The left today because as i said in my introduction its moved very far away from that go ahead. Well the traditional definition of course is that the left is in favor of progress and the right seems in favor of reaction no conservation and more generally i think the left is in favor of universal values wheres the right is more interested in particular values but theres no doubt that what you say in your introduction is absolutely right the left is changed a lot previous nate used to be interested in much more concrete things like. You know incomes and faction conditions and Living Conditions and health and things like that and one gets the impression in fact its more than impression im absolutely convinced that the left is instead now transmogrified into something completely different it has been completely consumed now certainly in europe and in north america by its highly metropolitan very fashionable internationalist. Elements which are the reasons why its more interested now in the kind of. Virtues signaling and identity politics that you mentioned in your introduction has lost touch with its own electorate he has become as i say much more metropolitan much more privileged to be honest because very often hi aaron as a left wing theres a huge left wing dominance for example in the business and political circles that are currently meeting or eventually anywhere else the title storeroom is for my points of view a very Left Wing Organization although that might surprise some people to hear it because it embrace embraces all kinds of nest wing things like a College System and internationalism and transhumanism and so on so basic intellect with its interest in change and its obsession i would say that change has now moved on to new postures and has has indeed whats next behind the old election and sure to find how do you really get another word its about a lot of us who has privilege and i saw susan rice yesterday. Announced the obama administrations. Regulations about how its going to proceed and she stresses you know marginalized group that she isnt an amazingly privileged person and good for her ok very well educated here but a lot of working class people of all colors are not very privileged ok i mean how do you how do you of course in privilege and i am very confused by that well i think that simply because she is someone who is from i guess what we would call a privileged middle class background that doesnt mean that shes not committed to people who are from a different background who for in working class because im originally from a working class background but some people could argue that i live a privileged life as a woman with a ph d. A University Professor but nevertheless that does not mean that even though you have an education even though you live in a nice neighborhood or you make a certain income that doesnt mean that you cant work in the community and that you cant serve people who are poor and working class and i think with someone like susan rice shes overly qualified shes educated shes going to have a tremendous amount of experience in both Foreign Policy and domestic policy and thats something that joe biden has been impressed with as president obama was also when he was president and as a result of all those qualities i think that she is the kind of person who is going to serve her were not doubting her credentials i know that i dont compound salut les ok image has a very long career. And for some people distinguish for others not ok but spencer if i can pull you in here i mean but she did and when i listen to her speech i listen to very clear carefully there that theres no hint of class ok i mean its looking at marginalised people i would say there are tens of millions of marginal highspeed people in the working class of all races ok but she didnt cut she didnt give that indication and i find that to be rather disturbing because a lot of people might say. Well i may have the privilege but as defined by others but that privilege hasnt translated into a lifestyle that a certainly a privileged person would have by that definition i guess go ahead spencer well there are multiple interesting strands in this discussion and i agree with the critique of part of the left that it has tended to become kind of a technocratic a leaf that has lost touch with its working class roots i think thats a fair critique of part of the left but the left is not a monolith just like the right is not a monolith and also just like really if were talking about recent developments in us politics its not really a left right divide anymore its more a divide between nationalist populism and enlightenment liberalism with a small al which includes moderate conservatism. Susan rice by the way is a fantastic person and i know that she has a concern for people of all kinds this suppose a divide between the White Working Class and you know members of the working class of other colors i think is a red herring thats often thrown up by people on the right to try to fuel exactly that same kind of racial resentment and cultural resentment that divides the working class against itself. They issue of helping the working class as i say is not monolithic and if you look at other parts of the left for example people often overlook voices like reverend al sharpton or reverend William Barber the head of the Poor Peoples Campaign theyre constantly talking about the interests of working people as is President Joe Biden which i think is very clear from his 1st week or so in office so as i say there is a critique of the left that part of it has become kind of elitist and focused on these important issues i would say important issues like equity but they are kind of a luxury for people who are struggling to get not have to work equity years are going to john here i mean maybe equity translate translates politically into oppressor and victim ok and thats the buy. Mary that keeps being played and for me thats just a political cudgel ok because you know they White Working Class is not necessary for the Democratic Coalition right now thats why they dont care about ok because it if theyre not part of their coalition so why invest resources and them and again you know when we go down this theres an equity thing which i am and im for much of for equality because thats more makes a lot more sense to me but everybody seems to be a cover for something go ahead john well i think its going much further really its not just the democratic policy or on the left wing policies have neglected the working child so moved on to Something Else its that precise need be language solved you know looking off to the people who could be neglected is instead being taken out by the populist right that was the whole period deal of trumps and it was always the hillary sense who called the trumps the polls is deplorable so it wasnt just that they wanted to make in they in their former electorate they actually came to hate the or at least came to hate balance of some of their political views weve seen this in britain as well have the contempt shown by many of the metropolitan left wing elite for rex it votes its for example very often a caricature of the way but its the same kind of thing as Hillary Clintons deplorable zx so thats why i say i think the left has changed really beyond the recognition you know the idea speaker was saying people are looking up to working folk and all the rest of it thats all fine but thats exactly what hes nuts not not now happening yes the left maybe approach me with that but im talking about the people actually in power the government the people who form the elite say of the Democratic Party they are not doing anything for ordinary people quite the country they despise them and they are pursuing instead of social reform or another with the courses instead they have to seeming pursuing motivation and highly questionable identity politics including transgender and governors what else. Not to mention opposite to the whole race issue in america and these seem to me to be profoundly different from what we had before you know sharon and. Joe biden saying he wants to reach out to to to to all americans but at the same time you know they dont people who will say you know in his 1st week in office he killed thousands and thousands of jobs and im not taking issue on that pipeline one way or another but i mean if youre if youre. In the working class and you see that the 1st thing he talks about is cutting jobs quitting 2nd Sexual Identity with gender which a lot of people have a very hard time dealing with that issue here and a lot of that comes from people is that it is an executive order what can it go to congress and let people debate it ok because theres no debate its just done and they and again its these creating these cleavage is that you know up again i always thought of the left as being a broad church that would be concerned with everyones interests here but it seems to be very unilateral and i think that divides people more am i wrong on that go ahead i would say youre wrong in the sense. I think that the left is inclusive and i think with joe bidens executive orders hes just trying to do things that really in his opinion should have been done a long time ago and so in the sense of immigration and a lot of other things that hes done just in these 1st few days and then also as far as the comment about killing jobs i dont think thats true either in the sense that he knows most americans are very much concerned with unemployment and the economy and want the economy to be stable again and thats one of the things hes trying to do but i think since hes only been in office for a few days its hard to really judge him but i dont agree with some of the things that i have heard about the left because i think the left is very inclusive and i think by them including people like people who are members of the l. G. B. T. Q. Community those are people who have never really been included before and so. I think that he really is trying to address rice for everyone including people who traditionally have been excluded it was spencer that you know the issue of immigration was brought up i mean during a pandemic and economic turndown theres going to be an opening of the borders and i say that kind of loosely i mean is that inclusive because you know again you know not being a trump supporter myself im a conservative on that and i dont even support the g. O. P. Ok but you know its hard for me to wrap my head around you know during an economic turndown and a pandemic you want to start having a much looser immigration policy thats why a lot of people voted for trump in the 1st place. You know really i think this is a series of straw man arguments were hearing here and there as i say there is a fair critique of parts of the left on various dimensions but that doesnt mean that the worst examples we can find of extreme behavior on the left characterizes the entire left and this is the same force asked we use of the last week yeah well again you know again where it is so if were talking about extreme you know Political Correctness and extreme Council Culture and or extreme examples of arrogance towards working people i agree those are problems that exist but they certainly dont characterize the entire left which is actually as sharon says a very Inclusive Party that of course is concerned about the fate of working class white people just as its concerned about the fate of all working and middle class people this is a Artificial Division that gets exploited by the nativist populist right to divide the working class as far as immigration goes down there is a false a false its a false one action rate oh go back you will be returned youre going to get a hard right not to get you when you start politics they are. The pandemic no certain you know born is just blind to nationalities. That you are as it were we told that with everybody we dont have the facts the whole world needs to think and be ready for. Judging. Commentary because this is the president and want to. We can do better we should not do better. Everyone is contributing to their own way but we also know that this crisis will not go on forever the challenges created with the response has been massive so many good people are helping us. And it makes us feel very proud that were in it together. Right now there are. People who are overweight or obese its the 4th little self. And sugary and salty and the big. Its not at the individual level its not individual willpower and if we go on believing that never change this obesity epidemic that industry has been influencing very deeply the medical and scientific establishment. So whats driving the obesity epidemic its. Imax keyser one more of my guide to financial survival this is a hedge fund is a device used by professional scallywags to earn money. Thats right these has flaws are simply not accountable and were just adding more and more to them. Totally destabilize the Global Economy you need to protect yourself and get informed watch has a. Secret prisons are not usually what comes to mind when thinking about europe however even the most prosperous can be deceived within the zeros on the work to view houses were allowed to preserve was located only c. R. U. People had access to the story from investigators she held the uncovered the darkest dealings of the secret services but i mean. You grated nor in. Sore need your sort of. Crying for justice. Well good to cross up here all these are considered i find you were talking about i get a cherry in politics. Ok lets go back to monterrey spencer i interrupted you before we went to the break please continue sure and to get to immigration again unfortunately thats no nationalist right which is what i would say trump ism is its i agree with you that it has very little to do with traditional conservatism it really makes no sense as conservatives are not i think if i could interrupt the ethno i mean trying to groom his support among minorities in 2020 that is you know refutable solely i wish we could be a little bit more careful with words ok unless people of color are voting against their own interests i mean i have a hard time believing that police and i think you know if we when we see people waving Confederate Flags and wearing auschwitz t. Shirts and storming the capitol and we sowing the proud boys in the vanguard and and we see trump fanning racism since before he declared with the birth or is a conspiracy lie i think we have to consider the case closed that thats a White Nationalist element thats very strong and trump ism and if you trace back the history of what trumps demagoguery as i do in my book patriots in 2 nations if i could mention that back to the founding of a country in the countering lightman it is classic classic ethno nationalist demagoguery and we could talk about why there were rises in support among some latinos and some africanamericans but its not at all indicative of what youre suggesting its probably another topic for that requires a more detailed discussion absent release which adds light room that you have nations right here and john has pointed out already john harris right now theyre theyre still going to laurels and theyre always going to be deemed deplorable and they didnt you know so and that every Single Person that voted for donald trump carries a Confederate Flag again i cannot get john right now i know and you know at home they all put on their klan outfit ok i mean this is a character sure is well and i want to keep going with class and he told the way i called your go ahead joe. Well i think im sorry to i dont want to be rude but i think it is what weve just had is a soto is an example really of the. I thought i would use the word hate filled but i would be very rude indeed but this the left is always portraying its enemies as evil and you know weve just heard stuff about outfits t. Shirts you know they go in the goldwyn movement has has come pretty quickly in this debate and this is what gets the left its terrible force and i say this with Great Sadness as a conservative because i do think that unfortunately perhaps its the nature of conservatism but i find that we are always on the defensive and where we basically observe one defeat after another trump is only the latest even though 1 may have great with you peter the trump is just expect a classic conservative but the fact is that the left has won again and again and again and i think it is because of this this this im sorry to say this but i think this hatred of the other side which is what makes the left get up in the morning is what makes them. Want to live its what they believe the left believes that it is fighting dragons that it is fighting these evil people all over the place and thats what gets the left what c. S. Lewis called that hideous strength and that hideous strength unfortunately i think is engulfing a soul on both sides of the atlantic you know sharing the issue of tolerance that was another hallmark of the left that i remember and lived through and obviously have studied here and im very i think thats the this Chilling Effect of big tech amplifying this intolerance of speech here i mean i would like to think all of us speaking on this program right now thinking the best way to get rid of bad ideas is to push and convince people with good ideas but if we cant have that debate then how can we find the best ideas and best ideas where we can find. Consensus because so many people on the conservatives and recently in the last few weeks a lot of populists and and people further to the left theyre finding themselves being canceled or suppress i mean all my position is and i im sure john will be certainly that will agree with me is that this neal liberal radical center has been a failure 1st so many people and now be taken once to make sure that they can control the narrative because if they dont then these people in power will never be held accountable because we cant debate them issues doesnt that bother you that you know you you and you may not have the best idea because it was never debated go ahead cher well i think that when i think about some of the things that are going to happen of course which were in facebook i think some people would look at that as a form of censorship but i think they only took these efforts especially whic