And welcome to cross top where all things are considered on peter limbo. The results of the u. S. Election cycle have surprised many. There was no blue wave, and the g. O. P. Witnessed gains all across the board. Both parties have deep internal divisions, and the court is in both parties based populist challenges. Is this the perfect recipe for a political realignment to discuss this and more, im joined by my guest, kevin chatters in washington, and he is an attorney and democratic strategist, and minneapolis we have and tom lazaro, he is founder of big 10 republicans. And in austin, we cross the west. Benedict is a former executive director of the libertarian party, originally, rules in effect, that means you can jump in anytime you want, and i was appreciate it. He was going to kevin kevin, in light of the election results, which you say that the, the, me, the postulate politics is, destiny is in the dustbin of history. Go ahead. Well see what happens over. So i dont have an official where of course i am a leader to the president and i dont like to remind us even though we know who are rude, i think we have a lot of work to do honestly in america to get past this huge divide i think elections showed us how divided really are, were present shop reform, got the folks out. But unfortunately for him and his supporters, he created almost a Stronger Movement of people who strongly hate, you know, the resistance, so to speak. And they came out. Theres probably a lot of work to do, so make sure you put it for free, but were not there yet. And ton, i think that it would be very welcomed by tens of millions of people if the political left and particularly the Democratic Party can stop voter shamy conservatives. And republicans, i think it meets that point. I think, you know, you can look at the results of the election, but you know, calling them deplorable xin races. Zina folds, i think that that is in the dustbin of history too. What do you think and absolutely not. Its incredible is all part of it is for the pollsters in the mainstream of the comment that this election was far closer than they ever predicted. I mean, donald trump received more votes than any incumbent president ever. And you know, this was an extremely tight apparent joe Biden Victory for 4. About the same mark, i dont trump one by the 3 states. He won wisconsin and pennsylvania in 2016. So the idea that you know how 5 americans are, you know, hes racist horrible people is just fundamentally absurd. And thats just the message from the left. Costly that anyone who supports it all, trump is a terrible, deplorable individual. Him in less it when i look at the results here it, it seems to me that there is a realignment going on pretty well, particularly in the g. O. P. , where you have kind of a mixture of social conservatism and economic populism. You think thats a Fair Assessment . Go ahead with us. Well, so some of thats happening, but what i see is youve got the standard republicans and democrats hating each other, making it sound like one side is going to totally destroy america. Where as the other is going to save america. But mostly that is all style. When you look at the substance of the issues, when you look at trade policy, tax and spend policy wars in the middle east, the deficit spending and fire mentalism, Social Security, medicare, on most issues. The republicans and democrats have actually been quite moderate. I wish republicans or democrats would be more extreme on some of those issues. And of course im against many of the extreme things if they propose. But no, i dont think republicans have gone through a realignment. Theyve always been, you know, im a libertarian. I want free markets. I want low taxes. I want to cut Social Security and medicare. Republicans never do that stuff. And democrats as well. You know, i want to end the wars Civil Liberties in the war on drugs and democrats never seem to get that done either. Ok, well you know, when i think its really kind of interesting have been is that when you look at like medicare for all in issues like that the, theres many, if you look at the polls among republicans, a lot of people are for, i mean, i find it really, really quite remarkable that even if you look at it instead of just, you know, blue or red, you know, if you just look at people, theres actually a lot of consensus about what people want. But you know, in your party, you know, when you have, you hire all the candidates in the primaries for medicare for all. And then you give it the nomination to the guy and doesnt want it. Ok. And then also, you know, and so on. We had trump, he talked about this in 2016, but once he got into power, well, we cant do that. Ok. I mean, i find it just really remarkable. Its the Party Structures that are the problem. Its not the people, the people are not the chloral. Theyre not deplorable on either side because both sides really want a lot of the same things. Go ahead. Yeah. Youre also shady. Oh so you know, over have people when asked out to support it. We saw you before, all care are yes, people or obamacare overwhelmingly say you support the Affordable Care act. They say they do messaging and know it. I agree, like i heard recently, were talking about the Georgia Senate race coming your way. The slogan here, you know, like the police and green you dont medicare for all. Sometimes its no laughing erms turn left again. I didnt come from the left sometimes turn or built a wall or something. And you know, you have, you know, i mean, happens on both sides of the slogans. And of course, people away they are right for me. Most people agree that yes or should be secure, should just write back and forth easily. We talk about, you know, building a wall, i have to be a wall on earth when you know that turn, so do it. And it just shows how, how divided really are if i am president by you know, in terms of what i find really very, very disappointing. I consider myself a conservative, dont i . , i dont always think very much of the g. O. P. , but i think it was a real mistake on the left just to make it about donald trump because all 3 of you talk about policy. But they didnt seem to be in the campaign all that much beyond sloganeering. Ok. And, and i think theres going to be a huge hangover, particularly on the left. You know that like what do we do now . Remember the candidates still in the 870. 00 . What do we do now . Because, you know, it was all focused on one man and that one man did amazingly well. He probably didnt win. It probably wont be inaugurated. Or you cant ignore that mass movement. Now im for a realignment, its in the cards because trump ran as a populist and he governed as jeb bush. Thats my disappointment. Go ahead and yeah, you know, i think that just to go back to the previous question, i think that the Republican Party absolutely does need to, you dont do one thing going from going so well on his, he was not this, you know, warhop, republican president , people were so sick and while i think medicare for all isnt popular, people do recognize in america that we need to have coverage for things like preexisting conditions. And you know, to talk about that a lot. So i, for one, i just want to go on the record and say, i do think the Republican Party, we do need to change when it comes to things like those issues that are more populist then kind of the traditional conservative view that just isnt that popular when you look at the margins of the president last with millennial as well as women suburban women by but you know, going forward, i think look at all comes down to georgia and what happens in the senate races there. If we republicans can hold on to the u. S. Senate, its going to be a lot different conversation that were having in january. That if democrats do, you manage to get the senate as well as joe biden, you know, is confirmed as president. You know, wes is a libertarian. I, i have to probably think that youre, youre probably just as sick and tired of this woke up politics, rhetoric that just sucks all the air out of the room. When it comes to issues that affect all people, when youre sick, it doesnt remotely, doesnt matter if youre a republican or democrat or a libertarian. Go ahead with us. Well, if youre talking about health care in particular and this applies to other issues when, when Ronald Reagan was running for president , he used to say government is the problem, not the solution. And he would spend quite a bit of time explaining how free markets and freedom orc donald trump is not really a reflexive, really libertarian leaning, or for small government or for free markets. And so for the last 4 years, he hasnt spent any time educating and training the people and especially republicans themselves on, you know, what does it mean . How does freedom work with, with free markets, with less regulation, with lower taxes. How would it be easier for people to pay for their own health care and less . You know, if i can interrupt you here, the day that donald trump was most unpopular as president is the day he signed his tax bill, because most people didnt see that it affected them whatsoever. And its because hes surrounded by libertarian people thinking people in his administration, and i think that was when one of his greatest mistakes. Thats my opinion. How do you react to the well, if you lower taxes, but you dont lower spending, then it doesnt accomplish much. Should just shift the burden away from the people who get the tax cut and as to everyone else who suffers from inflation. Donald trump, you raise spending from 4000000000 to 7, looks in one direction. It keeps going up. Were. Its amazing, republican or democrat, its kill, continues to do that and i think thats, you know, i think when we see what we have here, kevin is a middle class revolt. I mean, you have the choice, you can go blue or you can go red. But both, all are angry about this. Ok, i personally, i think government should do things for people looking. This is the choice we have right now to fund the police and, you know, lets just rhetoric, it doesnt mean anything when i get probably hurts people, the poorest people of our society. I mean, it really gets onto an attitude about what kind of how government should be used because its going to be used because theres, there is no doubt that that is they can 80209010 issue, go ahead. Why people overwhelmingly disagree, even in inner city neighborhoods. Oh, black voters and black and withdrew from a feared, at least they dont. They dont support it. Or they do support of moving some resources to go just for traditional policing. And maybe, you know, social workers, Mental Health programs, a version programs, things like that, which i think a lot of people do squirm when its explained to them as you or our president trying to explain it to dont exactly say least. So it happened though, both sides and i, i do believe its interesting because you talk about spending it seemed to go up. Didnt really hurt down ballot. Very Susan Collins to be on the number of one pretty easily. I mean, we were both in the early summer actually, you know, on hold down here, were going to go to a hard break and enter the card. Continue our discussion on the results of the 2020 elections. By the pandemic. No, certainly no borders and just plotting to nationalities doesnt work. We dont like seeing world peace people coming close is we can do better, we should be everyone is contributing to each other on way. But we also know that this crisis go on forever. The challenges create the response has been so many good people are helping us. It makes us feel very proud that we are in it together. A new gold rush is underway in ghana. Thousands of ill equipped workers are flocking to the gold fields, hoping to strike it. Rich. Here is a good day over the children are torn between gone from me was very poor. I thought i was doing my best to get back to school. Which side will have the strongest appeal welcome back to crossfire where all things are considered. Im Peter Lavelle to remind you were talking about the results of the 2020 election. Ok, lets go back to end on here. I mean, i kind of have a diagram. I mean, for the program here of what the Democratic Party is right now. Its woke corporate america, the super rich and the professional women managerial class. Now if this isnt an opening to create a big tent for the Republican Party, i dont know what is, are you going to take that opening the lane is why wide open . Are you going to grasp it is . I think it could work. Yeah, no, absolutely. I mean, if you go back to the eightys and ninetys, when you know conservative talk radio was really thriving and you know, Rush Limbaugh was, you know, building his audience and the extreme fringes of the country. But they were viewed by the middle worse always the right. It was always, you know, the right wing that was viewed in a lot of people became moderate democrats because they were so turned off by that, you know, socalled radical right. Now when you look at a o. C. , an ill han and a far left there is this enormous opportunity for this populist movement for donald trump and republicans to say, oh look word the mainstream or the moderate. Were the center right party. And we can build on that, and i sure hope that you know, we have enough people, our party can realize that. But, you know, unfortunately, im going to be all this because im a, i call balls and strikes. And i think there are a lot of people, the Republican Party who dont recognize how. So its very obvious to me that youre right. Someone like Susan Collins manages to win in blue states and then you have other, you know, people like a growing more who are, you know, terrible candidates. They cant even win a red state. And thats what, you know, the fringes on both sides never realize that these far left far right candidates are never going to actually, you know, i, you know, be popular beyond their little base of people. You know, when one of the issues that is always talked about is hardly ever dealt with, i mean that the amount of money spent on this election cycle is just absolutely phenomenal. It is just it blows your in. In South Carolina, South Carolina alone, Lindsey Grahams home. He was, its the most Expensive Senate seat ever campaign or here. I mean, i wish if we took the money out of the equation here, how would it change our politics . Because its, you know, we have a republican and we have a democrat on the program and we have you and everyone knows my beliefs here. But if you took the donor class out of this, we would have a very different politics wittingly. Im not so sure thats the case i. Theres been many examples over the years of candidates spending millions or hundreds of millions of dollars in primaries and even in general elections. And that money only seems to affect the outcome by a couple of percent. I of course, i wish the government was less important, so people were less interested in spending so much money to win an election were regardless of which side theyre on. But i dont think the money, you know, you, you can spend money and get a certain policy pass. It allows you now to do a lot of Construction Projects and you personally profit from that. But a lot of what goes on, i dont think has a lot of impact on the election results. So look, so the money, the total money doesnt really scare me. It up when you look upstream. I mean, this is all an investment. Ok. I mean, there are so many things like ending foreign wars. I mean, that is a genuinely popular thing. Thing weve had 3 election cycles. You have 3 election cycles in a row, you know, saying end the war. But if joe biden is elected president is inaugurated as president january, i dont think thats going to change or why . Because of the donor class. I mean, i agree with you, i should have phrased my question, better about camp, you know, getting elected, you know, but essentially, you know, they have a end to both parties. That is, its such a cool, a corrosive thing because you can have an 80209010 issue. But once it gets to the very top, its the donor class that makes that decision to make though that a campaign year. Because thats an issue that both parties, including the libertarian party, probably thinks about. Go ahead. Evan. Absolutely, and ross are on it were maybe years rates over 100000000, you know, pretty handily. And, you know, either early to consultants, one consultants, consultants going to be millionaires were minted in that region. Oh, yeah, exactly where somebody trying to restart their mind can try to raise a lot of money to mainly from outsiders and not get close to folks oversee it in a lot of states. Mentioned order a couple times. Its only going to get worse. You know, next month. Sure, sure. Outsiders coming in, but i think the takeaway is that it doesnt tell me now from lindsey graham, i want a certain kind of, they know their states better than these outsiders or even money is i think it turns off, you know what youre referring to, were you know the sarge talking about, they know it was better to find some who were and just buy these races learn from that. And if its all going to be here on the outside money thats for sure and time. Sometimes republicans win. Sometimes, democrats win sometimes and independent wins, but the consultants always agree and it will always remain. I find it really, really awful. Ok and, and, and its the same thing. The only skin these people have in the game is their pocketbook. And i think thats really, that really corrodes politics and so on. Youre the republican on the party and im not going to let you off the hook here. Im looking at the results here and im looking across the board except for an end of an educated white man and i thinking, putting educated women the Republican Party didnt phenomenally well of best since 1960 before the civil rights act. Ok, what is the Republican Party going to learn from that . Because im sorry, republicans can be very thoughtful, but they dont take on board something that is given to him on a silver platter. Here, this is a refund, nominal result. How many seats you pick up in the house of representatives . Probably keep the senate. This is, this is a maybe not a way, but its certainly a strong ripple in t