106,000 people were able to buy Insurance Coverage in the first month of obamacares open enrollment, instead of the expected half million. The fact that some 4. Million americans received notices from their Insurance Companies that policies the president promised they could keep were in fact being canceled. But regardless of the laws stunning failures and disappointments, president obama has defiantly declared that obamacare is here to stay. We learned not to make wild promises about how perfectly smooth it is going to be at all times. Do not let the initial problems with the website discourage you. Were going to keep on working to fix whatever problems come up, whatever comes up, were just going to fix it. Were not repealing it as long as im president. Lou our first guest is here to serve partly astute for you and me. He says obamacare is the biggest middle class entitlement ever conceived. He says beyond the flawed website we need to stay focused on the fact that the Health Care Law spend too much on the wrong people. Joining us tonight is tom scully. Set former administrator at centers for Medicare Medicaid services during the bush administration, the last. Also a Health Policy staffer in the bush 41 white house. Hes currently a general partner with welch carson, a new York Private Equity Firm investing in health care. Good to have you back with us. Tom, first, the administration is claiming Great Success and progress here. Were also hearing great skepticism. We just recounted our own correspondent, steve doocy sir, peter doocy, going through and getting error messages. It still looks to be a bit of a mess. What do you think . It is a mess. It cant be a lot worse than it was two months ago. It is a lot better from the consumer point of view as far as i can tell. Insurance companies, theyre finding huge problems with income verification. That will be a big problem for aetnas and cigna, blue cross plans next few months figuring out who get whats subsidies. It is a complex system. Theyre having a rough time. It is better than a few months ago but it will be march or april. It will take that long. Lou march or april, actually Jeffrey Zeints the man in charge of getting this thing fixed, he said he could make it by the end of november. It hasnt quite worked out that way. David plouffe says he is confident this thing bill be working by 2017. Were you just a little astounded when you heard a man say that, i thinks as soon as there is new management in the white house the program might be working . Well look, all these companies are offering insurance. Its a mess. The fundamental mess is trying to take a huge number of people, 15 to 20 Million People and income, verify income and decide what subsidy will be and they are huge subsidies. That is the fundamental problem. Telling aetna how much of your 15,000dollar Insurance Premium will be subsidized by the government. Will take a while. Zeints is a smart guy. I havent talked to him in years. They have smart people working on it but they were far behind from the start. Lou you talk about smart people, worked in the private sector a little while, worked in management and as well as on air, i have known a lot of smart people. One of the first rules i can remember being counseled on by my boss when i moved into management was just remember this. This is the axiom. Once you got people involved its screwed up. And it appears that that very basic lesson in management, no matter what level you work at, was ignored by a government, an administration frankly had very little obvious experience in management of any kind. Obviously this is much bigger nut than they expected. Not to defend them. I think current administrator, had my job, marilyn tavenner. She is very smart. I know her that years. She is great. On i. T. Side they have a lot more than they can chew. They have a long way to go. It will be a mess for a long time and its a political disaster. Too me the bigger issue this is a 200 billiondollar Entitlement Program and giving a lot of subsy it is to a lot of people. Primary reason it will work eventually, whether it works next election, one reason it will work eventually, it will give huge subsidies to a lot people. That is in a lot of cases wrong amount of money going to the wrong people and huge amount of taxpayer dollars going to the wrong place. Lou our ed henry at white house pointed out, chuck todd talking this weekend pointed out a line in the administrations report saying that they had decided, talking about the performance now of on the website, they had gone all private sector. They were meeting new levels of efficiency. Private sector efficiency. Actually doing things correctly. As it is done in the private sector. An outright admission that the government is not the solution. Why in the world o we continue literally trillions of taxpayer dollars the silly notion that government is the appropriate agency of resolution for so many of these problems in our society and our economy . Couldnt agree more. If they left this more, gotten aetna, cigna, united, blue cross plans in room together, lets figure this out, why dont you twice get the website for us, would have been a lot more successful and done a lot more quickly. The more they delegate to private Companies Better off they will be but theyre learning it the hard way. Lou theyre learning it the hard way. I take your point that these are good people, smart people, but these are frankly not the people i give a damn about. Im frankly concerned about the American People who were promised much by the administration that seems to be capable of very little. The idea weve gone through over the last three fiscal years. They have raised over 50 billion in revenue for the Affordable Care act. Theyre on track right now, there will be additional 500, could we put that up. Just to go through that. 50 billion collected 2010 through 12. This year and next. We, through the next 10 years. Well add 500 billion. Creating, in just medicaid unfunded liabilities because of the enormous shift to medicaid as a result of obamacare, 17 trillion, tom, in addition unfunded liabilities. What are we to do here . These are massive, massive entitlement expansions both in medicaid, those are poor people who probably need it, you could argue about that but these new expansions in the exchanges are huge amounts of subsidies to people way in the middle income streams. 62 of americans qualify for subsidies. Lou in obamacare. Yeah, the obamacare, 62 of the americans, family of four with 94,200 gets a subsidy. Lou never before imagined. It is crazy. Im upset about the website, i think its a mess. I hope the bigger discussion on social policy who should we subsidizing. You cant subsidize 62 of the americans for anything. Eventually this program will work and eventually the website, maybe two years or five years from now it will work and for better or worse this thing will not be repealed. Many of us wish we could start over. We cant. These are massive new subsidies for huge number of people. Once the sig got gets turned on it is probably not coming back. Lou there is another way to frame this based on what you said, tom. Just tell me, were over on time, tell me if im not correct, by the time this does work, we wont be so much thrilled it is working as we will be scared to death how in the world to pay for it . That is my point. You can debate whether it will work. It will work eventually. Scares me amount of money we spend on middle income and upper income people that shouldnt be subsidized. Lou we sure need to raise i. Q. Of folks running this government, republican and democrat, i mean that in the mosby partisan sense. Thank you very much. Lou tom, come back soon. Well need the help. Thanks. Lou up next, he exposed obamacare navigators, teaching enrollees how to lie for subsidies. He wasnt done. James okeefe, tonight, right here reveals his latest bombshell obamacare video. Dont miss it. Stay with us. Were coming right back. [woman]ask me. [announcer]. If you think the best b for one of you might be a comprise for the other one. [woman]a me about our tempurpedic. [announcer] theyre sleeping on the newest tempurpedic bed. The new tempur choice. [man]two peopltwo remotes. [aouncer] firmness settings for the head,legs,and back. And with tempur on top,that famous tempurpedic comfort comes any way you like it [woman]ask me about the lumbar button. [man]shes got her side. And ive got my side. [announcertempuredic. The most highly recommended bed in america. [woman]dont touch my side mm. Mmhmm. 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While reducing emissions bup to 60 energy lives here lou project variry taos, has icdeo of obamacare navigators counseling people to lie on applications, again. Following earlier criticism from dallas an irving, texas, were isolated incidents, project veritas, visited navigators in houston and fort worth. What they found was more of the same. Sa just like that . Me no. To get a lower premium i wouldnt include it. Cutting grass on weekend and they would give me money. It is worse to go with the silver plan. The lowest one on here right now is for you and your son is 469. My republican friends, they hate this. And they said that they would go into my bank account. No. And find out about money. I hang wallpaperer on the side and people usually pay me cash. No, no. If you dont report that, then no. Lou joining us now, project veritas founder and president james okeefe. James, congratulations again extraordinary expose. This latest video, it was a peculiar defense at best that many charged this is, focusing on isolated instance. It didnt take you long to prova it was not isolated at all. What do you think is going on here . Well, i think it is two things. A lot of these navigators are not qualified to be in the Insurance Brokerage business to begin with. Lou right. Theyre in over their heads. They have no formal training in anything medical and, as you can see a lot of them are eitherou incompetent or dont really know noat the rules are but it is deception n this case change happens is a local Community Organization in houston. They received somewhere aroundhundred thousand of your taxpayer dollars, federal. Theyre advising our reporter wearing a hidden camera not to h report our income to the irs so we get more obamacare subsidies. If youre federal poverty line, yosuu get 100 subsidy. If youre four times over the federal poverty line, four times, less money from the federal government. It is systemic thing. If youre familiar with my work, i release videos one at time to grab the naysayers that say it is isolated. Lou not isolated. You haveet a another video comig out next w week. U tell us about that. In the first video, lou with, we focused on relationship battleground texas, political metion committee and enroll america a 501 c 3 group how they Work Together to achieve a political agenda which i not thought what health care wouldha be about. Well dive into how peoples private medical information and medical data is shared with Political Action committees orh shared to achieve political purposes. I think that is what fundamentally i think that is what this is all about. I think that will be really explosive when we release that. Do you establish a connection, a direct connection, or can you tell us or do you want to tell us at this point, between the Democratic Party and its various ancillary v arorganizations, and what you hu discovered amongst navigators yes. So far weve released two different video pieces. The first video established that the battleground texas, which is an organization trying to turn the state into a blue state, was on tape with enroll america. O they crosspollinate their data. It is illegal for a 501 c 3 ll group, in this case, enroll01 america, to give anything to aur Political Actional committee. In fact theres a letter sent to the attorney general of texas, there was a letter sent, saying in media today, theyre actually thinking of taking away this nonprofits taxexempt status for that relationship. What were going to do, is were going to go a step further tha of these people willing to givel out private medical data,ve information. Now they will potentially give it out, explicitly for political reasons. And that is totally illegal and immoral. Im sure it will be aat big, big story when it comes out. Lou n james, already it is a big story. Congratulations on your work. This is, i hear people trying to describe you variously as anis activist, provocateur. N act right. Lou as if labels matter. I want to ask you, what do you refer to yourself as . How would you describe your role in all of this . Well, i think, im a journalist. You know, the media no longer does this type of work, for i think it is some of it is liability. A lot of people simply become pundits ora agra greattores. What we do, we knock on doors. We go out into the field. The we do shoe leather journalism. It is risky work. It is expensive. This investigation took us three, four months to do. We gathered 100 hours of footage well release a little bit at a time. Im a journalist. 60 minutes used to do this. Abc news dont do it. They consider me an adversary. I dont understandd why. Im just trying to expose fraud and abuse very long line in american journalism. Youre close as i imagine anyone in the country being a muckraker. And that is a, for me, i think thats a pretty high, pretty High Standard that youre setting for yourself and i thini you ought to be proud of that b label. Pr we salute you l here. If you want to know more about sort of why people dont do what i do, or why people are do, rea, breakthrough. It will talk about what the media and government put me through to get me to where i am today. Lou well do it. Thank you very much. James okeefe, thank you. My new book debuts january 7th. I hope you think about reading it and hardcover and audio book version. I narrate that audio book myself. Great fun. I hope you will pick it up. Just by talking to a helmet. It grabbed the patients record before we even picked himp. It found out the doctor we needed was at st. Annes. Wiggle your toes. [ driver ] and it got his okay on treatment from miles away. It even pulled strings with the stoplights. My ambulance talks with smoke alarms and pilots and adiums. But, of course, s a good listener too. [ female announcer ] today cisco is connecting the internet of everything. So everything works like never before. Joining us now to assess the psychology behind the obama statement and misstatements and the millennial rubble, doctor robbie ludwig. Its great to be here beyond the president talked as if he hadnt been around for five years as he criticized the income gap on this income. He was talking about his own policies, protecting that he wa. So what kind of madness is that . Its a hes really good at giving speeches and playing to thear we havent seengreat speech, fantastic. But do the job. Are people really doing better . Are they feeling more confident in the government . Know they are his talks i think he is a very ineffective speaker but he was exciting at one time. But i think hes become dull and dour. Plcks. And people who are watching an entitlement system just blow up in theirfaces. There is a grandiosity there. I think that obama really believes in itself and his mission. And so he doesnt think that he is failing. And he believes that this is the right track and that if things arent working out right now it is not his fault. And maybe its something that he inherited. But i think this is a man who really Still Believes in his vision. Lou if you want in your office and said hes going to sit down or lie down on your couch. I would love that. Lou [laughter] maybe the country went. I mean, is help available to him . The president s have psychologists and people to say this or that . He had been inviter. You have to be willing to listen. Therapy doesnt work magically. You have to be open to the idea that something that im doing is not working. Lou does he strike you as a fellow that would be open . No, he seems very seduced by his own ideas and image and putting people in place. Telling people what he wants them to hear. And this includes people with different ideas. Lou there is a crisis of credibility. But certainly there is the potential here for his entire Administration Health care is a complete mess, but it looks like obama is in denial about this mess. In his only interest is making sure we put this in place. He wants to create Health Care System that he feels is in americas best interests. He won even if its not americas tradition . Right. Because he believes in his rightness and his vision and even if its not working out. And its scary and exciting. Lou thank you for your analysis. As always, its great to see you. If president obama wants to talk to me, i am open. And up next, a recall election. He won a great deal more. Governor scott walker joins us now. Unintimidated. We are coming right back. vo you are a business pro. You can separate runwayridi. Seeker of the sublime. From fason that flies off the shelves. And you. Rent from tional. Because only national lets y choose a car in the aisle. And go. 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