Police face, something we should be thinking about, but what we rarely talk about is the danger that is involved in being on the other end of that interaction with the police, and thats not going to happen, at least not for a really long time right now. Obrien we continue with my colleague from the pbs newshour Hari Sreenivasan. This is a department thats been working on this, they didnt have that great of track record. Per capita, it was worse than a lot of other major cities, but really in the past five or six years they have done as Much Community policing as possible and made measurable gains. Decreased Excessive Force, overall arrests and most importantly officerinvolved shootings. Obrien we conclude with the remembrance of elie wiesel. Ththe Nobel Laureate died satury at age 87. We didnt know about auschwitz. To me, that is the greatest mystery and pain, by the way, that people i admired like roosevelt and churchill, they knew, but we didnt. 1944, a if few weeks before d day. We could have run into the forest and find a hiding place with our maid, a marvelous christian lady, a housekeeper, a maid. But we didnt know. If we had, half of my town, maybe more, would have survived. Obrien dan balz, jelani cobb and Hari Sreenivasan on the three days of violence and remembering elie wiesel, when we continue. Rose funding for charlie rose has been provided by the following and by bloomberg, a provider of multimedia news and Information Services worldwide. Captioning sponsored by Rose Communications from our studios in new york city, this is charlie rose. Obrien turning now to politics. Hillary Clintons Campaign had hoped that the f. B. I. s decision not to recommend prosecutions would have closed the book on her use of a private email server. It may have opened a new chapter instead. The state department has reopened its investigation, and a new round of congressional hearings began thursday with f. B. I. Director james comey. Dan balz has more. He joins me from the offices of the Washington Post where he is the papers chief correspondent. Dan, good to have you. Thank you, miles. Good to be with you. Obrien director comey testifying on the hill. How did it play . Well, it didnt play very well for secretary clinton, thats for sure. Director comey got a series of very tough questions from reps about how he could square the description of what happened with his ultimate decision not to recommend prosecution, and i think there were some telling moments in that, but i think, overall, it was simply a reminder, as you suggested, that this is an issue that is going to be with us and certainly with secretary clinton through duration of this campaign. In no way did the lack of prosecution close the books on this episode. Obrien director comey was speaking in the language of the law, and, of course, politicians being politicians were speaking politics. One of the members of Congress Said if the average joe had done what Hillary Clinton did, he or she would be le lead off in d off in handcuffs. Mr. Comey said, no. Walk us through that, if you would. What i think he was trying to say is if you look at the totality of what she did and the question of whether there was willful or malicious intent, that there is no press department for pros precedent for prosecuting her under the statute as he examined them, and as he examined similar cases and outcomes, there were nothing to suggest that she could or should be prosecuted under. This i thought one of the interesting foments, frankly, is when he was asked and did compare this to what happened with general petraeus and outlined a series of things general petraeus had done in which he deliberately handed over classified material to his paramour and biographer and knew this was classified and knew what he was doing was wrong and, at another point, lied to the government about it, and he said that this was different than what secretary clinton had done. Now, he also made clear that many of the things or some of the things, at least, that secretary clinton has said over the course of the last year and some months were not accurate statements about her use of the private server or whether she had engaged in moving classified material back and forth with her advisor. So it was classic kind of jim comey. I mean, hes an independentminded official and Public Servant with high respect on both sides of the aisle, and he steered a careful course through all of the mind fields that were mine fieldsate laid out in front of him during that hearing. Obrien so people are clear on this, as i understand it, she had to know that what she did was against the law, breaking the law and, in this case, i guess, ignorance of the law is a defense . Obrien well, i guess it is certainly a partial defense and enough, certainly, that the f. B. I. Director and the career prosecutors who led this investigation, as he said, came to the unanimous conclusion that no reasonable prosecutor would take this case forward and, as we know, the attorney general, loretta lynch, had already in advance of what jim comey had to say, had taken herself effectively out of the decisionmaking process because well, she announced it after her illfated meeting with bill clinton on the tarmac in phoenix, but she said she had made that decision some time ago. So this ultimately was one that was all in the hands to have the career pros hands of the career prosecutors and jim comey. Obrien to be clear, there is little doubt at this juncture that classified material was emailed through that server. Thats a fact, right . That is a clear fact, yes. Some that was top secret, some that was secret, and some that was coffi coffin confidential. Obrien how does this play in the court of Public Opinion . Partisan decisions will determine a lot about how people respond to this, but i think there is, as the republicans put forward in the session with director comey and also many of the things they had to say outside that arena that there is a belief that in one way or another justice was not being done in this case that she got special treatment. The director said that was certainly not the case, but i think the average person or certainly the average person who is not a fan of Hillary Clintons will believe that, in one way or another, that she did get special treatment, that she, in one way or another, was above the law. Jim comey went to some lenghts to try to knock that down, but i dont think he will change a lot of minds on that of people who came into this with a feeling that this was kind of an inside deal from start to finish. Obrien so, and, of course, donald trump tweeting who he frequently calls her crooked Hillary Clinton, now shes lying crooked Hillary Clinton, instantly this gets injected into the political discourse and in some sense the facts kind of get lost, dont they . Oh, the facts certainly will get lost. But this was an issue that was bound to be a centerpiece of Donald Trumps campaign, no matter how the f. B. I. Came out in its judgment on what should be done in terms of prosecuting secretary clinton. I had a conversation quite a while ago with an official in the trump campaign, and we were talking about this. Their conclusion from the start was that this was, in many ways, a winwin for trump and his campaign. First win would be if she had been prosecuted, which would have potentially cost her the nomination, but even in the absence of that, their view was they could easily describe this as a whitewash and what donald trump had to say coming out of the decisionmaking by the f. B. I. Was very much in keeping with that and he will continue to press that. People have been arguing about the facts of this case, they will be arguing about the conclusions of the f. B. I. Between now and election day without any let up. Obrien so Bernie Sanders said it last winter, i i guess it was, are people tired of hearing about Hillary Clintons damn emails . Well, some people are and some people arent, but i think that that reflects the Deeper Division we have in our politics right now. You know, its not just Hillary Clintons emails, its a variety of things in which people come to conclusions in part on the basis of where their partisan leanings stand. This is one example of this. This is a very high profile example of this. This is a very controversial example of this, but it is not a singular example of it, and i think we will see that in a variety of ways as we go forward in the campaign, miles. Obrien lets look ahead just a moment and see how much more we will be hearing about the emails. Members of congress to ask director comey to launch an investigation as to whether Hillary Clinton might have lied to congress, and then there is this that the state department announced it would begin its investigation now which waited for all of this to transpire. What shoes are we going to see dropping, do you think . Well, it is possible that, with a referral from congress, there will be an investigation into whether what Hillary Clinton testified to during the benghazi hearings when she was under oath last fall is contradicted by the evidence. The director said they had not looked at that, that they had not had a referral from congress, and the chairman of the Committee Said you will get a referral very quickly. So that will be one possible avenue of continuation of this. The second is what the state department is going to begin to do. One thing we know, and director comey said this any number of times in any number of ways, that not just secretary clinton but others who were handling this classified material in an unclassified environment on the private server could have their security clearances reviewed, and these are senior advisors to Hillary Clinton. If their clearances are, you know, eliminated, that puts them in a totally different situation in their ability to advise her, not simply during the campaign, but if she were to become president and she wanted them around her as senior advisors at the white house or the state department or wherever. So there is potential consequence yet to happen on this. Paul ryan, speaker of the house, said she should not get classified briefings as a candidate because of this. I doubt that will happen, but, nonetheless, you can see where kind of the drum beat, particularly from republicans, is going to increase over that there should be some kind of penalty to those who have been found to be engaging in this, as comby said comey said, extremely careless handling of the material. Obrien i want to put you in the role as advisor to Hillary Clinton. What would you tell her to get out in front of this . Well, i think her sense is this is going to be an issue no matter what she says. She has been grudging at best in coming forward with information throughout this process. She has only done it when it has been, in a sense, politically necessary. I remember last late last summer when the email issue was clearly hurting her in the campaign, she finally began to talk about it and to talk about it in a more contrite way. But it has been remarkable that she has really had nothing to say about this. It seemingly demands some answers from her. She has nod had a formal press conference in months and months and months. She has done individual interviews on television, certainly, but not done a General Press conference. Shes going to have to answer a lot of questions about this, no doubt about that. Obrien this controversy is like my email box, keeps filling up. Dan balz, the Washington Post, thank you for your time. Youre welcome. Thank you, miles. Obrien the dallas protest is one of several nationwide that had been called following the shooting deaths this week of alton sterling and Philando Castile. The men, both black, were killed by police in separate incidents that were both caught on camera. With me is jelani cobb of the new yorker magazine to talk about. This such a horrifying week, its hard to put words to it. Youve attempted. You talk about the layer cake of horrible issues that is involved in this, and the first one that comes to mind, of course, is race. And, you know, the governor of minnesota said it wouldnt have happened if that had been a white person in that car. Do you believe that . Oh, yeah, i do. Or at least its far less likely to have happened. One of the things that happens with Police Shootings in this country is we have a large number of them, disproportionate number of them that affect people of color but, in the aggregate, the majority of people shot fatally by police each year are white. So it means we have a twofold problem. One is that there is a great deal of Police Shootings that happen in the country, and a disproportionate number of them that happen with communities of color and people of color, but even we took all the africanamericans and latinos out of that equation, for the total number of Police Shootings, we would still have violence happening at rates that would horrify most western democracies. In the short term, its much more likely that the person this happens when theres a person of color in that vehicle. Obrien you mentioned the word horrified because it is horrifying what weve witnessed and yet it goes on. Theres a sense of inertia here, i think. How can we possibly at this point start working toward some kind of solution, a dialogue, a conversation . You wrote about that, that idea of initiating a conversation. Where does that conversation begin . I think were having conversations. Seems to me thats all were doing is having conversations. But thered been an attempt, i think, to create some kind of groundswell for reform around guns or to have reform around Police Training or these sorts of things. Now it seems, of course, in the wake of what happened in dallas that that conversation will change dramatically and drastically. Obrien how much does dallas change the whole equation . Black lives matter is a movement. I think we can say that up to this point. Does that stop it . I think dallas is catastrophic, and for lots of reasons, and certainly for people who are interested in having a conversation around police accountability, it becomes infinitely more difficult to have that conversation because now were much more inclined to think about the Dangers Police face, something we should be thinking about, but what we rarely talk about is the danger that is involved in being on the other end of that interaction with the police, and thats not going to happen, at least not for a really long time right now. Obrien by all accounts, Dallas Police, we are told, were judicious in their use of force, racially sensitive, all the things we would hope to expect out of a bigcity police department. Theres a bit of irony here. There is. Actually, there are two ironies. When we look at the Philando Castile situation in minnesota, he did what a motorist is supposed to do, he followed the best protocol, the best practices. When hes pulled over, he tells the person he has a license, a firearm in the car and is licensed to carry it, and from what we know right now, it culminates in him being shot fatally. Obrien which compounds the horror. Right. Obrien he was doing textbook. Doing the right thing. On the other hand, hearing from people during the march yesterday before the shooting broke out, people were saying there was a very heavy police presence, but there was a pretty good rapport between the demonstrators and police and it seemed to be calm, not a great deal of tension. In both cases, you see people following what might be the best practice force this and still wind up with the worst case scenario. Obrien so do we begin with guns, with retraining police, do we begin with condemnations of violence . None of it seems to work. It doesnt. But heres the interesting kind of commonality. When we were looking at what happened in baton rouge with alton sterling, who was shot fatally by a Police Officer, possibly shot by two officers, on tuesday, and then looking at the situation with Philando Castile in minnesota and ten looking at the situation in dallas, the Common Thread here is guns. One, when police talk about the dangers implies it in their work, theyre talking about dealing with a very heavilyarmed public. And when people say, well, this person overreacted or is antsy, the fact is they are confronting realities in which theyre much more likely to be dealing with an armed person than their counterpart in most other western countries and, on the other side of it, if were going to have a second amendment, this is almost an object lesson in its inapplicablability to other communities, wherein the idea that a person has a weapon generates a, you know, fatal response from Law Enforcement, this is not i think it points us in the direction saying we need to have meaningful reform in our relationship with weapons. One other point that ill say about this is, if this is correct, that there is one shooter that was involved in dallas, then we have to ask ourselves, is it reasonable for the average citizen to have access to a firearm that can hit 12 Police Officers, the 12 trained Law Enforcement officers before they have a chance to respond. Obrien its a difficult question given the constitutional protections, and ive got to say, we talk about a groundswell, you can pull people and there is a willingness to change the status quo when it comes to guns, but we dont see anything like that in congress. We dont. We saw just before the fourth of july vacation that, you know, there