Testimony today please raise your right hand . Do you swear the testimony youre about to give is the truth to the best of your knowledge . I do. Okay. Thank you. And i would just like to state for the record that the department will present its case first, and then, the appellant. Each side has seven minutes to present their case. Next, theres Public Comment, and members have three minutes each to speak. Lastly, theres rebuttal time of three minutes for the department, and then the appellant. And i also wanted to just read, as everyone knows, we are having a Public Meeting via teleconferencing. The number to call in is 1, 4084189388. The meeting i. D. Is 1464083349. To raise your hand to speak on a specific agenda item, press star, three to notify the meeting monitor. The next item is item c, approval of minutes. Discussion and possible action to adopt the minutes for meetings held on september 16, 2020. Move to approve. Clerk is there a second . Second. Clerk and who did the second . Hem. Clerk is there any Public Comment on the approval of the minutes . Operator theres no Public Comment. Clerk are all commissioners in favor . Any opposed . Then the minutes are approved. Our next item would be item d, continued appeal, order of abatement. Case number 6875, 2455 jackson street. Owner of record and appellant, nancy ryti and bob korman, 3450 sacramento street. Action requested by appellant, that the order of abatement of reversed. And i believe chief hernandez will be presenting for the department. Okay. Good morning, everyone. My name is mauricio hernandez, chief building inspector of the building department. [inaudible] before adding new story, coviolations, and permit code violations, and permit vieition las. An inspector attempted to visit the site on september 4, 2019, and to inspect the veracity of the complaint. On 10819, a notice of violation was issued [inaudible] that he has told him that hes not in in the office and has stated that the engineers working on consolidating permit said has just informed me that the engineer has been absent for 11 months. A notice of violation was actually written up. Mr. Korman was [inaudible] before reviewed plans, and determined the extent of the work taking place. On november 7, 2017, a notice was issued that the owner failed to comply. On november 26, 2018, the case was amended to reflect that the Site Condition as the inspector visited the site, and [inaudible] d. B. I. Also confirmed that the work has been done on the lot, including a new roof structure, infill light structure on [inaudible] and living space. On 8202019, the case was heard [inaudible] and a hearing was granted by the hearing officer. On september 24, 2019, the case was heard at the director ease hearing again, and a 30day advisory notice by the hearing officer to state that all permits required full compliance must be filed and completed within 30 days. So at that time, the 30day advisory was given, and order of agreement was issued based on the fact that the owner has not complied with the notice. At this time, Code Enforcement is requesting to uphold the order of abatement for all of the assessment of costs. Just to interject, and i dont mean to rudely interrupt, i id object to the notice of violation and move to strike it. Clerk okay. Mr. Hernandez, are you done . Yes. Clerk okay. Mr. Korman, you can state what your case and state what youd like. Thank you. Wed ask that the notice of abatement be rescinded because its essentially infirm. There was multiple levels of hearsay that were submitted. This process was very similar to the process today where mr. Hernandez just read a case summary prepared by staff. That says come repreparprepare and it doesnt say who inspected the alleged violations and who said what things, so theres insufficient evidence to support the directors finding or any finding today. In addition, theres one additional problem. As youre aware, the staff report indicates, mr. Korman applied for a permit on october 31, 2018 specifically to address the issues in the notice of violation. For whatever reason, in the system tracking system and i just want to make sure that im referring to it correctly, this is the supplemental exhibit to a, this is a screen shot of your permit tracking system, and attached to that screen shot is a pop up from the department of building inspection that says do not issue the permit, do not issue any permit without e. I. P. Review. Mr. Korman has tried to get a permit. Hes submitted plans, and the record shows that. Those plans will address all the issues in the n. O. V. , but for whatever reason, he hasnt acted on that permit in over two years. So mr. Korman has done everything he can do to comply with what the department has asked him, but the department 1i67 simply has failed to act on the plans that we submitted. Thank you. Clerk next, there would be Public Comment. If there are any members of the public that would like to speak . If so, press star, three. Mr. Cannon, are you aware if mr. Korman is going to speak or if hes just listening to todays hearing . My screen shows that hes called in. Does your screen show that hes there . Clerk my screen shows several attendees, but no one has raised their hands to speak. Oh, theres one person who wishes to speak. Caller, you are on the line. Hello, can you hear me . Yes. Yes. Hi, everybody. My name is bob korman, and im calling in. Okay. I can go ahead and speak. I just want to thank the board for having the hearing, and i just want to consider everything that mr. Cannon has said, and i want you to know that im interested in getting this permit issued. Excuse my voice. I met a couple of times with richard tam. He was very cordial and asked me to submit new plans, and i did through my engineer. I even went to the new building on august 10, 2020, and met with a gentleman named gary love, and he accepted all of my second and third i think iterations of plans, structural, and i didnt have the second or third or fourth iterations of calculations, and they were given to me by mr. Allegria in early september, and i mailed them by Certified Mail to mr. Tam. I never received a green card back. They were mailed by Certified Mail, so ive done everything can to comply, and im still waiting for the permit to be issued, and i believe the language in the permit application 201810314687 plus the attending exhibit, which should have been submitted to planning, which describes the project review application form, that the plans and permit are being submitted to comply with the notice of violation 201888993. Ive done everything that i can, and im still very patiently waiting to have the permit reviewed and issued the permit application reviewed and issued, and i would respectfully ask that the board consider everything that mr. Cannon has said, and everything that mr. Cannon has supplied, and i look forward to asking this issue rectified in an expeditious manner because this project has been waiting. Because of the stop work orders, theres a lot of water damage into the building, and more damage has occurred because of the delay of 25 months. I want to thank you for your time, and i apologize that i didnt understand the instructions. I was told to press star, not star, three, but i finally figured it out. I thank you for your time and your consideration and your patience, and stay healthy, and thank you. Im done. Thank you for your testimony, mr. Korman, and thank you for being here today. Madam secretary, does that conclude Public Comment or is there anyone else in the queue . Operator theres no one else in the queue. Okay. Commissioners, if theres nothing else clerk oh, i thought i unmuted myself. We have to go to rebuttal. The department has rebuttal for three minutes, and the appellant has rebuttal for three minutes. So the violation was confirmed on november 16, 2018, by the building inspector. He did confirm the work that was done. I just want to point out that, since through the whole process, mr. Korman has and i dont want to say difficult, but he has been sending a lot of sunshine requests. That only affects my staff, and we have provided about 400 copies of the same folder and file. So Code Enforcement has actually been helpful as much as we can. As you can see, this case started in 2018. I understand whats gone on with the planning process and things, but the history of this property goes back to 2010. There was a case back in 2010, and mr. Korman disputed that case. Theres a lot of history on this property. Permits go expire and renewal. At the moment, this property is vacant, so as you can imagine, we have neighbors calling us. At one point, we had a piece of plywood covering the roof had fell off, and we had to send an inspector out there to make sure that other nearby properties werent damaged, so i just want to point that out. Clerk thank you. That concludes your rebuttal . Yes. Thank you. I would object to any of that rebuttal. That constitutes hearsay. Mr. Hernandez doesnt have personal knowledge of any of that information. Mr. Korman has been trying to get a permit issue, and for whatever reason, the city has refused to issue the permit. If the city would look at his documents and work with mr. Korman, everybody could Work Together to get this problem solved. Thank you. Clerk okay. Thank you. That concludes rebuttal, then president alexandertut can take over. Thank you. So i wanted to ask one clarifying question to chief hernandez, and thank you for your presentation does today. Can you confirm i know you said it again. Can you confirm the dates that d. B. I. Inspectors went to the property and saw the violations . So on our records, we have 112618 and thats when we observed all the violations. There is also pictures of the work that was not included under the scope of the work. Theres multiple sky lights. Theres a light well thats installed. Theres a roof deck being built that is not in the original plans, so theres more extensive work that was done without the benefit of a Building Permit. And i dont mean to interrupt, just to make sure the records clear through the chair yeah, yeah. So you will have a chance to rebut any questions that we ask. However, to have order in this hearing and make sure that everybody can hear each other because we are in a virtual space you know, we will give each party an opportunity to respond, but im going to ask for no objections or interruptions while people are speaking, but you will have a chance to respond. Thank you. Im sorry. Please cannot, chief hernandez. So as you can see in the pictures, there is extensive work, like i said, you know, and the inspector did confirm the violation in november 26, 2018. Okay. Thank you. Madam chair, i have a question, please. Thank you. Commissioner mccarthy . Inspector hernandez, what i so know youve said what the charge is here, but the permit, the violation in front of us today is for work done without a permit. Now you went through a list of that work there. Is that a part of this violation . For example, you said there was a deck there. For exceeding the work there. There was a permit, which is what were here in front of us today, its for work exceeded. Yes, yes. Can you tell us what work exceeded . Its adding extensive work, sky lights and creation of a roof deck and living space on the top floor. So this is what was found to be not permitted to do. Yes. Just so my notes are clear, that date was from 2018. Yes, from november. And then, that violation was issued to the appellant then, is that correct . Thats correct. And then, sometime in 2019, we had the hearing, correct . Correct. And in that 2019 hearing, a comment was made, it was almost the whole hearing was hearsay. It had nothing to do with anything. What what can you can you address can you get me to understand why he would go to a hearing that had nothing to do with anything and why we were bringing him in because there was nothing to be talked about . So unfortunately, i dont know how to talk to that. You might want to talk to his Legal Advisor. I believe mr. Cannon is his second or third Legal Advisor on this matter, but i was not there at the hearing. There was no application filed in 2019 to address any of those violations, is that correct . Correct, yeah. Okay. Thank you. No more questions, madam secretary or madam chair. Okay. Thank you. Im just going to call down to the commissioners, and there will be an opportunity, as well, to hear from the appellant. Vice president tam. Yes, hi. I guess this question i have a question for mr. Cannon. I know mr. Korman mentioned this conversation in his statement, that he had since submitted plans and is working with d. B. I. To get permits. Can you confirm that . Yes, i confirmed that the original permit was filed on october 31, 2018. Theres been back and forth with planning on that. On the first day that planning opened for business this year, i believe it was august 16, mr. Korman hand delivered a second set of plans to address the notice of violation. The second notice set of pl addressed all the items in the notice of violation. [inaudible] exceeded the levels of the prior issued permits. There have been a total of 96 permits issued on the building, and no one has specifically said which permit exceeded the school of which work exceeded the scope of which permit. So aside from the [inaudible] highlight buildouts and infills and roof decks [inaudible] from the top floor . Excuse me. I didnt quite hear that. So aside from the most recent set of plans submitted, any previous set of plans submitted address a sky light buildout or light well infill or a deck buildout on the top floor . Its my understanding that previous permit applications did in fact address those as part of the seismic retrofit. Thank you. So i have a question, madam chair. Yes. So is it your testimony that permits exist, for example, that show the outdoor deck on the roof deck. Its my testimony that no one showed what work exceeded any particular permit, and it is my belief that there is an outdoor roof deck. I believe that is a mischaracter sedation of one of the neighbors complaints, and thats what im saying about the misunderstanding by neighbors, and you have photos by neighbors. Nobody has any confirmation of those, and there just simply isnt any roof deck. Okay. Thats a good point. Inspector hernandez, are you aware of the plans submitted . Do you have any records of what those plans show . Yes. We looked at the plans briefly, and like i said, i mean, heres the problem, mr. Korman. If you even look at the permit application, i think we actually added them. The amount of work that hes putting in, his 2,000 worth of work, we have tried to work with him and tried to explain to hem that evaluation was one of the issues. Second, i dont know if mr. Cannon has actually walked the property, but in fact, i know they keep claims that these are allegations by the neighbors. My inspector was actually there. The building inspector was actually there in 2018 to assess that it was actually a violation. We had to amend the notice of violation so we reflect the existing conditions. We do have a set of plans that reflect some of the work, but still, some of the work is missing, and hes not add that go. So there is nothing there but a roof deck, for example, is that correct, mr. Hernandez . Yes. So do you know whats in that amended addendum plans that have been sent in . The new ones, no. I know there was a half set that was given to me, but again, he doesnt even show the infill of the light wells. He still shows as the existing third floor to keep that open space, and he already has that infill. It doesnt even show that on the plans. So the only thing that he added in those plans was the actual roof sky light. Okay. Yes, the popup, so thats all thats in there. Wyeah. Okay. Because ive seen a lot of exceeding the permits over the years because of a lot of popups, and that was my testimony last week is there has been a lot of confusion in the building world and the Development World is what is and isnt legal in popups in planning, so i can see where youd get an exceeding the permit on popups. So based on the plans that have been submitted, it doesnt address all the other no, it doesnt address for example, the light well enclosure, it doesnt address that. So youre going to be writing another notice of violation because it hasnt been addressed. Well, no, because it was in the original notice of violation, and he can always do another set of plans that show that. Okay. Thank you, madam chair. Okay. Im going to go to commissioner clinch. Do you have any questions . Yeah. I guess the big question is, why do we have 96 permits on this property, if i can ask that of the attorney. Mr. Korman has been working on this property less efficiently than he would like to for a long period of time, but he has been going and getting permits as needed, not acting as a scofflaw. There have been problems, but there have been problems on both sides, and you can tell one of the problems is that the city has refused to grant the permit, and mr. Hernandez just gave inconsistent representations when commissioner mccarthy asked him about the new set of plans, mr. Hernandez first said he had not even reviewed the new set of plans, and then, he started saying what was in the new set of plans. I do i have to interject and say, with 96 permits, i dont know how mr. Hernandez is able to keep them all straight. I would agree, yeah. So i think theres an issue that ill let others mr. Hernandez, in fact, speak to, if he prefers. No more questions from me. Thank you. Chief inspector hernandez, did you want to respond to that . Yeah. In my response, i dont know if we were actually talking about the plans presented to planning because at some point last month, mr. Korman came in with a half set of plans that gary didnt know what to do with. Unfortunately, thats how mr. Korman likes to operate. He likes to send in things by mail, and then allege that things were lost, and we get them and said hey, what are these set of plans for . We talked to him and asked him if he could come in and tell us hey, what these half set of plans are for . The ones that i reviewed is a half set of about ten pages, its just a few sheet showing the sky lights but nothing showing the enclosure of the light wells or the living space on the top floor or the roof deck that was being created. Thank you. Commissioner jacobo, do you have any questions . No. Id like to thank commissioner clinch and mccarthy for theirs. Im good at this time. Thank you. And commissioner moss . No comment. No comment at this time. Oh, im sorry. Can i ask a quick question of our City Attorney. I believe mr. Kormans hand is raised again. Since hes an appellant in this case, is he able to speak again . Good morning, commissioners. Brad russi from the City Attorneys office. Its