Washingtons biggest scandals. Welcome to book tv. I former apartment chairman of the house government oversight committee. Were here to discuss a book by the retired chairman of the house government and oversight called watchdog. Watchdog tells about basically your political history and also about the investigation that you underwent as chairman of the committee and as a minority member of the committee. Your first election to congress, interesting for readers is the great davis recall in california and behind the scenes story of how that came about and was financed. It has a little bit of chairman toms time in it to. I think youll learn from my mistakes to move out. But what wanted you to write the book. Guest i think of voters right now have lost a little of hope. They seat the wrongdoing, not all of it but some of it. Then they do not see what difference it makes. I thought a book that took these stories and linked it to what difference it makes would really help people. There are things that were done as a result of our successes. I touch on the fact that you send off as you did when you are chairman about 2000 letters in a congressional cycle. Most of those and in government complying, making changes, addressing issues and our investigations. Many of them leading to fundamental change. The gsa and a number of number of other agents including the irs and veterans administration. They all held lavish parties on taxpayer money. Our oversight, making that aware have changed how the administration oversees it to make sure the taxpayer dollars are overspent. These changes or Success Stories id touch on the additional stories. Changes of of the freedom of information act. Of the data act in law and changes in how congress can bring to the Court Complaints about wrongdoing of the administration. All of those are part of what we touch on as the next step. What we are going to do to create a government were responsible to his people. Host we are sponsoring a balance of powers both the judiciary executive and the legislative branch, but maybe im just reminiscing since i left congress, but it looks like the Congressional Branch your book goes to explain some of things he tried to do the oversight and the importance of oversight from the legislative branch to make sure the executive branch does not get out of control. Guest i think youre hitting the nail on the head. Congress has given up much of its power. Periodically they said will punt over to the administration and with the Administration Takes all the power you give them, like most bureaucracies takes more if they can, we often find our constituents saying, where do we go to get fairness, how is it that elected officials are making best about so for . The other part is an interesting one. When addressing the oversight of congress have always sided with the legitimate requirement and obligation of the administration to comply with our oversights. What they have not done is they have not seen the cases brought to the for what our oversight leads to. They are very good at saying, yes you have a right to see these documents and call witnesses. But when we but when we say, but what you are doing is wrong, if the administration shows you the back of their hand and moves on, we have not been able to get back to the courts in a way in which they coincide with us, two against one of their rights and get the administration to do what they need to do. The Obama Administration has taken a lot of well sought and received grief for being above the law. But not really. They are above congress. When the courts have spoke on the Obama Administration has complied. What we need to do candidly is get to the courts when there are differences in views between the American People and administration, quickly. Host administrations never like to give up information. It is a nuisance that they have to put up with. As is the Associated Press and all the things under foia. But when you give a subpoena you give subpoena power. At one point it held members in contempt of congress but the administration had to enforce that and it just gets stymied at that point. Guest that was one of the Lessons Learned both during the Bush Administration and in your tenure when president bush, his people were held in contempt for not delivering witnesses to the judiciary committee. Then again herrick colder when he was withholding unreasonably documents about the statements and cover up in congress and the fast and furious investigation. In both cases we eventually were vindicated by the courts that the administration was over asserting their right to privacy but it took time. These are covered in the book. Both are covered in the book. They run the clock out. Actually the deal on the firing of the u. S. Attorney was made after the election of barack obama. Theyre suddenly willing to cut a deal and make it go away but the head are ready been ordered by a judge to do so. In the case of fast and furious, documents are still coming in but the real closing at that would probably happen if the administration is about to turn in the Obama Administration wants to make this go away before they leave. Host i want to get to fast and freeze but this is a great read. It is an easy read. I enjoyed it. But it is a very readable. You probably if not the wealthiest one of the wealthiest members of congress but you talk about how your roof and how you started to get into it. Tell us about how you got into politics and how you got into business and your successes and some of the trials he went to getting there and how that gets used against you in the campaign. Guest i did grow up just a kid, one of six and a i would say middleclass family who had five less kids. I was like he. I was given an opportunity to go to college paid for by the u. S. Army and another four years, like you, like you to serve as an army officer. That took me from a street kid with the likelihood of a bluecollar job and took me to the opportunities to start a business, to have the education to grow a business, and ultimately to do well enough that i began looking began looking at what was wrong in our society. The class warfare that was being instigated several president s ago. But also the whole question of government probusiness, antibusiness or or did they just not understand. Host but you are in suburban cleveland growing up in an ethnic neighborhood. What was it like . Guest are ethnic neighborhood was jewish. We would not have called ourselves arabs we wouldve called yourselves lebanese. But our neighbors, my School Teachers and so on, i was deep in that culture. It was a great opportunity. It was it was the 60s. But there is also challenges. The arab israeli broke out in 67 happened while i was a freshman in high school. Was a very interesting time to have older brothers with my friends heading off to israel to develop against an existential threat. This was a community of Small Business people. A lot of my neighbors, my friends and families own to businesses. Evything from retail shops and manufacturing. It gave me an opportunity to see that there was, in america, an unlimited ability to join a company and growth that or start with your own company. My father know never had that opportunity until fairly late when he started the business after he had a heart attack and could not, quite candidly his career was stifled. So he started a started a business. Growing up i had a lot of examples. For all of us that sort of live the american dream, theres always that question of whats next. Politics and philanthropy become the next whats next. I kind of have an interesting deal. My wife does the majority of philanthropy and we have a foundation that is able to help people. I participate, but i really had an interest in trying to get back to have government to a better job on behalf of the American People. I started off assembly coming to washington to describe what i was seeing, including in the nafta debate i came and testified on behalf of the chamber. I did get hooked on it and eventually help candidates win and then ran for office myself. You are not a stellar student in college. Youre youre one of the smartest guys in congress. But you had learning disabilities along the way. You ended up inventing a lot of things. You get some of your skills in the army and got in the electronics business. Guest it is an odd thing. I went through college as a business major which has been most appropriate for me. I was a like to tinker. I worked in high school what was to be radios made with the transistor tube. In the army i was fortunate enough to head up and organization of engineers and run a computer facility so i got the balance of big picture a a couple of hundred Million Dollars facility i ran. When i left the military and figured i could do anything so i joined a manufacturing firm. It never really did that well but got me into business and started looking at inventions of my own. By 1982 or 1983i was starting 83 i was starting to invent things. I got my first patent in 1981 an actual invention. Ive had 37 cents. Some have done very well, most most have been radio frequency control products and microprocessors. I was also lucky that industry was changing. When i came into security you stuck it key in the fender to protect your car. Or you locked locked the hood. By the time i left, everything was hightech radio control. It interfaced with the body computers and Engine Computers to shut down the car. Or to open the trunk, what ever you want it to do. It was a lot of fun. Innovating to that end of space as a cargo is a win, win. Host so the subcommittee chairmen on judiciary over patents and trademarks which gives you firsthand experience in this area in terms of how it affects real people. Guest fixing the Patent Office has been something i have been involved in. It is been something very much a passion. I came to congress with the number number of federal judges to become friends after cases. They have been good counselors and helpers. We passed early on in my career the second or third term in today that provides a federal judges who choose to specialize somewhat in Patent Litigation with expertise. They are are able to dismiss these cases, dispatch them quickly and accurately. The calendar of these cases are moving better and the judges are more confident in making good rulings with less overturning on appeal. It is not over. We are innovating as a country and the world, patents are becoming more valuable and as a result, there are there are people who litigate for a living sometimes with very weak patents but for great profit. That is part of what i am working on. Host you are certainly the right guy for understanding this. At every level. So you came to testify for nafta in 1993. You got the bug with the San Diego Chamber kind of adopted you in your ran for the senate at that point. Guest i ran for the senate not till 98. Everything early you have the rest of the night to party. It did allow you to have an early supper followed by a long enjoyable evening and sleep in a little bit. I was a freshman congressman at that point and a delegate from virginia. So 1998 you spend a lot of your own money and voters probably give you a favodid you a favor g you enact their. I have a soft spot hes now passed away. He was the state treasurer, graduate of the air force academy, great candidate. He didnt win but he did do better in the primary than i did as he became a nominee of our party. And through losing in the primary, i gained a friend and an opportunity to be seen as somebody to fight hard for what they believe in. But then to support the nominee of the party that they after you get your butt kicked in the primary having to show up at the unity breakfast and say good things about somebody but i have some hurt feelings when you begin to understand politics its fighting hard and losing at least half the time and then coming back into picking a gentle man about it and knowing theres another day it was good training and he remained a friend until he passed away of cancer. I never ran for office again because two years later my congressman announced his retirement and i was already pretty close to issuing in many ways and i was well garded and ran one and have been there ever since. Since. So your opponent who represented a good part of that his district was bigger than the congress. He was a formidable opponent. Tell us about the ad that blew up on him. Guest politics is interesting. They took the ads available in the senate and try to rerun it. A sergeant said i was a data private. He responded everybody has a sergeant that says that you were bad. Guest i was 17. I will never disagree the 17yearold private can be pretty questionable, and i was but i responded with efficiency ratings i served with some medal of honor recipients and some from kernels that retired threestar generals, and two of them general wesley clark in the two separate commands. That shut them up and took care of the question. I was a good lieutenant and captain. He went after my background and claimed some of the money was tainted because the gulf state company by the way the guide that headed the company we dont be ambassador in there and he had been the former head of protocol to Ronald Reagan and have gone on to be the ambassador and he said by the way its the gulf of mexico and so again it made him look foolish. The man accused was an incredible figure in history and a great help to the president , and those kind of mistakes change the rate. He had served well and might have one, but if it came between somebody, a false accusation he tumbled and never really recovered or ran for office again. Host when you came to washington you were fortunate to get on the committees. Usually you get one or two in the judiciary committee. You ended up it makes sense for somebody with your background and connections and government oversight which was probably your third choice at the time. You dont quite eat bluetooth do that in the buck but it was your first. Guest i always seem a thirsay mythird choice was the e on Small Business and they put me on that and i didnt want to be a Small Businessman. We start off as Small Businessmen and so i got off of that and went to energy and commerce for a long time and because of the work that you were doing and the fact government oversight often did not enjoy first choice but i saw the potential and buy him a third term i realized the work k youre doing even in the Bush Administration of holding the Administration Accountable was important and so with the help of the former speaker i got the temporary transfer and that lasted for a decade. Host there is a balance of power but when you have one Party Controlling the senate and presidency they see themselves intertwining and you investigate who did that as you know. We talked about that leadership that i will never forget whenever we go after something the Bush Administration did wrong, he wouldnt call me, he would call the speaker to try to get us off the sand and its our job and a balance of power we have the responsibility when wee see the wrongdoing in the executive branch. But we need to shine a light on those things that go unchecked until you word the subcommittee chairman because i saw your capability. Tell us about what you found there. It was amazing they created the service i was cobbling together organizations have seemed logical at the time and they oversaw three parts of federal land. They did andsign tv could seem to write a thesis accurately where we have a lot of billions. One of them had to do with the deepwater horizon. They had written exclusions into the leases even when the natural gas went up, huge amounts of revenue not to be recognized we found that they didnt even know how much they were entitled to until the Gas Companies told them. We found they were too cozy that in fact they went to parties and stayed overnight and even when their employees became pregnant and the father was one of the people she was supposed to oversee, this kind of a this kind of dysfunction was quite a scandal of the Bush Administration to set we will handle it but you didnt shut down the investigation we provided and we thought was good guidance in particular some guidance on the fact that the safety oversight was so bad that they never solve a problem or came off the oil rig and you figure at least once they showed, so it was sad after the chairmanship when henry waxman came into play and he had two years and during those two years we havent said another word about it and you would have thought it would be continued. Just as you would congress and president obama came in, what we found was the deepwater horizon, the service inspectors were on the raid that morning and left with a clean bill of health and the thing blew up. Loss of life, billions of dollars in damages all because nobody pulled the stop button so there is an example of a successful investigation and failure to starve to stop something bad. You cant just end by telling people something is wrong. You have to provide at least a proposal for change. Host so you came on and i left him the Ranking Committee member on the committee they captured the houscapture the hoe chairman of the committee one of the first investigations i think the viewers will note is the fast and furious, which was an investigation of gunrunning. You described the end it even has some applicability today just a few weeks ago. Host that continues fast and furious was a program that didnt make any sense but was done anyway and the idea of the inspiration we found went from an agent who tried to get it done similarly in the Bush Administration and i they had bn shut down because it didnt work and you woul he would allow theo be sold to those that were buying on behalf of the cartels and then you would try to find them later and make the link. So they had no way to track them when it was sold and where is at the scene of a crime which is where this program didnt make any sense but more than 2,000 weapons w