Transcripts For CSPAN2 2016 Savannah Book Festival 20160215

With this question that plagued nixon his whole career, who was the real nixon . Nixon as some of you may recall was always being trotted out in a new version. There was always talk of the new nixon, the old hatchet man being left behind for the statesman, then it was nixon the man of the people. There was always a new image been brought out, sometimes by nixon but sometimes torched in fabricated by his audiences. This led me to think about image making in National Politics generally, and this became a central critique of nixon certainly, were our politicians only, manufactured drugs politicians tony politics in the 20th century in our age of media where it seems so possible for politicians along with the consultants, spin doctors, handlers to present images and messages designed to give us what we want rather than perhaps what they really were, a concern with authenticity you might say. A theme we have been hearing a lot on the campaign trail the season. I began to realize that this story, even though ive just written in this book about nixon was not just about nixon. It was will about 20th century politics. I want to start just by reading a short passage, and despite what erik larson said last night, for those of you hard, i do think audiences, i hope audiences like, to your own bit of the style of an author. I wont go on and on but i think getting a sampling of the book is partly what audiences want as well as an understanding of the book that comes through a more informal talk. Let me just start with a short paragraph from the very beginning of the new book, republic of spin. Our political world is awash in over. Over many decades now electedcil officials and their age have t forged aheir huge arsenal of tos and techniques to shape their messages, their images and our d thinking. From the white house on down virtually every politician thos the brigade of speechwriters, press secretaries secretaries, campaign consultants, media gurus, handlers, pollsters, hucksters, flax, pacs and other assorted spin meister is to assure that each utterance is rendered in the best achievable light. Sometimes our politics seem to be nothing but skin. A dizzying cacophonous world of claims and counterclaims, each side charges the other with spin while asserting for itself a purchase on the truth. The growth of spin has given rise to a series of now familiar complaints. We hear that our politics are phony and corrupt, that our leaders are packaged and and principles, that their rhetoric is shallow and poll tested and even the most important political event, debates, conventions, speeches, interviews, press briefings are scripted, staged and choreographed. Spin, we hear, mislead or deceive such us and chokes off the honest and open discourse our democracy needs. This, i think, is at the heart of what worries us about the prevalence of political spin in our political life today and it was a question i wanted to get to the origins of. Where did this come from . Not just the tools and techniques politician by using that this anxiety that is adversely affecting our democracy. I realize nobody had written a history of the white house spin machine. Bits and pieces of it had been written about, talked about in many different ways but there was no single comprehensive history the told the story throughout the 20th centuries ago that is what i set out to do with republic of spin. This book has three narrative stories and i hope berated rather seamlessly, the intention was not for you to jump back and forth but for the characters and this seems to overlap among the three. The first of course is of the president s themselves who over the last hundred years have built up this machinery and in particular the specific innovation each one developed, specific struggles each one faced, specific challenges that each one confronted as they use these new tools to speak for the American Public and try to put across their agenda. A second story confirms less wellknown figures, spin doctors, information managers as they may be called more neutrally, experts who are trained in journalism comment advertising, Public Relations and other fields who in the course of the 20th century develop and expertise in words and images, they often come in to politics, sometimes on the campaign, sometimes in the white house itself, to work with president s to seek how they can best put across the message and then the third group of characters who are intertwined in the story are the critics, this is an intellectual history as well as a political history. It is supposed to tell the story not not just a house in evolve but what americans thought of it, how we assess its implications for democracy. There were some who were very bullish who felt new innovations, radio or Public Opinion polling could help us forge a stronger democracy where opinions could be exchanged freely, politicians could know what the public believed and this would help us to develop a democracy in which politicians were responsive to the public. There are others who have been very critical, felt the tools of spin were not used for leadership but for misleading, and powerful National Officials kind of an unfair advantage to put across their messages over the American People who would be fooled and lack the resources to know better and there is a third group called the realists who took a source of middle position, recognized the spin or publicity, propaganda in other eris was here to stay, and to educate the public. And how it worked in the hopes that the democracy could continue to be strong. I want to say about each group this morning. The story of the president s begins in my account with the roosevelt. This is not to say, in 1901 when Teddy Roosevelt became president. On the contrary argument the book that spin is as old as politics. And argue about the place of rhetoric in athenian democracy. In all year rounds leaders have superintended their images and try to make sure they were held in esteem by the public when they derive their power. For the american presidency there was the transformation at the start of the last century. There is the reason we dont know too much about most Nineteenth Century president s, we dont even know their names, they didnt do that much. Congress according to the constitution was the first branch of government listed in article 1, the presidency was article 2. It surprises my students who are used to thinking of the president as the big enchilada. What changed . How did the president become the one who drives the agenda to put his program across rather than implementing what congress thought best. Changes in large part because of the Industrial Revolution and the great social and economic problems that are introduced by the huge transformation and the nature of American Life and progressives, Theodore Roosevelt among some thought it was the place of the government in washington to tried to address those big challenges, and is not just the federal government roosevelt believed the president in particular, roosevelt had his own theory of the presidency basically saying instead of confining his role, the constitution said he could do, he was free to do anything except what the constitution said he couldnt do. He enormously expanded the field of president ial power but he knew he couldnt just do that by fiat. He wasnt a dictator. He felt he had to have Public Opinion on his side and the public was growing, the number of educated, literate americans were participating in politics was growing so marshaling Public Opinion was key to his political success and to do this, the public presidency, had to galvanize the public through the media. He toward wisely, took trips as no president before him had done, went out west, came down south, not just in a ceremonial role, and to advance a particular agenda weather was regulation of the railroad or the meat packing industry, all these progressive reforms that helped create a safer and fairer america. He also hired the first government information officers, press agents as they recall that the time when he decided to start his panama canal project, he put a journalist in charge of handling the oppressed for that project because there was so much interest in it. The great outcry from congress and why should taxpayer dollars be funding the aide who is going to give us Theodore Roosevelts propaganda and there was a big puzzle back and forth between the president and congress and he knew the value of commanding the headlines. Newspapers were changing. In the Nineteenth Century newspapers were partisan and champion the line of one party or the other. Now newspapers were becoming objective. They still had their editorial pages but readers cared less about the editorial pages than the news, what was happening and roosevelt recognized this and saw that his success depending on staying in the headlines, getting the news stories written the way he wanted so he would do things like descends to the bottom of Long Island Sound in a submarine, one of those oldfashioned with the circular portal door that closes, this was to demonstrate the navy needed to invest in submarines and develop into a modern navy. He once wrote 98 miles on tr would ask 5 reporters his quote newspaper cabinet, as he called them, or the fair haired as other said, to join him in the afternoon in a small room next to his office. There a Treasury Department messenger who moonlighted as the barber in chief going to roosevelt as he held forth politics, policy and gossip. Free willy in midshave the excitable president which bring out of his armchair, lab are flying off his face, to lecture the newsmen on a particular issue. Walter clark a reporter for the new york sun writing to a colleague of his quote only long confab with teddy gushed i wish id done because of all the funny things he said. He talked a blue streak wont even while the barber was shaving him. Barely able to squeeze in a word let alone the question, the journalist asserted themselves. That great muckraker attended many of these sessions would let roosevelt ramble until the barbers razor in his lower lip forcing it shut. Then the journalists fired off his queries as the president wriggling in his chair would be billed by the barbers admonition, steady, mr. President or a more skillful barber never existed declared a young reporter would later work for fdr. So that gives you just a flavor of Teddy Roosevelt style of spin and Media Management of which i think he was truly the first modern master. Without summarizing too much ive been in the course of the book talk about just about every subsequent president , each one brought his own innovation to there. Last night we talked about Woodrow Wilson a little bit. Woodrow wilson gave the first spoken state of the Union Messages to congress, at least in 100 years. Thomas jefferson had discontinued the practice. There have been written messages, receiving relatively little attention. Woodrow wilson who also believe in the public presidency wind up to capitol hill, delivered the address in person to great acclaim, to great Media Attention and leveraged, passing one of the most ambitious agendas. If you look, wilson, fdr, Lyndon Johnson were sort of the three great periods of reform activity in the last century. All president s sort of use of the medium to help accomplish that. Even some more less wellregarded resident contributed in their own way to the development of the spin machine. Herbert hoover i write about in 1928 campaigning for president pioneered a Campaign Film in a big way. You can find on youtube this film called master of emergencies. Who were of course have been commerce secretary during the Coolidge Administration where hed been tasked with addressing the relief and rehabilitation efforts after the great mississippi flood which was the worst Natural Disaster in American History until Hurricane Katrina a few years ago. And so the film shows hoover down by the river pulling forces out of the water, feeding poor dispossessed children and generally portraying this incredibly heroic image of hoover as a man who was there on the scene whenever challenges or crises arise. Who was also media savvy. He knew to give his speeches from the Mississippi River from a perch where he could hear the water roaring come rushing in the background so that audiences that dont have a sense of him as a man on the spot. And National Geographic and other magazines ran these lofty spreads of them in action with photos from the disaster scene. Of course, win as president hoover did have an emergency, he proved not to be such master. Theres a little irony in that title and thats another theme of the book is that spin stehr lake and helps only candidate running for president but spin cannot save bad policy or failure of policy. Thats a theme that recruiters throughout. More recently or ar getting inta later part of the century, i discovered even some minor bureaucratic elements of spin, or the development of the spin apparatus that turned out to be very consequential. During the vietnam war Lyndon Johnson organizes the Vietnam Information Group which has a rather benign sounding title but it was the first Interagency Group designed to sell the war, the vietnam war was going badly. People worried that the problem was the messaging from the white house. It wasnt. It was the war. But nontheless, johnsons aides and the state department, defense department, National Security council would gather on a weekly basis to make sure that theyre putting out the right message, their messages were coordinated. At one point in the fall of 1967 they did start in what they called the Progress Campaign to see an uptick filed in Public Opinion in how the war was going. That group became the template 14 a Big Policy Initiative that subsequent president would roll out where they would play in advance of the messaging. A few years back some of you may recall newspaper reports of the White House Iraq Group which did something similar for the George Bush Administration and came up with lines such as we dont want the smoking gun to be a mushroom cloud, and other sort of memorable lines that helped drive home for the nation the danger of saddam husseins acquiring nuclear weapons. And then, of course, i come up to the present with barack obama who has given us such innovations such as the white house videographer at the white house twitter feed. Everyday, every year there are new innovations in Communications Technology and spin that president s have to adapt to. So thats the first story. The main characters, the president , you like reading about president s and what they are doing behind the scenes, thats all in here. But its rated together with the second story of the spin doctors who insisted the president really at every step of the way. Its surprising even going back to the teens and \20{l1}s{l0}\20{l1}s{l0} are deeply involved they are. This is not a recent phenomenon. Summer people you might have heard of. L. Moyers working for lbj, michael deaver, Ronald Reagans image master, roger ailes, of course Richard Nixon and george bush seniors media guide who then goes on to found fox news. But there are also all these obscure figures who i found just deliciously fascinating and who also played a really historic part in the development of this vast machinery that president s now have at their disposal for trying to influence Public Opinion. One of these figures was johnsons jetson welliver who was the First White House speechwriter. That title didnt come into use until the eisenhower years but thats effectively what welliver did for warren g. Harding. Harding as some of you know was kind of known as a bombastic speaker. He was often mocked by the likes of h. L. Mencken who compared his speeches to scale bean soup and hogs barking at the laundry on the line. [laughter] and other same time and harding because of the rising visibility of the president in the new mass media, in the newspapers and israel was being called upon to give many more speeches than his predecessors had to do. So Judson Welliver is illiterate clerk, the official, who helps out and even curmudgeonly h. L. Mencken right at home recess i think welliver is having some positive effects on harding. I write about Robert Montgomery in the eisenhower years. Robert montgomery was a movie and tv actor who by the 1950s was kind of stalling his career a little bit, but he had gotten involved much like his friend Ronald Reagan had parallel tracks in hollywood. So we got involved in republican politics. In 1952 he is watching Dwight Eisenhowers Television Debut in abilene, kansas, in june. It sort of is first speech. But what is supposed we disagree and a, theres a downpour and i started reading his script through fogged up glasses. There are bleachers behind it and people are sort of traipsing back and forth like nothing important is happening. The optics are just terrible. Montgomery places a call to the campaign saying you need emergency help. The next year after eisenhowers election, montgomery is given a fulltime office in the west wing. He becomes the first ever white house tv coach, and he starts doing little things, telling eisenhower to change his glasses, use of these frames that look better on tv. He even has eisenhower come out in front of the white house a desk to look more relaxed. Starts playing raising and lowering the lectern. He raises it because he feels eisenhower has been lowering his head to read the script and the lights are reflecting off his bald head. Ill try not to do that here. And he also gets involved in the substance be making sure the pacing of the speech is correct. Eisenhower is born in 1890. Hes a man of an earlier time, not really a creature of the Television Age like a jfk who comes after him, but he surrenders himself to montgomery and other media advisers. And by the end of his presidency is quite adept with television. He gives these oval office addresses that are really wellrespected, over sputnik in 1957, over the little rock crisis, the integration of little rock high school, central high school, where his moral leadership from the oval office in these primetime addresses be considered an important contribution. Thats in large part this sort of these Unsung Heroes like Robert Montgomery. A final figure out which is mentioned again in the spirit of giving you a flavor of this is the first ever president ial pollster who i will wager most of you, perhaps all of you, have never heard of. His name is emilio, a finnish geologist and he spent time around the west and extractive industries, cut into oil in texas and eventually moved to new york when a wall street firm topic of jesus expertise in understanding the industries. Is also a diehard political bath and sort of studied politics and Public Opinions. And he realized that the way that magazines like the literary digest the rather time relied upon for polling, the way they serve the Public Opinions he thought was completely inadequate. He compared it to how you test the chemical content of the piece of rock. He said you cant just scan the surface because that gives you a superficial reading and doesnt test a full crosssection. You have to pulverize the sample of or. He felt that the service and written about in the newspapers were like skimming the surface, and you had to plumb deep inside them, calibrate them. I breezily wrote a little excerpt from the book that Politico Magazine published and they give the time fdrs nate silver, because like nate silver who runs the 538 website, he wasnt doing his own bowling but he was taken all the numbers that were out there from the parties, campuses to numbers from bookies to the newspaper surveys and then figuring them out. He he walked into the offices of the Democratic National committee in 1928 to settle his services. They think is a great and throw him out. 40 years later he tries again and is hired and really proves be an enormous help to roosevelt and the democrats in winning back the white house. He can tell them you dont need to spend money in pennsylvania. He will win it anyway. These kinds of judgments, and then in 1934 during the off year elections he once again proves prescient it is of particular spospies because in off year elections when a president holds the white house, his party holds the white house, almost always that party loses seats in the congressional election. Everybody thought the democrats were going to lose seats in 1934. But he was there quite a thing no, no. Record to pick up your end here, he turned out to be right. I want to read just one more paragraph about that. Washington wise men after these predictions came true were floored. I will never question another election prediction the president told dnc chairman jim farley that his bottom forecast was called the most remarkable thing he had ever seen in politics. He made the cover of Time Magazine and was profiled in other to he and his wife took to the social life of the Capital Entertainment diplomats, Supreme Court justices and congressmen after yellow brick georgetown house. I still to europe on the queen mary for the coronation of george the sixth. Reporters dropped by his backroom office as democratic headquarters. Describing for the readers the binders, maps and charts, newspaper clippings, almanacs, legislative reports slide rules and adding machines to books of logarithms, called it creates an index card, analyzing Political Behavior in every state, county and city in america. Quote he would star maps on the floor and look at them all day said one visitor. Then he would play with a tackling machine and with a pencil and pad ever come up with the information that was necessary, but it was mr. To concentrate speakers and propaganda and certain counties of the state in order to win. The press painted him as gnome or partisan or rational definition. His method is similar to avoid opinion, stick to statistical facts. So there are all kinds of characters like emil hurja and montgomery and Judson Welliver as well as the recent figures whose names are probably more familiar to you as well who populate this book. Theirs is a of writers, intellectuals, critics who argue about spin. Some of these were optimists, sometimes surprisingly so like a philosopher john dewey to when radio came on the scene, Great Potential that this medium could restore town hall feeling that the National Democracy that they had. And the hidden persuaders, people memberth write us bestselling book the hidden persuaders. People remember that as the Advertising Industry but it has a chapter and more about politics and it in which he worries that the new strides being made in Motivation Research as whats called to probe the unconscious to understand why people make the choices they do. But this was going to kind of undermined the enlightenment basis of individual economy and rationality that kind of under under under gird their notion of public choice. After all people werent voting for that candidate for the reasons they thought they were voting. This kind of the stabilizer understanding of how democracy really worked and put it in some peril. And then there are are those like the silent heroes of the book. These are the realists, people like Walter Lippman in the 1920s or Archibald Mcleish in the 40s. The journalist Theodore White in the 60s the making of the president s book pulled back the curtain on how the strategy is planned and how campaigns are conducted and have given us that understanding of political campaigning today. And even characters like Hannah Arendt the german american philosopher who wrote an essay called during the vietnam war and while she was deeply critical of Lyndon Johnsons socalled credibility gap that had opened up where the official line of the government was failing to reflect on the ground realities, she also didnt want to throw in her lot with the moralists who just condemned politicians for being liars. Since when she asks has politics and truth ever been in happy company in effect . Do you recognized from time immemorial politics is around in which people are always raising the truth, putting the best face on their argument and this is the way it should be in the way it has to be if we want pure truth. We look to the judge ,com,com ma the scholar, the philosopher. There are rounds in our public life where we expect disinterested truth of politics has never been one of them. So these are the three stories that cover from the early embryonic years of the Teddy Roosevelt administration and the beginnings of the 20th century up through this kind of crazy cacophonous media saturated spin soaked world that we live in today. And i want to conclude with three quick points about the spin that i came to be the course of my research, all of them i think challenge at least or revise what at least i had started out thinking about spin. The first which i probably would have made clear by now is that spin is not new. We sometimes think that if the recent anon on, maybe the days of clinton or reagan or jfk and the somehow before that politics was more honest, more pure, more straightforward. But as i hope i have shown going back to the greeks and their debates about rhetoric and certainly in our own time going back to the advent of the modern presidency thats focused on selling programs, selling ideas, selling the candidates and president s themselves to the public that this game of argumentation and collective self presentation has been part of the equation. The second one i want to make is that spin is not all powerful. Contrary to critics like Vance Packard or to those words that i read the beginning the common complaint we have about our political today. What was striking to me in the research i did was not just that president s could sometime effectively sell their programs but how ineffective it often was, how striking were the limits of spin weather was Woodrow Wilson failing his league of nations, projects to the American Public or franklin roosevelt, certainly one of the most effective communicators the oval office has ever seen being unable, despite his fireside chat to put across his courtpacking plan of 1937 that Public Opinion, that counter spin coming from congress or the opposing party, that series of elements in an open society to limit the power of president ial persuasion and to go even further, the theorists of span and they are also throughout the book, really come to see and come to state almost unanimously that most of what we are supposedly persuaded of is what we are already inclined to believe, that its very hard to convince the public to completely reverse itself on their condition. The most effective spin as one of the advertising man said doesnt persuade, it resonates. It brings out the beliefs that are rad within us. So spin is not new and spin is not all powerful and finally spin is not all bad. The name span, the term spin is one that comes out of the 1980s from the debates. That is after the candidates would debate on stage reporters would go to interview their surrogates about which man had really one and of course they would always insist insist their men had one and give all the arguments why. And the place where these people gathered is called spin alley. It was eventually upgraded to the spin room because there were so many of them and calling it spin there was and acknowledge me that this was a playful mechanism, that spin was kind of a game that the reporters were in on, that they were interviewing people they knew to be not necessarily sincere and that we thank you as the audience were in on it. We werent just being hoodwinked by one sides argument and then the others. We could evaluate skeptically and even with some enjoyment who is making a strong case and who wasnt. The audience is him on the action and in this case i think the word spin is different in its more benign form from what in the early part of the century was called propaganda or what in the cold war they called news management which imply a more passive audience role. I feel that you know todays spin culture may be overwhelming and may be offputting but its certainly not one in which we have no say or no capacity to evaluate. So i think we have a kind of deep down, and im bevel and stand towards spin. In ancient greece plato writing about rhetoric again deplored all rhetoric because the purpose of rhetoric he said was merely to induce conviction, not to teach truth. It could be conviction about something true or something false but philosophy was what brought you to truth. Rhetoric brought you to conviction so plato always had his ideals and that the debate versions in the real world and thats what rhetoric was then. To aristotle and his students this was all wrong. Of course he said rhetoric can be used for good as well as for ill and it was not the use of rhetoric per se but the use by the wrong person into the wrong hands. In 2008 barack obama running for president ran on a program of less spin. Hes running as an honest man like john mccain as well. He called for more Straight Talk and went on larry king live and said what washington needs is more Straight Talk and less spin but in 2010 when obama took his own what he called his shellacking in the off year congressional races were unlike fdr he did not pick up seats but lost quite a number or his party , he took a very different line. He was asked why he and the democrats struggled so much and he said well i think we came in and we paid a lot of attention to policy but not to the pr and the marketing and the salesmanship of it, in other words not to the spin so he had gone from calling spin to two years later calling for more spin. He went from being a play tennis to being an aristotelian. I think all of us on the surface we are platonic and our actions. We see this vacuous and often deceptive spin and we get angry at it, we culminate against it but then deep down and even maybe unwittingly unwittingly, where aristotelians and we are actually capable of seeing through the spin, plotting it when its in support of a cause or a candidate that like or we want to succeed read that with we like obama we wish he spun better. If we like someone on the other side we wish their arguments were more finally crafted and so spin really has this double valence. I think one thing i hope to show throughout the many characters in the many stories and the long history of spin that is charted in this book, is that spin also has of course at times perhaps too many times, been used for misleading. Its also been used for leading. That is, that kind of president ial rhetoric that has brought us not just some of the lows but some of the highest highs of the last century. So on that note im going to conclude and i would love you to line up of the microphones. I would be eager to hear your thoughts and to take your questions. Thank you. [applause] [applause] you obviously went through the primary season. If you hadnt written the book and you were covering this and taking a look at it, where would you place this in the book . We see highs and lows and the depths, the astronomical spin on this especially from the Republican Party. If some of this going to backfire . [laughter] well i wrote about this with obama but even other president s going back to jimmy carter, have tried to run on what i called the spin of. Because we are in such a spin saturated political culture, we get set up with that and we crave the authentic candidate. For some people that may be donald trump to in this unfiltered way the words come out and there is anger, there has got responses and that is appealing to a lot of people brought these reasons. On the democratic side i would say its very similar to the appeal of Bernie Sanders. He seems like someone who just says what he believes pay the guy looks like he just roll out of bed and got up and gave a speech. Thats an interesting note though about 15 months ago i was at a white house reefing on advice for obama for the state of the union. The president weapons they are but some of his aides were. When the people there Sanders Campaign guru and he was laying out this line he wanted to take on the state of the union. The system is rigged, the exact line that he had Bernie Sanders using. But there is an artifice behind the ump into the city and which if you worked with roger stone one of the most some would say devious was certainly effective consultants on the republican side going back to nixon, there is a real method in his spontaneity as well. After the iowa caucus win the spotlight seem to move to cruz and rubio he said oh he stole cruz stole the election and the spotlight is back on trump for a few days that he is very canny and delivered as well underneath his spontaneity. I think throughout our history, even the most seemingly im coached, untutored politically innocent politicians have used practice in a forethought. I mean harry truman to give one quick example, in 1948 delivers a speech at the Democratic National convention where he is praised for his new spontaneous ad lib. Style and it gets rave reviews and this is kind of seen as the beginning of his comeback that results in his upsetting do we and winning reelection. That spontaneous style it turns out in my document in the book he had worked on for months with the democrats radio coach. He brought him into the studio, worked on his pacing, figured out how to get notes that would serve as the beginning of the speech without hewing to their reading so i didnt mean that harry truman was a phony. He was a very authentic figure puck behind the authenticity there is spin as well so i think even this year and are kind of seemingly spontaneous, chaotic authentic debate of course there is still polling, beach writing, image making. Its all still there under the surface. I think on time this will be the last one. All right. Contemporarily with karl rove and company with the Bush Administration and going back to the numbers game. Is that now how you see future politicians working at or is it cyclical and just kind of comes and goes . Right, you think one of roves contributions and one thing that is has changed about politics in recent elections is the emphasis on what they call microtargeting, using data to figure out which constituencies need to turn out. Thats a little different from spin which is about communication. You might say there are game as opposed to the ground game but theyre there certainly tied together because what it allows for is also microtargeting of your messaging. Now that too is something that people like Edward Bernays the great Public Relations specialist who is advising specialists and i write about the book that something that he was onto six years ago as well. But we certainly see a more subsist sophisticated form of messaging because each constituency through its own niche media whether its fox news, weather his africanamerican radio, i mean on Climate Change the Bush Administration even had a thing for weatherman to get them to hear the White House Position so theres all kinds of ways that media, messages are tailored for specific media in order to read specific constituencies. I wish i had more time but i know you all have other evidence to get to and im getting that no. Ask about the destructive nature of the internet that tom friedman wrote about last week. We will have to talk about it at the tent outside. [applause] thank you all for coming. [applause] [applause] thank you so much. My pleasure. [inaudible conversations] this is the beginning of my library. I have i think one of the larger libraries in the downtown area of savannah. I have roughly 10,000 volumes and mine is not a collectors library. Mine is not a Rare Book Library but mine is a readers library. All i have read most of the books in the collection and those that i havent read i intend to read because i dont accumulate books that i dont intend to read. I tend to pick on the almost anything that relates, is about savannah or people who have been in savannah or heres a book on ted turner for example. And then i have judge lawrences book the storm over savannah. I have rabbi rubens the history of israel synagogue. I have the hunting season or the Hurricane Season by rosemary danielle who wrote fatal flowers and sleeping with soldiers and a number of other racy books about savannah. Most of my books are nonfiction but i occasionally get things like rosemary danielle ari also have here barry k. Andrews who did a savannah blues model. I acquire what is available and whats interesting to me and at any given time i generally have two or three books going and they will likely be on very different subjects. I was reading the biography of aaron burr at the same time i was starting no prices a short history so im reading on Different Things at the same time. Here i have a lot of little trinkets. I have some of my american collection and i have them roughly grouped by president. This is the kennedy shelf and then this is the johnson shelf and then this is the nixon shelf and this is the reagan shelf. And im trying to organize it by that and im beginning to have more books per president than i have and going to have to investigate a different way of doing it. How long is it taking you to do . I have been working at it for about 40 years. Where have you been getting your books from . I buy virtually all my books secondhand. Part of it i think is probably my economy that comes from my scotchirish heritage and whatever but i enjoyed by my books through garage sales and Thrift Stores and things like that and i ordered some over the internet and by a number from local stores as well. But i virtually never by a new book. All of my books are preowned. In this little section of shelves i have my collection of the georgia historical quarterly and then i have a little section on american and english silver. I have my studs terkel who i am a great fan of and in this bit here is books about shakespeare of one sort or another. This is an area where i make use of my Entrance Hall and i put as many oak shelves and as mrs. Mcalister will allow me to put in but i havent these two shelves, these are my civil war collection, like i think southerners are different than other americans that were really more concerned with our history and the question keeps coming up you know why dont you folks get over the civil war . I think we are over the civil war but what we arent over is american heritage. We have so much more history available to us about the civil war period and we could freeze out the revolutionary war period. Heres one that shows the savannah connection. This fellow was an artist and mapmaker and all with the union army and was captured as a p. O. W. And then transferred of the round the various parts of the south. Frequently he was at liberty and was able to make drawings and all. Here is a drawing he made of the confederate p. O. W. Camp in savannah. He was here in september of 1864 if he had been here in december he could have met general sherman but this was apparently in forsyth park because we have here the forts that still exists there. Some of the other buildings around here are a little harder to identify but this is the sort of thing im interested in, something that relates to savannah and savannahs history and then carries me onto some other things. One of my real challenges is keeping up with which books i have and which books i wanted. I get mixed up between the ones i have and the ones i want so i have a computer inventory. I use an excel spreadsheet and what i do is i assigned each book a number as it comes into the collection. Its entirely arbitrary but i have penciled the number in the front on the inside front cover. This is book 1666. My numbers go up to 10,000. Thats how i know ive gotten that many volumes and then when one comes out of the collection i erase it from inventory and reassigned a number. Do you have any particular favorites in your collection . I favorites is whatever im reading currently and i just finished up the biography of aaron burr that i mentioned earlier called aaron burr american rascal. But its just whatever im reading at the time. I started last night bill bryce s a short history of almost anything and im well into that one now so that is my favorite at the moment. Next week there will be a new favorite. Next on the savannah book festival, Gail Lumet Buckley talks about her book the black calhouns from civil war to civil rights with one African American family. [applause] [applause] thank you very much. Thank you very much for being here. Im delighted to be a beautiful savannah. I have asked to speak a little bit about myself to say what role books played in my life and how i first became interested in writing. I think the important thing to begin with is that i was born in 1937 and therefore have seen some pretty important changes in American Life. I graduated from red with college in 1959 which means i had a harvard education. I wish i had studied more and enjoyed myself less. [laughter] after college i had a terrific job as a reporter at life magazine, a job i loved even though i was paid less than a man doing the same work. Life is probably where he first thought about writing as a career. Part of being born in 1937 and most young women with College Degrees got interesting is ill paying jobs and then quit to get married. I gave up life because my first husband wished me to. I did not work again for 15 years. I have been married twice. My first husband was a film director and my second husband was a journalist Foreign Correspondent and editor. I have two wonderful children and to delight the grandchildren. Because i was basically an only child with a mother who was a voracious reader books have always played an enormous part in my life as i traveled in the summers with my mother. I dont see how i could have gotten through childhood and adolescence without books from dr. Doolittle and nancy drew to 17th summer and the catcher in the rye which the house maker in my Quaker Boarding School called us get it from my room as unsuitable. [laughter] i remember certain great traveling book moments, for example reading moby dick straight through nonstop on a train from new york to california which may be the best way to read moby dick. [laughter] discovering any favorite hg wells because he was the only englishlanguage author and the library of the french transatlantic liner and arriving in london to have my mother greet me by immediately thrusting a book into my hands and think you have to read this. It was the first james bond. [laughter] i have been asked about my life and what inspired my latest book. The idea of a life in letters amuses me because it makes me think of brilliant and prolific people who write all day and talk about books all night. My life in letters is sporadic intermittent and my first book was published in 1986. My second book was published in 2001 and my third book was published in 2016. I clearly have not had a life in letters. But all three of my books have been inspired by the same family stories read my first book was inspired by things found in my grandfathers trunk and family mementos, my second book the American Patriot was inspired by my great uncle who died as an officer in the First World War and my third and current book tells the story of the black calhouns of atlanta the founding family. Do are the black calhouns . They werent extended, a typical africanamerican family who from 1865 to 1965 north and south were also typically american in their dreams and aspirations. They were typically american because theyre founding father my great great grandfather Moses Calhoun implicitly believed in the American Dream rate although he was a slave until he was 35 he was culturally and geographically and historically lucky. He was lucky because despite laws mandating a literacy for blacks he had been educated in slavery. His owner Andrew Bonaparte Calhoun and atlanta physician first assigned article of recession wanted a letter at that layer was powerful enough to ignore the laws. Moses was geographically running because he lived in town and not on a plantation. And he was historically lucky because the great new reconstruction amendments to the constitution made him everything he needed for freedom besides the 13th amendment which made him truly free, the 14th gave him a quality under the law and the 15th gave him the vote. He was therefore an american citizen with all the rights of every other american citizen. An enterprising and intelligent man moses take advantage of everything that reconstruction had to offer. I dont know what would have happened to my great great grandfather without reconstruction but with it he was able to create a successful life for himself and his family and to utilize his skills and abilities to amass enough money and property so that in 1886, 20 years after the end of the war the atlanta constitution would call him the wealthiest man in atlanta. The black calhouns moses and his mother and sister had a Family Business with andrew calhoun. Moses was a butler, his mother was a crook and his sister was a nursemaid. They were considered favored slaves. Ap calhoun appeared to be relatively benevolent and generous owner. After the war he deeded property to moses mother and sister. The story of the black calhouns is the story of the family of moses his descendents would prosper in the north and the family of moses sister whose descendent state and propers prospered in atlanta. From 1865 to 1965 the black calhouns live to the civil rights century surely the most volatile American Century of all. It was both a wonderful and a terrible century for black americans. On the one hand it was a century of freedom, aspiration and achievement. On the other hand for most of freedom was ephemeral except for a lucky few the doors of aspiration and achievement were closed. Its important to remember american slaves were freed without compensation, preparation or education. American emancipation compared to britains for example was very badly done. Pretend mandated education for the exslaves. Reconstruction officially only lasted 10 years but its spirit would be indelibly great on the psyches of all the through the generations. They not only believed in america that believes they had a role to play in the progress of their country and community. As might be expected the black calhouns who moved north fulfill their aspirations and achieve success. Less expected perhaps those who stayed in atlanta had equal eight successful and aspirational lives in some ways even more successful. Northern parents could raise their children where there were no whites only signs and libraries and parks but high achievement was the norm on both sides of the family with interesting differences. Northern achievement and it didnt be professional and private. The other differences were personal. Among the black calhouns northern marriage is tended to be unhappy and families more dysfunctional with more divorce, adultery etc. While southern marriages were longerlasting and seem to be happier. My personal theory is the fewer social and political choices and opportunities southerners turned inward toward family, church and community from northerners have more choices, they also had more temptations. Moses calhoun waited until he was freed to marry. At 36 he found a bride who is 15 years younger, looks white and had been born free in new orleans. The two beautiful daughters cora and leyna calhoun were both highly educated and the socalled missionary schools that sprang up all over the old confederacy after the war. Sponsored by white northern philanthropists and mostly staffed by white northern teachers the schools and colleges and still constants as well as rigorous academic into their students who are being trained to become the first black teachers in the south. Couric graduated from Atlanta University and leyna graduated from disk in nashville tennessee where massachusetts youth named w. E. B. Dubois named willie who was prepping for harvard fell hopelessly in love with her. Back in the berkshire mountains of massachusetts for Dubois Family had lived in freedoms of the colonial days young willie was a star student and star athlete but he had never before seen such constant young man or beautiful girls as he saw in the south and he was bowled over by what he described in his autobiography as the rosie apricot beauty of 16yearold leyna calhoun of atlanta. Dubois famously named his fellow black teachers the talented tenth, the 10 of the black race whose job was to uplift the other 90 . Both calhoun girls married successful young man. Breaking Willie Dubois heart leyna buried it older this graduated became the principal of and later in the black middle class way being something of a renaissance man a successful ophthalmologist in chicago. Her older sister cora at journalists editor teacher known as the adonis of the new grove press and their cousin the daughter of moses sister mary to graduate of Atlanta University who became very prosperous and highly respected first black license real estate agent. They moved north and they wake up plesea v. Ferguson the Supreme Court decision that entrenched white supremacy. The cousins are named remained in atlanta. Cora and ed when moved to new york city to raise their four sons, two of whom were born in the north and brooklyn. When a former bug and activist became a democrat. Writing pamphlets for the 1910 election that black man for the first time led the Republican Party and elected democrat as governor of new york. The successful work on behalf of black tammany in new york its first black National Guard unit became the famous during his 69th regiment known as harlem zone the most highly decorated American Unit in the First World War. Although it flawed under the french flag because racist president Woodrow Wilson did not want blacks to bear arms for america. Coras oldest son Second Lieutenant erold of the punch of your Campaign Died in the war not in battle but in the 1918 influenza pandemic. Black life in the south was also touched by the world war. The granddaughter of moses sister married a young medical officer, wartime captain who became one of the most beloved members of atlantas black community and the father and grandfather of three more doctors. While life in the south remains difficult for blacks in general for some atlanta blacks in particular life was very good indeed. The Business Culture rather than a planter culture atlanta always had one eye on Northern Investment as well as punish certain lab political aspirations, it barely punished a black vision is aspirations. A planter made a good place for familyoriented blacks. Cora horne pitcher member of the talented tenth came into her own during the war as a red cross organizer and secretary of the brooklyn urban leaguer, as a director of the big brothers and Big Sisters Federation where she was a mentor to the very young paul ropes and as an appointee by the mayor of new york to the brooklyn victory committee. The war warriors were actually coras slow years. The former suffragist became an activist in the 1920s after she got the vote. Meanwhile in 1919 she made her granddaughter leyna horne the child of her second son edwin noticed had a lifetime member of naacp the naacp at the age of two. [laughter] cora was a busy woman and evelyn horan was a successful man. But they had an unhappy marriage. Handsome and debonair eglin was known to have a lady friend in manhattan. His son my grandfather ted also had an unhappy marriage despite despite both of my mothers young parents deserted her before she was to pay it after making small killing on the black socks baseball scandal in 1919 ted warned left is good tammany patronage job to pursue money on the fringes of the wreck as well ninas mother and member of the family for massachusetts left pursue an unsuccessful theatrical career. Until she was six years old leyna horne with the broken with her grandparents were her grandmother never spoke to her husband except to say good morning mr. Horn. Postwar black life in the north change radically in the 1920s. Now a voter cora horne became a republican activist certainly for historical reasons for certainly to annoy her tammany has been. She campaigned for it Calvin Coolidge as a member of the Speakers Bureau for the Republican Party and a National Organizer and secretary of Eastern Division of the Republican National womens auxiliary. Something else happened in the 1920s. Suddenly harlem was in vogue. Not just in new york but around the world. Harlem stemmed from a combination of reason from the fact that harlem nightclubs protected by compliant mayor happily ignore prohibition to the discovery of african tribal art in former german colonies which caused picasso to change the faces of his paintings into cubist masks to the smash broadway show a review with the hit song called im just wild about harry and a hit dance called the charleston. To a whole new group of black poets and novelists including coras third son frank horne. Known as the family intellectual frank horne became a prizewinning poet and young secondtier member of the harlem renaissance. In typical black middleclass families he also had a day job like his uncle. He was a practicing ophthalmologist. In the mid1920s Franklin South for the first time to convene and the first acting black present as an industrial industrial which could have been a model for the college in the invisible man. Frank wrote, but his new southern experience. I am initiated into the need for a raise it from now on im the enter of side doors and backdoors and sometimes no door at all. Meanwhile cora horne southern cousin and her daughters married prosperous husbands were also club women but of a very different nature. Middle class lexow and women concentrated on selfimprovement rather than do good things are uplifting the race which could be dangerous occupations in the 1920s self. They formed a circle to discuss horticulture, lecture and foreign travel but politics were forbidden and do gooding was strictly through atlantas first congregational church. Coras granddaughter little leyna now had her own for southern experience. In 1923 leynas mother wanted her daughter with her but most electrostrangers. Pull between her secure brooklyn life and wherever her mother was in the south. Young leyna who went to a Measure School and a Roman Catholic Primary School in brooklyn now attended oneroom southern schoolhouses were the other children always hated her. In 1927 however leynas life changed completely when her mother eloped to havana with the white cuban military officer. For the next two years leyna remained in the south happy at last living next to her uncle franks uncle and her fiance. As assistant director of the division of me grow affairs and the new deals National Youth administration. In 1929 leyna went back to brooklyn permanently where her beloved grandfather took her to museums in the theater. She was so smitten by fred astaire on broadway that she asked for and received singing and dancing lessons. Both leading to starring roles and middleclass black brooklyns young amhert just theaters. Everything changed for leyna in 1932 however when cora horne died and her mother returned from cuba with her husband paid now a refugee from the latest revolution they spoke no english. Needing money for leynas mother took her out of Girls High School to audition for the chorus of the worldfamous cotton club, a big glamorous showcase of lack talent for all white audiences in the middle of the black community. Lindas father ted was one of the rare blacks allowed in to see the show because his best friend of former world war i black officer was now the numbers king of harlem. Leyna, 16 years old and beautiful his mother whose mother protected her virtue by sitting in the dressing room every night was also famously protect if protected by the black mob. By 1935 however leyna was ready to move on against the wishes of the cotton club. Lenos mother spirited her away to boston to sing with the Society Orchestra meaning black musicians playing white music at the ritzcarlton hotel. It was the first black orchestra and she was the first black singer to appear. Leyna sang blue moon in a white dress and one a harvard fan club came every night. Leyna 19 years old and hard of show business as well as her mother hovering in the dressing room took a vacation on her own to visit her father who lived in pittsburgh where he owned a small hotel with a discrete private gambling den. In pittsburgh leyna met and married my father 28yearold lewis jones who had a patronage job in City Government and his older lawyer brothers were important black democratic war politics. Leyna was now young housewife and occasional forays and this is mostly because her husband who played highstakes bridge and unknown to leyna never gave up his former girlfriend needed the money. Despite the birth of my baby brother bill teddy leyna finally aware of lewis philandering called an end to the marriage. Leaving the chilled with her father and stepmother in 1940 she went back to new york to look for work. Living at the harlem ywca leyna had the calhoun luck. Charlie barnett was the most popular band to hit the 1940 records who was looking for a girl singer. Big bands of the 1930s and 40s were like 1960s rock groups in popularity. Barnett, shah and Bennie Goodman were the only bigband leaders who hired black singers for musicians. Leyna was tired and hated touring. She wanted to be in a with her children. She now got another career break singing in a cafe society in greenwich village. Cafe society was unique in its day. Besides presenting extraordinary young talents like delay holiday and zero mostel was the only integrated maglev outside of harlem with black patrons as well as performers. Leyna was an enormous hit it unbeknownst to most performers and patrons however cafe society was a fundraising outlet for the comments party usa. As the american comments party was none. If she had known leyna doubted they would care. She did not know economies from a republican. But in the 1950s every performer who appeared at cafe society would be blacklisted. Now however she was able to bring leyna abdel teddy to new york. Little teddys visit was shortlived however. Lewis grewal divorce agreement stipulated that teddy lived with her father but my mother and i were sent to live further away. Because effort cafe Society Success leyna had received an offer from hollywood not from the movies but in the night of called the little once again she was an overnight sensation with lines around the block. One man became night after night with mgms robert eaton bank man to discover judy garland. Talent and beauty one leyna a longterm contract. The first in hollywood for a black performer. But it might not have happened without world war ii. Leyna arrived in hollywood at the same time welterweight of the naacp. In 1940 republican president ial candidate Wendell Willkie began their campaign with colin would producers to eliminate degrading racist stereotypes of people of color including lax asians and and for the sake of wartime allies. Thus leyna whose contract brokered by her father stipulated no servant or jungle worlds was almost singlehandedly expected to prove to the allies that america unlike germany and japan was not a racist country. Selena became known as the first black movie star said she became the first black member of the board of Screen Actors Guild and the first black person to appear on the cover of the movie magazine. Despite allies of color however her scenes were always isolated so they could easily be cut out of the picture they were showing in the south. In fact in Stormy Weather she was cut out of every pictures she ever made in hollywood when they were shown in the south. Unless the cast was all black the southern rules stipulated that blacks and movies could only be shown as server and types. Those nightclubs considered, continued to be hugely important theatrical venues for leyna from harlems cotton glove to bostons ritzcarlton to the cafe society to and now in late 1942 while she was waiting for her first movie to be produce she became the first black entertainer to appear at manhattans very elegant plaza hotel. Once again she was an overnight sensation. So while months that she was featured in time life in newsweek all in the same february 1943 weeks. Nightclubs gave leyna recognition but world war ii made her a star. Black g. I. S needed a pen up and into was always embarrassed that she was the only one. While two atlantic cousins married Tuskegee Airmen leyna was chosen as queen of the 99 squadron, their combat arm. She toured black army camps was kicked out of the uso for refusing to sing at a camp in arkansas for black g. I. S were forced to sit behind german prisoners of war for her shows. Her grandmother was not proud. Postwar years on many changes in leynas life did wonder were shut and others were opened. By 1947 her movie career was essentially over but her life performing career went from strength to strength in 1947 she went to europe for the first time. She had Great Success during the wartorn british isles. She although Stormy Weather were deemed unfit for white g. I. S they have had been shown throughout the british sleepy chosun had a success in paris where more importantly she married her second husband a white mgm conductor composer arranger who became a wonderful stepfather. He came home to find a blacklist which began in 1947 with the hollywood 10 all screenwriters and former communist Party Members went to prison refusing to testify before congressional committee. The black list ultimately touched all professions and walks of life they have leyna was finally named in 1950 when she was red channel. Leynas crimes included her parents and cafe society and especially her friendship with two men w. E. B. Dubois and paul words then. Because they were actually her grandparents friends the relationships were more dutiful than political. Hollywood communists had indeed would leyna but paul rovers and in fact warned her against them. In reality he leyna was one of the luckier black artist. Although banned from network tv for 10 years and movies for six years heard nightclub career and touring career never suffered. In the days before tv people home at night she remained one of the highestpaid performers, nightclub performers in the world. By 1957 she was cleared by the lackluster is concerned in the hit broadway musical. Broadway by the way basically ignore the blacklist. Nina wasnt the only black coffin to be suspect. Frank warren came under his own black listing clout in washington where he was investigated by the Civil Servant service while supporting the founder of the National Committee against his permission housing. Supposedly he had an americanism. Blacklisting was an excuse for racism and antisemitism. A properly enough the modern Civil Rights Era began in 1960 and koro horns, monitor. In 1860 a fullpage ad appeared in the atlanta constitution. We the students of the institutions forming the Atlanta University center have joined our hearts, minds and bodies in the cause of gaining those rights which are apparently hours as members of the human race and the citizens of these United States. We must say in all candor with plan to use every legal and nonviolent means at our disposal to secure full Citizenship Rights as members of this great democracy of ours. That same year a Young Atlanta cousin Moses Calhoun great great grand ace was chosen to be one of the desegregation of the atlanta high school. Until her mother during the dramatic of people surrounding integration in Little Rock Central High School had second thoughts and her to a massachusetts boarding school. Meanwhile in the north leyna threw herself under the Civil Rights Movement preaching and Frank Sinatra produced the famous two night Carnegie Hall benefit. One night it benefited the Student Nonviolent Coordinating Committee the youth branch of the southern christian leadership conference. Leyna went to jackson mississippi. The organization which she had enrolled at the age of two to join medgar evers at a Voting Rights rally two days before he was assassinated. She went to the march on washington and she recorded a civil rights song called now that was banned from the radio in several states. The enemies of civil rights had very powerful weapons at their disposal but the Civil Rights Movement won the high moral ground early in the lone arc of justice ultimately turned towards american blacks. The larger and more systemic aspect of official racism were defeated in what could be called the second civil war. It was a strange war waged on one side by churches, children and young people and waged on the other by murderers, terrorists snarling dogs and fire hoses. Despite martyrs Voting Rights were achieved in jim crow was officially dismantled. By 1973 the city of atlanta city that famously became had a black mayor and former students at the Atlanta University manifesto were now in charge of municipalities. Although the 1970s were personally more for leyna who lost her father and husband and son between 1971 in 1972 and 1980s on other extraordinary change in the prayer of Moses Calhouns great granddaughter. She opened in a onewoman broadway show that brought brocker every honor and accolade none the theater. The 1980s were a decade of honors for black collins north and south did in march 1981 the same month that saw the triumph of broadway return dr. Homer nash the great grandson of moses sister died at the age of 94 and in the words of the atlanta constitution he was the longest practicing black doctor in georgia and the longest practicing dr. Of any race at atlanta. You could call the black calhouns lucky. They were never selfish achievers pay they shared their bounties with the community and their country. Its fair to say that the black calhouns is as much the story of america as it is of a family. Thank you. [applause] [applause] i moved down for questions . Anybody have questions . Microphone is here. I can hear you, yes. To brooklyn Girls High School, and she went to Catholic Church in brooklyn. She was a total she adored brooklyn. She was a total brooklyn girl. I grew up in the 30s and 40s in brooklyn which were great years yes. To grow up in brooklyn. Thank you very much. Thank you. Any other nonbrooklyn questions or [laughter] id like to know what favorite story you have with your mother. Oh, of my mother . Oh, my goodness. Thats a difficult question. That is a difficult question. Well the james bond story is one of them. She didnt even like say hi. She said you have to read this book when i walked in the door. That is one of my favorites. She was a fun mom. I didnt see her all of the time but when i did on christmas, summer vacations, and holidays it was total fun. That was the good part. Yes . The microphone is off. [inaudible question] she loved the history especially french history. She knew about all of the queens of france. She loved that. She was a reader because she always felt uneducated because her mother took her out of school. Everybody around her was bright and she felt really uneducated so she read and read. She was selftaught basically. In the south, in the oneroom School Houses she was the teachers pet even though the children hated her and her accent and everything about her. But she was the teachers pet so she didnt receive bad education. Thank you for your question. Would you share the way your mother did Stormy Weather called the lady and the music . She did Stormy Weather two times. Yeah, the question is why hoar how did my mother sing Stormy Weather twice in her onewoman broadway show. She did it twice because the first time was how she swauz was told in hollywood. You spoke to the sound recording and had to make your face perfect. She was told to think of irene dunn. The second time she sang it was how she would sing it at her age then and it was much fulling and the critics noticed that. [inaudible comment] thank you. [applause] any other questions . I hope you are going to buy books. [inaudible question] very little. I sing christmas carols. That is about it. So i think we are going to go across the street. [applause] thank you. [inaudible conversations] we are standing in savannahs city market. This would have been the place where the urban slaves would come sell their wares. They were able to pick from the garden and come out on sunday and sell their wares. I want to talk about the fact that urban savannah was a workforce. The institution of slavery was a little different in savannah was there was literally one degree of separation. The enslaved people lived where their owners lived but a lot lived a way from their owners. In 1801 it became law that it took an act of the legislature to free a slave instead of the last willing testament. So with the act of the legislature it rarely happened. So in savannah the urban slaves became nominal slaves and were slaves only in time. They would be hired out for work and be paid. One example would have been in the 1850s here in this building on ellis square where halcyon, the pastor of the third Baptist Church, had a butcher shop. He was an enslaved man and paid his owner 50 a month so he could work at his butcher shop. This building has a powerful history. On the top store you had a slave part. This building was built by a man name john mcmullem in 18541857. The land was valued at 4500 and went to 8700. It is three floors high and has a below Ground Holding area apparently that would have been with the enslaved people were kept. They were brought up in chains and taken to the third floor of the building. The middle window was where the Auction Block was. The window on the side was the room where the woman would have changed their clothes. Halcyon is interviewed after the american civil wars and talks about hearing the screams and cries of the thousands of africans who were taken up to be sold into the slavery here at the slave mark. The builder didnt live as long as the slave market survived. It was eight years this was a slave mart. The builder met an unfortunate death blown up in a steamer and his body broad here to be buried. Alexander brian was the next owner and he was selling slaves as general sherman came up the west side to get the city of savannah that would eventually surrender in the event of the war. And what else happened here . Alexander brian had a sign out front saying brians slave mart. The next year this build became the school for free blacks. James lynch came down and they went into this building and found the bill of sales they were selling the slaves on, turned them over and used them for paper to for the students to write on. They marched from the first african Baptist Church, 400 black people, for it to be the first freed school here in the set city of savannah in 1865. This weekend booktv is live in savannah, georgia for the ninth annual savannah book festival. Lets look at authors that called savannah home. Conrad aikin published his first poetry here. He has received many awards including the National Book award for collected poems in 1954. Aikin was the consultant to the library of congress. Aikin died in his home town of savannah in 1973. Critically acclaimed short story writer flanery oconnor was born in this area. She published a book that was a finalist for a book award. She battled lupus for years before her death. She was awarded a book award for her book the collection of the complete stories of flanery oconnor. James Alan Mcphearson was born here and earned degrees from harvard law, the university of iowa. He was awarded Pulitzer Prize for short essays. He has written books such as 1998 crab cakes he is a professor at the university of iowa college of liberal arts. Bruce frieler is the author of six besttime sellers includes. He writes a weekly column about families for the family section of the New York Times. That wraps up our look at some of savannahs authors. We with standing here in the basement of the second african Baptist Church. And this church tells the story of twice freedom is what i like to say. First of all, second african p baptist was founded in 1802. Reverend cunningham was the reverend. We have trained more ministers in the Baptist Church than any other church in the history of america. What is important to savannah is in 1865 on february 4th it was the site of the 40 acre speech. It was delivered here in this room and behind me is the pulpit that was here in 1865 and here in the benches are the benches the crowd would have been seated on. They were made in 1810 by the members of second african church. They serve a twofold purpose. If there is a minister at the pulpit the benches would be facing front. But for a politician who may not be able to go into the pulpit the benches face the back. You have to wonder where the pulpit was in 1865. The benches are still reversible and similar to the railroad benches. But who knows what happened to the patent in those days. Second african rings true for freedom. In fact they said they talked about shouting up the year of the jubilee has come. The praise of the 3,000 blacks who came here to find out what field order number 15 had to say and field order 15 was the order written after general sherman met with 20 black ministers here in savannah and asked them what they wanted and their answer was land. We want land. And the land assigned to them was a 330 mile track of sea island coast land that was the same plantation a lot of these enslaved people, now free, would have worked on. The question becomes that day with 3,000 people listening where did they go . Did they leave to find the land . Some went from history tells us out to skit island and lived there for a year. Reverend halcyon who was an enslaved minister and worked over in market square. He had a butcher shop there. He was the pastor of the third african Baptist Church. He was one of the 20 ministers who met with sherman. He had been enslaved and was able to hire out his time by paying his master 50 a month so he could hire out time and be a butcher. Reverend halston after freedom and this experience apparently dealing with the 40 acres of taking this group out to the island was a state legislature. We read about the africans who once free got into the politics. But that didnt last long because after reconstruction a lot of that disappeared. At any rate, we are in a historic structure. 1864, i am sorry 18651963 is my twice freedom story because in march of 1963 Martin Luther king came here looking for one of those famous mass meetings. He had been driving around for two hours and finally found the meeting. It said dr. King practices his ending to the famous have a dream speech here at the second african Baptist Church in savannah. Next up from saturdays festival, Steve Osborne talks about his book the job true tales from the life of a new york city cop. How you doing . My name is Steve Osborne and i used to be a new york city cop for 20 years and yes, the accent is real. But the funny thing is i didnt know i had an accent until i came to savannah. I was a cop for 20 years and then became a writer. People ask me how do you go from being a cop to a writer. I dont like telling this story especially at a book festival with other writers because they want to strangle me. It happened by accident. My life went from the last lane to the slow lane after i retired. When you are a cop living that life you have no life. I am working around the clock; nights, weekends, holidays. I am never home. Then all of a sudden i am retired and sitting there starring at the wall. First thing i did was move the sofa from there to there. [laughter] and my wife said to me what are you doing . She goes you havent been home in ten years put that sofa back where it was. So i did. So now i am sitting there and i am kind of board and i dont know why. I guess everybody has that little voice in the back of their head that whispers what to do and that was the same voice that kept me safe like watch out for this and that. It was that same little voice that was whispering in my ear to write. So i grabbed a pad and a pen and i wrote a story. A short story. About 12pages. Something that happened to me on the job. I wrote this, i am looking at it and think what now. So i wanted it to family and friends and i said i just wrote this do you mind reading it and telling me what you think. They read it and they said we didnt know you could write. We didnt know you were that smart. But they loved it. So i was kind of surprised and taken back. So i wrote another and handed it out, everybody read it, and they loved it. So i wrote another. The first one had them crying, the second one had them laughing and i wrote a third one and had them crying again. I had these stories and i was doing it to kill time. What do i do now . It felt good to write. It is hard to explain but the actual act of writing and putting those stories and thoughts and feelings on paper started something in my soul. It was the same way as like at 3 00 in the morning i would be out on patrol. This was where i was supposed to be. Not supposed to be in bed, sleeping, watching a movie with the wife. I was supposed to be out on patrol at 3 00 in the morning chasing bad guys. It stirred something in my soul. I had these stories and everybody told me they liked it but being a cop you are cynical. I figured they were family and friends and telling me what i want to here. But i had a friend who was a writer, a real writer. She wrote a television story, movie and book. I called her up and said read this, tell me if it is no good, it it isnt i will throw the computer out the window and start a garden or something. She reads it and gets back to me and says this is pretty good, i little rough around the edges, but this is pretty good. So i kept writing. Wrote another storstory. About a year later she calls me up and tells me she is doing this show called the moth what a great organization. For those of you that dont know the moth is a group where you get up on stage and regular people tell a real story about their life. They had a cop scheduled to appeal and he had to bail out. So they are stuck. They asked my friend do you know anybody who can fill it . A cop maybe . Sure enough she calls me. The universe works in mysterious ways. She called me up and tells me about this and i tell them and pitch the story over the phone, the next night i am at the players club. Now i thought this was going to be like in the basement of a church with a couple people sitting around doing like this for applause. I show up at the players club and there is like 300 people there. I was never so scared in my whole life and i was involved in thousands of arrest. This was the scariest thing i ever had to do. I wanted to run out the door. I told the producer i would rather be chasing a guy with a gun down a dark alley than get up on that stage. But i got up there and blew the roof off the joint. Everybody liked it. I was a little nervous because the theme of the show was crimes and misdemeanors and the speakers before he had these stories one guy did 20 years for a murder he didnt commit. Another guy is talking about the criminal Justice System and how screwed up it is. And my friend gets up telling about how she was arrested at the Republican Convention and how you can use a baloney sandwich as a pillow in central booking. I figured i was dead meat. I go out up there, told the story and they loved it. I thought that was the end of it. The moth calls saying we are going on a nationwide tour and we want to bring you. Next thing i know i am at ucla in front of 20,000 people. That is what i said. I am not doing that. But i did. And we went to seattle, san francisco, denver. It kind of encouraged me to keep writing. Then the moth puts me on npr and it goes out to 200 radio stations. One day i get a call from an editor and he said i saw your stuff and i think it is imperative you write a book and i said i think you are right. Before i got up and told these stories i would write them out. It helped me flush out the stories in my head. I told him maybe i have half of one of firstdraft stuff. He said send it to me. I said it is firstdraft stuff. I had never written anything before so i didnt know if it was worthy. I send it to him and he said you got an agent . Just so happened that i did. An agent had heard me on npr radio a couple weeks before and said i would like to represent you i told them i like short stories. A cops life is a series of short stories. I may handle 1015 jobs in a night and every job is a story with a beginning, middle, end, different characters, different consequences. A cops life is a series of short stories and that is what i felt comfortable writing. But my agent told me short story isnt the way to go. People dont go for that. Me wanted me to write a memoir. I thought about it and that same thing that little voice it wasnt working. I didnt want to do that. So my agent and i didnt for a couple months. Then the editor from double day calls me up, offers the contract, and i call my agent and say check the email, we have a contract. I had to finish the book which wasnt that tough. I kept writing and writing and finished the book. I would not say it was therapy but i enjoyed it. Every cop out there has Great Stories. You are involved in peoples lives every day and involved during crisis. It just, after doing that for 20 years, you got a million stories. Just not everybody can write it in and put it on paper. So, i wrote the book and as i was writing it through some of the stories i was afraid and like i cannot believe this. They are going to think i am making this stuff up. I wrote one story about a busy night i had. In a fourhour period, really, a fourhour period i had a 17yearold kid shot, two women stabbed in a family dispute that went crazy, and i had a 24yearold kill fall out a fourth floor window at a party and right before he hit the ground he clipped the back of his headon the fire hydrant. I was on my hands and knees and talked to him while he died. I looked at my watch and thought all of that happened in four hours. Nobody is going to believe this. But it is true. That is a cops life. And the next night it was probably quite. But every night when you go to work you dont know what is going to happen from one minute to the next. I didnt want to write about some things. I felt selfconscious writing about this but it was 9 11. I think if i didnt write about it there would have been a hole in the book. The first couple days i dont remember much. It was a blur to me. When i hook up with guys with me at the time they say the same thing. They remember something vividly. They have no recollection. I remember something vividly and they cant remember. All of us the first couple days it is a blur. And after that i was working 12 hours on and 12 hours off for the next four months. We got assigned to the morgue and our job was to identify the remains coming in. I could not write about what i saw and did. Those are peoples family members. I think i wrote about my feelings and how i dealt with it and you get a good picture about what happened. You might find it hard to believe but there was one funny story about 911. You might find it hard to believe but i was assigned to the morgue and my friends 80yearold mother called the house, nobody heard me from in days, my friends mother called and said how is steven doing . And she goes steven is in the morgue. [laughter] and she is a little hard of hearing, too. But she got that much. And she is like, oh, i am so sorry. And my wife is like no, it is okay. A lot of wives dont know where their husbands are. At least we know where he is. From there the story gets blurry. We dont know how it spread but it spread. There was this one bar down in jersey shore i used to hang out in and knew all of the guys there and they heard i was in the morgue. None of them knew my wife no nobody felt comfortable calling the house to find out the arrangements. They thought they would hear about it. Finally after two months i get a couple days off and i am like i need a beer. I walk into the front door of the bar and it was like they saw a ghost. Before doing this, i never wrote anything. I hated writing. I had to write Police Reports and hated them. I kept everything to a minimum. A lot of guys dressed up the reports with big words. I kept mine basic and simple. Even when i was a kid i wasnt a good student in school. I was a solid c student, you know. You know, on my best day at that. I dont know if anyone went to Catholic School but sister kathleen used to beat the crap out of me on a regular bases and remind me i wasnt going to amount to nothing. I wish she could see me now. Writing was never on my radar. When i was writing i found it funny. I kind of enjoyed looking at the stupid things i did like you know the dumb things you do as a rookie. Like chasing a guy down a subway tunnel who just did a robbery. Why i didnt think a train might be coming . At the time the adrenaline is pumping ask i just i dont know. I didnt think in the likely event a train would come. But i am still here to talk about it. When i was a kid my father was a cop. I guess that is where where learned about the job from the inside out. I saw it through him. And he worked at a prison not too far from our house and sometimes my father made him dinner and she would say bring this to your father. I would come up on my bicycle and bring him dinner and i would not leave. I mind be sitting lined the desk with the desk sergeant and people were coming in telling sad stories and here is a 12yearold kid sitting here listening. I thought this was the life for me. When his buddies came around the house they were the coolest guys in the world. They were real men and i wanted to be like them. I knew i never wanted to be a doctor or a lawyer or astronaut. I wanted to be the guy standing over the dead guy in the middle of the street trying to figure out who killed them. Writing took me by surprise. And in 20 years of police work, it gives you plenty to write about. Sometimes writers get mad about me like this whole writing thing happened by accident. I paid my dues. 20 years out in the street in new york city you pay your dues and that is where i was doing my research. In the back of my head i was recording these things i did and it gave me plenty of stuff to write about. I guess i feel lucky. I feel lucky because when you write like that, like i said, it stirs something in your soul. It gives you when i left the Police Department my life was empty and writing filled that void. It is good to think back because you forget all of the things you did. I remember being a desk sergeant in a busy prestinct. I am sitting there and the front door flies open and this guy comes through the door covered in blood and another guy chasing him with a pipe. I am jumping over the desk, wrestling and fighting and trying to get the pipe away. It turned out to be two homeless guys chipping in on a beer and one guy took a bigger sip than the other guy. Two hours later i am sitting on the desk again looking at this big piece of peeling paint waiting for it to fall down and the door burst open. Some guy with bagpipes comes bursting into the station house, does a couple laps, plays some song like out of braveheart i am looking at him and all of a sudden he marches out the door and down the block and you hear the bagpipes fade away and i am like i love this job. This is like the greatest job in the world. I am sure a lot of people have questions. If you want i could take a few questions from you. Can you come up to the microphone so cspan can hear you . You have to speak into the mic o microphone. I have two questions. I am from new york. Where is the 9th presinct . Lower east side. From broadway to the east river. I was there and you know during the 80s and 90s when new york city was the wild west. I go there now and i dont recognize the place. Now i have three questions. Go ahead. Keep going how did the neighborhood change while you were there . And if you could tell us if the writing was therapeutic did anything help you really work through something that happened one time . And then the funniest one um, new york changed like you cannot imagine. Like the Lower East Side when i was down there it was the wild west. Streets i used to walk down with a gun in my hand inside a coat pocket because it was so dangerous now there are cafes out there and people are sipping coffees. Moms are going into the parks that were war zones and now they are pushing baby carriages. Writing was therapeutic. There is a lot of funny stories but there is a lot of sad stories. And you would think that the book would be filled with all of this action and adventure and there is. There is a couple stories where guys pulled guns on me. I had a gun in my face fighting for my life and those are good stories. I enjoy them. But it is the stories of being in peoples lives and the interaction between two human beings. You would think the first story i wrote would be a car chase with shots fired or a homicide but it wasnt. I dont know why. But the first story i wrote was the first time i had to tell a parent that their child was dead. And their child was in the other room and she had been dead for a few days and her body was badly decompo decomposed and mom wanted to go into the that room. She wasnt going to believe her child was dead until she saw the body and i could not let that happen. I was a rookie at the time. I was about 25 years old. This was not my job. Somebody else, detective, sergeant, somebody. But nobody else was available. It was sunday morning, it had to be done now, and it fell upon me. In police work, especially as a young cop, you are confronted with difficult situation and you have to rise to the situation. You are in these peoples lives at the most difficult time and you have to rise to the occasion. I dont know how i did it. We were in the hallway and i sat mom down on the steps and i didnt know what to say. I stopped thinking about what to say and started feeling and melted down. I took her hand in mine and it looked like i was proposing marriage or something but i took her hand in mine and convinced her it was best to remember her daughter the way she was and not the way she is. It worked. When i walked into that building that morning i was young, like 25 years old and a rookie, but a couple hours later when i walked out i felt i had grown and matu matu matu matured and become more of the cop i wanted to be. Next question . [applause] do you miss it . The actual work. And does writing about it give you a chance to do it again . Yes, i do miss it. We always say that you miss the guys. Other cops, they become like family to you. You know, you go through these incredible adventures with these guys. My life depends on my partner and my Partners Life depends on me. There is a bond there. I will meet guys i know from 30 years ago and we are still friends. We still have that bond because we went through something that most people dont. You know my life depended on him being there when the whole world turned to crap and his life depended on mine. You develop friendships and bonds that lost forever. I still have one of my First Partners we hang out together all of the time. I miss the guys. I miss the adventure. I always say new york city cop is the ride of adventure you can ride the craziest roller coaster in the world is not going to get you there. It is like being a Fighter Pilot and then going to work for american airlines. I am a yankee fan. I grew up in the bronx. Welcome to savannah by the way. What was your opinion on stop and frisk . Did it work . And should we keep doing it . I knew somebody was going to ask me that question. I knew it. The one thing i will say is stop and frisk works. What happened was in the old days guys would be walking down the street with guns in their wai waistbands. Somebody would step on someones shoe or look at you the wrong way or walk down the block you should not walk down and the next thing you know it is like dodge city and they are shooting it up. We were going out with stop and frisk and stopping a lot of people and throwing them on the wall and frisking them. And all of the bad guys knew you could not go Walking Around with a gun in your waste waistband. Half the time by the time he got back the other guy was gone or the situation diffused. Stop and frisk did work. Back in the 80s we were a reactive Police Department. Respond to reports, react, and try to make arrest. And we went from reactive to proactive and prevent crimes. If you would have asked me in the early 80s and 90s if major crime could have been reduced by 90 i would have said you are nuts. I would never have believed that in a million years. I would not think it was possible but it was done because of a more proactive approach to policing. I worked in new york city on Williams Street and came down here and saw this. It is a copy done by tiffany of a medal for the first cop killed in new york city. And the yankees said this will be our symbol. Did you know that . No, i didnt the mayor is responsible for cleaning up the city or gets the credit. Did he contribute to keeping new york city safe . How safe is new york city yet . Whether you like jewel ony or you dont you have to give credit where credit is due. We watched reports and watched the crime go up. It took him to say we can do something about it. Back then you could not leave a brown paper back in your car without somebody breaking into it to see what was in there. Back then we had 40,000 cops. We had an army. They always knew we could do something about it but somebody had to lead the charge. And they said whether you like him or you dont you have to give credit where credit is do and he showed something could be done. Mayors and Police Commissioners after that, you know, followed suit. And now, new york city, some of the neighborhoods that i used to work in were war zones. It was insane. One time my wife calls me up, im in my office, working in the bronx, and talking to her on the own and she is complaining to me about the credit card bills. And right outside my Office Window bam bam bam. There is a driveby shooting on the station block. Gunshots are echoing through the window and i am covering the phone, not wanting her to hear it because she will go nuts, and i am saying i got to go. And she is saying the bills are killing us this month you dont understand and i want to tell her Something Else just got killed down the block. I could not tell her that. I had to hang up the phone, run down the street, gun in hand into who knows what. Back then we went from like 2200 homicides to you know like around 300. It is incredible the reduction in crime. I am proud to say i was there. I was part of it along with all of the other cops and i watched it happen. It was incredible to watch. I was at a Christmas Party of one of my old commands. I was talking to these young cops. I am the old cop now. I was talking to the cop that does crime analysis and i said how many robberies are you doing a month these days . You can tell the barometer of the community by the street robberies. And very seriously she said about 12. I said 12 . Are you kidding me when i was there we were doing an absolute minimum of 120 a month. And that was only the ones that got reported. Half the time people got robbed, figured what was the use, went home and never made a report. 12 was an astounding number. I remember during a blizzard we had eight. Now they do 12 in a month. New york city is such a different place. I kick myself. Some of the neighborhoods i worked in there was abandoned buildings and empty lots and if i would have had half a brain in my head i would have bought one of those empty lots and i would be a millionaire but i didnt think the city would every turn around like it has. It is a completely different city. In fact, i bought real estate in the east village so thanks for cleaning it up. You are welcome. Obvious question, if you love the business, why did you retire after 20 years . And the other question is how often did you eat at cats deli . Why did i retire. You get to retire after 20 years and there is a reason. Police work burns you out. It eats you over time. I was walking my dog and bumped into a cop and the dogs are talking and we started talking and he tells me he is retired detective and he said he retired because he was burnt out and it took a year to get healthy again. The nights and weekends you dont eat right, you dont sleep right, working around the clock. For years i hardly went to bed or woke up at the same time every day. It is a very unhealthy life style and you cannot do it forever. Everybody says they know when it is time to retire and i knew. I knew the exact day and second when i decided to retire. I was a Commanding Officer in the manhattan gang squad. It was a very busy place. This was about a year after 9 11. At that point i thought i had seen everything and done everything and i was burnt out and just didnt have it in any me more. A couple months before we had a homicide that was a gangrelated homicide, a guy killed another guy in front of his pregnant wife. She is standing there like six months pregnant watching her husband die. I mean there is not much more i mean what is sadder than that . And i always loved the job. I wasnt any smarter than anybody else or more clever but i was tenacious. When i was after a guy i never gave up. The guy who did this was a mexican gang member. He had no roots in the community. He was an illegal immigrants. He had no way to track him down. There was no house where he grew up, no father, mother, or girlfriend. He picked up and he left. A couple months later he got a tip from an informant we might find him out on the corner looking for day work. One of the detectives who had the case comes in and tells me how about we go up there the next couple days and stake it out and see if we can find them. Gang leaders get my juices flowing. There is Nothing Better than getting a guy like that. I was sitting at my desk, feet up, eating cold pizza and only had four hours of sleep and nothing happened. I was dumb. I was dead. I just couldnt get the juices flowing anymore and at that second i said it is time for me to pull the plug. I wasnt the type of guy to go get a job at headquarters wearing a suit and carrying a clipboard. That is when i decided it was time to go and i did. I am from new jersey. Across the street from the river. I have a younger daughter who went to school in the bronx for four years and lives in manhattan and i would like to say thanks to you and the rest of the Police Department for keeping everybody safe. It is definitely a safer place today. [applause] my question is i dont know if it started with the murder of the two police men in brooklyn, i think it was, where the current mayor had a difficult time with his relationship with the police force and the services and that type of thing. I guess my question is do you know if he is doing anything to improve his relationship with the police force . Has he made any progress . You know i wrote a book; right . Yeah. Back when those two officers were killed and i wrote an opted for the New York Times actually. In the emergency room the cops turned their back on the mayor when he went in to the emergency room to see the officers. And people were upset about it. But i dont think it wasnt a well calculated plan. Everybody knew he had no use for cops. That is what he campaigned on. The tale of two cities and the oppressive Police Department. All of the cops felt he had no use for cops. That night when it happened and he was walking in with two dead beloved brothers in the other room i think they just felt he was there because he had to be there and that is why they turned their backs on him. Um, he has gotten better with the police. I mean this is just my opinion but i think he has gotten better because he knows he has to. New york city, you can imagine what it would be like without the cops. It is so much better than it was in the old days and he knows that. I think because of politics he has to be better with the police. It would be bad politics to beat up the police because Everybody Knows what improvements were made. I think he is doing it because he has do. And like i said that is just my opinion. Is the lieutenant commissioner still Bradley Kelly . I dont think either one of them personal. But it is difficult to say. Like, bill bratton now i feel like he is the right guy for the job. With all of the anticop sentiment around the country and in new york he just when i see him on television i feel like he is the right guy for the job at this time. And when he was commissioner the first time that is when the whole broken windows things started and ray kelly became the pc and they ran with it. And they just kept going and going and crime kept going down. Who is better i wouldnt say who is better but i can say ray kelly did a great job. As a cop, when i would see him on the news, i mean we had some Police Commissioners in the past that i wasnt crazy but but when i would see him it made you proud and he represented the Police Department well. Now bratton is i think he has a difficult job with a mayor that i dont know what his relationship is with the mayor, but i am sure he has a very difficult job. I think he is the right guy for the job right now. So back to your book. Thank you. I know you did your research with your life. But i am wondering memory was play tricks on you and stuff. I am imaging that you then had to go back to your Police Reports and whatever you did in order to kind of get the details a little bit correct. And what was it like to revisit those reports and stories . How was that for you . Yeah, before writing the book, my only training was writing Police Reports. So that was what i knew and i really made an effort to make sure that the facts were as best as i could remember them. Sometimes i went back to the scene where these things happened and went back to the same footsteps i did and making sure my distances and everything was accurate. But i really tried to be as accurate as possible. Sometimes i even called my old partners saying even after i wrote a couple stories i gave it to my old partners and said check it out. Do you remember it the same way i do . And they did. I was used to activeing in court. You have to have your paperwork together, your testimony together, so that was the way i kind of approached this. You always but, if you and i see a car accident or a homicide, we view it slightly different. Remember, its television. What i wanted to do is ive always wanted to take my book and turn it into a script. I think is works well. When you have like network television, you cant always say what you said and you cant always show what you really saw. So it gets watered down a little bit but its pretty good. My mother will agree with you, she loves it. 9 11 and the aftermath, a lot of stories about the lingering effects of that on first responders, emotionally and maybe particularly physically. Just wonder if you or some of your partners are still living with that. Yeah. And guys are getting sick. It is true. I was one of the lucky ones. I was one of the lucky ones. On the morning of 9 11 i woke up, and im getting ready to go to work, and i turned on the news, and i see, and i see smoke coming out of the upper floors. And then as im watching it with my wife, the second plane hits. She starts crying, she starts screaming, and im holding her, and im watching this, and im, like, i gotta get to work, you know . Everybody else that had a normal husband with a normal job, they were racing home to be with their families, to be with their wives. Im hugging my wife, shes crying into my chest, my shirt is wet with tears and boogers and [laughter] and im holding onto her, and all i could think of is i gotta go to work. And i remember her looking up at me and saying and she was used to me leaving her. I mean, i get a phone call at night, i gotta go to work, i get up, im gone, i dont come back til the next day, you know . It wasnt oftentimes id be working 412, id call her at 11 00, wed catch a shooting, and i wouldnt come home until the next day. So she was used to being left alone. And i remember her looking up at me with tears streaming down her face, and she says please dont leave me, not this time. And i told her, i says, you understand, i have to go, right . You understand . And she knew it. She knew i was going. She was just trying to, she was just venting, you know . She was going to be left alone to have to deal with this by herself. And i left her there. I left her standing at the tour crying while door crying while i jumped in the car doing 90 miles an hour with the red light on the dashboard listening to the radio, and im racing down there. At the time i was a lieutenant in the gang squad, and i had, like, 50 sergeants and detectives working for me. And i knew once we went down there, it was going to be a madhouse. If we had to stick together as a unit, because if we didnt, we got separated, we werent going to find each other for days. So one of my sergeants, he was my righthand man, you know . I freely admit it, administratively im a moron. [laughter] you know . Its not what i like to do. But one of my sergeants, he was, hes the energizer bunny. Hes on top of everything. So i had him on the phone, and im like, come on. When are you going to be at the office . Im not leaving without you, im calling the guys in the office, get all the equipment we need. As soon as i get there, were jumping into cars, and were going down. So i got to the office, got everybody together, we all jumped into cars, and he was a few minutes late. His girlfriend was a nurs hospi. So he was about 15, 20 minutes late, and i wasnt going to leave without him. I needed him. I wanted my whole unit together. He gets there, jumps in the car, and off we go. The second building building cg. So if he wasnt late, we probably would have ran in there like everybody else. And i guess its hard to explain how you feel down there. I think more than anything i felt, i felt helpless because as a cop when you see something really bad, the way you find closure is you find a person that did it, you arrest em, they go away, and thats how you find closure. And right away we found out that that wasnt going to happen, you know . The individuals that did this were all dead. And the individuals that were responsible for it were in a cave overseas. As new york city cops, there was nothing we could do about it. And i felt, i felt kind of helpless those days, you know . All we could do was, like, dig through rubble and, you know, and pick up remains and process remains. So that was the overwhelming feeling. But i also felt, i felt privileged because i know that everybody in the country wanted to be down there helping, and i was able to do it. I had the ability to go down there and help my city, my country. And i think thats the way mentally i got through it. I felt privileged to be there. [applause] im from philadelphia, the home of [inaudible] who went from beat cop to the mayor of philadelphia. And kind of have a Public Service announcement for savannah, appreciation of the police force. My wife and our daughter, 26yearold daughter, took the 13week civilian Police Academy training here, and each week there would be two different departments that would tell you what they do. And on the 12th week, we did ride alongs with several different officers. And as you know, theres two of the most dangerous situations are Domestic Violence call and a car stop. Which i did a domestic call, my wife did a car stop. We actually got out of the cars stood a safe distance away but we really now understand and appreciate what police do. So that it really should be a civic duty for all citizens, and i know you know that. But a rookie starts at 37,000 a year to put his life on the line. So do you have a question . And you mentioned all the police get a bad rap for what little might happen negatively, but the thousands of cases that arent appreciated. Back to the 37,000 [laughter] you dont take this job for the money. Thats not i mean, as you go up in the ranks, you do better, you have better benefits, you have, you know, a good pension, but you dont take this job for the money. You take it because its a calling, you know . Theres something in your heart that tells you, this is what you want to do. And thats why you take it. [applause] in the introduction anne said you never shot your gun, and we havent found out why and how that came about. I always worked in busy places, busy squads, busy neighborhoods, and people always ask, did you ever shoot anybody . And when i tell them no, they seem disappointed, like [laughter] what were you doing for 20 years . [laughter] but the fact is its, like, i forget what the figure is, like 98, 99 of cops never fire their weapon in the line of duty. But i could tell you theres at least a half a dozen guys that are still Walking Around where i was actually pulling the trigger, you know . It got to the point where they were going. And at the last possible second, they dropped the gun. Or had a situation, i had several situations where i went to go stop a guy, you know, like a top and frisk, and a stop and frisk, and when i put the guy on the car, he reaches into his waistband, so i reach into his waistband, and hes got a gun, and hes got it first. Now, hes got the gun in his hand, and the guy was big, you know . His shoulders were over my head, i couldnt see what i was doing. There was another guy with him who had a knife, and all of a sudden im in a fight for my life. I couldnt shoot him. I could not let go of this gun. Him and i are fighting for it. And i picked him up, and im swinging him back and forth. I briefly thought about letting him go and going for my gun, but theres no way. I never would have gotten it out in time, he would have killed me. So im fighting with this guy, and the only thing i could think about was if you cant breathe, you cant fight. Thats the first rule of fighting. Cant breathe, you cant fight. So i started yanking on his fists. They were right here at his solar plexus. I was giving him this, like, crazy heimlich maneuver. [laughter] and im yanking and pulling and lifting him off his feet, and as im doing that, there guy who the other guy wants to stab me in the back, but hes not 100 committed to this, because he knows where this thing is going, you know . [laughter] hes not 100 sure he wants to kill a cop. So that worked to my advantage. And im swinging this guy back and forth and im yanking and pulling, and hes yelp p, and he cant breathe. Finally, he loosens up on the gun, i get it out of his hand and cracked him right in the temple of it. I could have shot both of them. They would have given me a medal for it. At that point i just didnt feel it was necessary. I had the gun, i had him down. And another time i went do lock up this little stockbroker, i thought he was going to answer the door with a pencil protector, he answers the door with a gun in his hand. Him and i were this far away, and the only thing i could do was jump him. And him and i go falling down to the floor. I had two cops with me, were all rolling around on the floor, and we managed to get the gun off him. You only shoot somebody if its absolutely necessary. And i think everybody has that line in the sand where when somebody crosses that, youre going to do it. And i knew where my line was. And it got very close. At least a half a dozen or more timings. But each time i always felt like i didnt have to do it, and i didnt. And that includes [applause] that includes several thousand arrests that i was involved in. [applause] all right. Thank you very much, and thanks for having me in savannah. [applause] ladies and gentlemen, how about this guy . One more tonight round of applause decent round of applause. [applause] [inaudible conversations] the 2016 savannah book festival continues. Next up, veteran travis mills shares his experiences and recovery from an ied explosion. The u. S. Has been involved in a war in afghanistan for more than 12 years now, and our next author retired Army Staff Sergeant travis mills of the 82nd airborne was one of those soldiers who sacrificed limb and nearly his life defending his country against terrorism. During his third tour, an ied blast cost sergeant mills nearly everything, and he is one of only five soldiers from the wars in afghanistan and iraq to survive a quadruple amputation. Through willpower and endurance and no small amount of faith, sergeant mills has done more than service, he has lived with a capital l. In many ways more than most. He lives by the creed never give up, never quit. He swims, dances with his wife, rides mountain bikes and drives his daughter to school every day. Of course, except for those days when hes inspiring folks like us. Now, i want you to know that he has really a better introduction for himself, and ill let him do that. So im very blessed and honored to welcome travis mills. [applause] oh, thank you so much. Thank you. Thank you. [applause] awesome. Please, have a seat. All right. Wow, thanks for those kind words. That was a great introduction. Only thing i said for her to do was i tell people whenever they come out to see me, i say, just ask em, what do you call a guy with no arms and no legs in the ocean . Bob. [laughter] on the wall . Art. Here today . Travis millings. Nice to meet you guys travis mills. Nice to meet you guys. [laughter] [applause] all right. Let me start off with my thank yous. Savannah book festival, thanks for having me. My fatherinlaw and brotherinlaw drove down here from fort bragg. We have the greatest hosts. If you guys dont know bill and carol, you need to. Theyre phenomenal people. Did i say that right . Ive been saying that all day. Dont do that to me. Its a tongue twister. Dont do this to me. [laughter] a couple of things about me Everybody Needs to know. One, im awesome. [laughter] [applause] two, im humble. [laughter] in that order. [laughter] you guys see what i did there . I have pretty cool tricks. [laughter] yep. And i wrote a book. So im an author too. What . [applause] i know youre not supposed to read from your book, so luckily i didnt bring one up on stage. I was told not to do that. But let me tell you something im very proud of. This book, tough as they come, it documents what happened to me and my family and what we did to get through it. Random house took a chance on me, random house publishing, crown, penguin, took a chance, and now im able to tell my story in a positive way. Im not a pity story, you dont have to sob over what happened to me. Im thankful to still be alive, and ive been able to do some pretty cool things, this being on the top of the list. So being here is definitely awesome. I want to express my gratitude for everybody that served, and in my authors note the first thing youre going to read is thank you for your service if you served. I didnt want serve any more than anybody else or any harder, i just had a case of the mondays, rough day at work. Bomb, oh, no. [laughter] monday. [laughter] next thing it says is i dont think my problems are any more than anybody elses. Physically, i look different. Visually, you can tell something happened to this guy. And if i catch you staring, i know what youre doing to do if i see you staring at me. Thats what youre going to do. [laughter] but its a train wreck, and you want to see it again. You look away and youre like, oh, my gosh. Its so amazing, he caught me again, oh, no. [laughter] he caught me. Everybody thinks im a really great person which most days i am. Im going to get you down so you know im not above anybody else. The worst thing ive ever done with this injury, there was a little 7yearold looking at me, she just keeps staring. I didnt want to be stared at. And her mom looks down at me, looks down at her, so i leaned in real close and i said, you know what did this to me . The bogeyman in your closet and the monster under your bed. [laughter] no, it gets worse. [laughter] yeah. And i said, theyre coming for you next. [laughter] granted, i dont know if i would do that again. Well, no, if i didnt want do it in the first place, i still would. Its a great story. No. But tough as they come just documents everything. Let me tell you a little bit about myself. Im from michigan, so go blue. Be youre from ohio yeah, there you go. [applause] anyone from ohio . Its impressive it takes two of you to spell ohio. [laughter] michigans an 8letter word, and i can spell it for you. Even say capital m. I digress. [laughter] from michigan. 18 years old i went to play a little bit of college football. Had a girlfriend that convinced me i should move home, and i thought, what an awesome idea. So i did. I met her boyfriend named colin just randomly. [laughter] no, i wasnt supposed to, right . He was a secret. It got awkward after that. So i joined the military in 2006, and i was in basic training in fort benning, georgia. Thats the only experience i ever had in georgia, so i didnt want to come back. Luckily, you guys have changed my opinion on georgia. [laughter] i hated coleslaw all they did is make me eat coleslaw. I couldnt say no, because i was afraid of these big men yelling at me. Sorry, takes me back. I went to fort bragg in North Carolina to the 82nd airborne where i served out three deployments. In my first deployment i was able to meet a girl yeah, on myspace, i know, its crazy and we decided, she was 18 and i was 20, that we were going to go to mexico the first time we ever met. I have a little girl. Like, i would kill that man. [laughter] but if that happened to me. Fortunately, my brotherinlaw who was my medic overseas, chased me with a knife, couldnt catch me, but he wanted to. How do you get a medic that wants to kill you overseas . Theyre supposed to save your life. My fall, he didnt kill me. He wanted to, i dont blame him. I only took four sures that showers that year. By choice. [laughter] all right, you guys are with me. Were still doing this. [laughter] a lot of fighting. Came back, bought a house, had a baby. Well, my wife had the baby, i didnt. Thats part of the process. We dont have to get is into that. Nobody . Okay, whatever. [laughter] ill keep going. I mean, i do this for a living, you know . I just talk. My wife gets really annoyed at me by it. Anyways, im on my third deployment, you guys can probably guess i was wrestling sharks and [laughter] its not at all what happened. Tenned on a bomb, you know . Stepped on a bomb. Became a triumphing amputee right away. On april 14th of 2012, i woke up to my brotherinlaw who was in the room with me and had to explain what happened to me. And it just so happens, ladies and gentlemen, little secret, my mom and dads favorite day in the entire world was april 4th 1987 because their little bundle of joy was born, me. Let me tell you about that process. First kid was born. Whoops, lets try this again. Thats my older sister, not that great. [laughter] next kid was me, perfection. [laughter] right. No, it was. And then they, like, lets have another one. Third kid. Whoops, oh, my gosh. Lets just drag these two along, the middle ones our favorite. They wont admit that, but its definitely true in my eyes. [laughter] but, no, on april 17th i made it to walter reed, april 19th i was able to talk to my wife, i told her to take everything we had and go, the house, the cars, i had a fourmonthold. I said i will support you any way i can, i will pay for everything that you need, but i cant, you know, i dont know what to do about this. She said thats not how this works at all. She wanted that close parking. [laughter] yeah, no. [laughter] shes, like, youre going to try to deprive me of close parking . Like [laughter] im part of the vip team. Im saying, little blue tag. Front row wherever i go. [laughter] i love it. You know, if you guys saw me on facebook, you might have saw i stepped on a bomb for 10. I came out ahead. It was a bet that it would kill me. If you didnt see that, youll come across it maybe. , no im so thankful for the opportunities that i have. Recovery was 19 months long. The first thing i did for my first workout, i got in an argument with my doctors, i said im going to workout, and they said, no, you couldnt. I said, ill jump out of this bed, i was trying to make a statement. So i went over to occupational therapy, and my doctor finally let me after four hours of every half hour calling him, harassing, and let me, you know, lay on a table, stretch my pelvis muscles out, and i fell asleep for 20 minutes. Best workout ive ever done. I keep that regiment to this day. Im actually joking, check this out. [laughter] and i do karaoke. Mary had a little lamb, little lamb [laughter] no . Thats what i do. Whatever. [laughter] ill be honest with you, i can stay up here and ramble all day and tell jokings. First time i met president bush, i forest gumped and didnt even realize it. Im so nervous, i could pee right now. [laughter] thats a true story. How embarrassing is that . And hes like bathrooms in back. He let me sit down. As im leaving, getting on the elevator, going down to the library, off walks mrs. Bush. Oh, my gosh. George said you were coming in today. Barbara, i love your work. My names laura, door shut. [laughter] okay, ill be thats a lie. That never [laughter] i just dressed that story up. I did tell him i had to pee, but the rest of it with barbara and laura, i didnt mess that up. Maybe i did, i dont know. But i really am very appreciative of all this exposure i get. I like to tell people its all about perspective with me. People wonder how i have such a good attitude, how i keep smiling, and to be honest with you, ive had a lot of friends not make it back home. If youre in the service, you know what im talking about. And my buddy francis Gene Phillips iv is a good example. He got hit in a humvee, five people in the humvee, all died. And he had a 3yearold and a wife of four years. Hell never see his family again, never take his daughter to school, hell never see his mother for the holidays. So i think itd be selfish and a slap in the face if i didnt keep Going Forward with my life. I have the ability to take my daughter to school, take my wife on dates, hang out with my fatherinlaw and brotherinlaw my wife makes them hang out with me. The book, New York Times bestseller, i would love everybodys support to beat Khloe Kardashian because shes beating me in my bracket right now. [laughter] the only thing about me, im all about winning, you know . So we can do it all together. Remember when you buy that, were beating Khloe Kardashian. [laughter] [applause] so they told me to talk for 20 minutes or so and then take questions. If you guys have questions, nothing offends me. Yes, i can still have kids. It all workings. I mean, im setting the precedent. Its totally cool, ask me whatever you want. So [laughter] no . Okay. Keep going. [laughter] so if anybody has any questions, i want everybody to know the books not politically based. I didnt choose a side and try to stick my agenda on anybody else. It has an underlying tone of faith, but i didnt push it, and its just all about my story, overcoming what happened to me. You know, 14 hours of surgery, nine doctors, seven nurses, two nurses for seven hours performed air into my lungs, and i got to meet six of the nine doctors and thank them for what they did for me and my family. I just want everybody to know i dont consider myself wounded. I have scars, awesome scars at that. Ladies, im married. [laughter] gentlemen, im married. [laughter] im sorry. Ive had some really neat experiences. Im a peer mentor. I like to help people through situations whether military or not. I run a nonprofit called the Travis Mills Foundation that was supposed to start off with just giving care packagings overseas, dont worry about what they request, you know . They want pepper beef jerky, Peanut Butter m and ms, gummy bears and orbit gum. Trust me, youll be the savior of the day. Now im in charge of it. As the president , i dont pay myself, ill never pay myself or the Board Members a salary, and we bring people in my situation up to maine where i live which, by the way, im so grateful to be in the south right now. [laughter] and we raised about 900,000 this year, were going to be able to bring families up, 3540 a week, for 12 weeks this summer. More like eight, but whatever. [laughter] and were doing some great things. So, please, check out travismills. Org and see what you think. But now i guess ill take questions if anybody has any. If you guys dont, its really going to hurt my feelings. [laughter] oh, and real quick, if anybody wonders why im dressed this way, think about it. You take these legs off, theyre pants, okay . [laughter] yeah. I know. I know. Thats a long sleeve right there. [laughter] thats a button up. Well within regulations. Snazzy. Does anybody have any questions . How this hand works . Ill need a volunteer for that. [laughter] okay, all right. Round of applause for dana. [cheers and applause] ms. Perino. Any political questions im just going to say great question, next question. [inaudible] when you want to take questions is you have to call on somebody. Oh. You have to force them to thats the only do you have a question, maam . I have a question. Yes, maam. What would your question be . You and i have met before and, of course, we share, shared a commander in chief. I wonder if you could tell me, tell everybody a little bit more about meeting president bush when you came back, and also a little bit about your foundation is doing great work. Theres a lot of different foundations doing a lot of great work, but what do you think would be the best way to try to streamline some of that work so that were reaching the most amount of Wounded Warriors who need our help . Because it feels like some are falling through the cracks. Absolutely. So i guess with president bush hes very, you know, thankful for our service, he, you know, takes it to heart with all the sacrifices being made by young men and women of this country. Just phenomenal guy. He let, you know, he let me hang out until i said, i have to go, sir. You dont have to go, no, actually, i [laughter] you know . I was with, like, im so sorry. He was like, oh, its find. Hes doing some awesome things and really helping with morale. We have, they had a conference to bring all the nonprofits together to see what we can do better and where we can fix things. But my web site has a bunch of the ones that im a huge deliver in, semper fi fund, gary sinise foundation. He does a lot of emojis, just to let you know. Hes Lieutenant Dan from forest gump. He builds smart homes, im an ambassador for his foundation. Phenomenal guy. I was at a concert in new york city, i just walked a 5q, and i 5k, and i get on stage, and i fall right down. In front of 20,000 people. Former mayor Rudy Giulianis bodyguard, brian, picks me up, and hes trying to get me standing, but hes doing the heimlich maneuver . [laughter] yeah, and my legs dont lock out until someone pushes them out. So after a good four times of sideways, im, like, buy me dipper first. This is getting awkward. [laughter] yeah, i know. I know. Then he offered to buy me dip, and im like, whoa, im married. I was [laughter] he doesnt return my emails anymore. Hes really mad at me. He thought there was something special. He felt a connection. Shouldnt have said that. [laughter] yes, sir. Travis [inaudible] encouraging word about the v. A. So the v. A. s been really great to me. Im so so thankful to walter reed. These legs are microprocessor, theyre blue tooth, so they makeover 300 adjustments. Theyre water proof, blue tooth means i lock them into a driving mode, and i drive with my feet which i learned in maryland completely illegally. [laughter] thats the truth. I actually just got my license in maine. Ive been there for over a year. But im friends with all the cops, so [laughter] its no big deal. But the v. A. s really great. I dont really go there for anything. Im not on any medication, youll find out about the experiment alcoa ma i was put in, that worked out really well, so i quit all my medication six months in. My prosthetics get done somewhere else, so i go there when i need to, but they definitely support me up in maine, and the negative stories that you hear, i dont see that where im at. I have nothing but great things to say about them, walter reed and the nation. Also keep paying your taxes, because this stuffs expensive. [laughter] sometimes that joke works. At colleges it really doesnt. [laughter] yes, sir. Travis [inaudible] from the time that you were wounded, how quickly were you medevaced to the m. A. S. H. . So i was in april 10th at, like, 4 30, 5 00ish in the afternoon. Within ten minutes i had a helicopter there, so my medic and my platoon sergeant put tourniquets on my residual limbs. My right leg was gone at the knee, the left leg was hanging on by muscles and tendons snapped to the bone, and my left hand was there, pinky and ring finger were pretty much gone, and my wrist was blown out. I hit the ground with the left side of my face, and i rolled over and looked, oh, no, this is horrible. I just hit a bomb, i need your medic here with my medic to assess the casualties. My medic came running up, i told him to save my guys. I wasnt suicidal, i just didnt think theres no way im going to make this. Im not going to go out crying or anything. He said, you know, let me do my job, some other choice words, and within ten minutings i was on a helicopter. From there i was rushed up into surgery, i kept trying to sit up, telling the doctors i can get up. They knocked me out, and the last thing i said, my little girl, im never going to see her again, because she was only six months old. But from that time to after the surgery, i was shipped to bagram, afghanistan, where josh flew with me, and then from bagram to germany. On the 13th, i think, we arrived, and i went into surgery and cleanouts, then my birthday, i woke up the. Th to find 14th to find out what happened to me. Happy 25th. From there we went to the states on the 17th. Five weeks in i was outpatient, had my left hand finally put on, and in seven weeks and four days i was taking my first steps around walter reed, so i was very fortunate in my recovery. [applause] oh, thank you. Thank you. [applause] hi, im jeannie nichols, im from ohio, im an ohio girl selling savannah [laughter] and i understand that you like [inaudible] and i wondered if we could help you get set up for a ghost church. I hate to admit this, i have a 3 30, but i would love that. You know, i dont know what it is about the ghost stories, my wife doesnt watch scary movies, so im stuck myself watching em. So scary. I cant run away, my legs are usually off, so its okay. [laughter] but thatd be great. I plan on coming back with my wife and really showing her this great city, because it truly is amazing. At the Hotel Conference week, thats [inaudible] glad to hook you up with a ghost tour. Oh, thank you so much. I appreciate that. Am i going to be scared . Because i really want to be scared. [laughter] you know, when youre tough, what can scare you . Oh, good. Well, one trip did he trip you . Or she . No . Whatever. Sorry. Thank you so much. I appreciate it. I love the red. You look lovely. Thank you. Happy valentines day. Oh, im married, you doll, but thank you. Im married too. [laughter] i wanted to find out, you mentioned earlier that you dont get paid through your foundation, so do you make money from selling books or selling books, go around speaking. Im also retired from the military, so i do that. So we have a different, couple different avenues that i take to make sure that i can take care of my family. But as far as the foundation, thats just all about giving back. I never want to take a salary and have that, you know, we have to pay our staff, but the Board Members will never get paid. Thats admirable. I appreciate its all about giving back. Some foundations need to, but this one doesnt. [applause] another buckeye. [laughter] the worst. Were going to gang up on you. And, you know, your coach at the university of michigan is a buckeye. I could keep going. Anyway [laughter] well, he made the right switch then, obviously. Theres more president s from ohio than anybody else. They just want to change the world, they had it so bad. [laughter] on a serious note, on behalf of everyone here, id like to thank you for everything youve done for this country. Oh, thank you. Your service. I appreciate that. Thank you. [applause] you know, i appreciate that. I was just fortunate to serve my country. I loved my job. Trust me, i would never get brown up again, but id still sign up for the army if i had the option. It was a great ride and, you know, im happy with the way the government takes care of my medical needs and my family and things like that, my retirement and my wife, stuff like that. Weve really been blessed with living in a great nation. Well, not to keep blowing smoke, but also oh, build me up. I love it. [laughter] ms. Perino said earlier, im really impressed by the fact of your foundation and you take nothing especially after reading a recent New York Times piece about the Wounded Warriors program and how little money is going to the warriors versus whats helping make it go. But my big question is, do you have another book . Not at the moment. Were thinking what i can do for the next book. Im mentoring with a lot of ptsd guys from the army, i take a different spin, so were thinking maybe a hard truth book or fitness by travis where we just eat a lot of cheesecake. [laughter] some barbecue and pirg out how we can figure out how we can make in this work into our diets. Spoiler alert, it never works out. Except for happiness, because thats what you get from cheesecake and been cue. Maybe you guys all get excited, well have a movie, and then, you know, you can play me in the movie. You look like [laughter] wait, you got it . [laughter] what you do is you stand in the mirror and you flex, and eventually it comes [laughter] i actually ripped my skin open lifting weightings, but i was going to meet my soon to be girlfriend, i hadnt met her in perp, so i had to look good. Put run can boards on it to get into it. Idiot. I know. No one claimed i was the smartest, but i love chess. Who wants to play me in chess . Let me no. Im that good. Just kidding. Im trying to hustle you out of money. I have a couple questions. Just because i didnt introduce you the way you wanted me to. You nailed it. I was just giving you options. All right. As you travel for speaking engagements, to different states what are the best ways you see communities helping local vets . Having vet centers, getting where they have job fairs and they understand what the veterans have done overseas and understand their jobs in the military and how they can plug them into society and having resource officers that are veterans that know what the balance is between the militarys civilian life. When people get out you would never guess i had great custodial duties. Withld cut grass like nodys [laughter] if i made a mistake is there life on the line. So just happened to translate to civilian lingo and a lot of great try to do tragedy that war to get them back to work to understand how to plug them in. Am i going to catch but he has, i dont want that. They talked about the Foundation Fund and retreat and other Foundation Projects going on. Peter kayaking, boating, fishing to show the hotspots but we want to build a network to live a life on the sideline to do things and accomplish everyday activities with their family because i do it every day but somebody might be less inclined to try something new if youre not around the same situation. The foundation has been very helpful showing people what they can that they can still achieve and Building Confidence between us ultimately decide this is the direction that we want to go and we had for families and then we have seven families, the last two years and its been everyone from maine and around the nation plus if post if you want to benefit from it, they can still go and do he is and we give them the tools to do that in their own area. I knelt there hopefully encouraging people and they know they can always call me if they have an issue or problem. They are on this together. They talk about nothing in general. [laughter] im looking at this and thinking my gosh, stop. Its a joke. While its not a. I tried to tell jokes to keep everyone entertained. [laughter] i wondered if we could share with the audience the process of how you sold the book and your reaction when it actually was so. We went to a couple of meetings scheduled at random house and simon and schuster and other big names and we went to random house and the agent said there will be one or two people here to interview you. Then they sit down to talk too fast. When i shake peoples hand i tell them either it hurts or i spent it in a circle. [laughter] they said youre slapstick humor and i did. They said dont talk too long and we were there for an hour and then i left. We were offered to take them off the table they said literally everything that you get away with it because like with ggolf i. Lakewood golf i played with a handicap to win. [laughter] thats how it went and then i went to another meeting with the sales force with barnes and noble and amazon and no one liked me so i cried and they thought well, whatever label have your book. It will process to come together and it took about eight to nine months in total. So he could help me because i cant read it considers just nine left that was a fun process and the worst part about the processes when i had to narrate a. With a look at random house or anybody else to see what he can do. Im originally im originally from michigan but also from maine and i heard you speak at a hospital several years ago when i was there. You are with the governors wife and you had just gone skydiving with her. I think you ought to tell about that. Shes actually a really great friend. I want to challenge her to go great white shark diving in a cage with me. Shes a great supporter and im grateful to have them down the street. I just wanted you to know that. After cow then they come out and treat me like im family. I like your boots by the way. My old boss was trying to detonate a bomb and im curious john used to wear a vest and they would open come on up here. And going to need your help. [laughter] you could get claims to be through claims claim. [applause] how this works. Let them hear the noise. [laughter] i had my arm up until about right here. Chop your hand to the ground the other way. So down here i cant hear it. Dont forget to break. [laughter] this technology is horrible. Walter reed has three guys i have to demonstrate how bad this is. They have a voice activated control so this light is on and engaged. How cool is that . And it spills over you and your bike shorts. [laughter] to be short i was at my daughters Birthday Party and my house was getting built and she had a remodel done and we had a slushy machine. One more time, try it. Open. Try it again with a little grasp, open. [laughter] so ladies and gentlemen you heard that. I appreciate you coming up. Theres nothing here is the own and off switch and this is how much battery i have left. Its not voice activated. [laughter] i have to be honest i got Peyton Manning to do the same thing. He kept yelling at omaha. I dont think that he really got it. Behind you, three rows, two euros. Yes, my fatherinlaw over here. Ptsd is a huge problem with the guys coming back. What is your take on that will help us they cant call it to the invisible wounded but im fortunate for that i do a lot of counseling where instead of asking about what you have in front of you i reminisce it but as soon as theres more studies done and people know more about it we will open up for that in the foundation but im fortunate and i know thats not to suffer from anything so right now i try to counsel the best i can with my limited knowledge on what the situation is but i hope that people that need help go get help because thats a big problem. Anybody can email my website and reach out to me but i dont suffer so i dont know the symptoms were caused as well enough to have people come to the camp and try to help them reform right now but we are open to the accounting for ten years we can help people in those situations. This is cspan so i can cant tell my normal jokes. We had the ability anywhere in the nation we want to do. Normal people get fingers and toes. Mine comes back warmer. So a third of my body has three layers on it. You probably cant tell that but i can. So first she grew up at age 11 and that would have been great but i didnt want six months a year complaining about the heat and crying all the time so that it came down to michigan or maine and i thought i told you everything we have a. They love me just like you guys do. But if she could sacrifice everything i was in a coma for five days. The doctors were not going to let me until she was forced to go home back to the room so i thought i can fly out and see them and they will come and visit me as much as i go see them in miami tomorrow and my wife deserves to be around her family and we want to have more children. [laughter] not every day is she in the situation that she is in i know she married me in 2008 when i had a 250 pounds same person upstairs still but she stuck with me and knew it would be a long road to recovery so now we are thinking of crap. [laughter] its like 40 below tomorrow or something, and not they are though. Picture me with no he does on the beach, alcohol free. Do you find that you get great support from the politicians and public figures and also since youre up there do you find that you can bring more support and more encouragement to those currently living up there . They are great and everybody is nice and i have no problem everybody is nice to me. On top of that been happy to be a voice because in the society everybody says you are a veteran you must have ptsd and im hoping to get on a platform and to tell people not all veterans have issues. Im up there with a positive message telling people never give up, never quit and keep pushing forward. But its kind of where thats kind of where i go. I feel thankful im able to have this page to tell people dont pity me. Thats not a good joke . Trump 16 . Like to help them throughout the nation. I traveled quite a bit we were just in the san antonio and now we are traveling to miami and then st. Louis because i want to catch the next show. [laughter] i was choking about trump 16. [inaudible] i talk to my old soldiers and friends and we still get along but theyve been able to accommodate that. The chief of staff asked me if i would stay in the military and go around with them. I said i appreciate that but im getting out and retiring. I broke down and i cried in front of them major and i said i cant do my job anymore which im sure you love. I cant put the uniform on anymore i will just retire with what i have and be thankful for what i was able to do. So i am so active with supporting. They call me for an event. They got hurt with me today that i got blown up and they went home with me actually and brian has since had a child and he named phoenix after me so thats pretty good. There was a nice letter written in was actually yelling at them really loud they couldnt believe i was in the situation that i was in the everybody buys the book and check me out. Im not going to force you to buy it. You should feel awful if you dont. Travis will be out in the author book signing when we leave here hes going to go out and sign books. I just want to say i am honored and blessed to be here today and i want to thank you for being here with us. Thank you everybody. We appreciate it. Seal Team Six is a [cheering and applauding] Counter Terrorist unit. Youve got the other seal teams. Sick has additional funding, Logistical Support and training which means they can be called out at a moments notice and go anywhere in the world who do counterterrorism. What sets them apart from the other teams is it just the training and all that, too . Connectors enhanced training. Are you familiar with the term close ports battle is the biggest thing that sets them apart and aboard a cruise ship for example just inside a building that is taking it a whole to a whole new level versus the other seal teams. What exactly does it entail . Youre already dealing with an elite warrior. All the seals have already gotten off of the land warfare training, old urban training the diving, skydiving, you have any elite warriors of the training training is training that would go into finetuning these guys for the specific mission would be that ceq v. A lot of our skydiving for example. So it was more than the other teams to come to land etc. Getting the whole team on target. What can you tell about your time during the seal what was your experience like . My experience overall was good during the whole blackhawk down but everything that the two that was great. I had a lost including helping other people and working with the cia. Its its distributor members the first. Can you tell us more on that . Basically weve been installing it for two or three months and working to try to find the bad guy they have some intelligence at the adult of force and the rangers have some intelligence that he was going to be at a certain hotel and as it turns out it was an ambush so 72 were killed and injured and was a bad day. The worst thing about that is a while we had broke in the back of the clan, we just left that unfinished over there which gave them an eight year incubation period. When you completed the training you joined a Sniper School . What is that like . I went to the training with Seal Team Six before i went to Sniper School and it wasnt until i got to sit i had been in a soldier and found out we that we needed more slave volunteer to go to Sniper School. But when i went to was just south of human quantico virginia. And it is the most prestigious and i could have went to any Sniper School i want to but i went to that one because i thought it was the best of the time. And what exactly is Sniper School like . Im not at liberty to count how many are in six, but how many people are excepted depends on how many people they need. How many people are rotating out, you know because you cant stay of six into the jumper ever. Not be an effective one. If you try to then youre pushing the age limit. The time come to slow down, you can stick her in and be a trainer but you still have to have that frechette group coming in. Based on their needs dependent on how many people they will scream for. They will scream for more than they need because invariably someone will get hurt in training or whatever. If somebody doesnt make it the first time is this a test someone can continue to take over and over . I have never heard of someone being dropped from Seal Team Six train and then be allowed to come back. I think this is a one shot deal. Im not saying its not happen but im pretty sure, ive never heard of that. Usually if you dont make it you just go back to wherever you came from. Ive never heard anybody come back again. And less like i said its a medical injury, and medical thing you had no control over. Maybe then dont heal up and come back. If you get hurt in buds and as such her fault, we had a guy gets slammed onto the rocks and really hurt him. Like really hurt him. He stayed around about six or seven months in rehab and continued his training. If you can say around how long does someone state in Seal Team Six . This is what i have brainstormed and what i think. I think from six years to maybe eight years in my opinion would be the maximum amount of time because you cant take that tempo, that tempo, that day in day out ground, that beating every single day up and down the stairs carrying equipment training perpetually and having no personal life to speak of. We are talking about a lifestyle. You would have to imagine doing her job for a living and being involved in every single day and being called at any time of night to do the job. I would do if i had to put a number on it 68 years would be your shelf life. That would be my next question. People who are involved in such a covert op group, what impact does that have under family life . They can discuss it with their families at all. Thats tough. When i went to seal team two, somebody told me the divorce rate is like 70 . If youre looking at a unit whose divorce rate has already around 70 , now we were going to a unit where youre away from your family more, doing more classified stuff that you cant talk about. For example, when i went to desert storm my wife knew i was going to desert storm. When i leave to go do something for Seal Team Six she never knew where i was going. She did know i was in mogadishu. She found out i was shocked as everybody else when the red cross called and said your husband was shot three times. I think that people who go there have it harder in their family life and the personal life than the regular teams. I think that you kind of got to take a break from it after a while. When people heard the news that bin laden had been shot, everybody wanted to know who these people were. They kind of august in the background, just the nature of the nations video . Its definitely a mission. When something goes really, really bad like with me on my last op where something goes really good, when are the two times when you heard something good . When they shot the somali pirates and then when bin laden was killed. I can guarantee you with all the intel these guys get when they raided a compound in abbottabad, that theres operations have gone on that none of us know but i dont need to know about. Heres the sad thing. Theres probably been a dozen books written on Seal Team Six, minimum a dozen books by different members, et cetera. Nobody really cared about it until bin laden was killed. These are Unsung Heroes. Its okay to read the books, and thats a first of all the reason i wrote this book is so people can do two things, see the amount of training, preparation, dedication and sacrifice of these young men make. The other thing is to overcome adversity. The hardest thing i ever did was leave the Seal Team Six and come back to civilian life which almost cost me my life. I was in a bad place. Its okay to know about them, okay to talk about them. Just dont try to involve yourself in their personal lives. I heard there was a group of people trying to find out who they were in stuff like that. Now we are crossing the line. I think its okay to talk about them and i think america should be glad that we people like this are willing to go there and do that. When you made the comment about transition into cellulite, how does somebody go through the intense training, make the transition . Are some of the not able to make it . Yep. Heres what i understand are what i think most people do believe that. First of all your coming up with a very unique skill set. Its not like youre coming out with anything thats really marketable. A lot of people go to a swat team. Some letter to like fbi, dea. Some people go to work for organizations like blackwater or whatever that change their or whatever that changed the nintendo, which is what i was about to do and tell my wife talked me out of it. Likely because i would either be older and less tactical now, or more dead. In my particular case coming out, ill give you this. It was harder for me because i had three Bullet Wounds of that cost me my career. I was going through a divorce. I have ptsd and wasnt going to a bigot because im an navy s. E. A. L. I cant tell you that. I viewed it as a weakness. The other thing i had i didnt realize i had, putting on my doctors have looking back, one survivors guilt. How come so many good guys, one in particular a doctorate in the book, how can these good guys died and i was allowed to live . If you think you should just be grateful for that utterly weighs on you. Sometimes even a i will still find myself thinking how come this guy died and i was allowed to live . So i have all that went on in the coming back into society. Was really are trying to assimilate back into i was lucky. I met the right woman, went back to school, became a chiropractor and now i can have a job out of law. Thats the thing, they have to have a job a little. Cant be lukewarm. Youve got to be making a difference. Thats the whole thing, being able to make a difference, being someone special. At what particular point can you talk about the nations that you were on . Thats a good point because my book couldnt be written until now. I think we finished about a year and half ago, but we had to wait for everything that happened with the cia in in somalia and to be out in open, declassified. The chief of station did an interview with the Washington Post and let everything out. Okay, now we can talk about it. Mark talked about when he did the black hawk down thing and thats the question of my book is out off. Theres an off spinner, desert storm and stuff but once something is declassified and you can talk about it. You still dont talk about tactics and techniques. The seals that will read my book will go we wouldnt do it like that. Exactly. So thats the way it is. Dana perino is next from booktvs coverage of the ninth annual savannah book festival. Yh [applause] c anybody here watch the fire . [applause] to thank you, chris. Frids, im honored to be here with newa friends, jim and danny has been my sponsor. Olde friend an older friend, older. Im kidding. And Tracy Schreiber had become o gsr good friends. We met because our dogs met at the blast. Usn jasper and greedy and, of course, you follow us on the facebook you know that their name is grasper. Im honored my husband to join e the. A lot of times you to travel these events by yourself. Youll hear more about him as i talk about the book that came out last april, and i have also before i start i want to thank robert bin gold who robin gold. Who has the cutest pink jacket on. She has been holding my hand through all the scheduling changes. Did you know were in the middle of a primary season . She made all of this work for me so im just really honored and thank you for coming out on a chilly but really beautiful saturday, and one of the best cities in america. [applause] , in. Savannah, georgia, i grew up out west, and have lived inlets of different places, and i found that this area, the low country, is the closest i feel to home. So thank you for welcoming my husband and i and jasper, and if you come to the book signing afterwards the real attraction of the day is going to be there jasper will bev outside. Will be outside. All right. I was going to tell this really funny joke about being at a podium, when i was at the white house and i was a Deputy Press Secretary to tony snow, and he was 65, and i was obviously not. Tony snow, you might remember as one of the best press secretaries the nation has ever seen. [applause] yeah. What you myth not know is after he passed away in 2008 from complication of colon cancer, his daughter came and just graduated last may so that family is doing great and we should give them a round of applause because without tony snow i wouldnt be here. [applause] so im not going to tell that funny joke because i looked at my husband and i said, i cant tell that joke in a church. So, peter is agreeing with me. So ill tell you, its in the book, and when you if you come across and it you figure out the joke could i not tell you in a church, send me a note on facebook and ill respond. Ill tell you this joke instead mitchell book is called and the good news is. Im going to explain why. The book is about lessons of gratitude and humility and character. Humility being one of the most important things you can learn because ive had all these amazing experiences. The first republican woman to serve as the White House Press secretary and i served during times of Terror Threat and financial crisis and all sorts of other things that were going on in the world, as any press secretary does. And i had this transition into television. And i had an opportunity to go up to new york and be on the five and its a little traumatic to leave washington, dc. Weed been there eight years. I really wasnt sure what i was doing to get to new york. Before there was a jasper there was a henry, which you will read bat in the book, and i get to new york and im out of place. I grew up on a cattle ranch. So new york is so different, and i was a little frantic, and i wasnt sure what i was doing with my life. And i got invited to the jets owners book, woody and susan johnson, invited peter and i to come. Peter grew up well, kind of an air force brat, Royal Air Force brat. That what we would have called him. But he i british originally and came to america and became a citizen in 2005 . 2006. He remembers that day very well. And he loves any american event. So, parades, sporting events, dinners at the white house. He would go to any american event. So i came back and i said, peter, want to go to the jets game . You watch the five you know i dont know a lot about sport us but i enough it would be catered by nobu. So, we went to the game. And i walk in, and im not really sure what im doing. I was just the White House Press secretary and now im not sure what i am doing and i had show but didnt know it would be a success. That was five years ago. Nobody knew the five would be a thing, and i walk in and this guy sees me oh, my gosh, love youve. I watch your show every day. I think you are amazing. You are so smart. I wish that every Young American would listen to you. We would be so much better of. Wow, youre amazing, and i thought, wow, maybe im finally accomplished something. This is great. Then he says, and could i say, you look great after the baby. And i realized, he thinks im megyn kelly. [applause] and i i didnt tell him i wasnt. And i tell megyn that story now and she says im going to take that as a compliment. I said so will i. Mistaken identity is something that is funny if you have also public notoriety, you can be humbled if somebody mistakes you for somebody else and actually happened to president george w. Bush. The first day out of office, 2009, think about it. He had security for 16 years. He finally gets back to dallas. He calls the promised land, and mrs. Bush calls it the afterlife and he said to the secret service team i want to go to the Hardware Store like a normal and shop around because im going to make a man cave and paint things and its going to be awesome. So he asked the secret service can we do that . They said, yeah, okay, sure. So they dress in khakis and particular it out. Theyre going incognito which is funny because they went in three suvs. But theyre trying. So he gets there and the secret service melts into the background and he says, thank you so much. Pipe going to shop around. So just on his own. And this guy is walking by him and says, nip ever at the you that you look like george w. Bush . And the president said, all the time. And the guy said, sure must make you mad. [applause] and he says, oh, you have no idea. [applause]. I said i hope he runs for president. Years later Barbara Walters is doing a special in the lead up to the 2000 election and shes doing an interview with al gore and george w. Bush. I remember the one with 43, president bush is walking along as governor and she says governor bush, if you were a tree, what kind of tree would you be . Its like a hard hitting interview question. President bush right away says well, barber, im not a tree. Im a bush. Off the. [applause] and i said im voting for him. So living life with that gentle witty humor its been a plus for me to be a regimented sort of embrace my own humility and character, importance of character. Elections are about character. People you surround yourself are about character and i didnt understand i had written a book about character until megan kellys husband, a novelist, said this is a parenting book about living with character and surrounding yourself with people of character. So id worked on many other books. Before i was the White House Press that i was the deputy and always tell people always take the deputy job. You have to work holidays andjo. Weekends but thats when you get but you geut thats when you get howt to do the job so that when theres an opportunity he can step up. Called upon to work on doing publicity for karl roves book, laura bushs book and i got a call from 43 and he asked if i could help him with a public tour. And worked with charles krauthammer. I was an editorial director on that book and i liked being behind the scenes. I never thought of writing by own book although every press secretary thinks about all of the experiences they have and want to tell the stories. I remember on a train between washington, d. C. And new york where wrote downtown if i wrote a book what would it look like and at the top in block letters it said not political because i didnt want to write a book like that. The guy who edits president bush, keep him in mind. He knew me and asked if i had a book. And he said what about your stories and he said you tell Great Stories about president bush. And i remembered i took the from the amtrak train and it was in my wallet for three years. All of a sudden i pulled it out and said i have do this. This is my book proposal a. Ripped up piece of paper folded in my wallet for three years. Sean looked at it and said leave this with me and went to this bosses and said we should do a book and they said that book will never sell and if you want to do something political we will help you. I said i am not doing that. I was a little humilitated. And then sean went to another publisher, my publisher. He said what if you did your book here. His team gave him a lot of room to run and he helped me structure the book. I wanted to fill in the gaps of history about president bush and provide mentoring advice to young people who didnt go to Ivy League Colleges or young people who might have narrow horizons and let them know you too could end up advising the president in the oval office. And he said you cannot start a book at age 36 as the White House Press secretary. You have to explain before that. That is where the stories of character come in. My grandfather was the first generation of italian immigrants. They homesteaded and mined coal in the western regions. There is finally Good Development happening up in that area. The pictures take me home. It is a beautiful part of the world. It is my mount rush more. I started telling the story of my grandfather driving on the cattle ranch and my sister would be with me who is four years younger. I was about seven or eight. And my grandfather would tease my sister saying did you see the smurf . My sister loved it. I got the joke and went along with it. We are having this great time, and i remember driving along coming across a cattle guard and we see one of my grandpas horses fell through the guard and broke his leg. He was in pain. And my grandfather is a softy, u. S. Marine and world war ii veteran bought soft heart especially for animals. He pulled up and is reaching for the rifle that was hung securely in the window. He told me to get down on the floor and dont look up. I remember trying not to look up but when someone tells you to look up it is like dont look at that guy. In the frame of the window of the truck was my grandpa who was rugged face, tan skin and i saw a single tear come down this cheek as he had to shoot the horse. When he got back in the truck i didnt want him to know i looked but i think he knew i did because he reached over and grabbed my leg and squeezed it and i hoped some of that character was seeping into me as well. Reading. I got to go to the Barbara Bush Foundation celebration of reading. She is still very active in literacy issues. A lot of people who write books love to read books. Everybody in this room loves to read or wants to meet jasper. I talked to my mom this morning and she would take me to target. You would not do this with your grandchildren. Take them to target, park them at the book session, and then go shopping and come back and get them. Back then you could do that. I would read one book by the time they finished and i remember i read sheila the great by judy bloom and that was my first instance of telling my mom dont we have to pay for this . My mom said we are going to the library and checked into two different libraries because you could only get seven books so then i could get 14 because i would read them on the way home. My mom could not keep us in books. We were readers along the way but there was one instance that goes to this character point that helps me later on. My dad required be to read the Rocky Mountain post and the Washington Times every day and we would help me think through the arguments and Critical Thinking skills. When i was riding the book i thought back about to that because there was a moment one morning and i dont know the issue but it was controversial. It was the Bush Administration. You know, nothing but controversial issues. What it was that my opinion was unpopular among the senior staff. We were on marine one and the president looked at me and said what do you think i should do . And i thought back to the moment at the Kitchen Table and how important it is for fathers or a male dominant figure, grandfather, to spend time with young girls to give them the ability and confidence they will need later in life because i was able to look at president bush and say this is what i think, hold to it, it was unpopular and he looked out the window for a minute, i didnt say anything, this is a negotiation, he turns back around and looks at the deputy chief of staff and said she is exactly right. And i also thank my dad for giving me a little bit of that ability. But when you are sitting on the barn yard fence thinking you will never leave wyoming you dont think you will end up in the oval office. My first time in the oval office i got kicked out. I asked bush about it on the book tour and he didnt remember it. But i will tell you now. I mentioned part of the book is about ad vicadvice. I thought it was important to tell the stories because everybody knew about the policies and politics but very few knew him from the behind the screens perspective that i did. He and i were meeting in the oval office were the first time. January 2005 and i was brand new as the Deputy Press Secretary. Dan bartlet, the communication director, asked me to go into the oval office to sit in on an interview. He said you dont have to brief him just sit there. I will come brief him but i to go to this interview so sit there and report back to me. I am excited to go the oval office and listening to dan learning the best and the president said i am not doing an interview with that guy. And he said boss, you said you would do an interview. And he said no, i said i would talk to him not an interview. The president was right actually. He should not have done an interview because it would look like he was negotiating with the iranians through this columnist who just got back. Finally the president said i am not doing an interview and therefore she doesnt need to be here. He looked at me and gave me one of these see yourself out. And i was so mortified. I am brand new and i get to the office i have to go and there is a door you can have slit shut. So i close the door, and i call peter and i was tearful on the phone and i said i just got kicked out of the oval office and i am crying. And peter said just thing, for the rest of your life you can say i have been kicked out of better places than this. [applause] and that is one of the reason why in the advice portion of my book i break it out into thick things you can do in the office, things you should do over your career, and things you should do over your life. The past piece of advice is that choosing to be loved is not a career limiting decision or doesnt have to be. Peter and i met on an airplane. It is a sweet story. He tells the story better than i do and has the british accent which is hard to compete with. When i was writing the book he was watching football and i am trying to write and i said what if you write this portion so i outsour outsourced a little bit of the work. It as a sweet story about how we meet an an airplane by chance on a flight he almost took a different flight and i almost missed the flight we happened to be assigned sheets from denver to chicago. Love at first sight and i moved to england 17 months later and that was 18 years ago. If you think about it, as i said, i didnt know george bush beforehand. My life changeded a so quickly peter allowed me to grow professionally and in many other ways. The reason i am going to read this is because it is hard for me to get through it. I came early today to make sure i was here to listen to travis mills. Travis mills and i met not long ago at an event in new york. He and i share, as i said we shared a commander in chief, and this affection for president bush, and this story i am about to read to you is about a scene nobody knew about until this book was written about a Wounded Warrior visit next to walter reed and this is one of the scenes from evans. It is called i think he wants the president news of americas military men and women were wounded and killed in iraq and afghanistan almost overwhelmed me on sunday. I may have sound n strong when talking to the press but sometimes i had to push my feelings way down in order to get any words out of my mouth to make statements and answer questions. The hardest days are when president bush went to visited the wounded families of the fallen. If it was tough for me you can only imagine what it is like for the families and a president who knew it was his decisions that led troops into the battle where they fought and were severely injured or lost their lives. On a morning in 2005 i was asked to go on behalf of scott mcclelin to walter reed with president bush. We started nlt intensive care unit and the chief naval office briefed the president about the first patient we would see. He was a young marine who was injured when his hum vee was injured by a bomb. At his bed side were parents, wife and fiveyearold son. What is the prognosis . We dont know. He hasnt opened his eyes since arriving. We had to wear a mask. I watched how the family might react to the president and was worried they would be mad and blame him. But i was wrong. The family gave the president hugs and thanked him over and over and wanted to get a photo. So they gathered him in front of the white house photographer and asked is everybody smiling which was funny since we were all wearing masks. The president talked quitely at the foot of the patients bed. I looked up to the ceiling so i could hold back tears. After he visited with them the president turned to the military aid and said okay do the presentation. The wounded soldier was being awarded the purple heart given to troops that suffer in combat. Everyone stood silenty the military aid in low and steady voice presented the award. At the end of it the son pulled on it and said what is a purple heart . And the president got down on one knee and pulled the little boy close to him and said it is an award for your dad because he is brave and courageous and loves his country so much. I hope you know how much he loves you and his mom. There was a commotion on the other side of the room and the marine just opened his eyes. I could see him from where i stood. The naval officer held the medical team back and said hold on, guy, i think he wants the president. The president jumped up and rushed over to the side of the bed and cupped the marines face in his hands and they locked eyes and after a few moments the president said to the military aid read it again. So we stood silently as the military aid presented the marine with the award for the second time. The president had tears dripping from his eyes on to the marines face. The president rested his headon the had marine for a minute and everyone was crying for the sacrifice, the pain and suffering, the love of country, the belief of a mission, and the witnesses of a relationship between the soldier and his commander and chief that no one else could grasp. I contacted several military aids to help me tig figure out who he was. I hoped so much he had survived but he did not. He died six days later in surgery after bushs visit. One mom and dad of a soldier from the caribbean were devastat devastated. The mother yelled at the president wanting to know why was it my son and not your daughters in the hospital bed. The president didnt leave. He sat there like he wanted to absorb some of her grief if he could. Later as we road back on marine one to the white house no one spoke. As the helicopter took off, the president looked at me and said that mama sure was mad at me. Then he turned to look out the window of the helicopter and he said and i dont blame her a bit. One tear slipped out of the sad of his eye and his face. He didnt wipe it away and he flew back to the white house. [applause] and there were other wonderful stories, i guess i can tell this in a church. On the last weekend before we turned the white house over to president and ms. Obama we wept to norfolk, virginia for the commissioning of the aircraft carrier. 41 is 90 years old and they follow that ship every day. They sent him all of the information and he knows exactly where it is. And i remember i dont want to take up too much time. I remember i was there and i was nervous because there was a high i cannot reveal anything but a high level of a threat of a terrorist attack because any time of transition from one period to the next is a time of instability. Everybody who was anybody was at his ship commissioning. I was standing in the back. One thing you learn as a press secretary is the reporters dont always watch the president for what is happening. They watch the press secretary. I was sitting there watching the beautiful cold day but sunny skies and got a tap on my shoulder from the secret Service Agent and he said the president needs you at the helicopter in five minutes. I thought what is happening. I thought we have to evacuate. I slipped back on to the ship we were staying on and ran to the helicopter. There is rice and the plane is on so we could not talk. He buckle up and i am nervous. And the president said lets go see the seals. He wanted to go see the navy seals one last time as commander and chief. We flew over there and dick cheney is going to speak. They go wild when president bush comes in. There is probably 400 young men, Young American men with really long beards, so you can imagine this isnt the typical american guy look. The president speaks to them from the heart and they will not stop applauding. He is asking them to sit down. And i thought that is one order they do not have to obey. He wanted to take pictures with everybody. He wasnt in a hurry to leave. The two seals came up to me and said excuse me are you the press secretary . I was honored they knew who i was. And they asked for a picture with me. And they are allinspiring. I said to the first one what makes you want to be a navy seal . Family tradition . Sense of adventure . Like to travel . And the first one said oh, no, maam e chicks dig it. And i said even with the beard . And he said oh, yeah, they get it. And when i asked the second one and i said were you are preparing to go whenever you are going do you have to take a lot of language courses . And he said oh, no, maam, we are really not there to talk. And got on the helicopter and told the president that story and he threw his head back and said god i love those guys. I talk about the transition to television. I have to credit fox news for seeing something in me i didnt see in myself. I didnt know i could shoot the breeze with four other people and have a great time on television and make a living doing it. I have had more fun, and learned so much, it is like all of these things i studied from my dad reading me the papers, to being the White House Press secretary, and being interested in journalism and being on the third most poplar show in cable tv news. My cohost have really helped me as well all of them [applause] i will ask gull field to come next year. Just make sure you have a lot of wine. I am going to get to your question but i want to tell you how i end the story. We are in a primary season. They are the worst especially for a party who doesnt have running for reelection. In 2012, president obama didnt have any opposition so they breezed through. In the mean time we were bashing ourselves over the headon our side. It is similar on both sides now. Hillary clinton is getting a battle from Bernie Sanders. And there is the republicans and later tonight there is a debate. I remember how unxhfrlable it was and i write in the book about a moment where a president and press secretary an are like this. And if they are not like this you cannot be a good press secretary. So there was an event and it was clear the president wasnt welcome. The president decided not to go and he gave a statement that was played live on the television at the convention. At the end of the, the president walked back to them and said do you think they know they are missing me . That is a hard question. You have to have total honesty when you are press secretary but you dont want to hurt someones feeling and i had to say yes, sir, i believe they do. It was such a freeing moment maybe for him but certainly for me because that is when i realized that more important than politics is always the character. On the last day when he was in office i got to go to the oval office and he wrapped his arm around me and he said the first day i walked in i looked at myself in the mirror and i said i want to be able to look at the same man on my last day of office and he said i think i can do that. He said he wanted to take one more walk around the grounds and as he left i thought there goes a great president. I miss him and i am grateful to be his friend. I call for civility and Public Discourse at the end. I dont mind if you start lining up because we want to get to as many questions. And if you dont line up, cspan cant get your question and it will be a mess. It is january, 2005, i was junior birdman and the president didnt know my name and i just got kicked out of the oval office. I got invited to the grid iron dinner. It is humorous and fun and i love it. Peter, who loves a Great American event, was disappointed because there wasnt a spouses ticket. I had to go on my own. I had two black dresses. One short and one long and i alternated them for events. I wore the long one because it was a tuck and tail event. I am at usa todays table and sitting across from me is the junior senator from illinois barack obama. And he and i laughed our butts off for four hours. I had so much fun. There is a lot of buzz around him. He had just been elected, he had a Great Convention speech in 2004 and everybody wanted to be around him. I had his full attention and he wanted to know all about my story, where i grew up in wyoming, all about peter and all about washington. It was so much fun. He took me to meet mitchell. And peter asked how my night was and i said i have to tell you i sat across from barack obama the new senator from illinois and i think he could be president in like 20 years. So, three years later, i am now the press secretary and the financial crisis is happening. John mccain suspends the campaign and calls barack obama into the oval office. 43 walks in and i am following behind my boss. I am a good staffer following behind. I never expect anyone to remember me so i am always reintroducing myself and obama is shaking hands with everyone and as he turns toward me i go to introduce myself and he said dana perino and wraps me in a hug and i said sir, you may not remember and he stops me and says not remember . That was my favorite night in all of washington. And i sat down, blushing, and the deputy chief of staff leans over to me and says what was that all about . And i said i will tell you later. But i just might vote for him, too. I didnt. I am going to tell one more story about gratitude. Senator john warner who was a senator at the time i was filling in for tony mills who was going through a lot of Cancer Treatment so i had to go to another press dinner. Hollywood gives a lot of rewards but it is nothing like the press. I was sitting in the spot and thinking of work piling up and how i didnt belong there because i was a deputy. And at the end of the night, senator warner comes up to and he said dana, dana and i thought he wanted he to pass on a message. And i said yes, sir . And he said do you mind if i give you a little advice . And he said i noticed when you were up there and they called your name you didnt barely stand and you hardly smiled and just give a little wave and sat down like you didnt belong there. You have a long career ahead of you, and you will be at a lot more dinners and whenever they call your name you need to stand up, wave and smile because you belong here. I always thought how remarkable it is as a young woman to be helped by so many men who wanted to make sure i had opportunity and took advantage of that. I end the book with that story because i think it pulls together the point of character, humility and a ton of gratitude to be there and all of those experiences. [applause] thank you. I see that my friends have followed directions so i will start with you in the red. I like fogs news because they have a variety like williams as well so they give both signs. And alan combs. And whatever happened to bob beckle . He has moved on and you can find him on cnn once in a while. We miss him, too. Thanks for watching. Thank you. The founder of the festival. This is going to be a tough one. Too bad introduced myself before it started. You belong here, too. You did a hell of a job. We are methodist. We dance and have a good time. So i could tell that joke . You can tell any joke you want to. I am a huge fan of the bush family. I have had different connections with them through various people. Julia reed is very close to the family. I voted for both 41 and 43. And i have gotten behind jeb unfortunately who doesnt seem to be keeping up with the family. When barbara came into New Hampshire i said there is hope. There we go. Anyway, when i was researching this festival i didnt know anything. People asked me about my background and if i was in publishing but i knew a good georgia writer and signed him up for the festival. And i ended up going to the national, going to the South Carolina, going to various festivals, decatur which is decidingly leftleaning. We have tried to keep this festival first amendment. When we had karl rove here i was extorted in the local paper and rather than responding to the paper i wrote to the people and said we dont have any opinion. Keep it fair and balanced. But anyway, the director of the National Book festival is also the librarian of congress. I met with him in South Carolina and he told a story of meeting when 43 was first elected he got a call from texas that said you will is a National Book festival. And dwi we do. Laura is not given credit for it at this point which i think is my wife is going to kill me. Whats your question . So why this disparity in coverage . Why the disrespect for someone who did this . About the festival . Like i didnt think he could do. It was like six months advance, three years before our first one. I think laura bush came through. Heres the great thing that i learn from them, which is you do things because they are right to do and you dont worry about the credit. Our number 43 would tell me when we get ready towards the end of the administration, every reporter want to ask about his legacy that i would ask them once in a while and he would say, dana, last year i read three books about george washington. If historians are still tried to dig up the first president , in the 43rd does have a lot to worry about because he will never know. They left the white house fully believing they had given it all. It continued to do so much in taxes as well. Thank you. [applause] i just want to start out by senator mitchell respect you and i think youre brilliant. Thank you. I will tell greg you said so. What i wanted to say this past primary season a big issue is terrorism and donald trump and muslims and all the. My brother just joined the marines and nothing makes me angrier than seen our troops, you know, and i ran an old think about the video women having their handguns about and all that. That makes me angry and i hate terrorists. I have the utmost respect for our armed forces. What i want to ask you was how do we defeat these people who believe that we deserved to die . Like that is their belief, their religion. How can we defeat, how can we get rid of this threat . Im over it. Im done. Thank you. Well, im not commanderinchief, but i think this is, what i learned from president bush everything is an important thing to keep in mind and its not necessary that president obama like to talk about things but there is good and evil in the world. Calling it out for what it is thallow japan to figure out howo defeat it. Defeating an ideology is difficult. They dont want our territory. They want our way of life. I also think our military is well equipped as long as we provide them the resources they need to do things like what travis mills did, to sign up in 2006 which believe me, who signs up for the army in 2006 during the middle of the worst part of the iraq war . That somebody was a patriot and one of the things we need to remember is that they dont only need our help when they return but they need our help now. We have an election coming up and i think that will help us clarify some things Going Forward. Thank you. [applause] my name is jay and my beautiful wife is michelle and we are huge fans of yours. Thank you. Back in 2006 i believe it was we went to washington during reagans funeral, or his service. I took my two little boys to the rotunda. My youngest was i could on cspan. And now youre on cspan. Wow. I just wanted you to know that you are respected and important. Thank you. Thank you so much. But i was just wondering you watch the news and you see whats looking like possibly a choice between trump and clinton. And im thinking, im going to write any person, a candidate because im not going to vote for either one of them. But i was asking, we respect you so much and your character is such a fresh, just nice to see your why could you not be our first woman president . [applause] do you think i could pass the background check . Thank you. If youre in a room with people, groups of 500, 600, 708 of people, often ask why can we do anything . I will say who here wants to run for office . No one raises their hand. The people that do decide to run i admire them because it is going, typical. Doesnt matter what side of the aisle, political spectrum you are. It is such an undertaking. Condi rice describes it this way, in 2004 she was the National Security advisor and the president of the United States has always have a National Security advisor with them and the press secretary wherever they go. She had to be on the campaign trail with him a lot. She only says that these were just ridiculous. You get up at 6 a. M. For the briefing, the presidency work and then youd be on the road and you have for breakfast and lunch and had to give speech and do an interview with bill oreilly and than this and another dinner. At the end of the night that have a team meeting to talk about the next and president bush would be raring to go. She was exhausted. Because for some people run for office and being out front feeds their energy, and for other people it depletes them. At and in the latter category. But thank you for asking. [applause] im a graduate student at Georgia State university studying anthropology and mass media. Im wondering if you have any advice speakers are going to try to dig up the ratings for msnbc clocks kidding. [laughter] he said i could make a joke in this church. Im doing my thesis on the production of information and media biases. Im wondering if you have information on how to stay truthful to the information we put out while being influenced media corporations, including fox news, cnn, msnbc speak as i do plan on being a journalist as well . Spent idea spent i was a journalist as well. I started Public Affairs reporting in grad school. I worked at the cbs affiliate in springfield, illinois. I grew up in wyoming. All of a sudden i did no bias existed. I had never seen it before. It was against republicans. It was 1984 and thats when republicans swept not Just Congress but all across the nation and the first midterm of president clintons first term. I left and ended up going back home to denver, colorado, and i did what every good student that has graduated from graduate school does. Do you know what i did . I lived in my parents basement and i waited tables. I looked for my next opportunity. One of the reasons i call the book and the good news is. Im a planner, type a. A planner, taipei, firstborn for iowas want to point to play in my husband makes fun of me so if youre not worried about something and youre worried about what you forgot to worry about. What i have learned over time is that i have to let go of that. Actually out of church singles group, im sure its right here in this book, i could find it, theres a short little first that says they are not. I took a chance and i ended up going to washington, d. C. If i look back all the things that have been moved to england to be with peter, moving back to washington to work with the justice department, all those things added up to what im doing a. All i can get it is i cannot be responsible for what anybody else says or does. I would like to be in charge of everybody and say thats not fair and you should do this way. The only thing to do is to be true to yourself. You know inside whats fair and whats not. So just keep that in mind because you cant be responsible for what anybody else says or does. I can tell looking at you, your light shines so bright. Youre going to do an amazing job. Im glad you chose that course of study because we need more of it. And can i quote you for my thesis . Yes. [applause] last question. This is a lot of pressure. A lot of pressure. Hopefully i can handle it. In todays world we are seeing a huge rise of selffunded candidates from president , senate, congress. Do you think it is freezing out the regular person being able to run if you cant put in 200, 300,000, million of your own money . Is going to keep the middle class and younger people out of the process . The Supreme Court ruled on citizen united case that we could have super pac money and everybody is mad at the super pacs. But selffunding your campaign means you inherited money or worked hard and care enough to spend the money on that campaign to get elected. However, i would submit having from a family that didnt inherit money or make a lot of money, it is harder to pick up the phone and ask for a donation. I cannot ask for anything so that is why i cannot run. I dont think we are in danger of people being frozen outlearn campaign . Money is not buying anything. One of the people you talked about selffunding their campaigns has spent the least amount of money of them. The person who has spent the most amount of money has had the fewest results. I think we will have find out in the future how this turns outism but because of social media and the way people can participate i dont think we are at any risk of people buying an election. Everybody, thank you so much and happy valentines day. She is signing books out in the square and you can meet jasper. Booktv is live in savannah, georgia for todays ninth annual savannah book festival. Now a look at some of the citys local book stores. Founded in 1978 the book lady liberty has a ride range of rare and out of print books. They are active with the georgia historical society. East shaver bookstore located in Madison Square has been operating for 40 years. They specialize in regional history, arts, cooking and gardening. Books on bay has a selection of vintage books ranging from biography and the civil war to scouting. And b and j dunnkin is in the citys historic district. That is a look at some of savannah, georgias local bookstores. Now the final author talk from this years savannah book festival. Here is ranker buck. Well, thank you. Thank you so much for that introduction. I am glad to see so many people here. I thought maybe we would get to the end of the day and there wouldnt be any book lovers left in savannah. I am thankful to be here and i want to thank the organizers. This lovely city. In 1970 while a freshman in college i came down to participate in a Vista Program on defusky island before there were any houses out there. There was just the Old Community and remnants of the plantations that had been there. I was down here for a combined work study. The Things College students in the 60s and early 70s did a lot. I had to get out there every day and there was mail boat but it only ran once or twice a week. But they said there is a School Teacher and if you are down at the boston docks every morning at 6 306 45 you can get a ride over to the island any day you want. I got down there and there was this skinny, mid20s guy. I remember he had a beautiful sunburn. I felt like he belonged together. I could just tell you can just tell, this guy might have had a whacky upbringing just like me. Not every morning but the few mornings a week i would go out to the island and ride back and forth on this metal skiff with a skinny guy by the name of pat. Pat went on the first time i sort of caught up with him when the river is wide was made into a movie. I have been back to savannah a few times but it is kind of sentime sentimental being here. My publisher told me almost a year ago as we were making preparation for the release of my book on the oregon trail that there was this great thing in savannah called the savannah book festival. I didnt pay much attention at the time because so many other things were going on. But i assumed it would be like most talks where i go and have a power point presentation and i have a nice one i can show you what the oregon trail looks like and how my brother and i became the first to cross the trail in over a century. After that i do funny readings for my book and everything is great. I didnt think about much about it. Back in november i called down here and said i have a power point and a reading and they go, this woman with a sweet southern accent said you dont have to worry about all that. We are not doing power point because you are speaking in a church. We just fine. Authors who stand up there and read from the books are so boring. You just come down here she said. Do i have to wear a tie . No, just come tell the folks down here what made you tick. I was immediately worried. I spent a lot of money over the years in the best welltrained psychotherapist in the country and we have never figured out what makes me tick. That got me started. And i will get to the oregon trail book in a bit and leave plenty of time for questions and that is what folks are interested in. But i want to start this way. I stand before you as someone with who complete plausibility and no prior man planning is not only the youngest aviator, to always the first person who took a covered wagon on the oregon trail in over a century. We tend to talk about important periods in life; christening, wedding, second wedding, third wedding all of those. The pivotal mome moments in life. If you remember the book called passages. It was all about the traditional moments that are shared in life and we all have to go through. The only problem i had with what gale wrote is there are a lot of other passages that are equally more important. For example, first job. When i got out of college and got a job at a great newspaper, the burke shire eagle, and they had me writing obiteries and it never occurred to me spelling a last time correctly was important. People would be calling me up saying i will not dead. But probably the most formative period is the adolescent turning in. They say from what i am reading in the papers everything is starting earlier now. But 1215. This is the period when you wake up and everything has been going on and all of a sudden something changes. Some has to do with new chemistry. But you wake up and it is like my hair isnt straight anymore, i come from the most embarrassing family on the planet. And catholicism . Why do they expect me to think i am consuming the body of christ . You are just convinced your life is miserable. I grew up on a farm in northern new jersey in the middle of republican hunt country. The only problem being we have the only democrats in the whole county. We had 11 kids. We had a carriage collection of 2530 wagons. When we got board with that we started building airplanes in the barn. My dad would come home after a days work and we had a used Yellow School bus parked by the barn and he would take us all down, there were a lot of kids and frepiends, and take us to t dairy queen in the next town over in this eccentric Yellow School bus. So i had a lot to be embarrassed about. My dad was a publisher. The owner of the magazine in those days kept the title publisher. He was very involved in politics civil right struggle and the antivietnam protest and so forth. So i was really getting embarrassed by reading my father getting arrested at a civil rights march when i am 1214. It is a vulnerable age to have all of the republican neighbors know you are coming from a crazy family. So my adolescent turning in what i did was became a reader. And a big reader. Reading is so important for the formation of a writer. What would happen is i would go down there and my father had this beautiful big walkin fireplace. I go down there and i would just love to read. I was a little precocious i think. I went down there and you could not miss it. This big long shelf of the same book, all blue, printed the same way. I said the collected speeches of Winston Churchill. So you know i took them upstairs and started reading away. It was really fascinating for me. I cannot believe i do it but i learned about the indian question and the irish question and the questions churchill had to stand up as first lord of the admirality and defend the battle of turkey during world war i and all of this stuff. And another book i found that was really great was the fixed volume biography of aberham lincoln. With my little brother saying have you finished the biography of abook and the six volume is condensed version of everything. And i said dad, why didnt you tell me this is almost like cliff notes. And he said i didnt want to spoil the experience. So what would happen is because of my dad he was very active in politics and kind of a big wheeling Democratic Party and this that and the other thing he quit his job in 1959 to work for the Kennedy Campaign to work for a year and went back to it. The people that came out to the place on weakeweakeekenweekends came out and we would go for carriage rides. There were newspaper columnist and i could drop names but it isnt important. They would sit around in my fathers Beautiful Library and say what are we going to do about vietnam . What is the impact going to have on johnson . And i am the only kid sitting there listening. And all of these imminent people are sitting around and they said rinker what do you think . And i said i think we have to go back and consider what Winston Churchill said about chamberland during that crisis. And these guys go whoa are all your kids like that . And we got to talking about Martin Luther king and there was point, if you remember where Martin Luther king in in addition to the civil war agenda he came out against the vietnam war. It was very controversial at the time. My dad was one of the few people of the time defending king doing this. We are there. Beautiful fall day with beautiful view from the windows and father is crackling and all of these people are sitting around. Big rigs. What do you think, rinker . Well you really need to consider this in light of the free soil debates in congress in 1854. So, what was great about this is that it writing was working for me. Being a reader and big writer was working for me. My dad recognized me. None of the other kids were interested in this kind of intellectual debate. His my father never graduated from high school and rose up to be the editor of look magazine. He started exhibiting this interest in me. Essentially what he was doing was encouraging me and all of my history papers he would send around to his friend and some included historians but it was a way of getting recognition and this adolescent turning in was starting to work for me in a certain way. The next thing that happened that i remember on my writing career that i would share with you is i went to a boys academy. It was like this Little School that could. We would show up with a Station Wagon of kids to the track meet and the other rich kids showed up with big buses and had guys massageing your legs and suf like that. And so it was kind of antiquated place in some ways. They had a tradition there of freshman hazing. Senior and junior and any upper classmate could haze a freshman and ask him to do whatever we wanted. A senior could tell you to shine his shoes and you were supposed to carry this shoe shine kit s. And i can tell the nerds in the class because these guys are running around with their kits. One of these freshman ran by and i said shine my shoes. And he did. I was learning there were ways around the rules. I did get to the bus stop and there was a lady coming by and she used to come by in this old battered up vw bug. She was old, had a lot of liver spots and her jowls were considerable. And whenever we were cutting up at the bus stop or doing something we should not she would go by in the volkswagon. The guys used to moon her a lot. So this senior goes, we see the yellow volkswagon coming up, and the senior says buck, shine a bear ass moon to the moon lady. And i figured i cannot get out of this one. He is a senior and my accountability is very low because a senior made me do it. So i gave her a bare ass moon. He comes to a screeching halt, calls the police and before the bus can get to there and the cops and and they arrested me and took me down to the station. It helped my career. It just helped me immensely because everyone at school was cheering me on. And so i got to the police station, you know the cops are there. What is the statute . You know . So i got driven back to school in a police car. And the kids were hanging out the window yeah and so in those days we had something that was called it seems antiquated. I am probably giving you good information here. In those days Catholic Schools had had somebody called the dean of discipline. Father arthur. He said i got you now. You know, i could give you weeks of detention. I got something in store for you. The worst punishment possible. I go, okay, father. And he said i am calling your dad at work and telling him about this. So i get home that night and my dad is sitting in there. I know it is a serious thing because he is home on time. And you know he didnt go to the aa meeting on the way home. He came straight home. And he goes son, and he is really angry at me but he said i am going to give you a good lesson. I am not going to get angry. I am going to show you how this exhibitionism can be turned for the good of the world. And i go okay, dad. He said go upstairs to your room and write a letter of apology to this woman. I said dad, that is a great idea. I am going up there. I will do it. I went up there and i remember because i was one of the first kids in the neighborhood to get one this was the point in Communication Technology we were making the transition from the manual to the electric typewriter. I had a typewriter i loved and it had a case on it and later i carried it around on my motorcycle. It was great. I must have known i was going to become a writer. I had an unconscious knowledge because i wrote carbon in on the final draft. And when i sat down to write flight of passage i found the carbon. So i took the letter down to my dad and these are not exact but pretty close paraphrase. Dear ms. Jinks, you cannot imagine how unhumbled i am to write you under these circumstancesism circumstances. I had no idea my school boy act would have such an impact on a woman of your age. It went on and on. Another sentence was the sun glistening through the windows of your volkswagon, shimmering off your liver spots and jowls, reminded me i had made a terrible mistake. My father is reading this and his hands started to shake actually. And you know, god damn it, ra ranker. I cannot send this. She will die from a heart attack and we will really be sued. He packed it up and threw it in the fireplace. So again writing was working for me. My older brother would confront my father and have a fight. I said dad, it a good letter. And he said it is a god damn good letter that is right. I will just give you one other example because my notes go on and on and we will talk about the oregon trail book a little and take some questions. So, writers talk about all these pretentious things and literary life. But no there are specific things that happen to you that put you in the direction of becoming a writer. So the other thing i remember is a couple years later i was in high school and this Little School was trying to become a bigger and better place. It now is a successful secondary school. But in those days, everybody in the class had to do really well on at least one or two advance placement exams because that would help you get into a Better College and they were trying to get us into secular colleges. I became this obsessive reader. My strategy that worked really well in high school and colleges and i would read ahead by the whole syllabus. By the middle of october i would have the whole syllabus read up and then i could spend the rest of the time reading what i wanted. I liked to read novel. And it is novel because it has sex. And that is great. So instead of reading my history some nights i would read what happened was i got in to take the ap exam and father john said you have to get a perfect score. There were three essay questions in those days that you answered and multiple choice. Multiple choice was easy but the three essay questions were the only three you would get and whatever you got you had to answer. And father john said, look, if you dont know the material just try anything because if you dont answer the question you will really be in trouble. So i get in there and my big essay question, and there is two little ones but the big essay question is tell us about the a alien acts and i think i dont know about thachlt that. And i go back to that was the night i was reading lolita. I didnt know anything about the alien extradiction extradition acts. So i go, aliens, extradition. It was bad. It was almost like the fourth volume of carl sanders biography. It is all about how he suspended hebious corpus during the civil war and all these other things. They gave me an out and that was comma and dont be afraid to reflect on the significance of the acts on future events in america history. And i go okay. We are good. So the opening sentence it is like, you know, no historian could possibly analyze the nefarious affect of the alien acts without contemplating their influence on lincolns suspension of corpus. The catholics are great because they teach you the short cuts. We had to study latin so i put it in latin and then first reference, give me the body. It is a big deal in school. How did you do on the ap test. All of the papers come back from princeton and father joe calls you in alone and he holds the paper down low and gives you a big lecture on yourself. They are scored 15 and i got a 5. This impressed me. It had a big influence on me because i realized it is all about the writing. I didnt know what the act was. And these things are graded by College Level historians. I did fine. It is all about the writing. Dont be afraid to go in strange directions. I got all these other examples but we will not have time and i know you want to here about the covered wagon trip. So the adolescent turning in forced upon me a regimen of welcome reading. A lot of reading. And then i would get romantic candlized with all of the reading. There was a period when i was like 1920 and i thought it was the most awful thing in the world that i had not been alive during the civil war because there is no way of making a life in america if you didnt start out after being a civil war soldier. I could not just imagine that. I was impressionable and vicarious. The reading pushed me in vicarious directions. About 67 years ago when i became fascinated by the oregon trail and all the things that were true but they didnt teach you in school and you would not find them in a hollywood movie. I came across the last documentary of crossing the oregon trail was in 1909. And my especially since i had ae background, growing up ton a farm didnt occur to me there might be a strange response to that. That the book i should do on the trail. Lets take the covered wagon across and write about the oregon trail. And people go, rinker york crazy. The wheels are going to break in nebraska. And youre such a weirdo. And im going, like, i know, but it feels normal to me. This feels formal to me. So i bought ai got my brother nick to come along, thank baud, because he is more experience horseman than i am and can ticket mission. I bought a team of mules from amish in missouri, very close from where i had to depart from, and the amish are annot allowed to have cell phones and communicate in any kind of minor way. Thats why you always cal them on their cell phone at night because you know hell be out in the barn doing chores. So i bought the team and boat a restored wagon, original covered wagon, and took us four months, 79 camps. We camped in the pioneer ground ounce crowneds and the fairgrounds, and flying gentleman truck stops are good because they have showers. My brother said, were going to get in trouble for going in. Its a truck stop. He said i bet you nobody says a word and nobody said a word. And things like we nobody said a word. Took us 29 days to cross wyoming and that includes the wheel breaking in south pass and somehow replacing them. 29 days from fort lair me to coke ville. We had to come down the rockies and things like that. 29 days. And we had three showers. I can remember each place we had those showers. I know you want to ask questions about that. I am all set. And i just want to say that we you know, to me, even though i really cant explain who i have become and what im doing and i am going off on another crazy adventure this year. Watch those children and grandchildren because it is the adolescent turning in and great things can come from it. Thank you very much. [applause] i am sure there is a few people who have read my book or want to read it but you can ask me any question you want. Can you elaborate on the inaudible. Yes, i have. Buke and beck dont like me. I took them 2,000 miles and they were in harness for four months straight. Jake, the john mule, was a big kind hearted gentle giant. At the end of the trip i wanted to keep the team together. Mules are paternal and have been on the same farm their whole life. So it would be tough if i had just sold them to the highest bidder. One of the ranchers said tell me what you have them in and i will buy them and put them on retirement here. I have been out to idaho twice now. They know who you are. Getting out of the vehicle it is like white guy. With they hear your voice, when i got out of the vehicle and i called them, how are you . Those two take off. They go oh, no. [laughter] not that guy. And jake comes over. So i still is a great relationship with jake. The mules are fine. They are a little overweight. Animals should be exercised. Butte, the big eater in the gang. I swear they feed her a bucket of bonbons every night. They are great to see and they are still healthy and i felt strongly a team that did something no ever team did in over a century and that is going 2,000 miles across the plains needed the reward of a good retirement. When you take risks like this i think good things happen to you in the end. So i found a really good home for them and i spoke with the rancher who is now a friend a few weeks ago and they are doing great. Does the trail still exist . I will explain that. They would not let me come with a power point so. [laughter] 2100 miles from saint joe, missouri or independence, to oregon city, oregon. 1,000 lanes are two lanes that follow the river. And the reason that the it is repaved and the reason it was repaved is for one example, as early as the 1850s the former pioneers, now ranchers and farmers in the west mainly oregon were driving cattle back eastward against the wagon traffic and it was being slaughtered and the beef industry was being created in places like omaha. In world war i the need to get processed meat, precooked meat, canned so it was safe for the soldiers, was enormous. Long stretches of the trail they were driving cattle along was turned into a highway because the combustion machine had been invented and it was more efficient and reliable getting the cattle there by truck. So about a thousand miles of that. But mainly back country roads or farm and ranch roads. Follow the platt river, sweet water river, bear river, and there are trailmarkers along the way. The other thousand miles roughly is the original ruts. And i mean original. This is why the deprivation of power point is cruel. From casper, wyoming to the northern line there are 300 miles of the original ruts of the oregon trail. It is no development. Just all federal land and ranching. And of that 1,000 miles that is open ruts we did sections in every state. Nebraska about 50 miles. 380 in wyoming. And so forth. Of the miles of the ruts that were accessible we did about 500 of those miles. For the most part we fallode followed the trail exactly. I am halfway through the book. I wish you had brought nick your brother with you. Here . Yes. Got you. Are you taking him on your next trip . And how did the two of you do your research . I go out and give these talks and i think i am a big guy because my book is a bestseller and i am a writer and it is so important how i wrote the book so good. And someone stands up and says is usually a woman hows nick . We just did an appearance where we both live. It goes well. It is good having him in the audience because he adds a lot. I say here is a picture of us flipping the wagon and we had the baby back on the trail in 24 hours. And nick is sitting in the audience and he goes excuse me, we . Because he did all of the work. Nick is great and the only reason i didnt bring him is he is back to work at construction projects. And how do i do my research . That adolescent turning in. You are happy lost in your books. I read over a hundred pioneer journals. I read the classic histories like the point of cross and a book called the great plat river road. I paid 160 for a bibliography of every letter published. One of the great feats of scholarships in america. It turned out to be great because i knew a lot more than i had to. We get to places the year we crossed 2011 was a high waterway and we got to willow creak which is a traditional crossing and it was such a high water year we could get not across. I could see the oregon trail marker on the other side. I did so much reading i knew there was something called the seminole cut off in the same air and it was more heavily traveled than the main ruts. All of the research pitted out. A huge amount of reading, going to museums, going back to primary sources as much as i could. I had tons of history books. If i got to a footnote, you know, or if i wanted to use that information, you know i would go to the footnote and try to get the original source. And believe it or not, if you thought the book was researched, the original manuscript was 85,000 words longer than what got published. So i am obsessed with this stuff. Pioneer journalist. There must have been a time when coming west off of the high plane, short Grass Prairies and the first time they come over the ridge, and then see the rockies, what was their comment and your comment when you experienced the same thing. Mine was untrainabltrainabl. The point where they came up the short Grass Prairie and first looked upon the rockies was scotts bluff, nebraska. The top of Mitchell Pass. I did this thing in the book where i quoted it is difficult to remember. But amanda something, when she got to the top of Mitchell Pass and saw the rockies for the first time and what he she was looking at was the top of mount larmie. And we get there and we look up sand the real thing said was nick was on the wagon seat with me and he said jesus we have to cross that . And i said you can see it right across from wyoming. It it it is just on the other side of a place called wheatland, wyoming. That is where they first saw the rockies. The thing about the trail is you circle around the big peach. You dont go every it except this one awful place called d n dduh du n ridge. That big Purple Mountain you see is laramie peak. With the adolescent turning in and the discipline of father arthur did you endure the training at all . It did. Because the thing about the track this fellow here graduated from the same school as me. He is asking about our track coach. And he was track coach at a Catholic School but the most profound man in the state of new jersey. You run like a freaking egyptian today. And if you remember, i was a good miler, i won a lot of races. And so,uled be coming in, and you know, i know i am going to win but i am still behind. Egyptian over there, pick up the speed. So i learned endurance. That was the big thing about it. My brother and i were proud. We would be 18 hours in harness some days. It was the ability to take munotomy and i learned one important thing. I got very tired on the wagon and fell asleep and that is dangerous on the covered wagon because you can fall into the wheels. So every day by noon even if where wasnt tired i would get off the wagon and call for five or six miles no matter how hot it was. Because i really needed to do that to get myself back up. And then the rockies were fascinating because we spent i think 42 days above 40,000 feet. And all the way up to 8,000 feet to get the last peek of the rockies. And my feeling about it was you never get altitude sickness or anything like that until you get up around 1214 because i knew from flying that you really are not required to put oxygen on until 10,000 feet. So i thought where was fine. I wasnt. I sufferesuffered depereration leaving things and leaving buckets and chains behind. We had to over rocky ridge. We got to the mormon camp and there were no mormons so i kept going straight. And another mormon came down saying you know you are headed straight for rocky ridge and you cannot turn a wagon around. He said you will never get around there. Listen to me. The oxygen deprivation i included later was the wheels are broken or we dont have any water because they were in that wagon. We will be good. You know . Because i had that kind of oxyg oxygen deprivation. There are two forms. Nick would go we lost such and so. And i would say we will get to work. Anyone else . I think we are pretty much done here. I just have one more question. You spoke about your brother nick. Yes i know i am supposed to ask a question about him. What the most creative fix you made . He admitted to fixing things. Because i know you had a lot of adventure i think the most creative fix well the most creative thing he did in the whole trip is called my mother. My 90yearold mother all the way back in maine. And nick was critical of me because i would always wear clean shirts and buy new shorts shirts. And he said mom, i am crossing the trail with three mules, a jack russell terrier and a cloths horse. He built a platform on the truck so we would carry another hundred gallons of water. We bought what is called a bio thane harness. It is a limitation leather harness. All of the horses out here probably have it. It is considered to be better for a trip like this because it is very durable so we would not have to do repairs. But i learned at certain critical junctures in the trip this imitation leather, which is really nylon reinforced plastic, would rub against the mules and they would get sores. Very bad sores. And leather will not do that as much because leather is leather to leather. I came in after carry water and nick is going through my backpack and taking out belts. Thanks for bringing all of these belts he is saying. And he rebuilt the bridles and other parts of the harness out of my belts and boy, it did it work. He made them a little bit on the large side and when they were rubbi rubbi rubbing against the mules and there were no sores. The best thing about nick is he was like an old western festive always complaining about something. You know, every hundred miles we had to grease to wheels and jack up the wagon and pull off the wheels, regrease, put them back on, and i would go regrease we would get somewhere and nick would say every week since we have been gone i have greased these wheels and not had a lick of help from my brother. I would go over to the wagon when he was greasing the wheels and i would say nick, let me help you grease the wheels. And he would say get your collegeeducated ass away from my wagon. There was this beautiful personality contradictions about him. I dont have any myself. But he was absolutely instrumental for the trip because he could fix everything. Thank you very much. This has been great. Mr. Buck is going to be out in the square to sign the books. Please let him exit and we look forward to seeing you hear at the theater tomorrow at 3 00 to see paul william young. Thank you very much. [inaudible conversations] here as a look at upcoming book fairs and festivals happening around the country. On march 12th and 13th, booktv is live at the university of arizona for the 8th annual tucson festival of book. The following week is the virginia festival of the book. Then on saturday, april 2nd, the Fourth Annual san antonio book festival. And then we go to the campus of the university of Southern California on april 9th and 10th. For more information on the upcoming festivals and previous events click on the tab. When i first started writing these columns if i said negative i was a fish. When ann coulter tweets out and says i dont care if donald trump performs abortions in the white house as long as he has this hard core antiimmigration policy. I think a lot of people are waking up. Even the conservatives who were hesitant to engage criticism of the conservative cause are like it is time for that. Did he finally reach the Critical Mass . Do you think, i mean all of these very successful and talented faces of the party like rush and like ann are they on their way out . Ory are we going to have to live together for the next decade . That is a good question. I wonder if he are in the midst of a reordering where you have a conservative movement that i would be part of that believes in small government, and free trade, and that free market helps bring about flourishing and you know, helps humans to reach their potential and enjoy the most prosperity and a most populus that is for perfecti perfectism pertectionism and builds walls and a whiteidentity party. I fear we could be heading in a direction where our policies are based on essentially what tribe you are in. If you are a College Graduate of minority you are assigned democratic card. If you are a working class white person you just reflectively become a republican. And i think politics should be about ideas and we should have this vigorous debate about identity. And identity politics your identity should not define your political persuasion. That is what liberalism says. Let them. And we are aping liberalism in many ways. The conservative argument is they do that to and we have to fight fire with fire. I reject that. You can watch nis and other programs online at booktv. Org. This host and our guest this week on the the communicators is the Senior Member of the federal Communication Commission and that is Mignon Clyburn currently in her second term. One of three democrats on the commission. Commissioner clyburn, i want to start on an issue you have been working on since getting on the commission and that is prison phone rates. Where are we on that issue . Guest where we are is basically in the court. That issue is one as you mentioned very important to me. Millions of families to the tune of 2. 7 million children and 2 million inmates were