Lose the election. I would just ask that. Did he lose the 2020 election . Tim, im focused on the future. That is a damning nonanswer. America, i think youve got a really clear choice of whos going Toar Honor that democracy and who is going to honor Donald Trump. That was the harris campaigns first ad after last Nights Debate highlighting j. D. Vances absurd claim that Donald Trump peacefully transferred power after the 2020 election and vances refusal to admit that trump lost. Now, if you watched the dewait Last Night, you would have seen Senator Vance try to put a gloss of respectability on the president ial campaign as trump himself appears increasingly unhinged. But that strategy to normalize the very weird and very extreme trumpvance platform, that Strategy Sort of fell apart when vance was asked about huz Running Mates failed attempt to cling to power after the 2020 election. Now, admittedly, it is hard to defend Donald Trumpsis actionsn the post2020 election period. There were a lot of bad Data Points there. And today it feels like the News Gods watched last Nights Debate and saw j. D. Vances appalling answer and decided to highlight the whole issue. Because today a federal judge in washington, d. C. Unsealed a partially redacted, 165page Filing from special Counsel Jack Smith in which smith lays out why he believes that the case is very much still prosecutable following the Supreme Courts immunity ruling. Along with that, smith lays out yet another new narrative of the case, and that all 161 pages of that is what reporters and legal analysts have been pouring over all day today. Stuff like conversations with Trump And Vice president Mike Pence before an angry mob called for Mike Pence to be hanged. At abe private Luncheon Decembe 21st pence encouraged trump not to look at the election as a loss, just an intermission. This was followed later in the day by a private discussion in the Oval Office in which trump asked pence, what do you think we should do . Pence said, after we have exhausted every legal process in the courts and congress, if we still come up short, trump should take a bow. Trying to get trump to think aboutp his loss as an Art Missn suggests Mike Pence wanted trump to run again in 2024 and was presumably ready to run with him. But it was Mike Pences decision to focus on the future, as jaesks might say, instead of doing trumps bidding in the present that might ultimately lead trump to believe Mike Pence lacked courage. Upon receiving a Phone Call alerting him that pence had been taken to a secure location, a staffer rushed s to the Dining Room to inform trump in hopes that the defendant, trump, would take action to ensure pences safety. Instead, after the staffer delivered the news, trump looked at him and said only so what. The Vice President s life is in danger, and the president s reaction is so what. This new filing further sheds light on just haw conscious he was hed been lying after the election. A white House Staffer traveling with trump overheard him tell Family Members that it doesnt matter if you won or lost the election, you still have to fight like hell. And then we learn the degree to which the Trump Campaign explicitly encouraged violent disruption not just at the capitol on January 6th but in states where the vote was still being counted. You might remember this footage of Angry Trump supporters in Detroit Demandingup Access to t secure location where votes were being counted after Election Day. This new filing describes how Trump Campaign staffers appear to have actively encouraged those people to commit violence. A campaign employee agent, and coconspirator of trumps tried to sow there he told that Campaign Staffer we think a batch of votesgn heavily in Bidens Favor is right. Staffer responded, well, find a reasonl, it isnt. Give me options to file litigation and even if its b. S. When a colleague suggested there was about to be unrest reminisce want of the Brooks Brothers riot, an effort to stop the Vote Count in florida after the 2000 president ial election, the staffer responded, make them riot, do it. Joining me now is democratic congresswoman Zoe Lofgren of california. Re she, of course, served on the January 6th committee. Congresswoman, thank you for being heren, tonight. Im eager to get your initial reaction to this traunch of new material, a lot of it quite damning, that the judge has unsealed today. Well, it has details that we were not able to get, but i dont think the conclusion is really much different than we reached. Thiser was a plot by trump to Kp Power even though he lost the election. He knew he lost the election. In fact, we found statements going back to April Of 2020 where he said, you know, he was going to stay in power. He would not respect the vote. So this was he never intended to seize power and we were not able to get, for example, testimony from the Vice President. So theres some things in here that we didnt know. Certainly the who cares statement is shocking but not surprising. Thats in keeping with his whole attitude, the tweet that he put out. He called he assembled that mob in washington and he knew they were armed, and he sent them down to the capitol any how, and he wanted to go with them. He tried to go with him. Congresswoman, the most explosive stuff a lot of it is explosive, but the stuff a lot of people really have not been privy to is Mike Pences testimony. Were allpe highlighting the so what comment because its so cavalier, so effectively heartless not to say nothing of theot morals and heartless. The indictment details 71 instances where trump threatens pence. And at one point threats that are so serious, that mark short, pences former chief of staff, feels he needs to notify the Secret Service, that his you know, his asset their asset could be in harms way. It is very hard for me to understand whatever the Supreme Court has said in its initial immunity ruling, that this could somehow be an official act. The threatening of a Vice President s life by its very Nature Cant be part of the role of the Vice President. Can it . Well, it boggles the mind if it is. Clearly as the prosecutor has laid out, these efforts were in his capacity as a candidate for President And Someonee who was trying to keep office, not act as the president. So i think, you know, its a compelling case. I think, you know, well see because if trump is elected president , hes going to order the Department Of Justice to dismiss this case. And the court the Supreme Court made clear that any communication between the president and the doj is going to be in that immune bubble. But if he is not elected president , this case is going to go forward, i think, and i think a solid case has been made that Theres Evidence sufficient to proceed and probably to convict. As a Congress Person i wonder how youre processing, you know, the details like Trump Campaign staffers encouraging Election Workers to make them riot as we now sit a month before another election when Donald Trump is once again at the top of the ticket and once again questioning whether the election will be free or fair, now has an army of poll to watchers who are going to do his bidding. Whats your concern there . And how prepared is congress in the coming months and years ahead if trump is reelected . Well, we did, of course, make changes in the electoral count act, liz cheney, and i with a lead on that to make it harder to overturn the election. Trump has been pretty overt, pretty open that violence is something that he appreciates. I mean, all the way from urging his followers in rallies to rough up people who they didnt like to, you know, summoning a mob and encouraging an armed mob to attack the capitol. I mean he uses violence for his own purposes, and he is threatening, i believe, to do that again. He sometimes uses code words, but his followers certainly understand what hes saying. They sure do. Congresswoman Zoe Lofgren, thank you for making the time tonight. I appreciate it. Im now joined by kristi greenberg, former federal prosecutor and now msnbc legal analyst. Thank you for being gifted to us by the News Gods. We havent had all the adequate time to digest it, but three buckets that stood out to me. Where the special counsel is saying these are not official acts, a and therefore they shou be in an indictment, we should move forward. This all stuff he can be held to account on at trial. The first is Mike Pence. It seems the Supreme Court has left open the door some of the conversations and interactions between the president and Vice President may just be prosecutable. In the filing the special counsel goes out of its way to characterize the conversations as those friends would have, that they are conversations where trump is being encouraged by pence to acknowledge that its over, kind of like you would console a grieving friend, that the Context And Content of the conversations reflect a candid exchanges between two candidates on a shared ticket, not, in fact, office holders. How convincing do you think that argument is around the nature of those conversations . Ofwell, i found it very convincing. Reading through their exchanges it didnt seem like it was a president and Vice President a talking. It seemed like a Schoolyard Bully and a victim. Thats how it seemed. Youve got Mike Pence call him on christmas to wish him Merry Christmas and hes saying, so, you going to certify that election . It wasec constant to the point was saying everyone is going to hate you. You have to do this. And then youre too honest, which is the part that sang to me. Because, again, goinganto back your intro where is the part in this 165page Brief where you get that Donald Trump knew he lost and knew these Election Fraud claims were bogus . And that right there was one example. You were too honest. And again, its hard to see how the Supreme Court can t look at statements like that and say, oh, that was well within his official acts as president. He was clearly speaking as a candidate who wantedas to win a who knew he lost. And when pence is speaking to trump trying to defend himself and get him off the ledge, effectively, its not that of a Vice President serving his president. Its a Running Mate saying, hey, bro, we lost. We can call it quits. Yeah, we can try again in 2024. And asca you said, its just an intermission. Dont think of it as a loss. Like the fragility of this mans ego, reading it it was kind of lame and pathetic, but again not seeming Veryin Official whatsoever. The next part of it is the ellipse rally, right . They go out of their way to say this was not an official, you know, White House function. This, was paid for, i believe,y Ave Grocery Chain heiress. The Secret Service responsible for the president s protection classified the rally as a campaign event. The special counsel is trying to establish that everything that happened there had nothing to do with official function, so Anything Trump said there would notru be deemed official acts, right . Ct right. And so i think what Jack Smith sets up so beautifully when he gets to this point on January 6th because he takes you through days and days on the Pressure Campaign on State Officials and the state elector scheme. And now everything has failed. This is his last shot. This is it. Th hes got to get this crowd to stop the certification because Mike Pence isnt playing ball. Seeing how Donald Trump, the words in that context, with that fuller context of everything that c had come up before it, i just seems so clearly designed to incite this riot. Th thats clearly where his statements were directed, and once again how is that at president ial . He does the same thing. Smith again takes the same logic and applies it to the fake electors plot, suggesting this is completely unofficial. Its Fair Game for prosecution. Judge chutkan unsealed all of this. Theres a purpose there. I wonderth what you think what happens now. The public is digesting it. Its heavily redacted or partially redacted. Trump gets to file a response. Where do we go from here . One thing thats been notable to me is trumps lawyers have said we get a chance to cross examine the witnesses. Youin cant just take this on t papers. We get to question these witnesses and confront them. And presumably for a number of these witnesses the way theyre characterized in the filing is not the Way Trump is going to characterize them. Forze example, Eric Hirschman W is not identified by name, but you can read between the lines and figure out who he is, he is described as a conduit between the campaign and the White House. But at one point in 2020 hes actually working in the White House. So theyre goingal to say, no, hes a White House guy. None of this was within the campaign and the candidacy. And with Mike Pence i think itll be a similar calculus. Those witnesses in particular important because those are the two Jack Smith says those people told him he lost and knew it in 2020. And you have statements seeming to acknowledge it when hirschman says this is not going to hold up in court, and Donald Trump says details dont matter. Things like onthat, those are important facts from the judge, and i think shes going to want to hear it from the horses moulgt. Ultimately whatever she decides, its going to get appealed and its going back to the Supreme Court. Thats a whole other question. Christy greenberg, thank you for your time and expertise. Appreciate it. Stillex ahead this evening, what happens when a massive deadly hurricane hits two critical Swing States five weeks before a president ial election . The chair of the North Carolina democratic party will join me to talk about how her state is recovering and getting ready to vote. But first Donald Trump has a T W Week to officially respond to special Counsel Jang smiths bombshell filing tonight, but hes already responding online. Going to have more on that with the bulwarks tim Miller And Charlie sykes Coming Up next. Syt why didnt you answer the question Last Night during the debate about who won the 2020 president ial election . Heres the simple reason. The medias obsessed with talking about the election of four years ago. Im focused on the election of 33 days from now. J. D. Vance may be interested in moving on, but a newly unsealed filing from the special counsel is keeping trumps increasingly desperate plans to overturn the 2020 election very much in the spotlight 34 days before Election Day as voting is underway in 29 states. Trump himself responded tonight on truth social writing, democrats are weaponizing the Justice Department against me because they know i am winning and they are desperate to prop up their failing candidate, Kamala Harris. The doj pushed out this latest Hit Job Today because jaefs humiliated Tim WalzLast Night in the debate. Joining me now are tim miller, writer at large at the bulwark. Gentlemen, here we have it. This is how you explain it away. Tim, this is the epiinization of the Justice Department. Never mind Judge TonYu Chutkan is an independent federal judge. Your thoughts. Amazing how weaponization works. Theyre going after Eric Adams and Bob Menendez just to throw us off the scent. Look, we know this is ridiculous from trump. To me i think the most interesting thing that we learned in the filing is just how much Jack Smith has on trumps behavior. I think the January 6th committee did such a good job i didnt know how much material would be out there, just kind of scanning what we see so far, knowing what trump what he was watching on his phone, like as the riot was occurring, what the context was of when he sent out the Mike Pence should have the courage tweet. The fact that people told him about the threats to Mike Pence and that he didnt care. There is even additional information here added on top of the already damning stuff that we learned from the January 6th committee. Hopefully between that and what we saw from j. D. Vance last Night Kind of continuing to keep this story in the news as it should be, by refusing to say Donald Trump lost the election, it can, you know, be something that is injected into the public debate in a way that, like, a certain demographic of people, probably not viewers of this show, but a certain demographic of people probably have top of mind. Charlie, theres the reality of how damning this is for any president. But the fact this person is running again, the election is in 33 days i lost count but hes out there saying this. Lets play the sound of, you know, his level of confidence about the coming election. Do we have the sound . Can we play it . Trust the process this time around. Ill let you know in about 33 days. Charlie, ill let you know in about 33 days. That is not what you want to hear from the guy who has a who is the subject of a 165page Filing detailing his desperate measures to subvert democracy. I wonder if you think this matters to voters. Well, were going to find that out. You know, youre going to be hearing a lot more of this because this filing by Jack Smith is a reminder what Donald Trump did his criminal conspiracy, his frauds and Deceit And Reliance on violence, but its also a warning because Donald Trump intends to do it again, and i think that that is one of the reasons why this is really on fire. And also you were mentioning just the juxtaposition of the story that the News Gods gave us today. With what j. D. Vance said Last Night because Jack Smiths filing explains why j. D. Vance was on that platform Last Night and not Mike Pence. And it is precisely because j. D. Vance is willing to do what Mike Pence refused to do. And really the dramatic take away i have from reading this 165page Document is the incredible pressure that was put on Mike Pence, all of the threats, all of the cajoling, all of the lies that were told to and about Mike Pence. And then that decision that Mike Pence made, that for the first time as Vice President he was not going to do Donald Trumps bidding, hes gone now. He has been excommunicated by Trump World and j. D. Vance is in his place. We should focus on j. D. Vance with his nonanswer Last Night look how he tried to overturn the election and the role Mike Pence played. And the reason Mike Pence is not on that ticket but j. D. Vance is on the ticket. One of the things i think Jack Smith has done, is he has taken whole January 6th story out of the Memory Hole it has been in the last few weeks, and hes placed it right in front of the voter. Whether or not theyre going to consider this old news, we dont know. The details in this report is dazzling. The narrative is clear and compelling and written in such a way that i think nonlawyers can go through it, and ask themselves how is it even conceivably possible that Donald Trump could be president of the united states again. It is a remarkable story, and it is a remarkable reminder of the stakes of this election. Yeah, when we talk about the relevance of the 2020 the capitol riots, tim, its often seen as i think charlie so rightly points out, as something that happened in the rearview. The Jeks Tuposition of his comments Last Night, Tim Walz saying where is the firewall, and this report. Honestly, i dont think you even need to read the report. Its just a reminder oh, yeah, that guy tried to steal the election, and the only guy that stood in his way is now gone. How much it matters to voters changes a little bit even if its just on the margins given the last 24 hours. Look, the gym comey letter, for example, that was old news, too, and it changed things on the margins. Wont know whether that was the decisive thing that happened in 2016, not to trigger anybody. But there are late breaking deciders. Weve seen this people who dont like either candidate decide really late. Its a small group of people that can be a decisive group of people. I think as far as the forward versus back element to this, two things. The thing i was frustrated didnt get mentioned Last Night in the exchange with j. D. Vance is it isnt just a backwards looking thing because j. D. Vances boss wants to pardon the perpetrators who are in jail of the 2020 riot, so it is a forward looking thing. Its part of their agenda. Its a key part of their forward looking agenda Donald Trump talks about all the time. Secondly, as charlie points out, this is an ongoing effort looking to the 2024 election. I talked to Jim Macina for the board this morning. Youd be astonished at how much effort is going in right now to gum up the works in all of The KeySwing States by republican officials who are trying to learn lessons from what happened in 2020. So this is absolutely a forwardlooking issue, not a backwards looking one. Charlie, for the, you know, handful of voters who are maybe former Nikki Haley supporters or just republicans who need to be reminded once more why they should not be voting for Donald Trump, do you think it would be effective for Vice President harris to talk about this in whatever way legally she is allowed to on the Campaign Trail . Yes, absolutely. And i think she will. In fact, tomorrow here in wisconsin shes going to be an at event with liz cheney, and im guessing that this issue is going to come up, and it will be aimed, i think, at republicans, wavering soft republicans who have to look at this and say do we want to go through this again . Do we really want to have another replay of all of this . And especially when you have to confront the evidence that Donald Trump actually was leading a conspiracy that would have resulted in vaporizing tens of millions of votes including the votes of millions of wisconsinites, that part of the plot was to have Mike Pence actually gavel in Donald Trump as the winner of the election, accepting the fake electors. When people have to confront that, i really think theres going to be a sliver, who knows how much of the electorate that is going to say, okay, we may not like all of Kamala Harris policies, but this is beyond the pail. This man is not fit for any office of public trust, much less being returned to the Oval Office. Tim Miller And Charlie sykes, great to have your perspective on this. Thanks for your time tonight. Coming up, how much will prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahus response to iranian attacks play a role in the coming american election . And can President Biden do anything about it . But first, Hurricane Helene laid waste to parts of the south including Election Infrastructure in critical battleground states, states that just might decide the next election. Well have more on that right after the break. man these men of means with their silver spoons. What will become of them when they discover robinhood gold allows others to earn their very liberal rates on idle cash. They would descend into chaos. Sleep more deeply and wake up rejuvenated. Purple mattresses exclusive Gel Flex Grid draws away heat, relieves pressure, and instantly adapts. Sleep better. Live purple. Right now buy more, save more. Up to 600 off. Visit purple. Com or a store near you introducing a revolution in Pain Relief. Absorbine junior pro, the strongest numbing Pain Relief available. Its the only solution with two Max Strength anesthetics for fast penetrating Relief Absorbine junior pro. Nothing numbs pain more. Today President Biden and Vice President harris toured the wreckage from Hurricane Helene. Harris spent the day in georgia while biden toured both North Carolina and South Carolina Meeting with local officials and thanking aid workers. Super charged by climate change, Hurricane Helene traveled 500 miles from florida to the southern appalachia mountains, destroying hundreds ofs, leaving millions of households still without power and killing 183 people across six states. Today Biden And Harris announced a series of immediate measures to help people impacted by the storm. Biden ordered the pentagon to deploy up to 1,000 active duty troops to help distribute aid, and he announced onetime payments of 750 from fema to assist impacted residents in florida, georgia, North Carolina, south carolina, and virginia. The message of these visits was clear, the federal government is here to help, and it is here to stay. My final point to the residents of this community and the region is that we are here for the long haul. There is the work we have done together that was the immediate response well, preparation for and the immediate response after. But theres a lot of work that needs to happen over the coming days, weeks, and months. Days, weeks, and months. Now, in addition to all the other challenges this Recovery Effort presents, the timing of this storm means that in the middle of all of this local officials are going to have to make sure people can vote. You might remember a similar situation from back in 2012 when Hurricane Sandy Hit the North East just weeks before the president ial election. It did not go smoothly. Election day got off to a chaotic start in communities outside new York City that still dont have power. When voters arrived at polling places that were not ready. Its a disgrace. This whole thing is a disgrace. Ive been here three times. They finally got machines in. Now the machines are jammed up. In new Jersey Anyone displaced by the storm could vote by email and fax, an unprecedented move that overwhelmed election offices. Even before that move, critics were warning of Voter Fraud, and legal experts say all this will very likely land the state of New Jersey in court. In any election trying to make sure people can vote in an area still affectively recovering from a natural disaster, well, is a challenge. But this is not just any election. This is an election where one of the candidates is affectively looking for reasons to claim fraud, to claim any chaos at all is a sign the election has been stolen. Hurricane helene wreaked havoc on six states across the southeast, two of which are potentially critical Swing States georgia and North Carolina. Today new polling from the Cook Political Report show that Trump And Harris are statistically tied in georgia and literally tied in North Carolina. Either state could end up deciding the entire 2024 election, so every vote in those states will really count. In North Carolina inperson early voting is supposed to start in 15 days, and in Georgia Mailin ballots are supposed to start going out next monday. I say supposed to because in North Carolina the state is unsure which Voting Sites will still be usable. And in Georgia The Postal Service has suspended operations at scores of their facilities across the state. So with 34 days before Election Day, how are these local officials going to pull this off . Especially with this guy on the ballot. Do you trust the process this time around . Ill let you know in about 33 days. The chair of North Carolinas democratic party joins me Coming Up next. Democratic party joins me Coming Up next. Have you ever considered getting a walkin tub . Well, look no further Safe Steps best offer, just got better now, when you purchase your brand new Safe Step walkin tub, youll receive a free Shower Package. Yes, a free Shower Package and if you call today, youll also receive 15 off your entire order. Now you can enjoy the best of both worlds the therapeutic benefits of a warm, soothing bath that can help increase mobility, relieve pain, boost energy, and even improve sleep or, if you prefer, you can take a refreshing shower. Allinone Product Call now to receive a free Shower PackagePlus 15 off your brand new Safe Step walkin tub. The scope of devastation caused by Hurricane Helene is still being assessed, but an early estimate suggests the Storms Price Tag could reach 34 billion, and some of that damage was to the states Election Infrastructure including reports of flooding at multiple polling sites. In addition to that, damaged roads could make it extremely difficult for mailin ballots to be collected or sent in. Almost 1 Million voters live in the area of North Carolina most impacted by helene. 1 Million voters in a state that Donald Trump won in 2020 by fewer than 80,000 votes. Joining me now to talk about all of this is anderson clayton. Shes the chair of the North Carolina democratic party. Anderson, thank you so much for joining me. First, if you could just tell us what the Recovery Process is like in your state and how its going down there. Well, as people know, right now North Carolinas western part of ouritate has been ravaged by hurricane devastation, and we are still in an active Search And Recovery mode right now. Anyone in North Carolina who needs Help Or Assistance can go to help nc. Gov and folks who have dealt with Flooding Devastation or the collapsing of homes in Western Communities of the state. We know people are out there needing help and yours. We are really appreciative of Governor Cooper and President Biden and the resources that have been given to North Carolina already, but our hearts are out there with the folks in the western part right now. Our hearts are out there. And the devastation is staggering. Preceding Hurricane Helene as such a critical state in the 2020 election, how optimistic are you local election officials get things up and running in time for voters to start getting things together in a matter of weeks . We have every confidence in our State Board. Our Board Of Directors has actively called the State Board of elections together to give Emergency Relief to the 25plus counties that have been impacted by the campaign, and also given discretion to those counties to be able it depict what they need to ask for from the State Board in order to get elections proceeding in the right direction. But, again, Number One effort right now is going to finding and rescuing people in western North Carolina. Theres still remote parts of western North Carolina that hasnt had access and been able to reached yet because of how hard it is to get into the hollers and places to your point entire roadways have washed away. Climate change has derailed the entire geographic presence of people in those communities. And folks familiar with the terrain are actually having problems being able to find folks out there right now, and so we trust the nonpartisan board of elections in our state is going to do everything possible to make sure folks are voting securely, but our first priority is to make sure were finding everybody in North Carolina because we know every single person matters right now. Yeah, of course this is about human Survival And Isnt about party affiliation. I have to ask, though, the president former President Trump is one to cry fraud even when there isnt any. And when there was a deadly pandemic that resulted in mass death, he had no qualms about trying to weaponize that. And precautions, measures taken to keep the vote safe and fair and free, and using those measures to cry foul and to say the election was rigged. Are you at all concerned that the dispensesations that will have to happen, the special procedures, whatever needs to happen to get these people the opportunity to exercise their constitutional right to vote, are you worried about that being seen as an opportunity by the republican on the ticket to cry foul . Look, weve already seen Donald Trump say that Voter Fraud exists in south carolina. We have a board of elections made up of nonpartisan and good people across the state, that theyre interested in just making sure every single person has access to the polls, and its our job to make sure weve got a Voter Protection Effort in the state of North Carolina, that anyone can have access to in the state to make sure that you know that your vote is the most important thing to us this election cycle. Anybody right now thats impacted in western North Carolina can go to ncsbe. Gov helene for help and find out where the best resources for you are going to be this year. Again, the Number One priority is making sure we find everyone in the state. Anyone missing somebody in North Carolina right now can call 211 in the State And File a miss persons or also be able to do a Wellness Check right now, too. We know theres still huge parts of our state that dont have internet acs ses. We dont know the extent what these damages are going to be for Polling Locations yet. Were still in an Assessment PhaseinNorth Carolina. And i trust our election officials are going to do everything possible to protect that vote this year. Doing really important work. Every official in North Carolina is doing really important work to save lives and rebuild ones that have been broken. Anderson clayton, thank you so much. Well put up on our site a link to some of the sites you mentioned where people can go for more information about voting and of course for help. Thanks so much for your time tonight. Thank you. We have much more to get to this evening. Israel vows to retaliate for the iranian Missile Strike yesterday. What could that mean for the region . And also the u. S. Presidential election . Ill talk to Nbc News national Security Editor David rhodes about that Coming Up next. R davs about that Coming Up next. You name it. And cleaning your gutters can be a real challenge. But just one call to leaffilter, and the problems solved. It wasnt just that leaffilter cleaned our gutters and guaranteed that theyd stay clog free. But it was more they saved us the energy of having to think about cleaning them. We go to great heights, so you dont have to. Call 833 leaffilter today, or visit leaffilter. Com we are continuing to keep a close eye on the mideast where israel has vowed retaliation against iran for launching nearly 200 ballistic missiles at eisrael Last Night, an Attack Tehran says was in response to the recent assassinations of leaders of the iranian military and its proxies, hezbollah and hamas. How and when israel will respond remains unclear, but many including The New York TimesDavid Sanger now argue that the longfeared wider war in the Middle East is here. Joining me now is david rhode, national Security Editor for Nbc News. Does biden have to pull what he wants, which is a proportional response from israel . The answer is no. And all of this in politics is local. For biden the biden administration is now four, five weeks away from an election. And cutting off to aide in israel in any way would right now simply hand a Giant Cudgel for trump and other republicans to attack and say you are not supporting israel enough. And then for netanyahu he wants to win this war. Hes got a tremendous big victory with hezbollah and he wants to punish iran. Bill cohen from the clinton administration, former secretary of defense, told andrea mitchell, our Colleague Today that biden is handicapped and Bibi Netanyahu is going to exploit that. Obviously this is domestic politics for netanyahu, but it is obviously Dove Tails greatly with whoever is going to be in charge here in washington. The cynical View Bibi Netanyahu wants trump to win. Is that cynical or anihilistic . There are thousands of israelis who want to move back to the northern part of the country, Push Hezbollah back so they cant be firing into northern israel. So maybe bibi sort of strikes back more aggressively than israel did in april, but he doesnt overplay his hand. But theres no question the idf a tremendous success, a lot of surprise how etive they were taking at so many hezbollah leaders. This could be Gas Refineries they could hit in israel, nuclear sites, intelligence headquarters. Thats what was targeted and mossad was targeted in tel aviv. Its a dicy time and maybe biden should have acted sooner in pushing harder for a ceasefire in gaza six months or so ago, but at this point he has very little leverage. You paint the picture of how politically untenable it would be to deny israel military aid, but theres also the reality of this war continuing and escalating and growing, and, you know, what David Sanger saying the war is here, its at the doorstep. The long fear wider war is here. That is also somewhat politically untenable for biden, is it not . Correct. I think gas prices, Oil Prices up 2 just after the Attack Yesterday on israel. So thats the challenge. One final Card Biden can play, and its too late, after the election theres some expect asian he can be very bold, put a lot of pressure on israel, put some grand Peace Deal so many people have talked about, when he has less to lose and hes thinking about his legacy. Do you think you that holds true even if Kamala Harris, his Vice President wins . Do you think biden is going to try to make bold moves his former Running Mate is going to be taking the reins in a matter of months . I do because president s have egos. They do . Shocking. Joe biden i think theres a good Chance Hell Push very hard, his pride has always been foreign policy. Hes a big supporter of some kind of twostate solution, and hell have a chance to do that for several months. Obviously netanyahu could again wait him out then, but i think theres a possibility. So hell say a lot of things but not be able to change much until november 5th. All right. Were obviously keeping an eye on all this, but i like the prognostication . Thank you for your time tonight. That is our show for this evening. Way too early with Jonathan Lemire is Coming Up next. This was a weaponization of government, and thats why it was released 30 days before the election. And Theres Nothing new in there, by the way. Nothing new. They rigged the election. I didnt rig the election. They rigged the election. Thats former president Donald Trump slamming the new filing