Moment of, its a Movement Moment and the nation over these years has been reporter of movements and the change the deep transformational change movements can bring. Whether its 400000 people in the street, the climate march, whether its the immigrant rights movement, whether its fast food workers. You know, the student death strikes. These are movements we are in touch with. We conclude with John Elderfield and Peter Galassi about the paintings in the studio. Take on the art of the past and in the end, theres a great moment in the past which is probably never going to be surpassed. They really are things which people have to work against and learn from and you know. But it will never succeed if they simply try and repeat. So outcomes continue to change. Rose politics for the race of the presidency 2015 the history of the nations magazine and paintings and photographed in the studio. All that when we continue. Rose funding for charlie rose has been provided by rose additional funding provided by and by bloomberg, a provider of multimedia news and Information Services worldwide. Captioning sponsored by Rose Communications from our studios in new york city, this is charlie rose. Rose we begin this evening with politics, kentucky senator rand paul announced earlier today his decision to run for president in 2016. Hes the second republican candidate after texas senator ted cruz to officially center the race. Rand paul is the only libertarian to announce his candidacy. We come to take them back the special interests this more concerned with their personal welfare than the general welfare. The washington machine that gobbles up our freedoms and invades every new and cranny of our lives, must betoo often when republicans have won weve squandered our victory. By becoming part of the washington machine. Thats not who i am. Rose joining me now from louisville kentucky is Mark Halperin and john heilemann. Theyre the hosts of the show with all due respect. Let me begin with Mark Halperin. Tell me about the rand paul announcements and how hes get cannng the candidacy, mark. Theyre on the ohio river well choreographed event introduced by his wife who i think will become a very strong presence in this race kelly paul. He gave a speech which was basically his message, some of the recover edges shaped out in the socalled liberty awe jelled all his father ron pawld was in the area but the photographers could not capture two of them in the same shot. This is a guy who is not afraid, raised a lot of money and in iowa, hampshire and south care. He believes he can go buy the mantra that john and i created for him that says the Republican Partydskl÷ too small and the government is too big and that he will stand out appealing to new constituencies with a different kind of message than anybody else has. Its a bet and is premised on the notion that the rules of the nonnation fight will be different if theyre the same theyve been since reagan, he cant win, if the rules are different i think he will be a fine list in this contest. When ted cruz announced hes a republican obama, thats in the big stadium and gave a compelling speech. But therey,b lwith that which was ted cruz was, the way that obama won the name nation in 2008 was by appealing to not just democrats, not just the Democratic Base but independents and some republicans. Thats not what ted cruz is trying to do hes trying to get more of the same republicans. Rand paul has a more obamalike pitch in that he wants to appeal to young voters he wants to appeal to voters not taking part of the political process before. He wants to appeal to independents economy wants to appeal to some democrats. Rose and african americans. Yes. His criminal justice reform. He said today a really extraordinary thing. He said he wanted to repeal any law that had a disproportionate impact on minorities in terms of incarceration. Charlie thats most of the criminal justice, most of laws in the books have a disproportionate effect. Thats a rather striking thin to say. Will that help him win the republican nomination . Theres a lot of reasons to be skeptical about that but in a place like iowa where he starts with his fathers libertarian supporters, many of those people will stick with him. If nothing else he inherits the list of those supporters who his father got in 2012, 2008. He starts there and he can use those lists and look for like minded voters and go and preach this gospel that is very different from standard republicanism right now on foreign policy, on civil liberties, on a lot of issues. Very different. So he has a chance to make that pitch of expanding the universe. Rose hes having to back a little bit from the socalled isolationist position. Thats his biggest problem right now in the time of war the traditional republican strength and military assertiveness which have not been his calling card before, they are predominant in the party and hes trying to get to a little bit more conventional place. Rose is iowa crucial, because cruz has a claim in iowa and people say hell do good then you have reason paul. Its super important if you look at a guy like Jeb Bush Marco Rubio gets in the race those been big establishment. Walkers playing both sides but guys like bush and rubio are more established candidates. They will be stronger New Hampshire candidates than iowa candidates. If youre one of the other guys running in establishment bracket iowa becomes very important because youre going to have a harder time in New Hampshire. You have to put a win on the board and iowas a better opening for a ted cruz or rand paul or Mike Huckabee or santorum. They are the two past winners santorum and huckabee. There will be a big scrub trying to get through on theje9y establishment lane trying to chalk a win up on the hawkeye state. Rose weve had two announcements now, one ted cruz and rand paul. Paul is all weak not just one big e investment at liberty college. Whats his most impressive so far. Very difference kind of announcements. Include was very powerful rhetorically. He was in a giant room, he gave a great speech. The crowd was there by force. They were compelled, they were students who didnt come flock to that event. Cruz is great on stage and he got a nice bump in the poll. Paul is harder to judge because weve seen the first part of it the that was a smaller room but more enthusiastic room. Hes not a great orator. His ability to really command the stage he was not as potent as cruz was. But what hes trying to show with this multistate tour hes a big time operator. That he has an organization already in place or the nucleus of one in iowa, New Hampshire, South Carolina, other places. That demonstrates kind of organizational muscle. Again inherited from his father, not entirely but that is a different kind of strength hes displaying than the one ted cruz did at liberty. Rose is that what this race is b republicans on the right, conservatives, tea party want to see someone early on clear the fields so it can go oneonone because they believe that the establishment has each time won the nomination and each time lost. I think its a little more complicated than that. Theres no doubt that the antiestablishment part of the party does not want to see the establishment part of the party win. And they want as mark suggested at the very beginning of this interview, they want to show they are now the ascendant part of the Republican Party and they think another establishment numb near will not be a winner against Hillary Clinton that you have to run in a different way thinking that Hillary Clinton is the nominee. I dont think anybody has an assumption theres a clearing of the fields until we get to iowa, New Hampshire or South Carolina in that side of the party. The interesting thing is even in the establishment wing of party there are people who like jeb bush fine. But are really concerned about the notion that you would run a bush against a clinton and guy doing that you would forfeit the argument of we are new, we are the future. So there are people in this town who are on wall street. Jeb bush is great with money no doubt about it, but wall street big donors are looking at scott walker and writing him checks. There are people who will right checks for marco rubio. Hes posed to announce his canned deon monday. There are establishment players who are going to write checks for marco rubio. They are this quiet about jebhk3 bush in the party. What he has not done in the shock and awe period in in early roll out hes established that he is in it to win it and hes going to raise a ton of morning and those things matter a lot. But he hasnt cleared the field. Rose he cant clear the field this early. There are people who thought if he raised a hundred Million Dollars in the First Quarter that someone like marco rubio wouldnt run against them for instance. There would be in the establishment side that people would say whoa bush has already too much Institutional Support ill step back not that he on clear the whole field no. One is running scared of jeb bush right now. Theyre looking at the poll numbers and they see he has real problems on immigration, he has real problems on common core, has real problems with large segments of the republican electorate. No one right now is running scared of jeb bush. Even though he looks very strong. No one thinks he looks unstoppable. Rose whats the latest on the Hillary Clinton campaign . Well it would seem as you know charlie, 245e Just Announced the other day look out a lease on a place in brooklyn for her camp headquarters. Rose what was behind that decision. I think its simple enough, shes from new york now, right and shes not going, shes going to run this campaign out of new york that was clear. And i think there are some who say that she wanted the hip, youthful cool brooklyn speaking of somebody who lives in brooklyn. I have spent some time in brooklyn heights. Its like the upper east side. Theres nothing behind or cool about brooklyn heights. Its a perfectly nice neighborhood but there are no arches or pickle makers there. A lot of people working on her complain will end up living in brooklyn. Its easy in terms of access to the airport. Thats important. I think its about more about that stuff. Rose when will she announce. Were going to see it it has been reported by others that word has gone out it will be quote anyway day. But i would÷ say that sunday this coming sunday or a few days, within a few days after that would be the likeliest. Rose within a week. Within a week. Rose thank you for coming. Always. Rose back in a moment. Stay with us. Rose this year marx the 150th anniversary of the nation magazine. It was founded by a group of young abolitionists in 1865. Its focus on issues such as civil rights, income inequality and Corporate Power has made it a leader of the american left. Katrina vanden heuvel had been the magazines editor for 20 years. She started there as an intern. Im pleased to have her back at this table. What has it meant to you, the nation. The nation has meant, the nation was where i learned about journal subpoena where journalism, it was a boot camp it was a school what you dont learn in a university. Its a a an america that you dont learn about in school but a sense of coming in at age 19 and there was the great andy copkind, Christopher Hitchens had just arrived from london in an exchange. The Pulitzer Prize winning, christopher came to the office. And there was just a lot of whirling discussion and argument. And it was a place where you learned about debate, civil, uncivil. And you learned about dissent and you learned about rebellious voices. It was a space, literally a physical space for such. For three thinkers for dissenters and then of course the pages were spilled over edited and thought through. It was a great school and much more it was fun exciting literary political place. You talked about civilyou talked about Corporate Power. But it has a great literary tradition too which one was steeped in it with betsy and the literary editor taking on norman mailer. Rose james you learned when you got there i think is also that you know, William Faulkner when we get it right the past is not dead its not even past. But i mean you learned about a James Baldwin. Youd go back into the archives. Now theyre digitized but literally the volumes. And youd read a James Baldwin from 1966 in the special issue. Report from occupied territory harlem. He writes about stop and for example charlie. You think today as i work with youngerdof turbulence around black life matter and any Racial Justice movement, there are younger writers going back into those archives digitally now but learning so much from a an extraordinary writer like james ball win who by the was on our Editorial Board and wrote his first view. A review of maxine gore key. Rose you mentioned Martin Luther king jr. He wrote an essay on the Civil Rights Movement in 1961 and 1966. In his issue we have his last report where he begins to talk about economic justice. He was some of the great editor. Rose which is where he was. When he was in memphis in 1968, he was speaking to the garbage collectors. It wasnt just in the pages in 1967, two monthsuccy o before king gave his famous Riverside Church speech coming out against vietnam. At a nation event in los angeles in february 1967 first came out against the war. And ill tell you charlie as we near the 50th anniversary as we do of the sending of american troops to vietnam 50 years, the nation, and this is what i also learned at the nation and not to be afraid of it that heretical ideas in one moment can be common sense a generation later. In 1954 bernard the great historian of vietnam wrote in the pages to the nation maybe a negotiated solution would be better than a military intervention. Rose this is 150th anniversary publication. Nearly two years in the works. My co editor, the great journalist who was the nations washington correspondent for a few years 30s and 40s has a piece in there. We spent almost two years. Izzy stone a great journalism who understood maybe its better not to go to too many dinner parties, sit with them and understand that governments, they often lie. We didnt do an anthology. A lot of places might have done an anthology. We did one for the 100th, 105th. This has great archival material. Rose you quote the first woman editor of the nationfrieda should be approached that means you would be stuck in the past. What we want to do at this moment is say we are here were present we have survived and survival in this media rose its hard to survive in a there are Different Reasons for survival. I suggest one is independence, not only independence of thought but independence of ownership. Our backers have cared more about what we stood for than what we made. Though were always happy to bring in partners. We have an interesting financial. Rose was paul newman part of that. Paul newman was a partner. We have a number of partners but we have a great circle of one hundred that gives each year. Those that give small amounts each here, 2530 of our subscribers give 25, 50 a hundred dollars. Theres a sense of community. Rose youre planning a new website. Part of the future. I mean youve had different editors here, charlie. I mean, were all, the old order is changing. I think were in a revolutionary transitional time. So you have to have a foot in different places but right now were read by 500,000 people each week on all kinds of tablets and platforms. On the actual birthday of the nation when these young abolitionists launched the nation july 6 1965, we launched a site which i think is going to be intelligent nimble, innovative and for younger years. Rose i want to use two clips before we start. First is by our great friend calvin, this is in 2003 on his view of the magazine. Here it is. You write for the nation magazine too. Absolutely. Rose are your politics right there with them. They always accuse me in the9o nation of being insufficiently political. Letting the agony of the voice dim from my memory. And i did say once on a television show. I said i was in boston once with a book of nation columns and the guy said well how would you describe the nation magazine. And i said pinko. I would say its a pinko magazine. Well surely you have more to say about it than that. I said yes its a pinko magazine printed on very cheap paper that is a sort of magazine that if you have a piece in the magazine, the copysf;nm a lot better than the original. Rose are your politics and the nation i mean is that where you are on the political spectrum . Your is your politics none of my business. No, theyre certainly your business. I agree more with the nation than i do with the national review. I love bud. To go cruising with blood and he writes in the issue. He writes about going cruising. Rose you were struck by the continuing conversations of so many of the contributors. They stay as part of the conversation. Stay as part of the conversation. You know to go from bud to this but to be, you know. One of the great animating impulses and principles of the nation has been anti imperialism. Opposition to wreckless wars. Spanish american war. Vietnam war. Into iraq. And i speak about you know in iraq because i was editor then and you had rose both iraq wars. Im thinking 2002. And you had a great correspondent or2f peace correspondent jonathan shallom and continuing series of a continuing conversation if i recall. But i think that was a defining moment and it was not a popular. Listen the nation is not a popular organ often because remember that many of the liberal, much of the liberal media decided to go along with the war, the run up to the war 2002. An