Because I want you for showing stop trying to limit the job Elijah katakana team in today's menu tomorrow's day story see you on the film's excellent show tonight from c n n on b.b.c. Radio 5 Live. So what happens down after the Foreign Office confirms that the u.s. Diplomats was involved in a phase and I sit in in the u.k. No longer has diplomatic immunity book is there of bringing her to Britain to be interviewed by the police also for the 1st time ever a human runs the marathon in under 2 hours with yeah we did it and here is Chevy de pong one of Europe's most wanted men and is not Jav he did phoned also for this morning's virgin books for in an hour's time it's been 2 and a half 1000 years in the making you know we're asking for the chin that delivers the best message what she delivers the best message you can text me from now on 8558 email up all night at b.b.c. Doc. Can join us directly for the phone in in an hour's time 180-859-0969 extension 3. Delivers the best message as you heard in the news the Foreign Office says a u.s. Woman who was involved in a fatal car crash in Northamptonshire no longer has diplomatic immunity because she's left the country 5 lives James Wickham is James this of course is about the case of 19 year old Harry Dunn who was killed remind us will app of yet Dotson he was as you say 19 when his motorbike collided with a car near Croton in Northamptonshire That was back on the 27th of August now police says c.c.t.v. Of the crash in which he died shows a Volvo traveling on the wrong side. The road that we know was driven by and secure listener she just left the base which is a u.s. Air Force communications station she's the wife of a diplomat was living there and returned to the u.s. After the collision apparently citing diplomatic immunity what is different that's a community all stems from the 1961 Vienna Convention So essentially what it says is that diplomats and their family members are a new from prosecution in their host country so long as they're not nationals of that country bought it does say that that immunity from prosecution can be waived by the state that has sent them so in this case that would be of course the United States now when there are around $22.00 and a half 1000 people in the u.k. You hold diplomatic immunity should be said most of them don't break the law bought if a diplomat is found to have broken the laws made or a big breach of the law there are certain things that the host country and in this case obviously Britain can do now let's go back to October 27th teen the vend Foreign Secretary Johnson now prime minister of course said in a written parliamentary answer that the Foreign and Commonwealth Office doesn't tolerate foreign diplomats breaking the law and when there are instances of alleged criminal conduct brought to our attention by the police we asked the relevant foreign government to waive diplomatic immunity where appropriate for the most serious offenses he said and whenever relevant waiver has not been granted we seek the immediate withdrawal of the diplomat. I say and. Do we know what's the response has been is there been any word from the Foreign Office apart from this to any response also from Mrs Sekula the woman in question yes so massive changes in this case in the last few hours say the foreign secretary Dominic Robb has written to Mr Don't family have an effect today to explain the both the British and the u.s. Governments now consider Mrs Secu this is immunise to you from prosecution irrelevant the family spokesman Rob Sega told Steve no one of 5 Live what has happened and on the last sort of hour Steve has been breathless I've just been informed that for a couple of officers have delivered a letter to the parents of Harry which says that the cyclists did not have immunity I haven't seen it myself I have had a chest die just that I don't know the reason behind it why because don't forget Stephen we were with Dominic rob the foreign secretary on Wednesday and he looked all of us and all of us in the eye and said that she did have immunity and he was quite sure with me what I try to argue that that was wrong so today's Saturday I was free for days what's changed if that is right why have the stamina and I protect right from the start why have this family been put through this hour 40 minutes ago I got a full phone call from Harry's parents who are still back home to say that they just had a knock on the door and a gentleman who introduced himself as us for a couple of Officer special hadn't delivered a letter carrier the last time I received the handle of a daughter and there is an opened it up read it and apparently it says that they have agreed that she does not have again today. So apparently this lesser said we will press strongly for a way river munity so justice can be done while the u.s. Government has steadfastly declined to give the waiver that is not the end of the matter so says the f.c.a. Says we've looked at this very carefully the u.k. Government's position is that immunity and therefore any question of waiver is no longer relevant in Mississauga says case because she has returned home the Us has now informed us that they too consider that to mean a z. Is no longer pertinent in other words she's gone home therefore she no longer has diplomatic immunity now Nick vamoosed Scuse me. Nick Ramos whose partner at the law firm Peters and Peters He's a former head of extradition that the Crown Prosecution Service has been looking at this letter which was as we said delivered this evening in one sense it it states the obvious which is. Curious has returned to the u.s. She no longer has diplomatic immunity because she no longer in the u.k. Alas covered in the Vienna Convention which says that when somebody leaves that Aussies who have to crank sions they no longer enjoy the privileges and immunities of a diplomat so it's unclear though from the Foreign Office that whether they think that means that she can now be subject to our criminal jurisdiction because she is no longer here she's in the us and well I'm not sure because there's no precedent on this is whether they would respond to an actual mission request because of course that would be bringing her back to the country where she did have a mask immunity at the time she committed the offense if she did in fact committed what a boat Mrs James has anybody heard from a year well not since this 100 livered letter came to light but there was a statement earlier on Sat. Today know it said Ann is devastated by this tragic accident no loss compares to the death of a child and an expense a deep sympathy to Harry Dom's family this statement from her legal representative Amy Jeffress said she would continue to cooperate with the investigation saying she'd spoken with all forages at the scene of the accident and met with the Northampton police at her home the following day ever heard any move from Mary downs from Yeah well they previously said they've been trapped in a living nightmare ever since the son was killed in orders now as as we said you know we did hear from the family spokesman Rob Seeger early who'd spoken to Steve Nolan here on 5 Live they heard sorry Harry's mother Charlotte Charles has also responded directly statement says As a mother father and parents we've known from the start of the extra feeling in our pit of our tummies told us that something wasn't right we're proud of ourselves for fighting for justice for Harry and not ignoring this nor in between within bodies we'd rather have our beautiful boy back but we are also elated that all this fighting for justice for Harry has not been in vain his life will not be swept under the carpet it will continue to fight for change to the diplomatic immunity laws and any other positive changes we can achieve we need to try to ensure this never happens to any other family so what next. Good question and we don't know I think is the answer at this point so we'd know we don't know basically if Mrs security is going to return to the u.k. Now. We seem to have to do quite a few times during the course of this chat don't we we've got to return kind of a few days really to get some context on this now the prime minister Boris Johnson on Friday said that the u.s. Was absolutely Rufus Those are his words in the safeguarding of a secure list following the decision to initially grant her that diplomatic immunity he said although President Trump was sympathetic towards Mr Dunn's family's views on the use of diplomatic immunity the u.s. Was very reluctant to allow citizens to be tried abroad now all of that followed that revelation that she wasn't going to return to the u.k. We discovered that because of briefing notes held by President Trump when he was photographed at a White House news conference but now well let's let's find out I mean that may have all changed with the decision by the Foreign Office that after all she didn't have diplomatic immunity the question is whether she had diplomatic immunity or not now I suppose it goes into the realms of if she actually going to be brought back is the government or anyone else in a position to bring her back from the u.s. To answer more questions as Nick vamose said earlier we don't know it's a case of watch this space James thanks very much Elliot kidshow has become the 1st athlete to run a marathon distance in under 2 hours beating the 120 minute mark by 20 seconds the 34 year old Kenyan cover the 26.2 miles in one hour 59 minutes and 40 seconds on a prepared circuit in Vienna is achievement won't be recognized as an official record because he used a team of pacemakers and have a car projection of beam of light onto the road showing the ideal speed that won't have stopped the celebrations back home in Kenya though has. The reaction of his friends and family back in his home village in Kenya it really someone wants to go for what you really see what once you do that if you really believe in a said Francesa in a sense we are happy and it wouldn't want to stick a name yes it will do it and that's why yes when in the letter we come to you since last night waiting for this event going to happen and it does happen finally let's reach a professor Scott traffic who as well as being the director of the Human Performance Laboratory at Bull State University in Indiana is a well toss travel eat it was self Professor how great and achievement was this oh it was outstanding one of 10 was given an 11 they say this sub 2 hour marathon is seen as the last great barrier of modern athletics would you agree and I think in the context of what the current sporting profile looks in the world I think this was definitely one of the last key races to sort of have a significant barrier attached to it that people have been so pursuing for quite some time so I think the mindset of that is fairly accurate but the fact that it's not seen as an official world record does it take some of the shine off. Oh you know I think that a fee to beta 'd product more light to it actually I think at the end of the day you know it's proven it's can be done if you look at the sub to our attempt they did hear 2000 and. 17 and then they lowered just missed it by 25 seconds and then we set a world record the following year 20139 and then this was yesterday and the end I think is just going to set the stage I wouldn't be surprised it's not too long before we see some to an actual performance I suppose you could compare it to Roger bet is to break in the 4 minute Mario 60 years or more ago. And that was. No perform it wasn't a tournament circumstance was it self was. Organized so preempted Rice record breaking right oh yeah he you know they had to pay search within that day at the track you know exist same type of thing we're going to pursue for years he breaks a record it was actually on May 6th of 54 and then 6 weeks later John Landy breaks it in Finland and it started to fall considerably after that so there is a huge psychological component associated with the form of while I think there is a huge psychological component associated with the 2 hours of marathon so I think you will begin to see that they're being pushed. How did they manage this would to be have to do. I think you can see in terms of human India and Professor how do you . Achieve something as phenomenas. Well you know outside of you know idea of course settings if they had Will you look at it from a you know a physiology exercise physiology perspective you have to really have all the key ingredients come together the body stature was ideal the engine could choke he has had. Huge engine a car engine the economy of running has to be near perfect. And you can tell when the same Ron and his the mechanics he's so efficient he has to have a high on them so slow fibers in his legs they're built for and Durrance and then his ability to thermal regulate and on a good day you know obviously he's been honing that engine for years and it all came together this sounds like a lot to break it is a lot of your most seems to be beyond the capability of any ordinary if I can put it that way a human being can show it is extraordinary in the way that you describe it. Well I think telling but there's a lot of people very close to that and that is heels here to all 5 and I think this is going to push that barrier for a lot of people to shoot for you know again the 2 is not anything feat by any means and a lot of the elements have to come together for this to happen is credible when you think of the pace that you have to maintain to break the 2 hour mug 26 miles a mole. It's not so Joe good tool in the plug this is who most sprint race nowadays. Well I was actually thinking about that when I was around him today so his pace of the ball for 34 per mile I'm in the us I think by miles. And he would had to run 68 seconds per one lap on the trap average and most people can't even go to the track and do one lap at 68 seconds of $400.00 so it's for most mortals it's it's a sprint. For you have to make sure we only have one so in Europe so we can thank you Miles as well Ok good. Why it seems it's the. Long distance runners that have the gym project the Kenyans the frostiness marathon runners have Kenyan heritage Yeah there's been a lot of discussion about that as you know it could be you know sort of the chin in a clinic which could be associated with it I think you have to put genetics on the table body stature you know is kept choking me ran at a very young age they ran a school so this is sort of endurance Foundation gets played 'd it a very young age long distances so there's sort of bodies there just built they have the physiology to do it so you know at 34 years old this didn't happen overnight he's been more or less doing distance running from since he was a child so it's good nothing to do the shoes. Well I definitely think these new shoes that have been put on the market with the card of play them in the phone with they have and. I've been following that pretty closely there's some nice data from from laboratory testing that suggest that the reports are quite accurate in the anecdotal comments across stage groupers the pros e.c.m. Everywhere I think the show's issues amongst everything else were or at least part of the factor it's a race it's been to North as is making this a. Yeah that's a good way to put it if and when you look at the you know just over the last 100 years we've taken about an hour off the time. Thank you very much really appreciate it so it shows. Yeah thanks a lot Professor Scott Chafee there of the bull State University in Indiana and you've. Heard my link that virtue to books flown in this morning it to Nothe Aus in years ago the marathon the legend has it at least the marathon was 1st run by a Greek soldier to tell the people of Athens from the Nazi far the distance town of Marathe and that the Persians have been defeated and of course he delivered his message and collapsed. That was to not hasn't years ago Foden in a way has been to North Aus in years in the making from Friday this one we were asking you what's the cheering that delivered the best message obviously Delhi every cheering you could describe as having a message was itching that delivers the best message for you text me an 85 or 5 email up for night at b.b.c. Dot co dot you can join us for the phone in in half an hour or so 108-085-9096 extension 93 now back in April 2011 it's believed that Chevy Dupont illegal on killed his wife and their 4 children before burying them and the family's dogs under a patch of the family home in normed in north western France the last confirmed sighting of the wanted man was on the 14th of April some 10 or 11 days after the murders until it seemed a few days ago when a man believed to be Dupont De Leon was arrested at Glasgow airport by police acting on a warrant issued by the French at this point it was so the man was traveling on a passport stolen in 2014 we now know. That wasn't the case the traveler who was detained has been identified as Guy Ogie shout who lives in Limaye north west of Paris so despite hundreds of sightings the police appear no closer to catching up with. Who was e.o. Indeed Who is he any good is part of the team behind the distortion podcast and he's looked extensive into the depot and delusional story I mean tell me 1st of all when did you when and why did you decide to look into these murders I Mr Ali bio 1st aside it's a pleasure to be with you tonight honored about that. Hard part cast is based out in Montreal in Canada so we didn't hear a lot about this story so it's part of our French community because our podcast is French it's a French Canadian cast and some members of our French community reached out to us saying Hey this there's this shocking story of a man murdering is an entire family here in the months and you should cover it because there's a ton of the interesting digital leads and you know digital clues leading to the to this mysterious man and we didn't hear about it at all back in the day so it was pretty intriguing and we we took a deep dive and yeah we started gathering a timeline around the murder around his runaway because he's apparently maybe still on the run or maybe is that we we don't know yet so yeah it was an intriguing case and we it really caught our attention because it was not covered at all up here in Canada what about a motive for the killings is one been established. Farnie a motive for the killings has emerged have been established now there's less Yeah there's there's many different theories regarding the motives 11 interesting lead came from from the Internet communities actually. Because at some point Internet communities gathered on different forums on social networks on different places on Reddit for instance and then we started looking at all the digital footprints that savvy left left behind and in some in some forums. Mentioned that at some point he was. Thinking about the idea of a sacrifice so he was he you was a Catholic believer and you posted a number of times on the Catholic forum and then you mentioned this idea of committing a sacrifice for the sake of God and then it raised it raised the attention and you know following all these digital footprints. Internet communities also looked at what is why for Agnes was doing online and and she was also posting in different forums about having trouble in her relationship with 'd the exact v.a. And also in different e-mails example you mentioned that she was having heavy financial problems and issues and that's why I mean I think that it's hard to establish a motive but if we take all these all these ideas combine I think we have a good risk that before a family side and probably that he wanted to hand his own life after murdering his entire family that's shocking but that's maybe one of the most possible teary at this point even so even so even if he had taken his ow