Politician in American History to Bobby Kennedy being the one to model themselves after. And now they to say one last thing i have written a book on very strange topics including superman wrote the biography of superman but i would like to present this church. I will not make template on tonight. [applause] but wonderful round of applause. [applause] you could not have known that is what everybody called me when i was mayor of. [laughter] [inaudible conversations] authod Michael Mccray discuss their books, this is booktv on cspan2. [inaudible conversations] good afternoon this is the southern festival of booksks center dog forgiveness and what forgiveness really means. The authors today will speak of the topic firsthand with much authority and sensitivity. Dr. Randall horton is a poet having won National Awards and endowment of the arts teacher one negative teaches it university of new haven and serves on the border directors of the prison breaking program. Those honors it gives him the authority to write this powerful book about forgiveness and what it is like in the Prison Industrial Complex both during and after. Michael mcray is the writer having published a book from the palestinianisraeli conflict and the authority on International Conflict resolution. And a teacher at the river bend maximum Security Institution and a prison for women gives him the authority to write on the topic of forgiveness. He writes what it is like to be in prison and calls the asocial exile what he knows about after being exiled himself for his advocacy work we are fortunate to have them with us today. They will speak and induce our reading and we will have a few minutes at the end of the hour to take repressions your questions. Thanks for being here the title of my booking is where the river bendsnds co considering forgiveness in the lives of prisoners the first thing out want to address it is why a white sign of the doctor in rural appalachia thinks he can write a book i found myself in belfast in 2012 and i was reading about forgiveness for a major paper i realize there was nothing written about what currently incarcerated people thought about forgiveness. I thought that wasve rec fascinating especially have wifes worst our man living in a system of and forgiveness is seemed curious nothing was written about ad and i thought i had the ability to write something about it from the academic perspective and i have already spent four years volunteering regalia river bend maximum security prison if youre in the area had a volunteer past and a relationship but thought i could have those conversations so i spent my masters thesis meant in this so i also turned into the book. I also wanted to present a platform that we live of the of the we miss things from below so wanted to put myself in proximity with prisoners and their stories with their thoughts might t teach us about forgivenesssical so this book is for sections of first is the academic analysis are hashemi talk about forgiveness then i do 14 stories of prisoners ever bent and a prison of londons i women that have some of the worst part how a friend of mine who was wrestling with the identity of a gaming and that was not acceptable then killed two wives. There are stories from tonya in an effort to protect her sister from an abuser committed an act of violence the story of gb whos suffered bullying and forginal as asian and school or the school the story of shelley and when to read her story seton see what it is like. When she handed me the papers containing the first draft that emerge from it sheet avoided specifics about her past. Care opening words i am nobody i have always been nobody the only thing that was special about me is i was a pretty child. T unfortunately the very thing that makes use special islamic to a target as a continued reading standing against galway wall at tpw my body slid to the floor then came the following paragraph class and use that to leave broke me. I have never heard of pt est and did not know of stockholm syndrome until i was diagnosed after the crime bill has been 17 years a still have nightmares crushing anxiety and more than anything else dealt if i had been a strong, i would p have taken the abuse in silence like i was supposed to did my best friend abbey would still be alive. I invite you to get the book if you want the rest of the story. S anot pdf then there is of story that talks of how they fit together in the map and then to take stock and in the appendix my time as a volunteer chaplain in the w most violent Michael Mcray in the present particularly violent counters and the offer prayers of how do we who break in the midst of dsch devastation and hell. Not that is the focus of the book before the focus of this conversation will michael panelist to have most of the time but wanted to wrestle with the question of the thesis that if forgiveness is valuable ended is our virtue to whicht we should be striving with the serious issue of the prison system they are noted interested in dealing reconciliation or the transformation in restoration and rehabilitation but they are interested in retribution. Those are kentuck entire league incompatible. Temporary exile is not compatible. Retribution is. I spent four 1 2 years spent f volunteering regularly at river bend without any issue but that i finally had the death of the violence of the prison system against the prisoners so i organize them to protest at the department of corrections that marin general population and the system of control and punishment to be put on one of the unisys did have one single instance of violence in the present day permanently behind me after river bend so this summer i tried to get on a visitation with the nearby prison and our away and was deniedan because they still label me as security so i hope that tells you something the way the prison system works if you try to humanize ourry create community or encounter the other not as the criminal has of brother or sister in need of healing or love that is a Security Threat to the institution. So present is of place that holds people captive to a moment in a hold their body captive to move forward its to wising collection to leave you seconds of their life. Not the case of everyone some people have perpetuated the same over and over like the friend of mine havingend whn convicted 26 young boys as a Catholic Priest there are situations like that who have a mental breakdown to snap and then for for our judged to. It makes so forgiveness a really difficult because of a few of the things that forgiveness needs his that entails restoring yourself and writing a new narrative somatic counters of single story that we craft of ourselves and others there is the great novelist who has of brilliant 10 talk and she talks about that simple stories only pick one side and that produces a stereotyping it isnt that theyre not to intrude mikees not true that they are in complete so our job is to complete the narrative. So often in the case of violence we craft to the single story is whether of ourselves and forgiveness is about changing those descriptions and the storyhe line sabir not cast in the rolls permanently and humanizing ourselves and not forgetting the harm the alsom not being defined by them and not let that be the description of who we are i rever. This is from a guy off the inside at to teach this brilliant man we offer associates and bachelors degrees to those in the end in prison he was one of the first cohorts the did class of forgiveness and reconciliation his final paper was so good i sent itit to the academic publisher in england and was published as an academic paper he is brilliant. But when he was 17 or 18 as the senior and highschoolni he was caught in a loveing triangle with some psychosis and drugs and bullying he snapped and bought a gun and murdered his rifle shot threetime saying killed he was given a life sentence with the possibility of parole but in tennessee he has to serve a minimum of 51 calendar years. s life that is the possibility with a minimum of 511 of the harshest in the country. He went into prison 18 he will be 70 when he goes up for parole not released. He said i fully understand society cannot let people victimized loved ones but i have to call for reform of the system whenever forgiveness i have found is an spite of the system a dozen facilitate any kind of forgiveness it is focused like a laser on vengeance motivated out of fear and uses suffering and pain tose punish suffering and painain. And shames me of my past. Forgiveness in christianan theology tries to offer but this system change you to the mud in makes it impossible to fully forgive yourself. None of the people involved in the events of the same most of even know me anymore i dont know them we have no effect on each other but the system is determined to take us back to d even to the man i am now and did not do with the person who did wasnt in a normal state. I forgive my old self identity is slippery. Like the butterfly effected 1 billion coincidences had to happen that day to ocher and nobody can change what happened but to change yourself to any event to bring it to the future we have to recognize your destroying ourselves. I wish my direct and indirect victims could live as much as they can we all have to face down the specter of suffering toec appreciate that it isal wonderful to be alive by can live here in prison forever but i cannot be changed to that event and it cannot define me. So the question i kept hearing it is how do i find and give forgiveness and a place so diametrically opposed that once to genu in the mud . And i invite you to read the book you like to hear more about the question. But i will wrap up my time i will read last section that is my major take away from the book dealing with the question what does this say about us as a society as reset in support what does that say about us . Engaging right teaneck researching for the book and previous volunteer work by a witness firsthand with the insiders and staff all of this revealed the deeply disturbing nature of arbitrary system for profitt rather than rehabilitation. More than 95 percent of all those in prison will beon released back into societyty. In we are wise to care about the security of our communities but we are confused about those ideal but its too ensure that a psychiatrist shows through Statistical Research that punishment does not deter violence as much as provoking it given and the obsession of the american system it is Little Wonder the recidivism rate that people return to prison between 50 and 70 percent. Over half of the people willov go back. We call a department of corrections is unnecessary and un preventable from that purpose and the practice of prison. I often wonder what will happen to my friends when they get out in return to society. But we speak of incarceration as paying a debt to society me clearly do not mean that upon returnpo many freed men and womenee cannot vote or sit on a jury and legally suffer Housing Education and employment discrimination their punishment continues long after release. By interested in social forgiveness. If that the individual level stands to reason that tot function as cultures of violence and shame and compromise to begin the jury toward personal forgiveness and a healthier society for those in a categorically condemn if we tell and hear different stories of remorse and redemption of forgiveness and reconciliation of even when the prisoners are forgiven. So the last piece and the man that mentioned earlier priso earlier, jacob after the love triangle wrote a piece called who we are and what we want as a plea from understanding from the house side world and i will end with those words. This i we are living question mark schipperke what is the point of all of this . Or we still human crux is there any value in our lives v is there any forgiveness or redemption for those who have truly be printed . If not what does that say about all of us crux weirs humanlike you and want to show that we are your t brothers and fathers and cousins and uncles and sons we need help to distract deposited future why in the name of all human good in the future of society which do not help us with such an endeavor . We are the prodigal son and a told the does not matter we will not have a chance to give anything back in theree is no return a matter what when we come back to the gates in the way in the name of peace and hope and love or else would rico . For human beings life means for ever with the love of family and community other than which we were exiled we know some of you will kick ass and spit on us the matter how true the words or parts we know you were not evil only afraid and asleep. Wakeup. Wakeup. We are not monsters here as knocking we will come back to again and again. Where else would rico . Thank you. [applause] also preserved with the palace in new york respond with a bouquet and listened in be attentive with the intersection of east capitol street and minnesota avenue and after his College Teammates were calling the nickname in the streets his team simultaneous. Tried to this in your journal maybe this will immortalize you will never forgive him you already for have forgotten. Choed go directly to the mahogany desk to sit in the brownsville chair stand at the building opposite. Prearranged the papers that dont need a ranging twice. Remember the doors opening after serving 18 months in Fairfax County five hours after their release. Out of the wall when he didpu that. This is your an introduction so to click that magnifying glass a step even though you know, what the results would bring. Even if the suspects were shot and killed one moment bird, but in determinantcome an wild and moves forward look for balance in the oddity. Those five deliver a pauses if the suspect shoots a killer in the imagination to formulate the free phrase, this is how he would die. Holding court in the streets after reading it was because of drugs to visualize and to make sense the screams wait for the bus to stop because somebody rang the wrong buzzer there is always an echo after the buzzing even after it it buzzes again it is not for you keep reading the articles the phrases and protective order acknowledge your friend was a suspect in the first white murder alsoif with the dead body in the trunk. Todays lighter while driving to school it takes that long to find someone to a barber who has 10 yearss a ba and was stuck in his memory of what happens agreeing that the prison return the brain that present taught you to be a better criminal see both digress you both understand the term but it was a composite of many men who never learned how to be a man and then i question for the first time. Why . And then before rush hour traffic to dig through therk closet the first line of the paragraph reads he loves that more than he was touching the torso of a woman chafe and then the impressions to the glass to pronounced of body is aa question mark. Over t and then threaten her with a claw hammer he tells the police. To signify violence how isdi this classified under . Pt back put him back in the closet dont be yourself up becauseou he said nothing to nobody. Forget that doubled negative it is nature versus nurture justify your silence into a have. Your silence will not protect you. Pretend this is tenants in which death the next morningng and go back to the computer any race of black screen ignore those blackbirds outside your window unique to forget but before you do blackbirds suspend an ebonyde animation of the top of the web page to yourselfelf th this is not Edgar Allen Poes style. She wanted him to go. It is about the 13 steps. At cau. M a chan i am a changed man but no one will cheer you pull the covers over your face, remember to dream, wake up tomorrow and feel guilty all over again. Its sort of talks about myey to journey through incarcerationct and the structure of the book is multifaceted and that there are these letters by go back and forth. In Brooklyn Federal Detention Center was held for about three or four years until the case was resolved but it was a former friend of mine when i was getting my phd when i was on this journey. All of the letters became part of my memoir so we talk about a lot of things in terms of the Prison Industrial Complex, identity, race construction and literature. So the memoir led me to thesees flashbacks that are sort of presented to her. Part of the thing with me ino this book is to give the voice to a woman who is incarcerated because that is often the voice we dont necessarily hear a. We are working towards this idea to be there for her as she was going through the case of mistaken identity that they held it for four years to make Hotel Something she just didnt know. We were helping other people go through their pain and what they were going through, so thats the sort of sounding board that becomes this book. I want to read a piece i usually bring she got out last year i am going to read her part. Working on some of these issues i talk about the. Thats why it appears as though exile. We script our lives on the action better thaactionbetter tg daily lives is to reply to the command and the world uses us in that way. The after sound of oppression yet we become willingno participants and the world holds us down. Ive been thinking about the question how we as a society chose little girls model of them would be able to live up to the idea constructed by the dominane narrative. Beauty is a dangerous thing in h addition to bookmark them that they play a role in this insecurity especially the socalled streets by the rejection of the counterpart and anything other than the object we just want to have somebody that loves us back in a delicate balance. I saw the objectification playay out with a man that dominated wn the point they broke their theory and to store their sound. They couldnt think of their own oppression because of the language to express the unimaginable. Hine. So much on the struggling dc. Here is the oxymoron. Nshine n s sunshine never saw the light. Darkness choked her to death. She never got to understand we are the shadows in the dark that are imagined. Language is only the beginning and then comes a new beginning and a new language. In the isolation this is something memory let me reinve reinvent. Ive been thinking about how we as a society imprison ourselves in the complexities of skin and of humaif human survival dependn this one specific thing of course i can make the conscious effort not to invade your space to make a parallelism. I feel that they intersect in so much as the next memory. I have the cell door claiming i cannot escape. There it is, that word, construct. Its on someone elses term for the scaffolding. It hadnt begun if someone could have stopped progress at that precise moment. Consider the evidence in theromh apartment. All they wanted to do is sayinga that somebody stole the light oo mine. The apartment rattling from the destination. I was in construction before i came with age and for so long all i could think about is vanishing from prison and ind t still languish. I keep asking if this is a totality of my life. True, i am on the outside my insight is tangled up still. Whether i can acknowledge or not there is no escaping this. Allow me to paraphrase. The man was no longer free because th there needs to be identified as free proved he wav changed to. That becomes the correspondence and theres actually a few pieces i go into. See if i can find it. Give me a second. This is 1988. The idea you cannot leave byha your own free will. Taking an acclaimed sidewalks to get a sense of false security and the campus and the rural town if not for those circling the complex. Comple about the snapping jaws immediately destroy this fantasy. A few cases further against thea backdrop you cant help but think about it every inmates steps the first 90 11 p. M. Until the door doors will back up 4 3r breakfast. Its migrating towards the dining hall which was 100 yards opposite the housing unit. Our bodies blending together effortlessly. We could have been a herd of b cattle. With the sun peeking through. Breakfast had to be eaten so we each stepped over the body. I will stop right there and read one last section. Actually, when i go visit this gives you more understanding between our relationship and the book as well. On the number two train and everybody plugged in, tuning out the world if only for a moment and creativity exiting stations and seeking along the split second is a glimpse of people in the car further up. In the metropolitan Detention Center in brooklyn that is a federal Holding Center for people awaiting sentencing. 7 p. M. Eastern time i would stand on the corner of 23rd street i entrance of the 24 hour video store and waves staring down from the window at a predetermined time. Ue, ou true, our lives intersected because of prison, but then weve been baptized babies through trial and error and webi know theres nothing left but the act you dwell in. The conversations have beenn overstating. In many ways, hes helping me deal with the guilt. D never having forgiven myself for the memories formed on the streets and ive never taken the time to enjoy my achievements. Maybe its because i said i should have been doing these things all my life and the predicament brought me back to try to figure out the magical lexicon that would teach me to say im sorry. They remind me of my time at the Detention Center when i had to write about things that have been most painful in my life. He made me take a deeper look at myself and for that, im thankful. I can only hope that i have done the same. They recalled the one ones laughte incessant laughter. The murder was presented as tangible and tactical and i could touch it with my fingertips and if it didnt touch me back my friend died alone in the bathtub shot and electrocuted into so many times i placed myself in the bathtub covered with water. One more time and then lights out. Rst th drugs create an alternate reality and he was one of my many here like figures. This is the only one i know. I cannot reimagine these things like it didnt happen. When you come out on the other side, are your friends stilln your friends and i gets t dubaio claim the laughter of my youth. H if im honest with myself there are some nights i did wish to kiss the world goodbye. Many nights i didnt want to go on but something got me through. I was almost afraid. Most people i associate with today wouldnt understand knowing someone made the trek from manhattan to brooklyn tonh stand on the claim waved like you just dont care but it means the workout and i noticed it means the world to all of the ladies and to witness her smile. My phone vibrates. I will make you fund 24th. After he won the buck award later they would offer valuable feedback that would help shapet my first book. Its the kind that aspires but d instead of evil. I want to tell them that waiting right now is more important and that there is someone in the world right now that needs to feel shfeedsterfeels she belong. 6 55 the Detention Center is next to the expressway and im wondering what significance thiw might hold during any given day. Im sure they use it as an escape mechanism to imagine a way for themselves. The phone is ringing and i know who the member belongs to. I answered the phone and press five which you have to do i do t to accept a call from a federala inmate. My god i can see you. E. Im smiling and i wave and then i wave again. We are laughing now on the phonn like this is a regular visit. She has the same talk with herk family so as much as i would like to stand i know we have to say goodbye before we do, let me get one more good look at you. She hangs up and i stand where i am for another three minutes leaning against the videoor thinking about my time in baltimore in prison and then i headed down third avenue to an unknown future filled with new e possibilities. 8 million stories in new york city and this is mine. [applause] i know you all have questions. I would like to take the prerogative of the host to ask the first question. When you have a question can yo come in to speak into the standing microphone . Either one of you can tackle this, but in your buck, desmond tutu writes prisoners are perhaps the most marginalized people in the western societies and you write a. Collectively unwilling to forgive and i wondered if you would address the one specific thing that you mentioned prisoners not being allowed to do even after being released and we have 6. 4 Million People in the population who cannot vote. And in all but 14 states thats the case with florida being thes most egregious. I wonder if you were to Say Something about the way to raise consciousness and do something about legislation what would be your recommendation . s pani that is a tall order. I think it starts with us as asi humanistic society. If we say that we base our society on the values and principles and we hold those every time we get in conflict, then i dont understand incarceration becomes a different thing. Its like when you have felonies and the idea when you come and serve her time there are still roadblocks you have to overcome. From getting a job ticketing federal aid. I am an anomaly. I have seven felonies. I know im the only one that has seven felonies and a tenure at thats just not going to happen. I had people along the way that were sympathetic. You have to be willing to give people a chance that the idea of not being able to vote or to do some of these things that are the spirit of our society i think his egregious because if you see someone served their time and you base your society on a society that is forgiving, then the hypocrisy comes in. I never said i something shouldnt have happened to me for the things i do. Th i i never said none of that. Y i get it. But at the same time what is the motive for the rehabilitationon, and years ago they talked aboutt this when you go into prison and these things you see become interesting because if i was to go and testify to the court of law and sit on the tria set on y would say you have seven felonies so youre not credible and thats interesting because i teach kids everyday and if they think im credible and i love them. [laughter] thats the reality of it that we need to address. Once we are real with ourselves and start doing the things we hold dear in our society we can come along way but it startsay with the collective we. Youve got to write, protest,ar. Call. Even the awareness is huge because i teach a person class and it becomes this whole thinga with students sort of aware now so they go into the world notot understanding. Other it is very real and they put a face on it. I will take 30 seconds to sayjor the major sin of prison allows humans to be disposable and that is what is at the heart of this, anyone is disposable. We hear this in the rhetoric ofi certain president ial candidates about certain groups of people. They dont deserve medical care werwith the same quality of life and when they are out they dont deserve certain freedoms. To borrow the phrase we stolen their sound. Spin i any other questions from the floor come up and ask at the microphone thank you. Quest i just wrote a book on forgiveness offered inforgiv charleston, the families in charleston and what im curious about, although im going tough read your book, what about forgiveness without christian theology, im sure youve thought about thayou thoughtaboo hear your answer. I was careful not to talk about christian theology. We are all born with humanistic traits and we are supposed to know right from wrong. That is the simplest dichotomyme that there is, right or wrong and then you go from there. You know if you cant go down the street and into a store and do those things innately thatt becomes built in as you grow up without anything outside of that and i think im more concerned with how we become human again. We can bring all these other things in, but are we going to let all these things that plays in our society run our society or take it back . We are in all of these constructions we dont know how to un constrict ourselves because everything matters anddo we dont want to give it up. Until we recognize that it becomes problematic because you are going to give us something. You cant keep everything and then move somewhere. Youve got to give something. At the beginning of the book i say i really want to discuss forgiveness especially in the first chapter outside of christian theology. I grew up in the church myol granddad was a pastor, and very thoroughly embedded in christianity. But i grow weary of forgiveness being held captive to christian circles. Its kind of preached in the pulpits but its rarely explain how this works. There is this pressure to do it and people will feel like they are not good christians if they cant do it and thats fascinating most people are not so forgiveness cant be only fo christians because everyone has to forgive. We all suffer and get harm to each other so we have to be abl to forgive. So the process i try to articulate the first chapter is from the theologians because i dont want to exclude them in the conversation but its done in a way that says i want anyone from any particular faith to find this conversation accessible so hopefully you will find that helpful. I apologize for not allowing more time for questions and answers, but we are onbut we a television time, so we have to cut it short. Short. L i would invite everyone to comet to the signing. And if you have time, thank you all for being here. [applause] this is an unprecedented level. Theres always moments most of us said that speaking specifically to the idea and the global export of that and what does it mean for those particular images like all of these images being projected into the world how are we wrestling with for the truth of the expression but also the heat of oppression and stereotyping how can we reconcile all of those things at once and thats a difficult thing to try to do to respect ones truth and know that its influenced by things you may not want it to be a part of. That is the Central American question becausCentral Americane necessity that blackness is to the american identity in order for the United States to operate in the way that it does, its a system of hierarchies and the capitalism is the exploitative class and White Supremacy renders the bottom class and its consistent always you have that class always there and it exploits to demonize we have latinos, muslims into a different plaintiffs ethnic groups considered white so italians, irish, german. But that he scape is that they needed to form strongholds, political and economic to be embraced and to ensure that its always at the bottom so there is a need to flatten those identities and demonize for the humanity of all the different post cards that depict black men being lynched and calling us lazy. But to have your humanity denied and that is what the concept is trying to get at. [inaudible conversations]
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