Insurgent army, any Resistance Movement is absolutely impossible without the support of the local population, both morally and purely materially, therefore, the holding of ee actions , the event was precisely aimed primarily at that in order to deprive the Ukrainian Insurgent Army of this support, and in principle we can say that the main goal of this action has been fulfilled, because already after a year, in fact , the Ukrainian Insurgent Army renounces the organizational forms of the Resistance Movement and goes directly to the underground struggle well, the goal of the leaders is to destroy the entire units, to destroy the organism that acts against the soviet government, it was achieved , we can also talk about the fact that the population in western ukraine has partially changed. We cannot say what about that that this change somehow radically changed his preferences, his views, some of his activities, but this change was quite noticeable, because mainly people from Eastern Ukraine or in those places where soviet military units were stationed moved there from it was directly the families of military personnel who started to create such closed communities, if now we would say closed communities that lived their own lives and did not cooperate in any way with the local population. Well , if we talk about uh, there was still there was the vistula operation well, and also participation in the resettlement of ukrainians from the territory of the podlaskie hill region, there were also other people there, where was lemkivshchyna, the podlaskie hill region, and here is this writing poles and czechs also took part there. Well, of course, the soviet army. And tell me , please, in general, the idea is to change the character of the people, to cleanse them. To what end . Does this indicate that the russians did not have other influences to work with the population, or that they and the ukrainians could not work differently , understanding that their ideas, their ideology, it will not be accepted, lets say it at least in this part of ukraine and leaves it in this well, and then the second question is the fate of the ukrainians who were resettled. Did russia manage to digest them even then . Well, i would not single out the ukrainians as some kind of community against which there was no power. The soviet repressive machine created such situations at that time, in fact, in all the newly joined territories, such a situation existed, in the current baltic states, in lithuania, in estonia , in latvia, the simple question was the number of the population involved in the Resistance Movement and the number of the population that was ready to actively resist the soviet occupation authorities, but if we talk about the fate of the ukrainians who were expelled from this territory, they were actually scattered all over the territory of ukraine. In fact, to a certain extent, it worked on the contrary, er, ukrainian consciousness , ukrainian culture was brought to those regions, to those territorial units of the ukrainian ssr at the time when, lets say, the soviet government considered themselves undisputed by some kind of authority and believed that the soviet government was established here forever and from the beginning, but these people began to bring as much political consciousness as Ukrainian National identity and now we can talk about the fact that in many areas e east of ukraine, in many areas of e south of ukraine, ukrainian culture has been preserved as much as possible thanks to those immigrants who appeared in these regions as a result of the event. Let us now move on to todays time. Continues to deport the local population, abduct children, and send entire families to different regions of the Russian Federation, well, in fact, starting from the coast of the Pacific Ocean there, the sea of japan, and ending, well, with the territories of the northern north and also there siberia. Well, here it is closer to the european part of the russian part federation, what is the purpose of the enemy now , is he trying to replenish some or fill some gaps in his ee in his population in certain territories, that this is some kind of mechanical action because we we have always done it this way and now we have to do it, or is it again a matter of weakening the Resistance Movement in the territories temporarily, what is the purpose of carrying out, in fact , a largescale deportation of the population, please you know i would not like to speak for the enemy what does he think, what is he planning, i will try to analyze it, well, as a historian, as a person who , lets say, was interested in similar processes , in the processes of changing consciousness in the occupied territories, here we can talk about the fact that the russians are solving several problems at the same time first of all, they want to deprive the occupied territories of a population that is capable of resisting it, and secondly, having a population that, in their opinion , is very close to, lets say, native russians , whom they subconsciously continue to consider as brothers or the reverse population aa they try use them to populate the territory, which is the most affected by the demographic crisis of the 1990s, and now this democratic crisis is reoccurring in them, i think that it is precisely the combination of these factors that, on the one hand, free the territories are occupied by a population that has lived there for a very long time and is replacing it with another population this is one side and the other situation is that empty territories that were once mastered during the soviet era are now trying to remaster the account of ukrainians or former ukrainian citizens whom they introduce to this territory, you know, it is possible to understand. This is how. Well, not to win, how to break this, uh, hostile, hostile character. Well, russia has been our enemy for centuries, i will soon be a millennium there in 1169 i im not mistaken, bogolyubske, the first time i came to kyiv, thats it. Well, soon it will be a thousand years since they came here, and it must be said that their actions, like empires, they were successful in a certain period of time. They already resettled today. I spoke with the previous guest only ukrainians and crimean tatars, and again you said about the baltic countries , uh, chechens, there are different peoples of the caucasus, this is constantly happening, this is resettlement here and there. And what is there to oppose to this , again, well, besides, while russia exists i dont know if it will be destroyed for good or not. But as long as it exists, it will do it all the same. What is the most important countermeasure to this . And the second question here is, do you know when in this war it will be possible to break the power of russia . Return the ukrainians home is the first and the second of which we will return the ukrainians home now how much work will be done on them and on theirs to change their thinking , worldview, ideology is it possible to what extent will the Russian Federation work with them now or are they just sent and no one with them in particular there will be no work in this regard, please. I think that there are several planes here , i will start with the second question, there are several planes of this phenomenon, it is possible, indeed, there are regions where ukrainians will simply resettle with them, no one will work with them, no one will apply, and not in their attention , an extra labor or demographic resource will simply appear there and they will use it in the same way, but we russians can see it, not only will we say so in military matters, but in ideological matters , they are learning, they will change the policy, and i think that the work with resettled ukrainians will gradually intensify, we can see this on the example of ukrainian children who are abducted or ukrainian children who are in the studied territories, it is on them that all the power of the russian Propaganda Machine is directed from one side, from the other side, all the power of the russian well lets call it an educational or ideological machine and they are trying to reformat these very people. I think they will work in the same way with the population that will be taken out of the ukrainian lands. Will appear in, lets say, empty russian territories, they will gradually be instilled with a new identity or will try to awaken, lets say , the old identity in some of them, on what putin always relies on, and his approach to the person there is also based on the lost identity единая исtорическое обечение новой исtоричкой обечение единый совеtский народ i think that here exactly this appeal to the nostalgic factors of the appeal to the former residence in a unified state will be directed lets say so to that part the population, well, the categories, lets say 45 plus, aand they will work with it using some nostalgic feelings aand they will work with the youth already using the uhe ideological mechanisms that operate there in russia , well, relatively speaking, since 2010, this is the youth Army Movement there and various patriotic events there are the activities of the Russian Military historical society. That is, there are many forms of influence on consciousness , what to do with it, well, in fact, we are entering what is now so fashionable to call cognitive deoccupation there or, er, work with mentality, that is, when these people will return to ukraine or when we liberate the occupied territories with these people , it will also be necessary to conduct military stabilization measures in the liberated territories. Cultural policy and all this will have to be paid a lot of attention, because the russians work with their propaganda, it must be recognized that it is very powerful, yes, it may look somehow terrible, it looks unpleasant for us, but it works and the russians will use it all the time, you know this prokhanov there is a man who wanted to burn himself in a tank on khreshchatyk well, but he didnt get into the tank, in principle the russian tanks on khreshchatyk were only burned, prokhanov was not there its just now ill quote him so that we can roughly understand the level of their propaganda , this is the level of such mythmaking that some ideologues of this russian world resort to , so i quote putin is reviving the authors of the factories , he went to beg for his forgiveness , the flame licked under his feet, the grass was smoking, he was in the alarm bells under his patronage were deer and moose, river trout and pike and sky swallows and cranes, this is along the golden road, how much is there at all . Another world in which they live with their god putin is conditional , so there would be no putin, there may be another god and where are they going . They involve ukrainians, you know, we dont already, during this ongoing war, we saw how dangerous they can be for ukraine. People who were struck by the russian peace with the infection of the russian measure took it into their bodies. Even living in ukraine and not understanding this, they unwittingly became traitors , they received signals from enemy agents, uh , actually continued to cooperate with them, many people accepted the approach of the russian guys as normal, so that their population points , thinking that this is normal, they came, that is, it worked even at a distance through television, which , unfortunately, was also infected by russian measures through show business through bloggers of various kinds, that is, not even intrusively, im not talking about how it works. If it is if it is imposed. You know, i have such an interesting question now, the Ukrainian Army is already liberating the territory that was captured 10 years ago. Well, in particular , if we are talking about opytne, and there are still a number of settlements there, we are either there or near them, and now i am talking about this population, which we will about this territory that we are liberating together with people who have actually been under russia for 10 years, so i also believe that the Ukrainian Army will reach the crimea here , how serious a problem will it be, what part of the people may be ideologically aa ideologically loyal to the russian peace yes to the socalled because i think that part of the people well, i have such acquaintances in crimea, relatives there, even if the government changes, they will return the passport and live as they lived. The main thing is that they are paid a pension there or a salary, well, absolutely, but these are people who are loyal to this russian world, how hard is it to change their worldview, their mentality, please calculate quantitatively, well, it is quite difficult, but i think it will be approximately within 2025 , it will be people who really consciously support this the position is consciously in paradigm of the russian world. Approximately 50, maybe 60 , this will be a population that really is, well, lets say so simple in quotation marks, a peaceful population that really doesnt care about which power to live, but lets just say it like that and it will be possible the biggest challenge because of this population it is necessary to be well, lets put it this way, pull out as many people as possible who can be swayed to the side of ukraine, it doesnt matter what means will be used for this, cultural, economic, or there is Something Else that will be attractive to this group of the population, and most importantly, i think that this part of the population will also be supported will be approximately within 1020 there. Who will deliberately support ukraine who simply stayed in the occupied territory because they could not leave, just as if the population will have to make a bet because these people have lived in these territories for 10 years or more they know their neighbors they know people from were close to them so that they know what, lets say, points on which you can influence something, what you can talk about with them in order to, well, if you dont make them loyal to ukraine, then make them loyal, because the main question on in the liberated territories, it will not be a question of loyalty, it will be a question of loyalty. And this is exactly what i tried and are trying to achieve in any occupied territories. Loyalty is not interesting ; loyalty, which will be manifested in any form, will be interesting. It is not time to participate in everything, will it be a formal vote in the elections, the main thing is that there should not be an active phase of resistance, and just like ukraine, when it comes to liberate the territory, there is no well, it is necessary to have, shall we say, a more or less balanced policy in these territories policy of deoccupation, because it will be necessary to act simultaneously in the field of education, in the field of culture, in the world of economics and in the world of ecology , even that is, in all these elements , it is necessary to have a clear position, it is necessary to understand who we are using. The boundaries of the ukrainian world and it is necessary to understand what to do with them, and then actually the algorithm with which to work will be a clear organ. Partners regarding the observance of democratic norms regarding the observance of cultural norms regarding the observance of tolerant norms and you cant turn away, although you know when you remember from history how they worked with the population of germany after the second world war, well, there was burned nazism, i have shorter people, someone of course not , but quite harshly i think that the idea of the russian peace is no less, if not more toxic and murderous than the idea of german nazism, and is the actual embodiment of what was implemented by hitler, so here , of course, it must be culturally and loyally but i i think that after all, this infection must be killed harshly. I am not talking about the destruction of people, of course, but we need to take care of something in us , just a minute for a question. Literature or russians burn books everywhere here in ukrainian libraries that bring in their own culture and maybe because it was not paid any attention earlier in the 30 years of our independence well maybe somewhere the enemy was successful he showed it everything matters history, culture, literature in our country, by the way, even history was not necessarily a subject. Unfortunately, it is possible that this will change our understanding and attitude to this, please, if possible briefly. I think that, in fact, we can see that a Critical Mass of ukrainians really understood that cultural and historical factors they are extremely important in modern warfare and in fact we and our adversary use them. I think that simply over time they will all occupy an appropriate place in state politics. Thank you very much, vasyl thank you for your comments, specialists vasyl pavlov , head of the expert group on internal communications , directorate of information policy in the field of defense and Strategic Communications of the ministry of defense of ukraine, was in touch with us. I am not referring to the one that started back in 14th year, but to this fullscale one. I have always discussed with friends and acquaintances, and this was some kind of indorussian assessment. Lets not say its a sin, and i always said you know this empire. Well, there was vlad, the kingdom from the first principality , then the kingdom, then the empire, then the soviet union, and so on , but well, in principle, it was from the first conquests of the moscow kingdom there, novgorod , tver, and already further there and kazan there, then siberia, it was always an empire in its own way until the 18th century, when it officially became an empire under peter the great romanov, but by its nature it was always an empire that lived at the expense of new territories, i always said, you know you are so frivolous, no one has ever wondered why, in fact, during the time of ivan the terrible, there is even basil the third , and russia as an empire actually exists, it has experienced many upheavals, the troubled times of the capture of the french by the poles , has survived them all and continues to live. The empire and now continues to live like this, conquering we say we have never thought about why she is like that, but because she always destroys what she is supposed to destroy. Defeat this empire, which will always crawl into every crevice and destroy. And you have to be stronger than them, and language, literature, culture, history this is all important without this monster. Well , of course, weapons and our army that fights with him cannot defeat this uh this poison must be destroyed, but on