Transcripts For DW Close Up 20221108

A glimpse that supermarket shelves shows that climate neutral is now more fashionable than organic. Many products are labeled this way humanoids solitude, such climate neutral is very broad term, of course. And lets ultimately we should be aiming to live in a climate neutral fashion to live sustainably. But its a controversial concept. The term has not been legally defined. And is climate neutrality even possible . If i like the imagination to figure out how its attainable in almost all economic systems, early science, well zealand blend, dickens and his son hendrick, a busy planting trees for the climate begins has been doing this for 20 years. Now. His business plant, my tree, acquires land all across germany for reforestation. The company enables private individuals to offset their carbon footprint. For 175. 00 euros a year, put guns on his team, plant 12 trees in return. Your maniachi under columbus, we are ecologically transforming the woodland with the trees. We are adding here, foreign and start. And we are pleased that we can create something here for future generations that will provide a habitat for wildlife and lots of oxygen groups here. Trees absorb c o 2 from the atmosphere during the process of photosynthesis, store carbon in their bio mass and release oxygen. Thats good for the climate. The principle of offsetting is based on this idea. It compensates for the production of greenhouse gases. Thats why Many Companies also fun to put guns, reforestation projects, his Business Model offsetting the carbon footprints of others, is successful because he earns money with every tree that he plants his clients range from the local baker to germanys major blue chip companies. So what are their motives . Not really, kids all ta named is are of course the mother of those companies that say they are doing it on the one hand because it helps nature with people but also because it helps their image thief heritage. Other motives are very diverse than what you, what you want, but the biggest striving forces, no doubt what a love of nature. Well, i love everyone realizes things have to change your mind. We have to act. Now allison planting trees is a wonderful way to help on the vulnerable mazama. The companies to help pay for the reforestation are allowed to use a label that shows their involvement. Certainly, germanys woodlands can benefit from reforestation, no matter whether the sponsors are acting out of true conviction or not. In many places, they are not in good shape. These spruce forests in western germany are infested with bark beatles, and theyll soon have to be cut down. Right next to it, the team is planting a mix of tree species. The sponsors see that as a meaningful step towards climate neutrality. But what does climate utility actually mean . The i p c. C puts it like this. Climate neutrality is balancing emissions, so they are equal or less than the emissions that get removed through the planets, natural absorption. What they mean is all Economic Activity release is c o 2. To reduce these emissions to 0, you can either cut them yourself or you can offset your emissions by compensating for them in other ways. By creating ecosystems like forests, for instance, which absorb and store Carbon Dioxide from the air. But how much c o 2 . Does the single tree absorb . Ive run it by film. All. Yeah, it is very, very difficult to assess how much they store per year because it is dependent on so many factors non such as the amount of rainfall. The default is infeasible, rain is needed for photosynthesis and office and it cant be too hot either. M. Trees always start to store really significant amounts after 8 or 10 years will not often befitting limbs your loss. Oh, this sampling will need a fair few years to get up to speed in terms of storage, height, girth, and would density also play a role . I the type of tree. There are various statistical models that attempt to gauge precisely how much c, o 2 a single tree can store. They estimate that by the time its ac, a mature beach has absorbed something in excess of a ton of Carbon Dioxide. The tree absorb some 12. 00 kilos each year. We would have to plant 80 beach trees annually to offset one ton of c o 2. Yet in germany about 11 tons produced per capita, each year to offset that, more than 800. 00 trees would have to be planted for each person. And all of these beach trees would have to live to be at least 80 years old. Otherwise the some doesnt add up, which is possible though, beaches that capable of living to be over 300 years old for the climate neutrality equation to work out. Trees have to live a long time on top of that. The wood cant be burned, nor can it rot. So you see the Carbon Offsets of a forest a difficult to calculate. At the Technical University in berlin, environmental scientist mathias think binah is researching how to measure sustainability and environmental impact. He sees the biggest problem in guaranteeing that Carbon Dioxide is permanently removed from the atmosphere. The conversation turned as to how can i ensure that the c o 2 removed from the air remains ideally trapped inside for ever. Who is going to guarantee that the forest wont be chalked our in is early and the moment that it is cut down, it triggers the process that leads to the c o. 2 emissions being released to get started because these are fields why miss yawn with the flags that still zealand clintons and his team are aware of this problem. The areas of land that they plant are owned by a trust that they set up specially for this purpose. The trees will not be utilized, at least for as long as that trust exists. The Tree Planting idea shows that climate neutrality is a bit of a slippery concept. Yet the label is everywhere. On supermarket shelves, for example, whether in loads of climate, positive, Carbon Neutral or climate neutral products. Food manufacturers are clearly keen to claim their products dont harm the environment. But what is the truth behind these claims . It is lets and left us. The idea ultimately is that you reduce your emissions as far as possible and then somehow compensate for the remaining ones as can know. But exactly how this is measured moment which emissions are included and which possibilities really count towards counting emissions that has not really been defined. Unfortunately, theres a slide only slightly, fiscally when Companies Say their products are climate neutral, its not quite clear what that means. They can use very different calculations to arrive at the claim of 0 emissions. And no one is really checking yada sits toys, dessert. This would be the fact that this concept is not legally regulated or standardized is of course the problem is, is not to, its from called limb by the an indies. It differs vastly indiscreetly, qualitative, and clenched as a consumer. I dont really know what the substance of these advertising claims are. Vices really nifty vascular subsilencio, there are cheap solutions. I gibbs gung, where people havent even attempted to reduce the emissions created, making their product kind of entrepreneur window. And then there are others who have really made a big effort when they are sitting on the same shelf, making the same claims. When do you stand with implies from claim, emily got the claim to be climate neutral is a pledge or rather an assertion the consumer goods industry is acting voluntarily. Apart from some sectors like mobility, heavy industry and fossil fuels. Theres no legal obligation in germany to reduce emissions. So why a company so interested in bearing this label . In his book, austria marcus sonia is the ceo of a family business. For more than 50 years sonia have been producing gloves. The company has been describing itself as climate neutral for 3 years. Whats that aim . More customers to mrs. Out there answered mystic this labor comp, vermillion. The issue is itself important and such a label doesnt get mean much to most consumers and does as we have just gotten the results of a survey that shows only 21 percent of consumers. Him say that it is really important to them to support a climate neutral business if that isnt to buy their product line or harmful for me. Its a decision that i have made for our company for our family. When marcus sonia decided to make his Company Climate neutral, his son was 4 years old. Human, almost because i thought to myself back then, okay, if this is really going to work for generation number 3, i want leave behind a company that considers the coming generations and the environment to let things. Its clearly something close to marcus tanyas heart. Thats why he decided to embark on a long and difficult process. Its time for the annual emissions stop taking. This involves checking all the phases in the production process. They 1st carried out a calculation of this kind in 2018. Seeing the companys entire c o 2 output in black and white was something ma, kristinia will never forget on funds. Well for me that thank you. So initially it was a real shock. Oh god. Oh god is what we are doing as a catastrophe, isnt it . The sofa, but theres no avoiding it. Is key. The one is on the pseudo up from all life on all activity on all types of business. Create c o 2. That was the main takeaway for me of learning. And what is important is that we adopt a more conscious approach the roster on did that some of examples of ford, sonya that means reducing emissions as much as possible in the manufacturing process and the company offices. There are external consultants to help advise him what to do about the rest. Like munich based climate partner, for instance, margarets name, who is the founder and ceo of one of the biggest organizations of its kind in germany. There are many others too. They like climate neutrality, consultants, they guide evaluate and recommend suitable solutions, and they issue a label at the end. Should once do blood seal does. Step number one is the analysis suits by miss. Where are c o 2 emissions being produced . 60 percent is connected with the product should sliced up to is then looking to see where a missions can be reduced or avoid a debit. When scoots, how can we effect change the short mediums and long time . Besides, for example, logistics packaging or using different materials in household, different materials. The austrian glove manufacturers zeniah say this is one way that they could reduce their harmful emissions. For example, by using Recycled Materials or a glove made partially from cork, which is sustainable because it grows back naturally. But the seo is also having to re think other areas to the company produces internationally in austria, germany, but also in china and vietnam. The supply chains a long and energy intensive. Locust accidentally logistics is of course an issue for book were currently switching to 100 percent e mobility and our fleet of m as were going to make dig reductions there. Oh. So where we are also making big reductions is imprinted matter of anything involving paper appear to call his but the individual company decides where it intends to make reductions. And by how much, oh said the extent to which it offsets its emissions is voluntary, there are no legal requirements to do so. Professor mathias think binah sees that is one of the cool problems of the concept of climate neutrality. Making comprehensive assessments of accompanies emissions. Although is related to particular products and then reducing them effectively is very expensive. The oh, fun for me was once cuz it listens roughly below producing an Environmental Audit that holds water scientifically, takes a great deal of effort. So for us, it would involve tracing the supply chain of but really looking at where the Raw Materials come from flight likable. Even with relatively simple products consisting of 2 or 3 components of fiber, cost, 10000. 00 euros upwards off of the complex products. It could, of course, be a lot all the at least voicemails and some of the offset scheme. Providers who also earned money with offsetting, had no interest in carrying out high value or disc the unclaimed, practically give that away for free because the economic return is generated by the sale of c o 2 certificates for cough. The comments are 2 instead of a copy of suitable for the environmental scientist mathias. Think by now its clear the Consultancy Companies also earn money, not by avoiding c o 2 emissions, but by offsetting them. C o 2 certificates show that a certain amount of c o 2 has been saved. Usually in developing countries. The problem is that frequently c o 2 audits and the provision of certificates a carried out by the same company, lucid oil. Theyre all fired him. We still see cases to day, a very simple audits being carried out even by some of the big market players. Because the focus of interest is not on cutting emissions or for that because when i just need a figure that i can then offset, reminds you from the info call from the common thoughts yawn, and some companies, even salva certificates. At the same time i list was hard to though im not saying that everything thats on the market, todays all bad our scripture. But there are lots of plans which portray all these various steps is very simplified, fucked up to build a climate partner moorhead, slim coolness company, also provides c o 2 certificates and its own climate neutral label. Doesnt the c . I think there are too many offset projects and team, few real reductions in emissions to my my toilet id with him as high as i would describe climate neutrality, more like a journey that step one, we audit set goals and reduce and offset a lot of c o 2 Emissions Community compensate for the amount of set has to be further reduced. Of course of you. We need change management to start concerning ourselves with the suppliers, with processes, etc. That should never stop stuff that you should never succumb to the temptation to say im going to conduct an order to make offsets end of story. This is at least asked him climate neutrality is an ongoing process. Marcus, sonya has clearly understood this principle. The austrian glove maker says he aims to continue cutting his company c o 2 emissions step by step. But zeniah needs comp and off sense to is everybody could look the fuel. So i was wondering, i always say that the carrot for us companies on is to keep on reducing our own c o. 2 emissions on that to come. We will never be able to avoid them altogether in was was if it was and you have to be aware of that on for steam, if the services. But at some point, when things have pretty much bottomed out where you cant reduce emissions any further on women, and thats what must be offset that i some of in nova, im with lieutenant as miss middleton malls, k the companies to ports carbon, offset projects to protect the environment in the alps and in china this, along with the reduction measures that theyve implemented, has led to them being classified as having 0 emissions and, and them the label climate neutral. Climate partners own climate neutral labels come with individual id numbers. The idea is to give customers the chance to find out more about the climate neutral project. Law school did the most, what has been done, what measures have already been taken to avoid emissions for our c o 2 emissions offset is what projects are being supported. The idea is maximum transparency and these are the steps that are repeated over and over again. He to see, to see every year how far you have advanced and what you have reduced and what you have avoided. What needs to be offset against your computer. Participating in seo to offset schemes abroad, like solar parks or wind farms is another potential problem. Under the 2015 paris agreement, most countries are obliged to reduce their own emissions. That means that theres a danger that some of these projects are counted twice over as so much Carbon Offsetting takes place internationally. Vineyards and comments or thoughts on peter and then if a Carbon Offset provide a funds, a Renewable Energy plant in a certain country, india, or brazil, for instance, it is counted as a reduction in the carbon audit of accompany all product em. But who ensures that the country where the plant is located does not include it in its own climate on it. And so that reduction would then be counted twice on the that of john. If hes a mission cuts accounted several times. There is the result. It will all be climate neutral by 2050 on the paper, but that the c o 2 emissions in the atmosphere will keep rising atmosphere that one last night. So climate neutrality may also lead to a paradoxical result. Nevertheless, companies that operate globally, believe that the label is increasingly important. What should we think about these multi nationals climate promises . Experts from the new Climate Institutes have been investigating that question. The cologne based think tank develops ideas about Climate Change and investigates. Existing concepts, caston, veronica, is a partner at the nonprofit company. In their latest study, he and his colleagues have taken a closer look at the climate. Pledges made by the worlds 25 Biggest Companies are merged to africa. They want to present themselves in a good light so that they dont lose certain segments of the markets with us. Now that the climate issue was very high up. And the agenda again, those we put ourselves in the consumers position and say ok, the of the companies are claiming that some of them and then they have to make the following information publicly and easily accessible in foreign from a to an armful of from dish mom or over till future, if it company says it aims to become climate neutral 520402030, or even 2025 than veronica stresses. It must be evident how that goal will be attained. Mainly by cutting emissions or solely via Carbon Offsets the new Climate Institute finding show that most companies lack transparency here benzo few negative was good when we have come across a lot of negative stuff here. Where a lot of energy has been invested by companies to muddle things, to cover things up so that they can make these assertions good stuff. Moving her, stella, for example, harding furniture, manufacturers who say i have stored carbon in my furniture exposure and it is permanently stored there. Excellent oils. And there are so much wooden or furniture that the bottom line is that we have negative emissions. So no, but how long does this furniture last . Is it equivalent to the carbon released to help create them for, for stored in a form that would last millions of years of going to stop them . We all know how quickly we replace our furniture these days. It doesnt work like that, and this data syncing insulin is there even apples that can claim to be climate neutral. Like Hamburg Airport here, emissions have been reduced by 80 percent since 2009 eve echols a used at the airport. And it runs its own combined heat and power plant. And theres Green Electricity to buds. Its important to bear in mind that the apples only regards itself as responsible for ground operations, not what happens in the air as stated by law. The emissions caused by the air traffic with in europe are in fact already covered by e. U emissions trading. But this example shows that often only elements of a product or a company, a climate neutral, such as the production, but not the logistics or distribution. The choice to reveal this or not is voluntary participation, after all, is also entirely voluntary. Must demarco city for this is an unregulated markets which was created by private players. Well, this is from chris from a state monitor childrens nor state regulated michelle michigan. Yeah, there are good standards and good initiatives, but there is also a lot of uncontrolled growth, some very, very bad stuff. Guns for non experts. Its quite difficult or almost impossible to find your way through this jungle fusion or fossil mo, position is enjoyed. I safin it remains impossible for consumers to really get to the truth behind climate neutral labels. So marketing claims. The state gives companies far too much leeway. Ah, zealand lincolns and his son hendrick, are on the road in, in germanys, i, for region across germany, lincolns and his team have planted more than 1200000 trees in the last few years. The condition of the re forested areas has to be reviewed regularly of muddy. I shall look the oaks. They have also made it thats good to run there. The 1st. Ok we planted about 12 years ago for if youre on the field now. Well then sure. Yeah. I wont, i guess im, i used to just run down here and play in the hey, daniel yard. I know. And now you cant even make your way through here anymore. The engineer wish lawson this is the oldest re forested area created by zealand pumpkins, company. And were here is transitional zyden is the s, i cant say exactly where the 1st tree i planted stands with somewhere here. Yahoo only, but i dont know how old i was. Maybe 8 or so, its always really special to see the trees here and how much theyve grown. Well see its, its great, but from their shoe. Boseman know that climate neutrality cannot be achieved by planting trees alone. But susan lincolns believes its not an option to do nothing wrong. And with every tree that he plants, hes also making a contribution towards bio diversity. As of you for that much, the hotline to my tree is not saying the solution is to plant trees and everything will be fine on phone. So to be far too easy and too good to be true. But its only one step on the way to greener, healthier future ah, one path to a better future. Its not Just Companies and multi nationals that have the aim of. Net 0 emissions. Entire states have declared this their goal and they want to achieve it quickly. Thats according to experts like mathias think binah is exactly where the problem lies. Lisa tight coke would be this pressure and push to achieve such an ambitious goal so quickly can sometimes mean that the right measures are not implemented in reality. Yes, of the hoyt, i prefer someone who says, i am going to reduce emissions gradually. Well, to attempt to become climate neutral by 2050 than someone who says that they will be climate neutral by 2030. But who has no idea how . By just by c o 2 certificates consulting, it was the construct of to say i have these remaining emissions and i have quantified them these. And this is why i cannot reduced these emissions yet. Oh me, it is amazon or that makes things transparent from pennsburg and then you could say were trying to reach climate utility by this date. But we can only guarantee a 95 percent reduction by then for more of a full transparency of constructive, fuller transport. It sounds less ambitious and public any, but it would be significantly better. Have you ever brought it before . Climate neutrality is a key term in International Climate policy. But when it comes to how its done, things tend to be a bit more difficult. That has a lot to do with the fact that implementation is mainly voluntary and unregulated. The climate neutral label is hard to pin down and can easily be used as just another green washing strategy. With blue ah, the do you know that 77 percent of laughing . I younger than 30 thats me and me and you know what . Its time old voices. Bob. Hi paul. The 77 percent we talk about with this is where the 77 percent in 30 minutes on dw attention as an environmental mm. A clothing graveyard to land desert. This is where thinking industrial nations no longer need an external waste gets stranded about the fun in the Global Fashion industry. Global 3090 minutes on d, w. O. Whats it state for the world when americans elect a new congress as us democracy faces, yet another stress test . Were here to renew the latest. All the fear of violence translate into action and what the thief, mid terms mean for the next president ial race in 2024. Let us bring a good break story across all platforms this week. On d. W. Oh, rare natural spectacle world ah, the return of the spiky yellow with laos ensure the survival of the entire ecosystem. Ah, one of the many Success Stories from a passion of biodiversity. St. Helena starts november 18th on d. W. Come have a peek at these county, the highlights you every week in your inbox, subscribe. Now with the midterm elections in the united states, theyve usually not been a big story outside the united states. Congressional seeds up for grabs, state governors races for decades. This has been considered a purely american affair, domestic democracy. Were not this talk today is voters in the u. S. Cast their ballots. The world is watching. Theres