closed crucial medical exports were stopped and solidarity was looking pretty illusory but that is now changing with french patients for example being treated in german hospitals yeah and millions out with a crisis that were 2 months into which shows some are calling the biggest test for this continent since world war 2 a lot of questions Going Forward the french president and you and michael calling it a moment of truth ahead of thursdays Virtual Summit there are those that are eyeing dick de confinement and then other nations that are doubling down what common response can france and germany often dubbed the motor of european unity a rally a continent thats sure to face some major major challenges both within the European Union and from the rest of the world our title today is corona europes moment of truth foss that cats and dutch avella t. V. Join up for the debate welcome. And joining us from frankfurt hes the former deputy mayor there former student leader of may 68 and former coleader of the green party in the European Parliament thank you so much danielle convention for being with us i and joining us from his Berlin Office is my tam fun mashaal hes a member of the german bundestag representing fribourg which lies close to the French Border and hes also a member of the Franco GermanParliamentary Assembly welcome thank you. From staus boule holland the banks of the rhine we are pleased to welcome a doctor cmyk by dr youre an emergency physician and also a member of the Municipal Council of bull thank you for being with us thank you over the past weeks youve been doing a lot less politics and a lot more of your quote unquote day job i know youve been working out of the emergency dispatch it should be pointed out to our viewers as asked the region the porters germany is one of the big clusters here in france originally it was down in the southern part of ads us in that city of new whos but you also have been feeling the brunt of it we know that the curve is flattened whats the situation like this tuesday. Well this new to them is a their deliberation in the number of people tested positive my team understand this and of number of people being persecuted. And then maybe with no hope in people transferred in i. C. U. Which is a. 10 person for less than the others so we still have people going to the hospital we still have people to think positively of you still have severe cases by the number of people dying and the number of people going to planning see america go by mary when you are 1st saw the cases coming out of china coming out of italy did you think as us would be hit so hard now never. We have the same image 1st the myth that we are from sars or from nurse. Early 2000 and we with our that we can have something about. Maybe 10 cases in strasbourg and then up in something like. We saw people coming in we still 1st the elderly people. Younger people with where we surveyed cases and we saw people dying. Before transfer to i. C. U. Unit ice you bet we were really surprised by no one of our colleagues. Thinking that. Their lives were coming have this race in our region. Let me pick up with a question to my town fun marshall whose electoral district is just right across the rhine river from that region that as we have just heard was hit very early and very hard by cove it so mr professional what has that meant for the people in your district and for your region as a whole. That was and still is very difficult for our region you should probably know that about 40000 people from all sides move to my home region to boston on to work basically but they all work in the very important places like for example hospital sir we absolutely need these people and as a sudden they they couldnt come but also because we decided to go with the boy as i was as was defined as a high risk area why was it you find a high risk area. Because the infection spread east exactly in that specific areas or south of koran and there it should jammu was because there was a stretch of band with several 1000 people and these people they were very close together and some of the virus spread very finest in that area not all are just these days we can come back to slightly open the borders again which is very important for our common diet and i hope and we will bring this topic into a meeting of the committee of cross order cooperation where i am member from the voyage of what is taught in this cross border cooperation this will be a Video Conference this thursday and a very much show that we cannot convince both sides germany and france to make a cross border cooperation more easy in the near future then youre convinced frankel german cooperation well thats literally in your d. N. A. Because youre the citizen of both countries how do you think your 2 nations have risen to the challenge. Difficult its difficult because for the french its difficult to see that it seems that. Its easier to be in germany and that they handle the cold leaves or the cover it is not so explosive or less explosive that in france and because. They stand then me. Push through national or react so if the 1st safety the senate the safety its a national thing and so the cooperation is is is not good is not good is difficult and i think that the french and the German Government is not doing it well its not doing it today wed still today you know if they did some wonderful things you know our you know our transfer from france to germany etc yes but even now you know even if you see the discussion that we have now caught the post and then make the premier league recovery i think that france and france and germany are not on the same track and if france and germany is not on the same track then it would be very difficult in europe we want to we want to come back to that question just a little bit later but let me go now to dr cmyk because we just heard from daniel cohen bend it that in fact there are many people in france who have a sense that somehow the germans are doing it better weve seen some pretty prizing headlines coming out of france lays out months back croissant you may you know why are they better across the world not only in europe but all over the world it seems that the corona virus is exposing the gaps and deficits in countries Health Systems and in their economies so what would you say you have seen about what needs to change in france. Well what i can say about the difference of 1st of maybe it will be it is a different time counting the dead people because in front of the people and you see here we are. Also are enduring. That people are counting their lives. But in germany if you have they either tears or you have hypertension you may be counted different when i said that i can explain all the difference while the other part of the difference is maybe of other than number of bet per capita and you have in germany i think its something that i ate there for one family have you done in front its 5. 00 and the number of ice you there that you have germany its 2 or 3 times higher than in france so thats going to explain because when you have severe cases your ability to have one too large or mechanical ventilation supports to safe people and if you have more ice you bet and you have merit more i see your doctor and nurse you as well trained that you can save people so maybe one of the 1st listen. Its that we need if you show. Wildly of service you are going for the European Union around the world and we need this urgency to face other pandemics coming lets see america go bury the french spend more per capita on health care than the germans why have they have less to offer as youve just described. Well because we had them. Where we. Countenance vision on health policy. Last 2 years. The last french government world. Was really. How do i do. A story policy on birth and they close something about to work through 2000 beds in 5 years so i have. A some moment you will pay for this because you need these beds were the people we Emergency Departments are saying that that or something about who are who you are that need beds we need nurses doctors we need but just spending on Public Health structures let me say to daniel come back i know you wanted to weigh in here we want to just bring in a brief report and then id like to come to you right after that so even between the close neighbors in the European Union not only the effect of the virus but also the responses to it have diverged pretty widely the lock down restrictions here in germany for example were never as drastic as those in france and in fact are now slowly being relaxed my thoughts about our colleague michele they could has this short report from berlin 4 weeks into nationwide contact restrictions the government is beginning to loosen its tight grip on public life and german chancellor Angela Merkel is cautioning germans to be responsible with their regained freedoms then the at all female lock were now lifting some of these restrictions but we dont know exactly what the consequences will be. And thats why we have to take this slowly step by step. It would be a great shame if we now knowingly headed into relapse. At varying speeds German Federal states are allowing medium size shops to open but hotels and restaurants have to remain closed people on the streets of berlin not torn between a sense of relief and concern. And style lifting the restrictions to mean go both legs it really depends on how sensibly people behave now he demitted no government. When most like their life must go on im not worried that people are going to drop dead around me. By the law i did the shops down people just dont keep their distance they cannot imagine how many wont pass just 5 centimeters away from me and i stand by laughing the public backing for the restrictions imposed has so far been always upwards of 90 percent and im going to mount calls Approval Ratings have also sought Germanys Health system has so far been spared being pushed to the limit now the german chancellor is concerned that germans may over celebrate the easing of restrictions and it will take at least 2 weeks until she finds out. So let me ask danny can bend it do you share the chancellor is concerned about a premature relaxation of restrictions i know that in a recent interview you praised her leadership for example in comparison with the marshall rhetoric of president knockoffs yes. Internally she is doing well the problem is when she doesnt talk about europe in which we can discuss this after i just want to to come back to the difference between france and germany i think the critics on the german system Health System was exactly the same in the wording before that it was in france we felt so bad. Because there there didnt have enough nurse etc etc the big difference is the federal system the federal system is stronger if its good managed and it is a good manager in germany you have the heads minutes in every lender its white even if they have less money they are there all that as it better lead are these improvised 11. 00 and this is a big difference between france and germany and i think a part of the German Society will be aware to continue to keep the one who left to lead they will be and a part of our its a problem but at the end you cant lock down from months and months the people of their family dont you cant do it offensively with 3 kids in a 60 need popular its impossible you cant do it 5 with cigarettes and then there it will explode so that all its also the french have to understand that we have to improve in distance. Distance etc but we have to open a little bit if not the people who we dont resist to go out without any restriction because its too hard may i may i just ask my town from marshall to weigh in on this point are you concerned about premature reactivation of the restrictions. Well i feel that we here members of parliament when we are in discussions with the people of our regions or our constituencies we are raising High Pressure especially from the Business People because they have been there they couldnt they had to work for the last weeks i mean we have programs to support them but lets say those who are selling goods in the series those who run Restaurants Hotels they are basically in a very difficult situation and they are urging us to do must. To do whatever we can do to relax these districts and regulations and i think for the moment being we are going to smooth the way we do it step by step we we ask our people to to to cooperate we we try to avoid you know strict measures of course if there is big parties we we must be strict but we tried to change the people with us and try to make them sensitive due to the fact that weve been not overcome the crisis in a few weeks but were need to wait until we have medicare and and vaccination and this will take probably all of almost about a year so we must as im here for many years. Again you who just drew a certain kind of disdain behavior i think we can manage this we can manage it in supermarkets but its its a hot way of which also might be if i may say so differently in the left income trees in many direct him countries and in one go all the countries because we have differences of forms of. Being close together on a lot of trees a good distance is different in kind of jersey countries i think we are in between and is in germany and we are somewhat more libertarian less state less in amber i think there is a different culture which which we might have that this. Are lets begin. On this issue of the mindset of you can see you can see germany from your window you can almost say since after all its possible you have a tramway line that runs to canada and on the german side. You heard then youre convinced there you heard martin van marshall. Is there a french mindset that makes it harder to observe the rules well i dont think so or maybe im just going to say before and before answering your question that maybe the 1st difference between france and germany was the. Attitude facing this crisis in germany they are up to. Massive just instructively and in more loose luck than in france we have. Where we. Are not a massive distance right there you guess were reserved for wealthier people. And growing there we are so good. And now we have a general. May at last something that after tomorrow maybe more than some some people that. Daniel can believe you can see people this way and there is no evidence today apart from. Just on modelers then their dinner or another is better than a specific so i think that we should in our the country with able to work to have a massive 1st things right to do so p. C. R. Or so all of their stuff and them out and then proceed by spirits to fight look down maybe untruths to people who can through it and i can say that i dont think there is a difference. In france and germany i think that what is different its the political discourse of the present my point and what the german president say i think we need to move from fear to trust we should trust people we should trust in him there are in there are understanding and begin to understand and began better than what we can do yeah one phone call to. Steinmeyer spoke 10 days back he seemed to be all thinking a dig at the man you had may call for employing marshall language in his initial speeches were going to talk more about that in a moment 1st off northwest of where mark is there is the law then border town of carling and there theyve been keeping one essential service open its a report from france 24 dot com a web desk by sample. Of the reader if you. Want to. Get a. Major speech looking like in the spirit. It will be quote 4050. 00 plus if obscene and i want you to look at the piece when you look at mystic times mcmillan read a quote toward another i dont scale and her family. Plan to listen when you take it from your p. O. V. No im not a visual look at it about your. Vision out of pocket and calling up the mic how far should such hear about. It was on leave and because i want to cause almost feels like they could just leave it to just you have to get to. Well i thank you pastor transitions one tough hombre and one night under. The condition of got referees i think ill just. Let you know im happy to talk to the good user and introduce a kid. So a great example there of how innovative people capable can become in a crisis necessity being the mother of invention but as you mentioned the town from marshall in fact the border closures have caused a good deal of disruption serious disruption what would you say looking at cross border cooperation as a whole how healthy is Franco German solidarity in general. Are basically am i thinking. We hear from hans and germany im always hearing different viewpoints on things but as we discuss together we can find a compromise and if we reach across reminders this often can beam what will for the of the Member States of the European Union to follow that is basically how i would like just described our partnership and im. A very specific partnership of course is the one we are having between us and us and southwestern germany is specifically bob because we are almost the same college youre on historically even and therefore. I really am very sad about the fact that we have had the border us close and this is counter to go on as i said in the beginning we must open again these borders of korans undiminished deigning strict standards of hygenic measurement measures that is quite clear but we must meet again because that is the reason why in europe we build friendships we have a sharing of area all people can move can get together we have the students in the arrest was Program Europe has been. Going to unity of common values of. Of d