Women voters, but first, lets understand why trump is deriding the complex rules by rich republicans by which republicans and democrats like their delegates. After a ted cruz friendly Colorado State convention on saturday, trump is trying to reverse the new narrative that ted cruz crusaders are outmaneuvering even in places where trump one popular vote primaries. He follows the democratic caucuses where Bernie Sanders crushed Hillary Clinton in the popular vote and walked away with the same number of delegates as his rival. Here is donald trump making the case for himself and sanders at a rally in rochester, new york last night. i watched bernie and he wins and winds and then i see hes got no chance. They say hes got no chance. Why doesnt he have a chance . Because the system is corrupt and it is worse on the republican side. Im up millions of votes on ted cruz i dont mean to votes, im up millions and millions of votes. We are supposed to be a democracy. We are supposed to be you vote and the vote means something. What they are doing and whether it is me or whether it is Bernie Sanders and i look at it and see always victories i have an all these victories hes got and you look at the establishment and i want to tell you, it is a corrupt deal going on in this country. Today, the chairman of the Republican National committee defended the process. Andng that the rules conventions are totally fair. Is donald trump correct . That the delegate Selection Process is unfair . Campbell no, the rules are the rules. Ownfact that trumps children are not able to vote in the primary in new york demonstrates how unprepared they are and how little they know about the rules. Get your ownn family registered in time . It is absurd. Thats the way the process is designed to work. The rules may be crazy, but they are not arbitrary. They were decided on by the party or by the voters and thats part of the campaign process, earning the rules learning the rules and playing by the rules. End thatgree in the the rules are the rules. People would be shocked if they knew theres not a great correlation between the voters voting, the popular vote, and who gets the delegate . Campbell al gore won the popular vote but did not get the presidency. Mark and people were critical of the electoral process and it was the question of whether people went to the polls intending to vote for al gore. I think trump is onto something with a restorable with a talkingal point, as a point, to say Bernie Sanders and i are the outsiders and insiders are fixing the game. Sure,exaggerating, to be but he is helping to rally his supporters to come out in the polls in states yet to vote. Campbell i think the rules are designed this way to build consensus around the nominee. About increasing the popular vote, they are about getting the establishment people and engaged Party Activists onboard with one person. But the news organizations should stop reporting the popular vote because thats not the point. Passover was a sunday, why was the sunday different from all other sundays . Donaldson donald trump did not do a single sunday show for the first time all year. This is a sunday where trump has not owned in or taped an interview. Press so they the could watch him toward the 9 11 memorial museum, but afterward, he did not take a single question. He did a phone interview into fox news this morning, a trump classic, but is doing less media good for his chances . I never want to argue in favor of a candidate talking to the press less, but i think trump is smart to play with the supply and demand. When he does a lot, reporters tend to playoff of each other. If he does more local press, which he is doing below the radar, he does local tv without telling the national press, i think hes in a better vision to control the message better than he has been. Campbell i think just because hes doing less media doesnt mean hes getting less media. They are still taping his press conferences live and he has basically taken over the media in this campaign. They have given up editorial control. Take my rallies if you want to and they take his rallies. It has been a testament to trumps brilliance how he has manipulated the media into giving up total editorial control. Maybe hes doing less, but it doesnt mean hes getting less. Mark he does one sunday show and everyone covers it. He doesnt need to do more. Campbell ted cruz has exhibited a quality that might take a middle manager at staples. He is scoring delegates in dates but the road ahead is clogged with voters who dont like him so much. The next x primary contest in the northeast and midatlantic, including new york where a new poll shows him in third place with 18 of the vote. Does not return to a more friendly stretch of the primary calendar on until indiana on may 3. He is campaigning today. Is he going to pay a price if he finishes third . Will in twok you ways. He needs to get close enough to trump so he is within hailing distance to win on a third a la. Geti think his argument to kasich out of the race if he cannot finish second. Weve got a month where theres only northeastern states. If heetter off for him could surge here and prove he can compete in these northeastern states which means showing he can appeal to more moderate voters, which he needs to do. Mark does any of this even matter if it just about getting to an open convention . You are not going to win outright, so he is just trying to keep from from getting to that magic number. Hes got to mark have enough delegates in the general election argument that he can be an alternative. If ted cruz hasnt won by the secondly, he cannot win because too many delegates are bound to vote for trump. If he cant win, i dont know that he can win on the fourth ballot. There are a lot of delegates at stake and he cannot go around arguing that john kasich is irrelevant if he cannot eat him in all of these contests even if it is in the northeast. Campbell i think the trump voters are the trump voters and trump is not necessarily convincing new people, so for ted cruz, it is about how do you expand turnout . You look at a state like maryland where he comes in third but youve got a governor there who hates trump and who has said he will not endorse but maybe you can get him to engage more and ramp up turnout or get that percentage. Mark he has switched from an economics and jobs argument this is a testing ground for him when he goes to california and other western states. A writ guessing game who will be the republican president ial nominee and how will that person be selected . Over the past two days, ive gone on twitter and then one of those unscientific holes with four options. One, trump will win the nomination for the convention. Two, he will win at the convention. Number three, ted cruz will win the nomination. Matchesy on the pole exactly what my reporting finds there is a total disparity on what people think is going to happen with trump winning at the convention being the scenario that is the least addicted. The others are basically tied. This is not scientific but of those four choices, which do you think at this point is the most likely outcome . Campbell i think it is more scientific and a lot of polls we have seen. And if they follow me on twitter, they are people of refine taste. Campbell i think for trump, he has to win on the first ballot. Dont you think most people have conceded as much . Certainly see that things become much dicier. That is notthink the most likely. I think it becomes about ted cruz and his organizing. Using ted cruz at the convention is most likely . Campbell i think it is. Does wellink of trump in northeast and wins indiana, he can get there before the convention. Day of then the california or new jersey primaries, but there is this interval between the primaries and convention and if he is within 100, he can shimmy his way to a majority. Campbell and the people who are trying to stop them will concede we are talking about a 20 or 30 delegate difference here. So coming up, what is the difference between classified and classified . Aboutent obama talks Hillary Clintons home email server and we talk with bernie jane. Swife, campbell welcome back. We are going to be talking to jane sanders, but first, the senders campaign has shifted its message about the Hillary Clinton campaign. Last week, sanders was calling her unqualified to be president because her super pac takes money from wall street and because of her past positions on wall street and trade. This week, hes using a different word. See if you can spot it. Mr. Sanders she may have the experience but in terms of the judgment, something is clearly lacking. Maybe her judgment is not as high is at high as it should be. It is a question of judgment. I have my doubts about what kind of president she would make. Campbell does sanders step over the line of personal attacks . Mark i dont think so. This is the essence of what you want in a president. That is someone who should be president. The kind of argument i think candidates should make. Campbell some of the clinton people are smarting over the not qualified comments because they think it could be used over and over in the general election. But to be complaining about this, welcome to politics. Is it any harder than what barack obama said about hillary iraqon or in 2008 over her vote . Any harsher than she was on him . This is a campaign. Grow up. Mark Bernie Sanders would have been making would have done better to make these arguments out of the gate. His strongest case is on things like trade. What kind of judgment do you want . City,er the state and the shes got her own comparison. It feels like helicopter parenting. Primaries are supposed to be the camp and make you a better candidate. Bernie sanders made several stops rong gotham city, call mating with a big rally in front of the roller coaster at coney island yesterday. Polls show him lagging behind clinton by double digits and is trailing in a new poll we mentioned earlier by 55 to 41 campaign is saying new york is not a must win state. A lot of pundits said it would. Is the Sanders Campaign right that he doesnt need new york to be the nominee . I think he has to win new york if he wants the nomination. As probably know the math well as anyone. He needs a big wildcard moment of some kind to change the dynamic. Is unexpected is is Hillary Clinton going to make another mistake or big gaffe . With the clintons, you dont know. I dont see him getting out. I think it is going to be a long and hard slog. By a lot orwins loses by a lot or wins by little or loses by a little, it doesnt affect his chance to be nominee. Tore are too many delegates say he doesnt need to win here. Chances of being the nominee dont go down appreciably if he doesnt win here, but he needs to win here and pick up delegates and get and he needs the momentum and the geewhiz factor of saying i beat her in new york. Now, for those darn emails. President obama sat down with Chris Wallace on fox news on sunday where he was asked about the pesky fbi investigation into Hillary Clintons home server. First, obama said he couldnt speak about it and swore not to interfere and then he spoke about the pending investigation anyway and once again exonerated his partys likeliest president ial nominee. Clintont Obama Hillary was an outstanding sectarian state and would never intentionally put america in any kind of jeopardy. Theres classified and then there is classified. Their stuff that is topsecret topsecret and stuff you might not want on the transom going out over the wire but is stuff you could get in open source. Chris you were prepared to say she hasnt jeopardized president obama i continue to believe she is not jeopardize Americas National security. And ive also said and she has acknowledged that there is a carelessness in terms of managing emails that she has owned and she recognizes. Campbell today during the white josh ernst reefing, defended his his boss and what he knows about the investigation. The president has neither sought nor received a confidential briefing about the Ongoing Investigation. The president s knowledge is based entirely on public reporting. Is one of the benefits of the approach secretary clinton and her team have taken to dealing with this matter. Campbell so why is the president talking about his email investigation . Mark beats me. If hes only learning about this from public investigation or not , then to try to exonerate her who is overseeing the Justice Department, i dont know if he is trying to help her towhat but it makes no sense be talking about this investigation. Just say it is an Ongoing Investigation and i have confidence in the Justice Department. To talk about the specifics of the case, i dont get it. Campbell i agree. I was stunned when i heard him say it. Any president would be expected to say it is an Ongoing Investigation. Then to say you are not going to influence what is going on at the Justice Department and be very overt about your view on this and if he doesnt have any inside information, he cant possibly exonerate her. Campbell it is a testament to how much she is struggling that he would feel the need to step in and protect his legacy. Back, janewe come sanders will tell us about her husband latest plan to win. Mark our guest tonight is jane sanders, wife of Bernie Sanders who dreams of being the next first lady. Were going to talk more about the concrete jungle where dreams are made of. How is new york going so far . This is a rough and tough state. Jane it is our state. Both of us born and bred here and it has been really good to be home, going down to coney island yesterday. 18,500 people in the audience and it has been fantastic. Your husband has said you are from vermont is it intimidating to run with all the spotlight and glare . Not intimidated by new york. We love it. Clinton represents new york but it feels like home to me. Campbell your husband has made the complaint that the process has been unfair given the way delegate rules are designed. It isnt so much that it is unfair, but it seems really that 30 of the votes you need are superdelegates. There are people who are not the voters and that doesnt seem quite right. I know that is what the republicans wish they had, but we just dont agree with that. One person, one vote. Mark what would you say to your by 12hat he wins wyoming points and make up the same number of delegates. Has its ownstate rules. I dont like how they figure it out but it doesnt make a lot of sense to me. Those were the rules set before we entered. So unlike donald trump, you would not say these rules are correct . It is interesting to see that it is all different state by state. I would like to see more of a federal election, that you win a state and every state has the same requirement. For instance, independence cannot vote in new york and we are building a democratic party, if we are keeping them out last october, they did not decide to register as democrats. That does not seem smart. You mentioned the superdelegates and the role that they play. What is your message to them . Jane i think the key is to look at who is the best candidate for the general election. Democratic Party Nominee is going to win the base of the democrats. Who wins the independence and sways some of the republicans . Independence everywhere. In the last senatorial election, he got 25 of republicans because they say we know you and trust you. We might not agree with everything you are saying but we can count on you to do what you say. I think hes a much utter candidate, but if you look at the polls, hes doing much better against all the republicans. Mark were going to come back ofh more with jane sanders vermont and new york after this. Campbell we are back with one of Bernie Sandersclosest advisers and also with his primary news source like when she broke the news that he had won the wyoming caucuses. Jane sanders, thank you for being here. We were talking about that in wyoming and the differences on the delegate rules, but also about the superdelegates. Talk to us about your roles in all of this and how you define it. You are involved in the ad making. How do you see your role in the campaign . Jane there are about half a dozen of us that work with ernie on just about everything, but it started with buying furniture for the office. Whatever needed to be done was done and now i travel with him a lot, which has been really nice. Really just talking about strategy and scheduling and television advertising. Itk there is one rolled have uniquely you are the family cpa. Here is a candidate is a stressed me when i release my taxes, there will be no problem but wont say when he will release them or how much is in them. I was expecting when they were due we would be releasing them. Mark how about the prior years . Jane sure. They are on file but we havent been home for months. Asked, thego, people Clinton Campaign asked and we said of course we will release them. Mark and in full, the whole thing . Jane no problem. Mark if donald trump said release them i will release of eventually, would you say thats no problem . Jane i would say when they are due, i expect them to come out. But i would tell you that every other year, i ask for an extension but this year, we knew i couldnt do that. So you will release how many years . Mark you will release how many years . Do you want . Y every year, we have released them. Did when he ran for election. I will release this years as soon as they are due and can i have time to go home . But you are saying theres nothing in them . Jane nothing. We are pretty boring. You have your senateve income, what else is in them . Jane i sold my moms condo at the beginning of the year. Campbell this was more on the republican side a kerfuffle about the wives that came out with the intention that was the attention being paid to wives and spouses. Do you think thats their . Are spouses fair game . Jane i dont think families are fair game. Spouses put themselves out there in a supporting role. As trump didpeople for heidi cruise for her looks, that is ridiculous. First of all, shes a nicelooking woman. But beyond that, its not nice to take personal attacks against anybody, let alone the spouses. I think it is fine to ask questions of them. Are you leaving