Chris wallace. Are you willing, tonight, to condemn white sprem sixtupremac militia groups, and to say they need to stand down and not add to the violence in a number of these cities . As we saw in kenosha and as we have seen in portland . I would say i would say almost everything i see is from the left wing, not from the right wing. So what what are you saying . Im willing to do anything. I want to see peace. Do it, sir. Do it. Say it. You want to call em what do you want to call em . Give me a name. White supremacists and rightwing militia. Stand back and stand by. Stand back and stand by. Now, thats just not a condemnation. Thats actually an instruction. Stand by. Stand by means, keep your ar15s. Keep those tactical selects that you juvests that you just bough online. And all the camo you got so you can look like you were in the special forces when, in fact, you werent. We might need you to descend on polling places come election day. You know, things they do in places that have a lot of coups. That was no condemnation of this group the proud boys or any white supremacist and militias more broadly. In fact, the proud boys have taken it up as a rallying cry, apparently. This is the biggest thing in their lives since call of duty war zone was released and that was big. They are selling extra extra large tshirts with that printed on them. And what did the president say, today, about all this . He did what he always does. I dont know who that is. I dont know who the proud boys are. I mean, youll have to give me a definition because i really dont know who they are. I can only say they have to stand down, let Law Enforcement do their work. Like theyve done in new york. I just told you. I always denounce any form. Any form. Any form of any of that. You have to denounce. But i, also joe biden has to Say Something about antifa. Any form of any of that. He cant say talk about racism. He cant actually put four or five sentences, off the top of his head, together about the dangers of farright White Supremacists. His Homeland Security department can. Theyve said its one of the biggest domestic in terms of domestic terror, its the biggest threat there is. In other words, the president s inability to condemn people like the ones who shouted jews will not replace us, it appears its just going to be more of the same. Just like last night was more of the same. He gets reelected, more of the same. And maybe, thats what voters want, and so be it. Listen to what the president said, back then. And compare it to what he said today and last night. Yes. I think theres blame on both sides. You you look at you look at both sides. I think theres blame on both sides. And i have no doubt about it, and you dont have any doubt about it, either. And and if you reported it accurately, you would say. They showed up in charlottesville. And you had some very bad people in that group. But you, also, had people that were very fine people, on both sides. Not then, not last night, and not today, could he simply condemn farright hate groups. I am repeating what he said, word for word that, quote, you had some very bad people in that group. You know, the bad neonazis, not the good ones. All that said, and its a lot. The bottom line is simple enough. The president cannot condemn anyone if he thinks there is even the slightest chance that they might vote for him and thats what it boils down to because thats all he cares about right now. And there is no reason not to expect more along those lines for the rest of the campaign. Its why when he was asked about the bizarre qanon conspiracy theory. You know, based on antisemitic and anticatholic tropes that have been around for centuries. He said first thing he said was, i hear they say nice things about me. Nor is there any reason to think the president will stop sowing doubt in the election process. Of course, not. Or commit to accepting the outcome of it. Not given what he said last night. Will you urge your supporters to stay calm during this extended period, not to engage in any civil up rest . And will you pledge tonight that you will not declare victory until the election has been independently certified . President trump, you go first. I am urging my supporters to go into the polls, and watch very carefully because thats what has to happen. I am urging them to do it. Okay. Yeah. So thats not even a stand by. Thats go into the polls and watch because things are happening. Big things are happening. Thats the kind of language that raises now questions nobody wants to think about. Until this election, nobodys had to. There was plenty more last night to tell us what the rest of the campaigns going to look like. If last nights a preview, there will be a flood of falsehoods on the pandemic, which has now taken nearly 207,000 lives, expecting more blame shift from the president. If we would have listened to you, the country would have been left wide open. Millions of people would have died, not 200,000. And one person is too much. Its chinas fault. It should have never happened. They stopped it from going in but it was chinas fault. So, its nothing new. None of it is. Everything donald trump is and everything he says that defines him was on display last night. In some ways, the question comes with its own answer built in. But it also comes with another question, namely, how much worse . Maggie haberman is the white house correspondent. Shes been covering donald trump since long before he entered politics. She tweeted about last night but it might as well have just be about today and all the days ahead. Quoting now from her tweet. People close to him are blunt that the president knows he is losing and is scared of it. So he did what he does when afraid or anxious, and tried to impose his will on the night. Perspective now from cnns chief political correspondent, dana bash, traveling with the president just outside of pittsburgh. And cnns abby phillip. Well, i am told from a source familiar with the president s thinking that, in private conversations, he is insisting that he did well. That he had a great night. And when it is suggested to him, strongly, that he did not have a great night, that he was too aggressive. That he interrupted too much. That that he is surprised to hear that pushback. What i am told is that the, sort of, feeling is that once the president digests his steady diet of cable news that, you know, he always does. That, it is going to hit him, likely, in the next day or so that he did, in fact, interrupt too much. That he did, in fact, have a bad night, like everybody around him believes that he did. But, wait. Do they really believe that . Because all im sorry, sorry to interrupt. But i mean, all the mouthpieces who have been flooding the air wavers, you know, Peter Navarro and others, theyve all been parodying both the style and substance of what the president said. Thats true. But what the analogy that was given to me was remember how can you forget when the president suggested that injecting or digesting bleach would help with coronavirus. And he couldnt believe people actually thought that was a big deal. After a day or two, he got that that was a big embarrassment. That is the analogy. Whether or not he will get there, youre right, its obviously a very open question. But despite what people who are paid, you know, to be around him say on tv, i am told that there are people who are very blunt with him, behind the scenes. Never mind, again, what he is hearing from people who are almost always very complimentary of him. From david urban to rick santorum. He sees that kind of thing. And, you know, one other thing that was interesting is that they want him to, kind of, i was told, take take a beat to rest. Theyre not even going to go there on the next round of debate prep until, maybe, next week at some point. And they hope, by then, he will have absorbed it all. But, look, anderson, i get your point. It is a big if and a big hope, given the fact that they did work hard with him, behind the scenes, before last nights debate. Abby, you know, the president had a chance to try and clean up, if you can, you know, his stand by, proud boys, comment. And take some responsibility for his behavior last night. Instead, he did what he always does, which is just try to muddy the water further. I kept wondering. Today i mean, is part of this just a strategy to disgust and depress everybody but his supporters and maybe peel off a certain percentage of voters who just feel kind of so dirty after watching last night and disgusted that they just stay home and not vote . You know, its an interesting question because i do think that a lot of President Trumps political strategy, just in general, not just in this campaign or in this political moment, is about sort of beating the public down. Beating down the entire system so that everybody wants to just wash their hands of what is going on. Whether he intends to do that or not, i think that is actually the effect. But, you know, the president is not willing, ever really, to just, as you pointed out earlier, even say the words white supremacist. He doesnt want to say the words. This is not a new thing. It dates back, many years, even going back to the campaign. So, you know, i think that he doesnt like being wrong. And he doesnt like admitting that he made a mistake. And so, youre going to see him trying to stand his ground for as long as possible. And then, perhaps, we might see him change his tactic. But ill tell you, you know, one of the problems with where the president is, is that he is trying to project a persona of strength against joe biden, who he says is weak. And, in his mind, strength means dominating the conversation. It means being aggressive, in the way that he was last night. And im not sure that he understands how to modulate that, in a way that doesnt continue to hurt him. I mean, its its not just the i mean, dana, does it hurt him . I mean, again, among his supporters yes. You think it does hurt him . Yes. Well, among his supporters, the people who are supporting him, probably not. But those people he doesnt need to reach out to, despite evidence to the contrary if you look at his actions. Not only over this campaign but the past four years. Hes done very little with few exceptions to reach out beyond his base. Its one of the things that have a lot of people scratching their heads, who really like him. But like, in a place where i am right now, im in pennsylvania. The president. His campaign believes that he really needs to win this state. And he really needs to win people who are not so sure if he is the right guy, right now. And in large part, because they dont like his character. They dont like his personality. They dont like his tweets. And what you saw on stage last night was his tweets come to life. And i will tell you, one person who is familiar with his debate prep, anderson, said they prepared him to be aggressive but not to be jason from friday the 13th and that is the perception of how his performance was. These are people who like him. You know, abby, anyone who thought, you know, that moderate republicans in tough in tough reelection races might forcibly condemn the president s spectacle. Look no further than senator collins of maine who said she thinks there was, quote, fault on both sides. Wow. Susan collins. Yet again, you know, all this expectation about really fault on both sides. I mean, come on. We got to be real about where we are, as a country. We are in a hyperpartisan moment, and she is not an exception to that. Susan collins is trying to fight for her survival by literally walking a tightrope in her state. And i think that thats what you are seeing. Shes just trying to, sort of, kind of, be, quote unquote even handed about this, in a way that is not does not gel with reality. You are going to see a lot of republicans sort of saying, well, it would be nice if he had said the right thing last night. But theyre not going to go out of their way to condemn. To actually condemn what the president said and did last night. That is what we are going to see, in the coming days. And perhaps, for the future debates that are probably going to look not too dissimilar from what we saw last night. Seems like, in the past, you know, there were politicians who thought there is something more important than just political survival, you know, from time to time. Like, human decency and, you know, actually having morals and virtues, and standing up for what you believe in and saying what you believe. But that seems increasingly rare. Dana bash with the vice president. Abby phillip, thank you very much. Next, the mother of heather heyer. Killed in charlottesville by white extremists. Later, what other countries saw when they tuned in and what that means for americas role in the world. Former National Security adviser, susan rice, joins us. Beautiful. But support the leg when i started cobra kai, the lack of control over my business made me a little intense. But now i practice a different philosophy. Quickbooks helps me get paid, manage cash flow, and run payroll. And now im back on top. With koala kai. Hey more mercy. Save over 30 hours a month with intuit quickbooks. The easy way to a happier business. With new bounce pet hair lint guard,tually attract pet hair . Your clothes can repel pet hair. 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And then found the home of my dreams. But my home of my dreams needed some work sofi was the first lender that even offered a personal loan. I didnt even know that was an option. The personal loan let us renovate our Single Family house into a multiunit home. And i get to live in this Beautiful House with this beautiful kitchen and its all thanks to sofi. Saw at the top of the program, the president , once again, could not deannounce a group that is sending armed people into the streets. You also heard him use some familiar language to shrug it off. I dont know who the proud boys are. I mean, youll have to give me a definition because i really dont know who they are. I can only say they have to stand down. Let Law Enforcement do their work. Doesnt ring a bell . His answer certainly does. Here he was four years ago when asked by cnns jake tapper whether he would condemn david duke. Well, just so you understand, i dont know anything about david duke. Okay . I dont know about what you are even talking about with White Supremacy or White Supremacists. So, i dont know. I mean, i dont know. Did he endorse me . Or whats going on . Because, you know, i know nothing about david duke. I know nothing about White Supremacists. For a guy who watches television, nonstop, i know nothing is his favorite retort. In 2000, when he declined to run for president on the reform ticket, he said in a statement, quote, the reform party now holds a klansman. This is not company i wish to keep. In a moment, we will speak with susan brow, whose daughter, heather heyer, was murdered in charlottesville. But first, our sara sidner on the movement the president cannot bring himself to condemn or even remember. Lets go with a [ bleep ] antifa chant. Lets start it. [ bleep ] antifa. The proud boys are known for holding rallies. Being armed to the teeth, decked out in tactical gear. Black and yellow shirts and being ready to rumble with antifascists. They say, as a whole, all this is solely for selfdefense but that is not how a new york jury saw it. Two between proud boys wearing red hats and antifa members in all black. Were fiery but were peaceful. Reporter they say they believe in law and order but a apparently not in this case. We are not going to apologize for fighting back when somebody throws a bottle of urine at you. I am sorry. Reporter they say they are not a hate group and members have sued over being described that way. But the Antidefamation League says thats exactly what they are. The proud boys, unequivocally, are a hate group. They style themselves as a, quote, prowestern fraternity. But their rhetoric frequently invokes antisemitism, misogyny, xenophobia, and both homophobia and transphobia. So when the president was unwilling to explicitly condemn white sprupremacists and then sd this. Stand back and stand by but ill tell you what. Ill tell you what. Somebodys got to do something about antifa and the left. Reporter the proud boys celebrated. What does stand back and stand by mean to you, as a leader of the proud boys . The organization does not see that as an endorsement, in any way. He plays it down but their chat rooms hype it up. His exact words used as a rallying cry with this added. F it. Lets go back to portland. Another one reads standing by, sir. I was the one that said that. So the president mentions your name. Is this going to be used as a recruiting tool . I mean, any media is used. I wouldnt say that it was like a recruiting tool. Any time that were in the media, matter of fact, one reporter he then boasts about the proud boys mentions on twitter after the debate. So, apparently, americans think that proud boys are more important than coronavirus, at this moment. Reporter the adl says there are many, serious consequences to the president s inability to plainly state that he condemns White Supremacists. I always denounce any form, any form, any form, of any of that. Reporter the president was asked to do it again, after the debate. But again, never uttered the words white supremacist. We need to stop asking for explanations and simply take him at his word. He believes these people are his allies and hes given them a call to arms. Taylor knows the terror that can bring. She was targeted in a neonazi trolling campaign for simply becoming american universitys first black, female student body president. To me, as a hate crime survivor and cyber harassment target, i know too well how dangerous this rhetoric is and it causes real harm and real violence in our communities. Sara sidner, cnn, los angeles. My next guest knows that same feeling, along with heartache and loss. She joins us now. And author of bring