Gasparino. James freeman is here from the wall street journal. Forbes contributor rick unger is with us as well. Wow, the fdny just tweeting out this picture. Were going to show it to you, a look from the inside. There. At the scaffolding hanging. Can you imagine two people are stranded on this. My dad was a construction worker. Worked on the original trade center. Went up on scaffolds, maybe not that high, but fairly high. I will say this, when we sit around on this network and talk about unions, denigrate all unions, there is a reason why there are unions for jobs like this. These are very, very, labor intensive scary jobs. You need some sort of a way to make sure your workers are not taken advantage. Im not saying these guys were. Thats why there are coal miners worker unions. My dad was Iron Worker Union is you get a union lesson out of this. This is why, because that is the work they do, that the private sector unions are starting to get so angry with the public unions. Youre right about that. Who dont get more benefits and more job security. I agree. We all agree. That is definitely it. My old man, my dad was a democrat but was a reagan democrat. Why was he a reagan democrat . He saw the way the Republican Party denigrating men like this, a lot of them were veterans. They did not get the same benefits as you got, if you went to work pushing paper up in albany. Right. There is the difference. These guys do very dangerous jobs and i just, you know, our thoughts and prayers we can agree government needs to be smaller. That is the lesson. Really you . Get that from this. Im not sure i get that from this. I think we agree i hope they have a way of getting you can see movement on the scaffolding right now. The two men that are trapped there. I cant imagine how terrifying this is. These guys have, i know a lot of these guys, i grew up, when i was a kid i went up and did this stuff. These are men and there are some women that do this stuff, that have you know what of steel. These are some of the bravest people in the world. No doubt. They have, i would think, that right now these guys are figuring out a way to get, listen, our prayers are with them. But these guys, if anybody gets out of this melissa im reading reports saying windows are not removable which makes sense. Right. Melissa the plan or one of the plans that is being floated trying to break the windows, get them back inside. What i dont understand in this day and age with technology, you would think it would have a failsafe mechanism. Melissa failsafe mechanism that it didnt fall. Or would think that we didnt need men didnt fall. Can they lower something from the roof . Canned they send out another one . I imagine all of these ideas are being explored at this moment. But 69 floors up. Just incredible. So terrifying. Terrifying in regular circumstances. Much less, something where something has gone wrong and as precarious as it is right now. Just really, wow, something were definitely keeping an eye on here. Former new york pd detective tom russ skin is on the phone right now. Tom, an amazing situation. What do you think are some of the plans going through the mind of folks trying to solve this humongous problem . Well the office of Emergency Management for the mayor and the Police DepartmentsEmergency Service and Fire Departments rescue units are now probably approaching those floors to determine what theyre going to do and how theyre going to get those workers off the stuck scaffold. There is safety procedures already in place and that is why the guise are hanging, hanging there in that precarious situation. But theyre safe at this point in time. Now it is a matter, do you fracture a window and pull them in through a window . Do you have Emergency Service officers repel down and secure the scaffolding and then somehow raise it up . But that is all the different considerations that are now going on. Melissa why do you say theyre safe at this point in time . To us, to the naked eye it looks like it is dangling. It is dangling and secure, not flopping around in the wind or anything else. Right. It has safety cords attached to it and guys also have safety belts attached to it. Thats why theyre not dangling at this point in time. There are procedures that have been set up over these different tragedies that have happened that have stopped anyone else from being seriously hurt or killed. Melissa you say one of the options is to repel down from the top . It would be either repel down from the stop or fracture a window, a floor or two above and then repel down from there. Or, fracture a window right where they are and pull them through. The problem is, i dont know what the windows are made of in this new building and i dont know what the ramifications would be to break a window. Remember there are people below. You have to secure the plaza below, to make sure that no one was hit with shards of glass or whatever it is may out of as it falls down. Mr. Ruskin, it is Charlie Gasparino. Hey, charlie. How are you. If they broke the window, talking about 60 stories up, it might be hard to, there is a whole, there is a whole other dynamic when youre that high up when you start breaking windows. Seems to me that weapons. Seems to me like their best chance would be to secure it and hoist it up, dont you think . Thiazol things that are being can considered, but to charlies point which is very good point, tough take into account the wind in that area. As we all know in the area of the trade center the wind blow wildly. So anything you break could fling, blocks away. And you dont want to see anyone else hurt or killed. During 9 11, people were killed and injured by glass. That is one of the main things that killed people on the ground. Good news, apparently what im seeing on broadcasting watching on the channel, it appears that the scaffolding is secured. It is not flopping around which would bring it to a different level of i am immediate sy to deal with it. So it looks like, you know, theyre going to have to look, do they send something down . Do they have other officers repel. Remember we also have aviation units that could be utilized for Something Like this and do that type of rescue. The problem it is so close to the building you cant get the copter in there. Tom, i dont know if you know the answer to the question. You look at risk youre taking doing this sort of job. We talk about unions that try to secure benefits for these folks. What does somebody who does that job what do they make . Do you have any idea . I would guess theyre not highest paid workers in the city of new york. Their unions will like what i have to say. I think theyre underpaid for what they do. But they are very skilled at what they do and they do go through these emergency procedures. Melissa okay. Were getting word, fox is confirming right now there is a second scaffolding coming down the side of the building. So theyre going to pull them up. Melissa what does that say to you, tom . What they will probably do, make the second scaffolding adjacent to it. They will put the workers in the second scaffolding and get them out of there. And then they will try to secure the other scaffolding thereafter. Melissa what kind of a high wire trick is it to move from dangling scaffolding to the new one being sent down . Its a little bit of a manuever but, as i said, Emergency Service officers, who are the Specialized Police officers and the fire rescue officers, are trained in this. They do drills in how to do these type of rescues. So theyre very trained in it. Not only that, tom, these gentlemen stuck in, there would you say there are two of them, theyre trained in it. They dont go up there because they dont know how to manuever. That is the one, that is the one thing that is positive here. Theyre actually know what theyre doing, these guys. Melissa you make a great point. It is amazing we have send humannings into this condition. I would just say this . Melissa there is a not shot. What if youre looking at, that is the second scaffolding, fox has confirmed being lowered in order to rescue the first scaffolding which is dangling at about the 69th floor. It contains two window washers. It is hanging right now. They are stuck and trying to rescue these folks. Charlie, go ahead. And thats a very slow, gradual process to lower that scaffolding it is not something that were going to see solved in minutes. It is going to take a while. And remember, our Emergency Responders are risking their lives to go down to rescue these other people who are trapped. The point, and tom makes a great point this will go on for a couple hours. Take as while for that thing to come down. You know, i said this on the show. I dont know why we built that tower, it was symbol of defiance to the terrorist that we can rebuild. I just wonder why we need buildings this big . I, you know, you know, just personally, as someone who kind of lived through 9 11. If it wasnt for a doctors appointment and i was downtown. I wasnt far away from it i would being working right by the place. I worked at the World Financial Center across the street. I wonder why we need a building this big . Tom, what do you think . I think charlies right in the way that, you know, it was an act of defiance but i think that, in a free society we should be able to build any building we can and take every proper precaution to stop a terrorist attack. From someone right below the south tower when the second plane hit. Melissa go ahead, james. I wouldnt say the lesson is not necessarily to put height limits on buildings but it is reminder we enjoy the great symbol of our resilience i would call it and we enjoy this beautiful city, it comes at a cost and requires people to do melissa you dont have to visit there if you dont want to. Do we really need buildings . They would have tenants. Is it complete . Like i said my dad worked on trade center. Still a lost empty floors. Starting to fill up lately. Melissa one at a time. Before 9 11 you had some empty floors, maybe a lot of them. A lot of them in those towe a lot of them. I think market will eventually tell us that question. But i think, that obviously, it doesnt, the building does not have to be that tall for this to be very dangerous situation. Right. Rather than saying lets rethink cities and rethink building it is a moment to appreciate the work that they do. All that in, we were sort of going back and forth on unions. The, police, Government Employees are now rescuing them. Melissa somebody sent me, i dont know the source if the is bureau of labor statistics, new york, new york, yearly window washer pay statistic is 31,000 to 47,000. Not a lot of money. Melissa also hearing theyre cutting through the window right now as we speak. Theyre trying to cut through the windows. As you can see, they are cutting away the window. , in the lower portion of the scaffolding there and may decide that the scaffolding, being lowered is too slow a pros test. This is easier way to get them out. You can see it. I still think that we need to think why, rethink. Listen there are zoning order din nances. This is not purely the free market at work. There are zoning, you cant build a football stadium near a park or whatever. You can but there is zoning, im just saying, my point, why do we need would they even support it . I would urge people not to look at them victims at the moment. Although theyre in tough situation. People who like what they do, and it is important what [all talking at once] why do we need off . Why not 30 . A lot easier. From 30 . Still easier. Guaranty, being on top of the 15th story in the middle after 30story build something lot less dangerous than the. Theyre pulling this in. Melissa were watching as theyre pulling the window. They have cut through the window. Theyre making progress. Talk to us what is going on . What theyre doing theyre making sure theyre secure. They dont want to have anything happen between the window where they have broken it and scaffolding. Theyre slowly pulling each guy n they have to undo his heart harness once he is in. Just to bring it into terms. These guys are earning about 15, 16 an hour up. Amazing. Melissa wonder what is going through their mind right now . Theyre scared but theyre not scared to the point, listen, these guys are used to tremendous heights. They start at 102 and they worked their way down to the 80th floor so theyre not scared. And they do train for this. The scaffold and window washers. I do wonder if our viewers are giving any thought to the fact that these guys earn 15, as tom just said, 16 bucks an hour and yet have to listen to everybody complain about them being in the union . Well, not everybody complains. I clearly dont because my old man was one of those. Melissa you dont mow that everybody complains about them being in the union. Im not sure that is exactly fair statement. About public employees. Not about these guys. There is no debate about these guys. Actually there is a lot of debate about private unions and many people dont appreciate what private unions did in the past. There is different unionizing walmart workers and might get a paper cut and these guys. I hear that. Melissa i, back to charlies point about the tenants, this is conde nasts floor. Theyre the anchor tenant in this building. They put their names out there, kind of went in first where their employees started, their name has really been associated with those willing to go back in and be a part of this building charlie you point out, goes up in place of a building that came down as a target, always been a target. I think there is legitimate debate whether we need buildings this big and this tall. What is the utility for them . Is there really market demand for them . Are the safety hazards, do they outweigh the benefits . I dont know what the benefits are, other than saying well build another building that big and melissa tom, talk for a second. Let me just tell you one thing. Falling from a 30 Story Building or 69 floors is not a good fall. So either way, if we have a 30Story Building, i dont think that is the debate. But, tom, say they were on the 15th story. Im not saying falling. It is an easier extraction of these guys, when it gets higher up, you know that. It is same honestly, 30 floors, 60 floors, 80 floors, same extraction. But what youre seeing here somebody is going inside. Taking the guys one by one. Youre seeing there are ropes to the roof. Window washer safety ropes to the roof. If the scaffolding had totally given they still would be hanging there. Melissa seems like we saw one of the workers go off the scaffolding. Did he get all the way inside . Looks like theyre unharnessing him. Right inside, the rope has so much leeway and so much gap in it, once you get them in you have to unharness them or cut it. Melissa i cant imagine what the suction like at that level. That is why, but that is why it is more dangerous the higher you go. Higher you go. That is true. Tom, how often does Something Like this happen do you think . This high up very rarely but there have been other cases. I know that responded to one years ago on 67th and 2nd where one of the guys was not harnessed properly and did lose his life. The other guy was rescued. It happens, it doesnt happen as often you would think. Melissa is there another way to wash these windows . I think these guys would be furious. With a canopy but they would lose their jobs. Melissa they would be furious if they heard us saying that as they risk their lives looking to replace them with somebody not a human being. Rethink why we need buildings. Just listen from target. This is dramatic incident. You dont rethink design of cities. There are various for reasons, people in centuries gathered. Why do we need 60 stories not even filled. Melissa guys, lets, all right. Fox businesss adam shapiro is on the scene right now. Adam, are you there . What do you see . Hey, melissa. Were over by the memorial area now that this has all opened up. You can see the scaffolding quite clearly, on the south side of the buildings. Were on the south side obviously of lower manhattan. Think producer was saying from the helicopter shot, you can see the scaffold cleaners were being rescued. Someone earlier mentioned this kind of thing being a rare event. I remember covering one of these in twix at the hirsch build 2006 not far from 21st century fox headquarters. This happens from time to time. There are tourists from all over the world who come to this part of manhattan to take in the area. This is very calm. They closed off the memorial area where you can get. That has yellow tape up to keep people back. Melissa what does it look like from the ground . From the ground it looks very frightening if you happen to be one of two people on scaffolding. Everybody is very calm. Yellow tape around entire Memorial Plaza to keep people away. Looks as if they have access to one World Trade Center still open so you can get in and out of the building but on this Southern Side you dont get near it. Melissa obviously will be really windy at that height. What is it like on the ground right now . Not too much after wind. Nice day, other than being overcast. Not too much wind. I dont know what the wind would be at 69th floor either. Melissa were getting word that the second window washer has now been rescued and gone in. You can see there just to the side of the scaffolding that its dangling, you can see where they cut that hole in the glass. That is where we saw the first and then the second window washer get off of that scaffolding and go inside. They have both been rescued at this point. Earlier they were lowering another scaffolding at the same time ostensibly to rescue them. That had to be backup plan as they were working on this idea of cutting the window and getting them inside. But what had to be really terrifying situation lyms like now is resolved. They just have to retract the scaffolding that is dangling right now. Is for sure a danger at that height should anything happen. What do you think, james . Kudos to the firstresponders who pulled this off basically well weave been talking for a few minutes. Very prompt and effective action im not sure if nypd or the fire department. Clearly, getting back to our government thing. Melissa yeah. Fire department, police, military, these institutions all seemed to work pretty well. May be a question for another day why other agencies cant work as well. Well it is new York City Police department which i grew up with a lot of cops and you know, theyre the besttrained. New Yor