Transcripts For CSPAN3 Avenue Of Spies 20160718 : vimarsana.

CSPAN3 Avenue Of Spies July 18, 2016

Arthur alex kershaw discusses his book avenue of spies. The National World War Ii Museum hosted this event. It is about an hour. I actually am for many reasons. First of all, i would like to really thank without being too selected. I would like to thank jeremy colins and larry, where are you lar larry . Is he here . These two gentlemen were my cocon spc cocon sp coconspirators. We talked here late at night. I thought to myself would it bae great idea if i can persuade a new yorker to pay me certain amount of money to go back and get drunk at least two or three times every year and it worked. So, i wanted to read you a quick quote, i dont want it to be too much today of the slide show but i was fortunate in finding some remarkable images that was given to me by the last living hero of my book, third jackson, hes 89 years old and you will see images of him later. I want to read you a quick section. It is a very short section. I hate reading from books because people always fall asleep. This is a really the theme of the book. It is by a very distinguish and extremely brave frenchman. There were many in world war ii. We live in the shadows of soldiers of the night, but you are our lives were not dark. There were arrests and tortures and deaths of so many of our friends and comrades and tragedies awake us, all of us just around the corner. We did not live in or with tragedy. We accelerated by the challenge and the rightness of our cores. It was in many ways of the worst of times and just as many ways the best of times. And, the best of what we remember today. I think you can say that with the entire narrative of world war ii. The memory serves us in many wonderful way that makes the horror in some ways and as we go on. To the left here summer jackson born in may, poor childhood, he left school at 10 years old. He finally ended up working for a doctors chauffeur. The doctor on the left here encouraged him to go back in college. He became qualified as a doctor at the massachusetts general hospital. This is him on the left and hes joined as a volunteer at a medical unit and thats taken in 1917 on his way to france to serve as a combat surgeon. This is another picture of s Sumner Jackson of 1917. If you look at the guy ahead of the table thats operating. Thats jackson. The woman right besides him to his right is his future wife. This was taken in 1917 in a hospital in a room in paris where the Sumner Jackson actually met his future wife. Phillip jackson, their son told me they fell in love while jackson operated in the surgery. Their first very long kiss was off the picture. He told me it was a very long kiss indeed. It is france after all. Here is toquette and sumner, she was a remarkable woman, she was a fantastic tennis player and boasted throughout her life that she beaten frances number one tennis player of all time. She won 31 championships. Toquette was a very good tennis player, she loved to play tennis with sumner. And for ten years she tried to get pregnant and it did not work out. In 1929, third jackson, their only son was born at the American Hospital in paris. She was in her mid30s and given up hope at having a child. Here is phillip and sumner. It is an absolutely beautiful autograph. Phillip is still alive. To most of us of this photograph is the railing that you see the effect of railings behind them. Very privilege of bringing and living on the exclusive streets of paris. He ended up treating hemingway and fitzgerald and many of th them thats taken on juniper beach. One of the beaches for dday the family here, 1930s. His father. The gentleman to the left he plays the grand role as we discovered later in saving phillips life, he taught fi phillip to swim. He also learned how to swim in the great difficult water of the english channel. I pointed out here if you can see this and this is the i think you can see berlin, thats where they lived. There were two entrances, there you go. Thank you, gentleman. It is perfect. This is the address today. Whats in red shows the ground floor of thats where doctor jackson had his private medical office. He made a lot of money. A lot of very rich american businessmen that came to paris had a good time. They have his telephone number in their pocket box just in case. Importantly there was an exit to the left here than the front entrance of the ground floor apartments where people came and went all the time to see doctor jackson. June of 1940 sumner, the newscanazis arrived. He did not leave paris. He fled paris. On the 10th of may 1914, i will be in paris with my artist in six weeks. He was. Amazing amazingly in paris six weeks in june of 1940. This gentleman here is one of americas first spies. Before the Second World War, there was no foreign intelligence service, you guys did not have a foreign intelligence service, that was the job of the people working for the state department, donald costar was a prince graduate. He witnessed a huge terrifyi terrifying this ambient, he was working for the americans of the he found his way to paris of early 1940s and dropped off of the hotel by none other of george kennedy. And then found his way to the American Hospital of paris where he went to doctor Sumner Jackson. He said he needs to hide for a while, he was being hunted. They knew he was a spy. So jackson thought coster, he said only one person in his basement doctor Sumner Jackson. He was one of several agents that was sentenced to north africa in 1942 before operation torch and had a long and distinguish career oss, it is like the cia. Allowing coster to hide in the basement of jacksons. Jackson took his first great risk of all. Avenue boche in the fall of 1940 of the most cultured and most bevolant. When they came to avenue boche, named after their great french general, they literally chose the nicest. They all lived at avenue boche. It was so many finest houses of paris. Here you see the arrow is pointing to 72. Helmet knochen. Hes 37 years old here, he had a phd. He speaks four languages, a distinguish and brilliant gentleman. He arrivedd in the 1940s in disguise. Germans do not want these black bastards anywhere in their power. They wanted to have a very nice war thank you very much, occupies with the most beautiful city in europe. They did not want men like this terrorizing them and among their influence. I found him to be incredibly interesting. He was a extremely able intelligent agent. He was involved inside one of the the great cues of the early day. Extremely cultured and sophisticated and really, really highly functioning operator. Winter of 1940s, the jacksons lived wealthy. They had a country home in enghein which is 20 miles north of paris. Theyre cutting woods in the backyard. I thought she went to the backyard about a year ago and theyre cutting the woods because it was the coldest winter on record over 100 days when the temperatures went freebelow freezing at night. He loved this photograph because it was one of the few occasions where he got to spend time with his dad, the hero worship. His father was very busy at the American Hospital. Doing things like this bonded them. 1942, if you go on youtube, you can find the original newsreel for this i am packamage. It is a truly horrifying image. When you look up here of the museum, when you think of what this museum means, it means defeat of these black bastards. If the center obviously, those who recognize brian heydrich. At least 15 to 20 Million People died because of his plans. To the right we have knochen, king of paris on the eighth of may 1942, just outside of paris of all the adults and on the left we have general carl oberg, who arrived with heydrich to take control over the ss in france. They got a beautiful mercedes. Together they planned the murder of 80,000 french jews. That was the Head Quarters of danica. He worked closely that week to deport and killed over 80,000 men. And heydrich, thats one of the last photographs taken from him, hes 38 years old. What struck me is theyre so young. I am 49 and they have a future of the entire population in their hands at that time. Heydrich three weeks after this photograph is taken, as senasa 5 assassinated in prague. Heydrich is his protector and mentor. That was a nasty incident in 1971 it was discovered by the commander of paris and they headed back to berlin. So during the week that heydrich spending in paris whining and dining and meeting a lot of maam dams madam madames, they talked about what they would do. Heydrich was killed because of the shuffling that went on in evolving doors of the ss. And knochen here became ahead, the most powerful men, the germans secret police in the wholly france under the control of fs general carl oberg. Meanwhile the hospital, Sumner Jackson waiting for his own war against the nazi. This is a document and i know it looks boring. It is quite interesting. It is the invasion from a 19 years old joe manos. He flew one of those up there. He shut down on the 14th of july, 1943. His father sold his huge air battle above paris. Americans bombed paris on bastille day on 1943 which managed to shut down. He made it back to england about four months later completing of whats called a home ru run absolutely amazing achievement. He was interrogated for about a week by british intelligence. Here, you will see here that he reports having kept the three days and 11 avenue of doctor Sumner Jackson. The penalty for aiding evan by this search of war of 1943 was instant death. He was shot ton the spot. This is one document example of one the ones that jackson helped. Jackson took him back to his home on avenue foch. 1943 the French Resistance is becoming much more active. Many communists and other in fran stop to join the resistance and instances of bombings and assassinatio assassinations. More than ever by 1943, more have moved to Head Quarters on the avenue foch waiting for an unrestricted war against the resistance. Mission was to destroy all operations and assassinations and killings and gangs working for them. All desi here you have number 84. And the blood hound good at tracking down british agents. She was tortured at number 84. Several members of the soe actually most of our british agents were captured. Thats why you ended up at number 84 on the fifth floor where they had torture chambers. You will notice that here on avenue foch here. In august 1943, this gentleman is still alive, hes 94. You see the track here, hes a neighbor of jacksons. He grew up next to jackson. In 1943, he walked out of his front door and took a step to the left and walked o ut of the foyer and knocked on the door of jackson. He stood in the living room and said i belong to the resistance network. Can we use your home as a drop box for the intelligence as a Meeting Place in paris. It is a perfect place, it is a Doctors Office and people come and go, it is too ethics and essential. He told me in paris years ago when he asked duqette if he could use the house, she did not hesitate for a second. Several high profile agents deposited information at gestapo office. It became an important part part toquette was the main in s instigator. This is a beautiful shot. I wish i can make it bigger. I should not be using this. It is a photograph taken from the stairwell at avenue foch. He was left in a hurry. You can in fact, fourth id veterans of utah in the streets of deliberated. By the 1994, jackson had been deported to france. They were exposed and betrayed and just two weeks before dday may of 1994. The rest taken to fuji, south of paris. South of france, toqutte taken to paris and she was deported literally a week before the american and the french arrived. She can hear the sound of american arteillery as she wait to be deported. This is a picture of ravensbruk. It is unknown of thousands of women and many of them are the bravest, very, very special people at the Political Prisoners. People opposed of all over. Women were sent to ravensbruck. Toquette and many others who were imprisoned with her. Somehow she managed to survive tp winter the winter of 1944 and 1945. These women here shown wearing uniform. It is quite unusual. Most of the women in here group were forced to construct an airfie airfield wearing summer dresses. Many of them died from hype t m hyperthermia and disease. She had a couple of weeks to live. This is toquette at 59 years old. Look at her face. From her cheeks to her breasts of thousands of scars for life which she had for the rest of her life. 59 years old, this is a picture taken as she comes off a boat on the 29th of april 1945. She was rescued by the red cross. She had 200 other women were taken in white buses and escorted and this is a shot of her taken where shes coming off a boat looking into the camera. Phill phillip, this was taken in place of prison ship summer of 1945 set out to the gulf of 9,000 concentrated camps survivors. Phillip was aboard on the filbeck where 2,500 people stuck in a boat. Commissions were horrendous and hundreds of people died. In three days boarding this prison ship. On the fourth of may 1945, the ref under water sank, and two other boats killing almost 9,000 people. It is the greatest maritime disaster of world war ii. From his ship, nearly 250 people survived. He told me when he was in the wo hole of the ship, he climbed up the metal ladder and he wanted fresh air and he was gagging, an old german guard took pity of him. He stood at the deck and saw the typho typhoon. It is a beautiful plane coming towards him and he saw a rocket fired. He was a brilliant mathematician, he game an engineer and he thought to himself of the ankle of the rocket is slightly to the left it is not going to hit me. He watched the rocket coming down and sure enough hit the other people. He saw three more rockets come and they hit the ship. He managed to jump off the boat. He spent maybe up to five minutes as the ship sank looking for his father trying to find sumner. He was in the hole, he did not left. Phillip jumped in the boat and had a mile to swim to shore. He will tell you today that the best thing that ever happened to him was when his father taught him to swim in the english channel. He knew how to swim out of water. He was picked up by a german craft, they thought hef was a german sailor. They realized he was an inmate and they allowed him to stay on the boat. Ss actually they kill as many of these people as they could. I should add and this is what is disturbing of world war ii still today that germany civilians went out on the beaches in quebech took here guns and weapons and also kill these survivors. The rage is so intense towards the end of the war. This is phillip, he was lying up against the wall and in filbeck. 20 survivors and the ss mountain 22 machine gun and he tells stories as they are mounted machines. Thats how Phillip Jackson survived. He was taken by the british army and actually became a translator for summer of 1945 in the city. He was involved with the american incentive interrogating germans because he could speak german very well. His mother toquette survived in paris, saying where are you . Come home to paris, i want to be with you. She lost the love of her life, she had a son, she wanted him to return. Phillip told me that he did not want to go back. Going back would be to confront the lost of his father. Eventually, he went back. Phillip you cannot be hardly decorated because of the suffering. You might not made a difference in battle but the prison war camp allows him to qualify. This is in hamburg in 1946, phillip is in the right and he looks remarkably like his father. Hes a splitting image of his father. His testify here for the ss of nine men, he pointed to each one of them and faced them in the court, number one, number two and number three and five and six and number eight and nine, a every guy he named was hung. Absolutely. These guys were not hung. Knochen on the right here, 1954 on the right oberg. Knochen ran the gestapo in france. He was directly responsible for the deport of the jacksons and other people. He was found guilty of war crimes by the french. We had british had sentenced him to death beforehand for the murder of sas troops in august of 1944. He was directly responsible. And this is their first day of their trial in paris. For crimes against humanity. Both were sentenced to die. Both were released ten years later because of the cold war politics. We commuted sadly, i believe, we commuted a lot of the sentences for convicted ss war criminals because we wanted to keep the germans happy. They were our bullwort against soviet and russia. It was the cold war. These guys, we treated them with kid gloves. Knochen went back he was actually finally pardoned in 1968 by a general, of all people. He went back to germany and worked in insurance and died a wealthy man in 2003. And he said that the greatest regret of his life was that he had been involved in the holocaust. But he didnt know what was going to happen to the people who were deported to the east. He had no knowledge of auschwitz. He knew nothing about that. But he was very sorry that he was involved with the people that sent them somewhere else. Very skilled, fabbial to the very end, and carl oberg here, also lived to see retirement in prosperous west jugermany. Thats phillip, taken 2014. You can see the blurred image behind him. Thats where phillip lives today, surrounded by other highly decorated veterans of not just the Second World War but alsoi also any highly decorated french veteran gets to live there, which is where i interviewed him several times. Thats the dome, and under that dome is napoleons tomb. He today lives a tones throw from napoleons tomb. And at the risk of making you wince, this is me and phillip, and there are some people in the audience this is phillips favorite restaurant. There is some people in the audience who got quite timsy in that restaurant with me relatively recently. Can you put your hands up, please . See over here. Its a restaurant called pasco. I expect to eat for free now. And this is his favorite restaurant. I was very fortunate to spend a lot of time with phillip, he was 89 and extremely proud. Extremely proud of his french heritage and his American Heritage. Extremely proud that hes the son of a guy from maine that risked it all and gave his life for the allied cause in world war ii, in a war that we dont know enough about. A private war. A disturbing war. A war in which the knock on the front door could mean your death at any moment. Thank you so much for being a wonderful, wonderful audience. [ applause ] if there are questions, please raise your hand and ill come

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