Exploring issues that affect leaders in the U. S. And around the globe. Okay, this person is trying to move a conversation in this direction for this purpose. So it seems a little obscure, i dont understand where are theyre trying to go. Is it a pr strategy or is it a legal strategy . Is he a lawyer or a spokesman we have michael avenatti, lanny davis and Rudy Giuliani out there just talking away. I dont think any of them are actually coming up with a cohesive legal strategy for what they need to do because they want to win the pr battle. Lan ny is not allowed to talk. Whatever were talking about now, i have a feeling Robert Mueller has already been over that. But Rudy Giuliani is acting like a squirming coil an going all over the place. Hes saying donald trump never hacked the dnc. No one ever claimed that. Hes also saying that donald trump Didnt Attending T the me with russians. Take a listen to what else he said. This russian meeting, he wasnt there. He wasnt at the meeting. He did not participate in any meeting about the Russia Transaction. The president. The president did not. What Russia Transaction . No one ever alleged any of the things hes talking about. No, but is there a transaction . Is there now a transaction . The whole campaign, you know that, this is just donald trump via channeling through Rudy Giuliani. But doesnt this make it so that the Senate Judiciary committee or the Senate Intel Committee will have more reason to say, you know what, ive got to get all these people pack in front of us and only extend the investigation and the news around the investigation within the senate. Slow things up for the rest of the legislative season . I dont think so. No . Feinstein wants to see him, don junior. They dont have the majority and so dont set the rules. I think republicans think we need to just move on from this because this is what weve been doing for almost two years now. So i dont think this sparks some sort of new but when the pressure starts to build and its out there, out there, out there, and theres denials and contradictions, its hard but the senate has been so respected in how its handled it. The house has been a mess. Im not talking about the house. Im talking about the senate. It hasnt seemed to be as partisan as the house has. Wouldnt you think if contradictions keep coming up and there are real questions about who said what and who may have been lying, at some point theyll be pushed to ask more . I think they can say we want to wait until we see what the findings of Robert Mueller is. They also have a responsibility to we need to know all of the facts around the collusion or potential collusion and what the russians did and who helped them because there
wasnt Voter Targeting or targeting without some of that data potentially. So i think that its an all connected story where the senate does have a role and they have a responsibility and obligation to the American Public to ensure integrity in our elections. I agree with both of you which is going to be hard because youre saying contradictory things. I think they are connected stories and they are connected questions, but the Senate Judiciary the investigative committees are going to say, listen, we went out to determine whether russia interfered in the 2016 election. They did. Weve said that. Its unambiguous. The Intelligence Community is unambiguous in its view that Russia Colluded in the election. Yes, all these figures are saying Different Things which is good because we have a federal investigation going by bob mueller and hes going to come to a conclusion of his own. Weve done what we wanted to do and determined russia had an influence. And if they bring in those other people people have compared this cyber attack to the attack of
9 11 and that was an independent commission which resulted in actual readout of actions that the government could take. But it couldnt potentially interfere and thats a difference between 9 11 and the commission they set up. This investigation right now, Robert Mueller, first of all, i think a lot of people in the senate both sides of the aisle want to see it come out. Second of all, if the Senate Starts doing other work that can potentially interfere with that investigation, thats problematic to the senate. Lets go back to Rudy Giuliani and denying things that nobody has alleged, and then also just contradicting himself in the span of a couple of hours. Listen to him first on cnn and then on fox talking about a Strategy Meeting that nobody had reported until today. Nobody has reported still in fact. There was a meeting two days before the meeting took place with donald junior, jared, manafort and two others, gates and one more person. And thats a real meeting. Youre saying that thats thats a real meeting on
another provable subject in which he did not participate. They were talking about the strategy of the meeting with the russians. The people in that meeting deny it. The people weve been tiebl interview. The people weve not been able to interview have never said that before b that meeting. So its a meeting two days before the Trump Tower Meeting with the russians and giuliani says that is a real meeting on another provable subject in which he would not participate, being the president. I guess hes saying its not a Strategy Meeting here but it is a real meeting. Here is what he told fox a couple of hours later. That meeting never, ever took place. It didnt happen. Its a figment of his imagination or his lying. The second meeting was brought to my attention through jay sekulow. Both of us dealt with it with two different reporters. Essentially the same information about this meeting that took place three days earlier with a whole group of people, every one of those people says it didnt
happen. So, jake, he says theres a real meeting on cnn and then a couple of hours later, four hours later, he says that meeting never took place. Is Rudy Giuliani whats he doing . Is he actually acting as the president s lawyer here or what is going on . Did somebody get to him and say, oh, wait, no, no, no, you misspoke or were not telling anyone about that yet . The person controlling the overall Communication Strategy is obviously the president. Theres no sort of infrastructure that would dictate anything else. So again, i go back to my original point, its not clear what his strategy is here. Its not clear what hes trying to do. Its difficult to discern what his motives are. If people are confused, is giuliani winning . Yes. Yes. I do think so. Its just adding more uncertainty into the situation. It muddies the waters and thats his goal. But to your original question about did he get a message saying that he made a mistake . I think so, because two days before the June 9th Meeting is
the day donald trump stood there and said hes going to have dirt on Hillary Clinton on monday and miraculously didnt have anything on monday because donald trump jr. Said they didnt get any dirt out of that meeting. It is so stupendous living in this tube. Ahead, President Trumps mysterious claim about a mueller Conflict Of Interest and his attorney, Rudy Giuliani, Isnt Making Things much clearer. Were in a small room. What . welcome. [ gasps ] a bigger room . how many of you use Car Insurance . Oh. Well, what if i showed you this . [ laughing ] hohoho wow. Its a computer. We compare rates to help you get the price and coverage thats right for you. Thats amazing the only thing that would make this better is if my mom were here. What . an unexpected ending new laptop with 24 7 tech support. Yep, thanks guys. I think he might need some support. Yes
start them off right. With the School Supplies they need at low prices all summer long. Save 200 on this dell laptop at office depot officemax. You wouldnt accept an incomplete job from any one else. Why accept it from your Allergy Pills . Flonase sensimist relieves your worst symptoms, including nasal congestion, which most pills dont. It helps block six key inflammatory substances. Most pills block one. Flonase sensimist. Tryna find the old me you might or joints. Hing for your heart. But do you take something for your brain. With an ingredient originally discovered in jellyfish, prevagen has been shown in Clinical Trials to improve shortterm memory. Prevagen. Healthier brain. Better life. Welcome back. More than 14 months into the Special Counsel investigation, President Trump has decided to go aggressively after Robert Mueller for what he says are conflicts of interest. The president Tweeted Yesterday is Robert Mueller ever going to release his conflicts of interest with respect toPresident Trump, including the fact that we had a very nasty and contentious business relationship. I turned him down to head the fbi one day before appointment as s. C. , as in Special Counsel, and comey is his close friend. President trumps attorney, Rudy Giuliani, was asked to clarify that tweet this morning. Here is what he had to say. Hes referring to a dispute which i imagine mueller i imagine he disclosed it to rosenstein when he appointed him because it would involve something that actually wasnt settled even to this day. Whats the conflict . I cant tell you. Im not sure what the conflict is. Its one that would have kept me out of the investigation. Joining me now is chuck rosenberg. Chuck, we dont know this for sure but its believed that the conflict the president is talking about is a maybe a dispute over fees at one of the golf clubs, we think. What is Rudy Giuliani trying to
do here by saying i cant say what it is, but it would keep me out of the investigation . Katy, its odd. He says he doesnt even know what it is. He thinks he knows what it is and it would have kept him out of the investigation, which are all sort of inconsistent with one another. I can assure you this having worked for bob mueller and having been on his staff and having been around that man for quite a while. If he thought he had a Conflict Of Interest, he would step aside. The Department Of Justice regulations are incredibly clear, and bob mueller knows those regulations inside out. This is just nonsense. So say he did feel he did have a conflict and he did flag it to Rod Rosenstein. Hes still the Special Counsel. If it was a serious Conflict Of Interest, would Rod Rosenstein continue to allow him to be Special Counsel . No, sure would not. There are plenty of ethics officials at the Department Of Justice to whom you can go to seek guidance. If an issue came up and i thought it might create a conflict for me, theres a whole bunch of people i can talk to to
help think through the issue. By the way, the way most prosecutors handle this is if theres even an appearance of a Conflict Of Interest, theyll step aside. So the fact that mueller has not stepped aside tells me, a, he knows exactly what hes doing and, b, he has no concerns about a Conflict Of Interest. So bob mueller was interviewed for the fbi director. The president interviewed him, he did not choose him. Is that a Conflict Of Interest . No, absolutely not. By the way, i dispute i dont have firsthand knowledge but i have a pretty darn good guess. I dispute the president s recitation of what happened in the oval office. Remember, bob mueller had been the director of the fbi f ten years when president obama asked him to do another two. So the man had one of the hardest jobs in the country for 12 years. That he would be in the oval office begging for another tenyear term when he was in his 70s strikes me as not credible. Is it a Conflict Of Interest if he did work for president obama and president bush, as you just mentioned . Not at all. No, not at all. The mere fact that you work in an administration doesnt mean that you have a conflict because youre investigating an official in another administration. That is not a conflict. Nowhere in the Department Of Justice regulations is that suggested that that would be a conflict. This is stuff theyre just making up, katy, in order to dirty up bob mueller. Thats all it is. He also tweeted why is mueller only appointing angry dems, some of whom have worked for Crooked Hillary and others worked for obama. Why isnt mueller looking at all of the criminal activity and collusion on the democrats side, podesta, dossier . Hes saying that everybody investigating him or the people investigating him are angry democra democrats. They have gone on and they have mentioned peter strzok a number of times, lisa page, peter strzok has testified in front of the house. The president seems to be indicating that hes running his fbi when his fbi is a deep state that is working against him. Does everybody in the fbi and the Mueller Investigation need to come in and present what they think of donald trump in order for this investigation to be fair, how they personally feel about him . No, absolutely not. Look, its perfectly okay for you, me and everybody else in the entire world to have our personal views and our personal opinions, right . We all think certain things. It doesnt mean we share them with everybody and it doesnt mean that it infects or infests our work in any way. The fact that mueller has a team of folks who may have voted, who may have contributed to certain politicians is completely beside the point. As long as they can put those views aside when they have to do their work. And by the way, katy, when bob mueller found out what pete strzok had been texting, he got him off the team that day, pretty darn quickly, because he understands better than anyone how important two things are, not just that outcomes are fair but that perceptions of outcomes are fair. He has a very professional team. What they do in their private life, how they vote, to whom
they donate is their private business. They can put that aside to do their work. Rudy giuliani has visible today, lets put that mildly. We just talked about it a moment ago before the commercial break about how hes contradicting himself on air, hes denying things that so far have not been alleged, a Strategy Meeting, talking about the Russia Transaction, unclear what transaction hes talking about. It does seem that hes trying to muddy the waters to make this whole investigation very confusing, that this is a pr strategy rather than a legal strategy. Do you think the president is being well served by Rudy Giuliani . Well, katy, it depends on what the president wants. If he wants a pr strategy and not a legal strategy, i guess you could argue that mr. Giuliani is executing on that. To put it kindly, mr. Giuliani makes absolutely no sense, and as you point out, it is absolutely not a legal strategy. And by the way, katy, collusion is a crime. We just happen to call it Something Else. We call it conspiracy. But it is absolutely a crime. You know, you probably wont find the word bank heist in the criminal code, but bank robbery is a crime too, so im sort of perplexed that its come down to s synonyms. If they dont know this is a legal strategy. Lets talk about how Rudy Giuliani and the president is going after Michael Cohen saying that hes a liar, saying that he cant be trusted and is inethical. Theyre very clearly trying to undermine cohens credibility. If cohen ends up being somebody who cooperates with Robert Mueller and we dont have any indication that he is doing that or somebody that cooperates with the sdny, how does Robert Muellers team turn him into a credible witness for the prosecution . Well, first of all, prosecutors, and i was one for a long time, dont pick their
witnesses. Defendants pick their witnesses, right . I mean it sort of comes down to who did you commit the crime with and who knows about what you did and so defendants pick witnesses for the government. E the government simply puts them on the stand. And how you do this and is going on every day is my corroborating your witnesses. You introduce documents, emails, telephone calls, bank records, other witnesses who can testify to what Michael Cohen knew, saw and heard, so while a case could technically turn on one witness, the law wo