About immigrants. As they say to provide tonally sensitive messaging points to those members of the grand old party who just havent evolved disgurively on immigration. Some of the dos and donts are dont use phrases like illegals or aliens and never say anchorbaby. Instead, why not use undocumented immigrant when referring to those who are here without, well, documentation. And when addressing border security, dont ever say send them all back or electric fence. How about the enforcement of our borders. The hln is a group devoted the bringing more voters into the gop, is highlighting that the president broke his promise on the Immigration Reform in the first term, but they caution not to focus on amnesty, and to avoid at all costs president reagans Immigration Reform as an example that applies today, so it got me wondering when i heard senator john mccain getting straight to the point this week. How do you convince the republicans about the path to citizenship . Well, look, i will give you a little straight talk. Look at the last election. Look at the last election. We are losing dramatically the hispanic vote. So did senator mccain get the same memo . Maybe he got the other memo, the one that sold all of the congressional memos to get with comprehensive immigration program. Because language does matter and shift in immigration debate is one that we have all been long calling for and one that channels the speech for the real people about whom this political debate is about. Seems that the republicans got one more memo since the 2012 election. There has not been just a change in speech happening. Remember when was this acceptable speech coming from the senators two years ago . One of the issues that is often talked about, but never seriously discussed is the practice of allowing people to come here illegally and having a child and the child automatically given american citizenship. We need to look at that in the future as to whether or not we want to change that, because i believe it is a incentive to change the wave of the future and i dont want the third wave of Illegal Immigrants coming here. And from the illegals and the anchor babies, and senator graham coming in the gang of eight, and graham says, this is time to get it done. A press release this week quotes him enthusiastically saying that i do believe that 2013 presents the best chance to pass Immigration Reform. These days, everybody has a come p prehennive proposal to offer. I wonder if the bipartisan folks in the house and the senate got the memo, the one with these numbers, 27 and 2. A policy wonk reminds us, 27 is the share the democrats picked up, and 2 is the electorate projected to vote for the republicans. If you see it as an electorate as a voting bloc, and you want to take back the white house, the fight is now. And no fight preceded in the years starting with victory. The civil rights struggle did not start in the 1950s, because the africanamericans had been demanding representation in the 1580s. And women did not just decide to fight for voting rights. The leaps in the country have been made since the founding of fighting for the safe and the legal status, and the frpressur from the dreamers and others have trodden the Political Landscape this time. As the president said in nevada tuesday when unveiling the Immigration Reform proposal, the time has come. With me is aisha moody hills from american progress, and immigration attorney and former federal prosecutor michael wilds, and christina jimenez, managing director of the united we dream network and Media Consultant john riley, a democratic strategist, and in tucson, arizona, democratic congressman raoul jimenez. Thank you. I would like to start with why are we coming to a consensus, when we have seen a wedge . I believe that the opportunity to do Immigration Reform at a level that is lasting and good for the nation has taken that momentum building in communities and churches and i think that the dreamers crystallized that for all of the nation politically and much credit to this dialogue we are having right now goes to the students and the young people. And the election and the beating of the republicans in the last election in the latino and the Asian Community as well is the barometer of the future. They know it. So whether it is by heart felt instinct that my republican colleagues are coming to the issue of comprehensive Immigration Reform or expediency, and political expediency, i dont really care. This is a chance to do something that is right. It is a Long Time Coming and much sacrifice and frustration and heartache in the communities and immigration is not the only issue for latinos, but it became the moral compass in this last election. And congressman, you make such a good point that i want to turn to you, michael, on, and it is a point that the president has said not to allow the perfect to be the enemy of the good and perfect motivations may not matter, and yet, i worry, michael, as a Immigration Lawyer and secondgeneration one in fact, you know what this looks like in the nuts and the bolts of peoples lives and when you look at the policy proposals, what do you think that the president is proposing and for example marco rubio is presenting . Well, thank you so much for having me and you spoke to eloquently. With 270 immigration judges, and there are not enough handcuffs and beds and prisons to detain 11 million people. We cannot afford do it, and maybe political expediency to bring us to the table right now, and the republicans can try to take credit and the democrats can say it is in our dna, but the bottom line is that the lady of liberty has seen justice for blacks and gays and so many others. And they have to say Border Patrol first and then deal with the 11 million second, no, we cant do that. We have more drones and fences and news flash, who is going to actually build that fence if it is not going to be in the republicans may not want to the undocumented immigrants. And may not want to call them aliens or undocumented, but they are workers. So to the suburban hands in the nation, we need help, and the greatest entrepreneurs of the nations history have always been immigrants. Yes, it is interesting bark was you have two ways to hear the frame. On the one hand the congressman was saying thank you to the dreerms and the young people who managed to shift the discourse in dialogue, and what happens when the dreamers become the face of Immigration Reform is that it no longer feels like the face of immigration is the lowwage worker and those are in fact the most vulnerable people, and how do we keep immigration in the forefront as we talk about these policies . Thank you for having me on the show. This is not only about the dreamers, and it is helpful to keep in mind that what the dreamers did successfully by coming out and sharing the stories and saying that we are undocumented an unafraid, because this is what we learned in school. That is what we learned about the values of america, freedom of speech, and freedom of dreams, and dreamers are parts of family, and they were brave enough to seek a better life come t coming to the country, and that is what it comes to that we are fighting for. When it comes the sharing the stories, part of the work as the organizers and the foot soldiers as you refer to the organizers is sharing the stories of the families and our parents, because it is those stories that need to be reflective of the policy debate that we are having about Immigration Reform, and it is not only about the students. It is about families, and it is about people. And it is interestingly not about republicans. Gentlemen, i want you to listen to this as a piece from Rush Limbaugh and marco rubio and the fact that they are on together is fascinating. What you are doing is noteworthy and fascinating that you are trumpeting reality and shout i shouting i. Is that guy good or what, folks . Marco rubio. And so congressman, you know, here we have limbaugh who is cheering on marco rubio for Immigration Reform. Am i in the Twilight Zone . No, but you have seen the raw and the most offensive form of expediency that you will see for a long time. But i believe that the key to that and in mr. Rubios proposals and the senators came up with the skeleton and the flesh needs to be put together, and the family uniication has to be central to this. The issue of the road map for citizenship, and what does it look like, because the proposal is to create a road map and limit the number of resources to unify families, it is a selfdefeating proposition. You know, the issue of security, and the president was right, those cannot be tethered together. They have to be separate. Before we talk about layering more money, and more detentions, and more and more, lets look at the efficiency and the use of the 18 billion a year enforcement in the southern bord border, and lets look at that before theres a kneejeshgs reaction to say, put security front and center again, and that is all we have had for the last ten years, and not do the human humane side of the equation. John, i want to bring you in on this side, because it feels like two discourse, and on one hand, you have hln saying dont use language like anchor babies and illegal, and yet the president is saying it is a fundamental part of the discour discourse. Well, we should not have exuberance on this issue, because when the debate came in the republicans were saying unifying things, and this is going to be a tough battle. When you think of what is happening in america whether it is at the state level or the federal level and when it comes to whether the republicans will work with anybody, look at what the tea party value, and that is what we will have and think of the angriest and the whitest and the oldest men in america, and where they are, and they are not good on immigration. I have done some, and been in on some research recently, where we were talking about the medicaid and the Government Programs and when you talk about how people view these things, a lot of what was coming out was especially from white voters and men is that they are defining immigrants as part of the problem. I love the talk right now, and we will have serious cross fire when we get into the details. Take wit a grain of suspic n suspicion. Thank you to congressman grijalva from arizona, and thank you for weighing n. When we come back, i want to talk about the defl in the details, and aisha, i want to come to you, and also, we have the conservative viewpoint of reform coming up. I have low testosterone. There, i said it. How did i know . Well, i didnt really. See, i figured low testosterone would decrease my sex drive. But when i started losing energy and became moody. Thats when i had an honest conversation with my doctor. We discussed all the symptoms. Then he gave me some blood tests. Showed it was low t. Thats it. It was a number not just me. [ male announcer ] today, men with low t have androgel 1. 62 testosterone gel . The 1 prescribed topical testosterone replacement therapy, increases testosterone when used daily. Women and children should avoid contact with application sites. 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Change your number. Turn it up. Androgel 1. 62 . Get the blood tests. Change your number. Turn it up. Capella university understands bright students are getting lost in the shuffle. Need. And administrations work gets more complex every year. When you look at these issues, do you see problems or opportunities . With an advanced degree in education from capella university, youll have the knowledge to meet these challenges and make a difference in the lives of students. Lets get started at capella. Edu. Even as it seems that Many Republican politicians are johnny come latelies to the issue of Immigration Reform, there are conservative advocates on this issue for some time and most notably former governor of florida jeb bush has been pushing the party to more warmly embrace the latino electorate. Next month, former governor bush and his partner at the Goldwater Institute will release their book immigration wars, forging an american solution and last week they penned an oped in the wall street journal, that in some conservative circles the word comprehensive Immigration Reform is an epitheta code word for amnesty. People who have such declaration s when associated with the border states are moving toward something more. Go and now the author is joining us. Thank you for having me. You have said that the legislation act since 1952 has not held up well and in short, we need to start from scratch. So how realistic to make policy from the groundup . Well, it is super important the do that, because americas realities in the 2013 are so different than when the law was passed 60 years ago. First of all, we need immigrants more than ever, but we have a system that does, that has extensive family preferences that include parents and siblings that crowd out workbased immigrants both on the high skill side and on the lower skill side. That is the sort of thing that we need to grapple with as we move forward, but we do think that the best way of preventing ilLegal Immigration is to have a workable Legal Immigration system, and we havent had that for a very long time. All right. Part of it is about raising the caps and those other sorts of things, and aisha, it feels like the devil is in the details here, and we have been hearing comprehensive Immigration Reform and seeing the bipartisanship, and still we have a premium on border security, and on both sides, and we have the fact that the path to citizenship is contingent on fines, and english languages and classes and getting to the back of the line and still feels like to me there is a preference for a certain kind of immigration here. And yes, it brings up class issue, and first of all, anybody who would suggest that we are not enforcing the border is woefully ignorant. 85 of the border is secure, and the parts that are not are inhabitable and it would be so much to maintain that portion would be economically nonviable. Anybody who sayings we have anything else is kicking the ball on the court. And if you say, that you can be on the path of citizenship if you pay all of the back taxes that you have and pay a fine and we are talking about folks who are coming here and making the meager earnings, and how long does it take them to pay it all back before they can become citizens. Michael, you made an economic argument about the cost of detaining and the cost of deporting and the cost of all of this, but i keep thinking about the cost of getting on that path to citizenship for ordinary immigrants here. All year long, we have the stories of the people coming into the offices. The filing fees are prohibitive to everybody introduced to the new gift. These people are putting food on the table, and they have the same challenges. President reagan in the 1980s changed the Immigration Law when he gave the nasty word amnesty out, and then he shifted the responsibility of policing immigration from government to employers, and the employers in a hard economy and generation now are being punished by the Obama Administration and the Justice Department and Homeland Security by not doing i9s and policing the immigration of their staff. The economics here are very harsh. What we should be doing is to remove the biblical straw and giving employers the staff and the resources that they need. Giving people a path legally in a earned legal since and financial fee they can afford, and yes paying taxes and ferr ferreting out all of the criminals. Im a former federal pros prosecutors, we do not want to create a place for people to boot strap themselves in on criminal grounds, but again, this will prevent deporting people to areas that should not be, and we cannot detain people here who are scholars, because the detention facilities are abominab abominable. Clint, i heard you say a couple of things that are surprising, well, a lot of things that are surprising, and the number one thing is that we need more workers, and we are hearing of a xhiblg crisis and surplus of workers and that is part of the reason why immigration is down overall, but secondly, as i talk to michael about the resources that we will need to make any of the groundup policies work, that sounds to me potentially like big government. Can we get the republicans on board give ten two realities . Well, first of all we theneeo look at the bipartisan plan is not just for the labor unions, because on the left they are sounding the alarm that we are going to be allowing too many immigrants in, so this is an issue with many dimensions to it, but right now, we are not producing through births enough new americans to keep our population as it is right now, and we are about to have a massive number of people beginning to retiring, and we need productive workers to fill those spots and to sustain our economy and social welfare system. This is something that is missing from the debate, because with we need productive workers and the only place to get them right now