Should be assessed her role in the coming of the American Revolution . Sexist ortent is it just the opposite of that to call attention to the fact that the dominant event in her life are biological rather than political. Someone who wants to be true to the experience of women at this time, does that mean that you are going to be not interested in the political story . That the political story for them is the biological story. You know what im getting at here. A couple of comments on this if we possibly can. Yes. Where are you from . West chicago. 30 miles west of the city of chicago. That is really west. I think in the book parlor politics she was a student of mine. That make sense, why i enjoyed the book. Tell us what that is. It basically about how people like Abigail Adams and Martha Washington were working in other venues in political ways, whether it be in the parlors, through letters, through correspondence, to kind of make these connections. Behind the scenes. Making connections that were helpful to their husband thought political careers, and oftentimes making connections that would maybe be unseemly for their husbands to make. We read these letters about john, it was kind of on unseemly to be overly political and ambitious. But the women made connections. Catherine focuses mainly on early 19th century president ial politics. The Dolly Madison principle. Every guy need the Dolly Madison. Intail eight dolly a dolly. She is like adding she is like eleanor roosevelt. Dolly is the one who really coined the term first lady. Abigail is never a first lady. He is a copartner in a sense and in that sense, i will tell you for sure, we could conjure her up, or even more historically legitimate, if we could just read her letters back to resistors and everything, but what is most important to her. Her role as a mother. She does not think of that as constricting or anything like that. Straddles the public world. She is reading these newspapers that john is writing for, and at this time you cant get direct evidence of how influential she is. Later on you get it and you have to assume that you did not get it because they were together at the same time. I read that she was herself part of the thought process that she was engaged in, and in fact, and let it in letters to certain women abroad there is a whig historian in britain, abigail has a slightly different take on british tyranny. It is operatic. It is like the forces of light and the forces of darkness. She talks about it in a more and for her, this is interesting. For adams the ultimate evil is slavery. Not black slavery. He british enslavement of us for abigail, guess what it is . Rape. That is what the ultimate horror would be, rate. She has got a feminist perception of what british tyranny feels like that is different than his. Think, noticing that her life is dominant dominated by pregnancy and child rearing is not a disservice to women of the world or to the feminist agenda. It is a recognition that that is a central part of it. It makes me feel good about the fact that i am not crazy about this. Kate. I mean, just in the miniseries we were watching last night there was a scene where she is talking about politics and she says, politics is my empty shell. It is the fact that i am missing , i cant feed my kids. I mean, she was living a daily life, but she was intelligent enough to make the connection about why this was happening. Question. Who is in greater physical danger by the time you get to the middle 70s. I think so too. She is up in boston and the Boston Boston is occupied part of by the british army. There is a smallpox epidemic that probably had already started, but is now amplified by the presence of troops and unclean conditions. There is a wonderful book called americana. It still happens. The war of independence coincides with a huge smallpox epidemic. You have to believe that they you people bringing contagion in. The british army contains most guys who have immunity. The American Army does not have immunity. One of the biggest things that washington does is to require all soldiers to be inoculated. Ok. I do think she is in greater risk. Where she leads A John Quincy by the hand up penns hill to watch the battle of bunker hill in june of 7035. June of 1775. The battle was a big battle not just in terms of casualties. The political impact on both sides was really pronounced. What is the american effects . Hey, we can beat these guys. We can kill a lot of them. Miss, they over interpret this, the capacity to deal with the british army. British interpretation. E cross the river this is now a violent struggle and we cant compromise anymore. At this point george the third as we areiii release going to lay it to these guys. All these people come back into london and their lives are at the docks and covering it and it is like huge casualties. Ok. You guys started this, we are going to finish it. It is at that moment that the prohibitory act comes, they close the american fork. Debt, and hete all goes to the British Ministry and says, i want you to raise an army to include at least 10,000 professional soldiers from prussia orsure russia. That is how you get the hessians. They create a 32,000 man army, 10,080, 337 ships. The next part is when we go across. This is a huge force. It is designed to deliver a massive blow and end this silliness once and for all. Ok. Where are we . Abigails personal career during. His time in march of 7076 she writes 1776 she writes this letter, and i now understand she talked about this afternoon. I do think we should talk about it as much as we possibly can. Ladiese remember the letter. What page it on isnt on in the formal reading . I take it as page 110. It is a letter about buying stop at the store, and all of a sudden she says, by the way. A piece of advice. Whenever you get a letter that says, by the way, look out. [laughter] coming. Something is who hashe way, means it in front of them . Anyone . Marine maureen . Read the part that says by the way. And by the way in the new code of laws which i suppose it will be necessary for you to make, i desire that you would remember the ladies and be more generous and favorable to them then your ancestors. Do not put such Unlimited Power into the hands of the husband. Remember, all men would be tyrants if they could. If a particular care and attention is not paid to the ladies, we are determined to foment a rebellion and will not found ourselves bound by any laws to which in which we do not have a voice and representation. There are other letters after this that usually do not get cited. He responds to this, and my recollection is he says, lets be serious. We know that women are the real tyrants, women control the family with matriarchal power despotism of the petticoat i love that. Reach their there are several volleys here. She has a couple of letters to mercy ellen warren in the same time that basically says well, maybe you and i ought to write a letter to the massachusetts General Court saying we dont intend to pay taxes, because we are being taxed without our consent. To reach sort of need some sort of compromise. John has to find a way to make this ok. He says, we can all agree that women do have a role, an Important Role to play, that needs to be acknowledged in terms of education. Therefore i am in favor because the Education Revolution is going to mean an increase in schools for women. Can we agree on something here . There are two agendas going on here, her agenda and what she was really saying, and the context in the Continental Congress in the spring of the 76. Lets take her agenda first. Interpretation, plausible to me, she is kidding. Banter. This is why if you look back at the early hours letters, they are always bantering. This thing that you objected to , his way ofrase referring to her. They play roles. Her role is to sort of stick it to you. This. Not make too much of there is a great poem by a british poet. Lets not take this too seriously. It sounds good, they put it the feminist ideologies, everybody thinks that she is a feminist. Ok, thats fine, but thats really not what is going on here. These are people playing word getting a kind of shakedown from her. Yeah. Serious. Nk she is can you be bantering and serious at the same time . Yes. Thats marriage. Thats marriage. These big for great experience . Do you speak from great experience . She says that what we are seeing here is a recognizably modern marriage in which people are bantering but also trying to make a point about the nature of their relationship. If you say there is a serious dimension to this and i agree it seems to me that there is having lived through marriage and stuff [laughter] direct assault toward the patriarchy . Patriarchy is the western traditions believe that women are inferior and that property cannot be held by a woman in a householdand that the le is theil is ma leader of the household and defines the identity of everybody at it. Im sure you can get even a fully definition of patriarchy, but male supremacy, female. Ubordination is that what she is saying . What do you think . We will let you have a go at this. I dont know that it is so much an attack on patriotism. I almost wonder if it is not just some of her frustrations . She is at home with young children. There is a theme in the series where she is scrubbing the floor very angrily. She is doing it in a sort of passive aggressive way. Was if some of the bantering here is not necessarily an attack on patriarchy but almost to say, i am tired and kind of frustrated with my current role not because she does not want to serve in that role but it is an early version of betty friedan. I am sitting home eating of myate covered cherries life is not interesting enough . It sounds too pessimistic. But i almost kind of wonder about some of the things that you hear from her. Some of their playfulness, some of their relationship. Ok. We agree that there is banter here, a very serious dimension. The fact that she says this does not mean she does not mean what she says. , is what asking you is she says a direct frontal assault on the central assumptions of patriarchy, which they were radical feminist position than say, we want the vote. In the 19th century the whole Womens Movement gets taken over by the right to vote. There are all kinds of other things going on that women needed to be paid attention to. I am saying she is deeper than just give me the vote. This is a guy named after my son. Michael ellis a mike for michael. Excuse me. You are over here. Hold on. I would say that it is an assault on patriarchy. Good. I was say her comparing men to tyrants is an example of that. That she is using her closest to her husband to lobby for women, to try to make change. I would the letter that she writes after she writes this letter is a telltale sign to me that she is going further than just banter. Beyond just talking to her husband. You read that there really that i do. I read it as, she is talking to her buddy. She is the first person in america who writes a volume history of the American Revolution in which she does not feature john with sufficient significance and he gets all upset with her. Ok. But absolutely, this is a frontal assault on page record. A need for radical restructuring of american society. I am enclosing this on you, what would you agree that the agenda of American Revolution required fundamental change in gender relationships . She sees an opening. She tries at least. Ok. We have to get to michael here. I will get it. Up. t screw a lot of pressure. Isi think i agree that this an attack, but i think it is more a flank attack. He is not disagree completely. You can send some men to the front and some men to the side. Followup on that. This is good. This is good. I am so proud of you. [laughter] how does she raised her daughter . Be a good wife. Is a daily or she has, becauseshe married a she is a good wife and she married a shit. This year ever tried to vote . Tried to vote . R what is ther say woman in france . The feminist. De beauvoir. Does she ever leave her husband . Here is what im getting at. Abigail is so far ahead of she were to try to act this out now, she would single,become a alienated person. This would have to be what she decides her life is. She is not going to do that. Reward comes from family, it comes from being a mother and a wife, and from personn active political going toe is not agenda,to live out an sheuse she is rooted herself is a traditional new england wife and mother. She has. That is where she derives the bulk of her fulfillment. At least that is what she says over and over again. Well, what this does make clear is, why is she having these ideas. The woman i was trying to think up with mary wollstonecraft. John reads her on the french revolution. He is reading are allowed to. Bigail later in the 1790s he goes nuts. If you go to the Boston Public Library that is where his library is. His books. The margin of error is almost as many as in the bible. Im not kidding. Thou shall understand that are anyway,ind what the letter really is is a statement about how one woman bynking is being affected the values being described in the American Revolution. Is by thes saying way, john, all the arguments you are making about british tyranny have implications that you do not seem to understand. John says, i do understand them, we cannot take those into account now. If you allow that radical agenda our is implicit in argument, we will kill the revolution. That sheting letters received. He is in the center of a wind tunnel in philadelphia of current slaves and former slaves you know, they are heartbreaking. Theyre basically saying, it does seem to me that the tyranny unless an untilson you are willing to take slavery o directly, you are vulnerable to the charge of hypocrisy. He did not have to think this himself. This is coming into him on his email account. The second group of people. Artisans in philadelphia. Philadelphia way, we saying, by the are the major sources of support for the revolution. The quakers, all they will do is sit this out. And, we cannot vote because we do not own property. We are not farmers. Will beave this guy who speak for us, and we would argue we have to and property qualifications for voting. So, we will end slavery, we will end the property qualification to vote, and now, abigail says, by the way, we also need to end patriarchy, and at least begin to recognize that the values we fall between the sexes. Ok, lets do it slowly, be responsible about it. The American Revolution has powerful, radical implications. Abigails job is to say, is, by thef them way, women. What is interesting is johns response. We would not have this family correspondence. John is a conservative revolutionary. Let me tell you. If you want to have revolutionaries that succeed, you want them to be conservative. Most revolutionaries are radical. She must have said Something Like this yesterday. Anyway. He is as there to be real radical on the issue of american independence, ahead of all the moderates. There a way to in 1775 . S just before bunker hill. Could we, in retrospect, looking real advance of the story has is hindsight. This is the biggest diplomatic blunder in the history of statecraft. They are going to lose a north american empire. They are going to suffer 30,00040,000 casualties. It is not going to be fatal. The sun will not set on the British Empire until the 20th century. Their golden days are really still ahead of it. But it is a big loss. It was unnecessary. What do i mean it was a necessary . There is an answer to this problem. It is looking right at them. And they cannot grab it. William pitt tells him what the answer is in the house of lords in the fall of 1774. Admin burke tells them what the answer is in the house of commons, shortly thereafter. This is a nobrainer. All we have to do is say, ok, you guys can tax themselves and legislate for yourself, you stay in the empire economically because it is in your advantage, and youre going to have to pay tariffs, but that is ok because you pay them anyway, but you get the benefit of the market. This is a good deal for you. And you recognize that you are under a protective canopy of the british monarch. Recognize legitimacy of the british monarch. Guess what that is . That is the british commonwealth. They have figured this out when hundred years later. That is the reason why australia and canada stay in the empire. India, for a while. They cant do it. Not in 1775, why . Two reasons. Central to the british mentality is the political talk of blackstone, a Great British jurist, who has said and everybody believes that this is true, it is as true as a principal from aristotle on to the present, and every political unit whether it is a nation or in empire, there has to be one final, allpowerful source of sovereignty. A place where all critical and controversial questions can go for resolution. Otherwise, chaos. What the colonists are proposing is multiple sovereignties. Over here they get to decide, over there to get to decide that stuff. That is no good. It is a recipe for failure. What is the constitution but multiple sovereignties . Some for this day, some for the fed. The great thing is blurring, ambiguity. Somebody smart. Admin burke knew this. Anyway, this was a missed chance, why did they not do it, because of blackstone and a sovereignty. The other reason we dont need to do it. We can just send an army over there and squash those son of the guns, like that. And that is what we are going to do. Why should we compromise when we have the military power to resolve this decisively . And that is the reason there is no turning back after we get to the battle of bunker hill. They have moved a military direction. The troops are getting ready to come. And in the summer of 1776, which we are now entering, on may 15, 1776, just about six weeks after abigail since her letter, john writes this thing, this prelude, to a request to be sent to all the colonial governors. If you read the request, it has certainly which in it that sounds sort of like the declaration of independence. We have been patient. Prudence dictates. It says, each colony should now begin the process of rewriting its colonial constitution, from a colonial constitution to a state constitution. This, is the referendum a de facto referendum on independence. Adams goes to his grave, believing that he wrote the real declaration of independence. That jeffersons thing six weeks later, whatever, is like the