With the $3.00 increase in wages 1.8 percent above inflation that we continue to have more money in people's pockets and tributes are being paid to the former Labor minister Frank Dobson who has died at the age of 79 he was an m.p. In London for more than 3 decades as the news on 5 Live his delegate with the sport around him Sterling and Joe Gomez both trained with England this morning following their spats in the team canteen yesterday chemist sporting a mark on his right eye still it has been dropped for Thursday's euro 2020 qualifier against Montenegro but will be available to face Kosovo on Sunday caps and Andy Robinson along with Scott McDonald and Ryan Fraser I will withdrawn from the Scotland squad for the euro qualifies with Cyprus in Kazakstan Celtic's Luis Morgan Dobby midfielder Graeme Shinnie are added to the squad while said the Jonathan Davis will miss the 6 Nations he said to have surgery on his knee and has been ruled out for 6 months flyhalf Rhys Pacho could also miss most of the tournament he'll be sidelined for at least 3 months following show. And Roger Federer takes so much play about Seanie shortly at the a.t.p. Finals realistically needing a win to stay in the competition we'll cross live to the 8 to one at 2230 baseball Ownby to Ses k.s.i. But this law is going to head to the rematch. Was. It. Simply would. Be to. Dream the dream. Would be. Loosely. This is b.b.c. Radio 5 Live the on the b.b.c. Sounds awesome like I. Think it is 5 minutes past 2 and a very good afternoon to you. My next guest is an Afghan Canadian singer television host on show in Afghanistan and her nickname the Oprah of Afghanistan. He's a women's rights activist and I bug a fever of rebellion written by Roberta Starr is a fascinating insight into what it means to have no rights to have no voice but then to be adamant in that you should have a voice and that you have to a great personal cost and to be surrounded by armed bodyguards to be able to make a stand and we need more people in the world that we're willing to make a stand now I want to start with the day most the un very good afternoon to you welcome to the show by the way you so much for having me it's great to have you here most the Jamal's of the I want to start with a day you describe is probably the best day of your life seeing your mom sit next to Michelle Obama when you sang this song at the White House on International Women's Day. Long as. I am. Listening power of music tonight culture is to bring people together absolutely how musical music is a very powerful thing this event. Changed your life in so many ways to the White House yeah oh it was you know I don't even I don't know sometimes I think like Can anything ever top that for me. But it has. Brought you international recognition Absolutely and you know it wasn't really the White House it was who I was performing for and it was the Obama's That was a big deal for me because for the longest time I was just following everything that you know all the debates and the and the speeches and I was like one day I'm going to meet this man in person and you know 8 months later I get an email and they're requesting a song on International Women's Day and that completely changed my life and it kind of. It gave me that reassurance that people out there really are listening you know to get on that international level when as a young girl of this naive young hopeful girl wanted to make a difference somehow and you know I didn't have any interest in music but I went into it because I thought that the media is the strongest platform to get a message across and to say you know seeing all the struggles and the oppression that Afghan women were facing during the Taliban regime and even afterwards I just had that sense I had to do something and the media and music was the most powerful thing it's a good to reach the White House that was incredible what do you remember so this is the moment Ok And you just said this may be a moment in the life it will never be told I'm sure it will be there's no doubt about that but to get to the point from being a little girl I'm talking about 5 years old yes leaving Afghanistan. What do you remember of the journey of the feelings what was going through your head at that time you know being a 5 year old in a war zone you're a lot more grown up and you know a lot more than the average 5 year old kid you know that I might not be here to see tomorrow. Of the fall absolutely I had you know when I was playing in the playground with my cousin for example we would hear the rocket from far away and I would just make this sound that still haunts me and I just went through and we would cringe we would both just freeze and cringe because we're like where's it going to land where is it going to land and then we would hear it land and we just breathed You know in and out and were like not this time it didn't get us this time so for a 5 year old to already know that and then the journey I remember every bit of it and you know the way that it's been described in the book but what I didn't realize for the longest time was what my parents went through and to have a sense of what they went through and what they gave up you know I was 5 but they were adults and they left everything and they went into the end zone and they didn't know if if they were going to survive but during that journey I knew that we might not make it to Pakistan that we might get hit by you know there were there were planes flying above us and and the rain was just so dangerous so I was like were you know this truck could either fall over or we could get hit by. By one of those planes so it was at that age I already knew you know that I had that. Moving a 5 year old. By Harold should not be wondering if they're going to you know survive to see tomorrow but I did. I did wonder that actually when I was reading the book about what your parents went through the revelations that would be for you yes discovering that and how has that affected you knowing what they went through in order ultimately to give you a better life exactly this was a selfless act but it really was and I could see how it was all about us the kids and you know what while I was reading it there were a couple of times where I had to put the book down and I was just crying and it was very hard for me to get through the 1st few chapters of their story and their struggles and everything that they had to go through and I hadn't seen it that way and with the refugee crisis right now being the worst it's ever been in oh in the history of the world I think that it's really important that the story got told because. And the more people hear stories like this you know you see statistics and numbers but when you put a human face to it it really brings more awareness of what every all these refugees are going through constantly and so for me it was very important to and even gave me the realisation of you know what people go through when when they're leaving their home and their loved ones behind and they they have no idea what the future holds so it just gave me a completely different perspective and I appreciate them so much more and I take much less for granted because you know growing up in Canada you kind of forget and it just brought those memories back for me and made me realize what they went through because they had to pay off soldiers at checkpoints they were concerned about as you said planes flying over presumably banditry because it wasn't just your family there were a number of people trying to get across as. Same time was in there in your mother and you knew you were in the back of a bucket of trouble us well 1st of all when we were going to up to a certain point it was a bus and it was a bus full of families who were pretending to be villagers some were the real villagers among But you know the soldiers when they hopped on the bus they would know they could just see who is a real villager and who was pretending and we had to my my father had to keep paying them off and bribes. But yeah it's and then And then of course on the truck and then when we got on the truck it was the bridge I had seen so 1st it was the Soviets that we had to get through at the Soviet checkpoints then it was the majority and so it was just as a crazy crazy time a new mother had to dress in a one of those blue burkas to cover herself which was not a piece of clothing that she was accustomed to or not at all no my my mom you know she when she was young in her early years she would wear mini skirts and you know matching shoes and purses and they was all about fashion for her and such a European influence with with fashion in Kabul at that time so my mom was really not you know she had to pretend to be a village woman you know just obeying and respecting her husband walking 10 feet behind her husband like these are things that she wasn't used to and of course carrying our 6 month my 6 month old brother under that burka. It was it was very difficult for her. And you go to Pakistan and you finally get into a hotel know which has a what we say hotel I mean it was essentially oh yeah I mean this is not. But it was a place of luxury compared to what you've been through on that journey I mean that was the least running water in the bathroom yes and walls and then the windows that actually you know the that weren't broken and you know so the the cold and everything that we felt when we were seeing in these little shacks on the way to Pakistan was just unbearable especially for the kids and not having the proper source of food and water and anything and then all of a sudden we get some of that and you know just being able to I think that moment that we crossed into the Pakistan border and we're like we made it where alive we made it and now onwards with the journey where there was cheering it was a lot of cheering yes over from everybody it was just me I mean they were I remember my cousin and some of the younger people just running out of the truck and just you know exhaling and is even even though the air was different everything about it was different was just peace you know we finally felt peace and there was no question at any point of it feeling like an adventure you knew very much how dangerous it was even as a 5 year old what you were doing you understand why you were doing it. What we I definitely knew there was a war and I knew that you know we were not safe in Afghanistan as long as the war was happening and and of course fleeing I had no idea where we were going I didn't know what Pakistan was I didn't know what a border of a country was you know so none of that I didn't understand any of that I just trusted my parents I trusted my parents to get us where we need to be in so often the conversation about Afghanistan is a negative one yes but describe the beauty of Afghanistan issues in a post on Afghanistan you know what it looks like what it feels like the smells the energy the culture the music. I think I wonder what you love about your home. The one thing that comes to mind right away is the humanity and the hospitality and the love that you get from your fellow Afghans that's still there even after 4 decades of war the same thing that I remember from you know before escaping it's all still there that that love and that hospitality I feel like you know Afghanistan and there's there's no country like it when it comes to the people and the love that you get from them. But and how they treat outsiders as well they really treat them with love. Right in thinking the Pashtun way is that if a stranger comes to your house you want you to ground an honor bound yes to look after them not just a stranger your enemy steps into your house and the same rules apply so that's how how strong that is within within the Afghan community in general. And so in a you get that in its I always remember that magic about Afghanistan and the roses and the people in the and just the architecture and there's so much beauty in Afghanistan of course you know a lot of it has been damaged by the war and even people now I see have been damaged by the war of course with that many years of hardship and nothing else exactly and of course a lot of these refugees who have stepped out and been in refugee camps and you know coming back now into Afghanistan so they're bringing back different cultures and different. Different languages and things like that so it's just it's getting a little bit mixed up so the restrictions placed on females in Afghanistan. Is it a relatively new thing is it a reaction to the Soviet invasion and then the rise of the Mujahideen in the Taliban and in fact influences from without or is it something that has always been there. Because you mention of course your mother and how she used to dress and but that was the. Presumably Kabul elite was it not yes it wasn't rural Afghanistan it wasn't roulette wheel and there were places like no and I you know if you look at the rural parts of Afghanistan and the smaller the outskirts of the not that the major cities but outside of the major cities for a very long time there are. Many women are accustomed to wearing the burka and there are a lot of restrictions on women and you know but but I think Afghanistan used to be at 1 point one of the most liberal Islamic countries in the world and so the major cities were very westernized and their mentality and their lifestyle everything was very Western and they they actually love to being influenced by the West and Europe and while retaining their own culture yes and tradition Yes And so at one time during the Soviet invasion women were the most liberated the most I think they had the most power that they've ever had or the the most freedom that they've ever had and I think you know education was forced on both men and women to a certain up to a certain age and there were a lot of things that were but of course the invasion you know it was a war and so many lives were lost a lot of men lost their lives leading to the the Civil War after the u.s. Pulled out there was a civil war among those. Exactly so that's when that's when the restrictions started coming in for you know for women there were there were a lot more restrictions and then of course the Taliban came in it was just unlimited I mean the the oppression and the restrictions that woman faced were like I don't think it's ever been like that anywhere else in the world ever until I says kind of group Exactly yeah. You made your way to Canada and you were this. Afghani go in a predominantly white environment yes in the 1st place you lived in but you you kind of grew to become accustomed to that and you became I guess would you say you integrated or you were assimilated into Canadian coach. Because I'm making that kind of juxtaposition between You've been in. The us where they go I go and I go I show and to them going to Vancouver which was much more cosmopolitan yet much more but face different challenges so when you were there in Ontario did you assimilate or integrate I think I integrated but I don't think I ever fully felts integrated into the Canadian. Just just as a Canadian until until just recently Oh man I really didn't feel like I fit in ever and you know my heart and soul everything was in Afghanistan I felt like I was in done with Afghanistan I wanted to be there and so I was very angry with my parents and I was like why am I here and I want to be there but of course you know that I was angry with the situation I was unable to go back why I was unable to go back so the 1st chance that I I got Iran back over there and so now the fact that I'm able to go there I've you know that I've removed that anger and I know and I've managed to integrate into Canadian society as I'm able to go back now exactly Ok but then you moved to Vancouver and fascinating that you walked into your classroom and you suddenly saw Sikhs and people of color and you thought wow the whole if we did right thing good but like people that look like me yeah but they certainly. Kind of made you feel different again yes I mean I had I was facing a lot of racism in. There were amazing people as well but you know like I was being called Paki and my 3rd grade teacher was asking me to stand in the back of the line because I had the darkest hair that she's like you know the latest hair to darkest hair I'm like who does that and I had at that. Law even if he cheers I. Depend on my color of their hair and I was like at that age I know I was like this is wrong this is in your eugenics class. What Yeah I'll never forget you know it was just the adults and the kids and I was I was just being harassed left and right and it hurt it hurt every day I was going home going what happened what is happening like what even my teachers you know someone that I should be trusting to take care of me is putting me in the spot that way so it's very different in the back of the back of the line and then if I stood a little bit in the back there like no no you got black hair so you need to be all the way in the am like the only one with black I'm like well technically there's no such thing as black hair you know my darkest Brown maybe my gosh you had to go through that so yeah you go to my Cuban Yeah you and then everyone's Brown and Asian and yeah all but they're accusing you of being too preppy Yes So now I'm trying to fit in with these with this white culture and white people and small white town Oshawa Ontario and so I you know I had a young age you can mold yourself very well yeah and so I'm moving to this East Indian community and to the Asian community and now I'm to wait for them. No when quite lonely I mean yes in terms of finding a classroom on your own lunchtimes Yes I spent many lunch times alone I was and I was considered a nerd you know kids would the only time that kids when it interact with me was when they would pay me to do their homework or ask me to do their homework or ask me for help with anything schoolwork basically that's that's it yeah and that's shows immediately your tenacity this kid Dossie comes up to you and can you help a lot of the flaws I think it was I think so and. So yeah Ok you know immediately you go that cost you $5.00 yeah. And there was no hardly Iraq Oh no you know $5.00 was a pretty decent decent price is that we have my thing after is that the Afghan he says something about the culture. Well this is a commercial for sure my voice is actually about western capitalism. Well there's a lot of western capitalism. Influence in Afghanistan so that you know it's a little bit of both I guess but I don't I don't know I guess I just had that you know I was I was really insulted that the only time that somebody would talk to me is Oh do my homework so I'm like I have to get paid for this yeah sure when you're determined to get something out of exactly turned negative into a positive I mean how did your parents treat your need to return I mean this is a country that they fled from they were not happy they were very upset I think it took me 3 months when I when we got that phone call and I knew I had a chance to go back right away I was jumping up and down going I'm outta here ready to pack my bags and my parents were like absolutely not and so it took me 3 months to convince them and I said I need this I mean if I don't go if I don't do this if I don't go back home like I'm going to lose my mind probably end up in a mental hospital or worse and so they I mean it was it that was destroying you from the inside about not being able to return and it sounds like is the big question for anyone who is. A broad not because of choice but they're in a different environment. Well it was eating you I felt like I had left myself there and I just needed to go back I had left myself like my a part a big part of me back there and I was not able to move forward with my life here I was constantly miserable a