Now hollywood is fighting back. Nischelle turner has more on that now. Reporter in the bloody aftermath of the Santa Barbara mass killings, ann onaday sees Elliot Rodgers diatribe. You popular kids, youve never accepted me. Reporter and writes a column tying his murders to a directors son growing up on the fringes of hollywood n it she writes, rodgers rampage may be a function of his own profound distress, but it also shows how a sexist movie monoculture can be toxic for women and men alike. He had created this video on youtube that seemed to be such a product of the Entertainment Industry that he did grow up in literally and as a member of the culture. Reporter but her column specifically points to seth rogens recent film neighbors and other comedies made by writer, producer, director, judd apatow asking. How many students watch neighbors an and feel as rodg did . Are you talking to me . Reporter those comments inspire a celebrity backlash with rogen tweeting how dare you imply that caused a lunatic to go on a rampage while apatow says she promoted it. She didnt mean to single out apatow or national neighbors. Those that are created by men and pivot around vigilante justice, how that might inform not just someone suffering under really terrible Mental Illness but the culture at large. A culture still struggling to understand what could drive a young man to murder. Nischelle turner, cnn, new york. Nischelle turner, thank you very much. That was a nice story there. Joining me now the star of the iconic 1980s comedies three men and a baby Steve Guttenberg and rachel scolara and michael med ved, arthur chu, might remember him as the former jeopardy show and nina burly who writes for rolling stone. Steve, thank you and everyone for joining us. Steve, hollywoods taken quite a rap since this latest shooting. Just some of the titles that have been mentioned neighbors, 40yearold virgin, weird science, a big bang theory, knocked up, superbad, 16 candles, superman two. Is hollywood part of the problem, steve . Well, first of all, my heart goes out to the families of the victims and its just a terrible tragedy. But the truth is that nobody makes somebody do this by watching a piece of art, whether its going to the museum or watching a movie or a television show. This is a person who had a deranged mind and were going to have to figure out why he and many other people think like that and we have to get to the root of the problem. Since his father was the a. D. , assistant director on the hunger games because, you know, his Youtube Video was shot in such a cinematic way, was blaming hollywood you think just an obvious choice here . There were just too many factors that came together . Sometimes everybody in the media is looking for a hook and this seems like a reliable hook. But films are inspirational for the most part people go to movies and feel great about them. They learn. Theres movies like 12 years a slave or Dallas Buyers Club or bridge over the river kwai. This tragedy has nothing to do with hollywood and its a shame that its come to that and i wanted to put myself here to talk about the industry that i love and how i love movies as most people do because it makes them feel good. Michael medved, what started all this was anns column in the Washington Post and heres what she wrote. She said movies may not reflect reality but they powerfully condition what we desire, expect and feel we deserve from it, the myths that movies have been selling us become even more palatable the a time when spectators become their own auteurs and stars on youtube, instagram and vine. Does she have a point . Where we believe them to be true . No, of course, theres no question at all. Of course movies influence reality. I wrote a big book about that 20 years ago but the point about this is theyre attacking the wrong movies. I wonder if anybody has seen neighbors. I wasnt a huge fan but seth is very happily married. What is so striking about Elliot Rodger and demented testament he isnt interested in relationships. He isnt interested in the nerd getting the girl. interested in sex. This is a fact of life. Most women are not interested in nerdy guys who dont want a relationship and all of the movies hes attacking by judd apatow and seth rogen and Steve Guttenberg, yes, about nerdy guys in loving relationships and a sweetness to them. Thats enough of us guys talking. A womans point of view. Rachel, was it fair for ann to focus on seth rogen and judd apatow. I dont feel like she did. I feel like seth rogen focused on seth rogen. Neighbors was the most recent movie to come out to glorify frat culture but i agree with michael that im not even sure how many saw it. I saw the ads for it but i dont necessarily think its films Like Neighbors that are the culprit. She mentioned themself. Why wouldnt he respond . What do you mean shes not talking i think the focus on neighbors as the demonic hollywood film to blame is a red herring here. I think you have to look at the totality of who is making films, whose voices are usually heard and who is portrayed and how. You know, the other thing that ann mentioned was the bechtel test which looks at are there women in the film, do they talk to each other, do they talk to each other about something other than a man . A lot of films actually fail this test which is indicative of male centered stories and male centered protagonists. Okay, if i could just jump in. Let me jump in then you can, michael. Listen, in normal life i hear women talking about a lot of things but most of the time theyre talking about men and that may sound sexist but they do in real life. Why wouldnt they in movie. To the exclusion of all else i have many conversations with many women and men and amazesly we talk about a wide variety of things but if you look at the dialogue that in these movies the bechtel test you will generally see that men are talking not only about their relationships and their romantic dreams, but also about, you know, how to blow up the asteroid or all right. Or whatever it is. I want to know why do women general point that there is a disproportionate emphasis in the culture on how men view things and what men want. Okay. All right. Hold on. I know you want to get in. I have to get arthur in here. You wrote a powerful piece for the daily beast. Fixating on a woman from afar and refusing to give up when she acts like shes not interested is something that generally ends badly for everybody involved but its a narrative that nerds and n echlt rch nerd media kept repeating. Explain that, arthur . I mean, im not going to i dont think i would go so far as to say its a monoculture, thats always exactly the same story but when you have stories about when have you stories about underdog guys trying against all odds theres usually a woman in the story who is there sort of as a reward. You know, that someone is having a conversation without us. Who is is someone having a conversation . Okay. Go ahead, finish your thought, arthur. I mean, its kind of undeniable and if you go past, you know, movies, you look at tv, video games, a lot of things that influenced me growing up, influenced young guys like me, this idea just that to be successful means to be, you know, in a relationship with a woman and usually in movies its a conventionally attractive woman, a beautiful girl is your reward for doing well in life and Elliot Rodger, one of many who thought he wasnt doing well just because from his perspective its true of shakespeare and mr. Smith goes to washington. He ends up with jean arthur. For goodness sake, thats the plot of a lot of our lives. There are a lot of us who are nerdy guys successful with women way above them. I am one of them. I plead guilty. Theres nothing wrong with it. Thats the plot of thats the plot of the male point of view. Again. But you see, heres the problem i have with what you said and i understand, rachel, what youre saying about the male point of view being prodominant in movies and i can acknowledge thats a problem but has nothing to do with this hideous violence. If you want to take a look at one of the most prominent violent movies of our time that Elliot Rodgers father was actually involved with as a second unit director is hunger games. It is wildly violent but passions the bechtel test because its all about a violent woman. It seems, though, that after every mass shooting we have the same conversation, guns, mental health, culture, i mean but this time it was different because this guy clearly had some sort of hatred for women, some sort of, you know, just dispassionate about women for some reason, i dont know why but impossible to ignore that. Tell me what you know about his misogyny online. Manifesto for the column i wrote and i feel that hes you know, i agree with rachel and i agree with arthur that, you know, while you cant say hollywood is to blame, certainly the stories that hollywood repeats over and over again are from the male point of view. They drive home the idea that men are entitled to female flesh. I mean, you havent talked about pornography yet but, you know, if you read this kids manifesto his First Experience of sex was watching porn and writes about how, you know, he thought from that moment on about sex and how he must have it and he would never get it and, of course, porn as its produced in hollywood much of it is produced on the west coast is providing men with the idea that they could have sex without making women feel any pleasure whatsoever. Okay. So, of course, entitlement, male entitlement is a part of this and it is to blame but, of course, virulent misogyny comes from a lot of places, its not just hollywood but hollywood has some role to play in this. Nina, hold that thought. I got to get to a break. Stay with us. When we come back, why hate bill rants are nothing new in the nerd world and later well talk about america the power phil. Is this country still the worlds policemen and is that what president obama wants . 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We are not guaranteed to get laid by the hot chick of our dreams as long as we work hard enough at it. There isnt a team of writers or a studio audience pulling for us to triumph by getting the girl in the end. First, steve, isnt hollywoods biggest part of hollywoods job is to sell a fantasy . But its fiction. Thats what movies are for the most part. Unless its lincoln and a true story or Dallas Buyers Club theyre fiction and its fun and thats why you go to the movies. And arthur, thats what being a guy is all about. No matter if you look like brad pitt or youre supposedly whatever a nerd is, you always want the beautiful girl, the popular girl. You want to be the football star. So do girls. There are lady nerds. Hasnt anyone seen shes all that. She transforms into the beautiful swan from the nerd this is a great movie, by the way. I think that this is missing the point. Great movies are great. I watch more tv than anyone that i know. I think the point is here this conversation is only relevant in the context of this tragedy that we are discussing and what were looking at Elliot Rodger and what influenced his point of view, his maniac and i think the point is theres something wrong with him. Movies have nothing to do with this. Hang on. Part of a larger culture. Go ahead, steve. Rachel, movies has nothing to do with this, neither does television or books or going to see picassos cubism. This has to do with a deranged mind. And whether he does this or Something Else thats completely inappropriate, you know, it happens all the time. But it has nothing to do with art and it has nothing to do with the male point of view or where hollywood is coming from. It really doesnt. I cant believe this. Quickly, rachel, respond. Drawing a distinction between the small like category of art and the larger category of culture and how women are portrayed in culture. He got his conception of what women owed him and at the same time that woman who gave it up for sluts from somewhere. This doesnt he didnt just invent that concept. Nina. Nina i think women you know, what were missing rachel, its the culture, the culture is its not just hollywood. Youre setting hollywood up as the strawman. Its not just hollywood but this sense of male entitlement that is behind, you know, what theyre calling an epidemic of campus rapes where, you know, girls are getting raped all over the place, all over the campuses of this country because young men are taught to think that female flesh is their entitlement and, you know, whose fantasy are we talking about when you say fantasy, yes, we love fantasy but whose fantasy. Can i ask a question . Where in any Motion Picture or tv show is there a plot where a guy rapes a woman and then she loves him for it or where a guy throws hot scolding coffee on women as Elliot Rodger did before he started shooting them. Theres nothing i can remember. Gone with the wind. Whats that . I didnt see the movie version of the fountainhead but thats 60 years ago. For contemporary movies there are not movies where nerds attack women, throw coffee at them, insult them, threaten to kill them then get the girl. Arthur, were discussing arthurs article so you should probably respond to a discussion on your own article. Yeah, yeah, okay, im going to jump in. This is one of the things where as a guy i have something to add to the conversation in that one of the things i said in the article was that rodgers manifesto, okay, was over the top. It was, yes, insane, all right, by any definition of the word but it did not sound like it came out of the blue. When you say his Mental Illness manufactured this attitude that he had that it somehow came like whole cloth out of no reason he hated women that doesnt make sense because hes saying to a much more extreme degree, yes, to a far greater degree hes very unusual. No one is saying that we have a country full of people just like him. Thank you. Hes saying the same kind of thing you hear guys say that when guys you know, when you have a friend who gets drunk and broke up with his girlfriend and gets on a rant about women, havent we all been there . Yeah. But sometimes that doesnt mean you want to kill them and doesnt mean you want to threaten them. For goodness sake, complaining about the opposite sex is an american right. Practically speaking when were talking about the epidemic and the trend of these Violent Crimes, they historically and recently disproportionately are targeted at women and they are disproportionately by men and even more so disproportionate disproportionately which crimes are you talking about . 98 of the Violent Crimes moist of the murder victims the overwhelming percentage are male. Africanamerican males 85 of murder suicides have female victims. 95 are perpetrated by men. There are 66,000 Domestic Violence hold that thought. I have stats this. Is an epidemic. Its real. Hold that thought. Steve, listen, you know, you heard what arthur said and this is art imitates life, isnt it . Of course to an extent it does but were talking about something so violent and so as arthur said insane this doesnt come from any piece of fiction. This comes from a kid who has real problems and what we need to deal with in this country and this world is Mental Illness. We need to put more money toward it. We need to try to figure out whats wrong with people. We need to figure out how to cure them. How to put them back into society so they become productive people as opposed to people who destroy society. This has nothing to do with any part of art. It has to do with okay, last word. Can i thank you, guys. Steve guttenberg is working on a script for a feature film project called the pride of san quentin. Steve, thanks for joining us. Everybody else, stay with me. Nina, you say misogyny is a disease and i want to talk about that next. Try alka seltzer reliefchews. They work just as fast and are proven to taste better than tums smoothies assorted fruit. Mmm. Amazing. Yeah, i get that a lot. Alka seltzer heartburn reliefchews. Enjoy the relief. I missed you, too. Ou. Hi buddy. Mom awesome dad i missed you. Oh. Daddy. Chevrolet and its dealers proudly support military appreciation month. With the industrys best military purchase program, for all that have served. Olive gardens latest iyou ration . You told us your number one olive garden dishes. Now theyre part of our 2 for 25 guest favorites featuring for the very first time your all Time Favorite dish, creamy chicken alfredo. And our seductive shrimp mezzaluna you loved so much we brought it back. Unlimited salad and breadsticks, two entrees, and dessert. Its our most inspired 2 for 25 ever. Olive garden. Were all family here. Discover 70 pronto lunch combinations starting at 6. 99. Elliot rodgers hatefilled youtube rants against women have launched a viral hashtag, yes, all women and sparked a heated debate and back with my guests. Nina, beyond hollywood, you write in your new York Observer article that misogyny is a subtle thread wove noon society. How so . Well, i mean, lets just start with gun rampages, okay. You take the gender out of gun rampages when you dont point out that all of them are committed by men. When we talk about them as Mental Illness and having to do with gun culture, you forget, you know, 00 of the population is female. 50 of the population female p