them as punishment for the russian leader now that he has attacked ukraine, jake. and the big question given what president biden said about this not being the end of the road for president putin, saying he has his sights set on more than just ukraine. it's a big question of whether or not these sanctions once they start to go into effect as president biden was saying today, whether or not they change that calculus of his. >> yeah, that's a kind of confusing messages on the sanctions deterring or not. caikaitlin collins, thanks so m. joining us to discuss, former white house chief of staff john kelly. general kelly, thanks for joining us. now we've seen what the u.s.' response to russia is. what do you think? is president biden going far enough to punish putin? we had general clapper on earlier who told me that he thinks it's time for the west to impose every possible sanction and punishment possible. >> well, it's always great to talk to you. not being on the inside, i don't exactly know, but as i