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Begin the conversation at $76.00. Or visit. Time. It'll stay that way until. At this point although we do have a. Forecast we're looking at possible repeat of yesterday afternoon which. With temperatures. With. 86 a sunny degrees feels. Like a rewriting of the rental and landlord code in some significant ways giving license and inspections more power by moving the power to. I guess refute the agency or I address the problems a way from the courts and to license that inspection itself bug free will is sponsoring a sort of he's going to be on the show in about a half an hour right now on the phone Christian well Our she lives in the city and has experienced some of these issues as she worked on you worked alongside the folks at the West End neighborhood house for a while is that right Kristen Yes I was with the left which a community based organ effort of many different organizations including the tickets location and then churches need based organization that was focused on comprehensive community development in the west side a woman can and that will. And initiative a quantised on West d.c. Sure affiliated with the about so you've been involved with the city in in this way I guess for quite a long time you heard about this I guess you went to a couple of meetings and now you've read this it looks like it's over $100.00 page document what you're concerned about. But any time you make a major change to a law it definitely was being really careful and considering all the possible. Outcomes of it and I think that this law because it had to do with outing and specifically it changes the way hold enforcement. Take place for rental properties which are more than half the city was vacant properties it has a very it's just a very significant change or a lot of residents of the city will make sure and neighborhood now where is it because I was I was going through this ordinance and oh my gosh I mean it is about 100 pages where is it if you know if you can tell me we're actually changes the. Well I guess the opportunity to challenge Ellen I or to say to Ellen I hate this is a house I own and I'm reading it out and I know we had a ticket because of the see the grass was too high or someone threw garbage all of the house and I was in there things like that and normally someone can go to the court and appeal and say look we got this whole thing changed but now it looks like what it's saying is you don't go to court Ellen I actually handles all that themselves including the appeal is that right. So the code is written so that the proposed code could be considered tonight at 5 pm there's going to be a committee hearing of the. Committee the financial economic development committee at City Hall at 800 North Front Street to talk about what's being proposed and the public can share new concerns and ideas that's 5 pm today but and the legislation can be found on the city council website under pending legislation I don't know the exact page number or what you're talking about but I think you're talking about it is that instead of. 2 that there's a code violation. Specter will give the property owner a violation and they have a certain period to fix it and generally that's 30 days in an emergency or a health and safety issue that. And then if it's not fixed then Ellen I can take that to the court and the court looks at the evidence that Herman have to present the evidence. Property on or have a chance to say their side of the story and then the court. Finds that asking for the property owner asked them. To get this code violation. And there is a system in place that that are associated with not fixing a code violation but they would have to be approved by the court on the current system. Is criminal process which means that it goes through the court process which means it doesn't go through the courts which means. To have. A don't have to have but neutral 3rd party oversight of the court instead they can it all administrative. Inspector. Violation. Of property owner that there is a violation the property. Ok picture that allowed or if they don't Ellen I can give that property owner the code violation. Find her Q $150.00 per code violation and then every week that it's not that's another violation but what it meant to do is to grab the attention of the property owner and have them think I have to take care of my property right away I can't I can't wait on this and then the appeal process that the property owner has any you know anything that they want to make an appeal bad find the l. And I. And the review board which is a group of 5 people. And they can the property owner pay the $50.00 I think and can it within 20 days and they can tell their side of the store to the element of the board and then the l. And I reviewed the make the decision about whether or not that's a justified fine for the courts or no longer providing that. It's the l. And I review that it's providing that we view that it would be kind of scary to the I would imagine hundreds and hundreds of people in in Delaware who own rental properties in the city you know when you are working with this organization on the west side I mean did you consider yourself to be an advocate of of tennis. Well I tell you instead of speaking about my past. Then. And of course all of us who live in the neighborhood we love our neighborhood we have great with great neighborhood great neighbors and there's but there are challenges there are vacant properties and there's people who don't maintain their property so I think there is broad support on the part of residents in the city that we need to get cold unfortunately. We need a code unfortunate that old property owners accountable and that make sure that there aren't property owners who abandon their property to let them get run down and have tenants living in situations that aren't good I think we all agree on that . And I think I do want to you know say that Councilman Friel has had a great job in trying to bring attention to and I really am grateful for the efforts to bring attention to this area but we need to make sure that the law is right and I think what you talked about about you know. Having the kind of check on that. And the fines are significant in a week they can add up fast and also go find they can become a 1st priority on the property which the city can then foreclose on to be. He. You know get money we want you are going to buy Listen you want to get the bad actors out there absolutely want to get the new ad actors out of there right and I don't know if this does that or not I mean what I don't know I guess I will ask but is are you are they having a problem. What would be the question of a guy having a problem collecting the fines I mean you always go to some bad actors but gosh for the most part of they having problems with this they have to go and say look we're no longer going to give anybody redress to the courts we're going to take that like you said neutral 3rd party oversight away and go right to l. And I you know by the way we have an l. And I review board but that's not as much of a neutral 3rd party oversight as the court would be so I'm wondering gosh they must really be having a problem to see that even with good owners what do you know. Well I think the public would you know that's really important information for the council and the public to know if you know what has been Ellen either experience of doing coding for cement so far that is the reason for making a change you know how many violations have they been giving Have they been giving them rental property have they been getting compliance based on those violations What's the timeframe that they can get in compliance if they haven't been getting compliance have they been taking them to court and if they have been taking them to court have they gotten compliant with the result of taking them to court or has there been problems with that and I think you know some count of that those details would be really helpful for understanding you know what is the scale of the problem and then we need to know because you know due process is kind of fundamental to you know the way the country set up right and property and due process what you process does and you know having a 3rd party oversight of the court is really a good process issue and you know and I can get your kit but the process. Your property and pool violation find is going to be it's going to be some checks and balances there. And what do profit good people and give to investors that give. It give you that confidence and how everything is going to work right like you know that there will be a chance for you to tell your side of the story you know that there will be a neutral 3rd party that will hear both sides that's what you profit. Every year and you do your homework and you tell your story and you hope for the best but with this it just doesn't feel the same does it well that you know utter utter our places have done administrative penalties and I think that and ministry of penalties and using you know removing the courts for cases where. You know you are not able to achieve your force and goals with. Role of the courts like that does happen there are there are cities that have said we can use administrative penalty more efficiently and we can uphold our code more efficiently by using this but they have also paid much more close tension to setting up systems for due process than the law currently being proposed and that like for example that review board you know another place of really bright line between the people getting the fines and the review board and oftentimes there's qualifications for the people who serve on that review board like they have to have legal control they have to be lawyers or they're you know they're situated in another department and they are. You know they have their lawyers in housing. You know there are some level of qualifications so that the people who are reviewing the case are you know are qualified to review what is potentially very significant decision I think that that is currently proposed and needs to take a look at how it can have that put some of those qualifications in place and also there have to be steps in the process I mean it's simply l. And I review board and then you know you're done according to the law that's been proposed and I think that if we want to have due process it's going to require like a. Hearing where the inspector sits down with the property owner and a violation and you know there's a chance for. For the property owner to have a dialogue with the code and look out a plan for fixing up the code violations of the boat old cold force and should be compliance you want to have a law that has that had opportunity for that property owner to get into compliance if they start locking up well that's then and that's the point right there. And I'm wondering because you have a number of people in city council who have a couple rental properties full disclosure I have a couple of rental properties I mean I've got a lot of friends we've done a lot of blood things and I believe in the city I still love the city limits and I'm actually quite supportive of the mayor and the things he's trying to do as well you see this though and and you look at this you know revenues for licensing gosh $100.00 you know per per unit and right now it's $10.00 That's a 1000 percent increase and I'm also wondering about this in and I'll ask but about this too in the bill that have dissipated the revenues about $800000.00 that's considering 20 percent compliance meaning what they're only. Bring in fees on people who are already compliant is this this 20 percent is that the usual rate I'm wondering about that and how many people they have in l n i to actually do this because I've talked with people who have rentals in the city they do a nice job keeping them up and they see it as an investment in the community not just that financial investment but also they want to see the city do well because of the city does well then they will as well and and yet they'll have something some people complain about something and they'll go fix it and they'll call elde I come out and see we fix the problem and for days and days in the week and another week and no one comes no one comes and I'm wondering if there's a problem with the number of people in l a night if they're actually able going to be able to enforce the sort of thing you know I mean well that's why you know you bring up important issues which are that you don't want people to be caught in a situation where they might be racking up fined or you know what it really kind of operational issues at l. And I and when you won your Alan I did and we did let you know residents that I've talked to it will be all over the city wanting for Ellen I focus on. Problem you know the vacant property that is causing all the problems. That property is secure make sure that not trash in the backyard and that there needs to be prioritization of of what Ellen doing and I think a plan and that of priority than they were both objectives than you know up performance measures for l. And I that would report it out to the public would give people more confidence in you know what is. How how bad l. And I allocate its recourses you know and are they putting the emphasis on the right things because the last thing that you want is for home byelection find to become. No a source of leverage new for the city that is not serving the purpose of compliant that of more plus just didn't have the opposite effect it could be deleterious if you rack up fines and say that family owns a house it was mom's house mom passed or grandma's house and they're renting it out the galleries fines go like wow now we have to pay these fines and we don't have money to fix it up I mean you could have had that problem too can you address that after that right I got to be advocate for their help to be a broader set of policy interventions to strengthen women can neighborhood you know find out one thing they should be reserved for the worst actors who want to do the right thing we need we can't be. Fining them we have to be finding ways to support them and separating out you know the way that they're treated for the people who are really doing the wrong thing and then focus and force an action on the people who are doing the wrong thing so that people who want to keep up their property want to you know invest in those properties have the confidence to do it bring their investment to the city and I also have a lot of confidence in woman you know it's a great place to live what you rent or own I think that you know there's a tremendous amount of excitement in the city right now about that with things are going but we want to get this law right we don't I mean we don't want to pass a law that introduces a lot of. His potential unintended consequences gotcha that could kind of slow down the good things that are happening here and I understand hang on for 2nd question it's Christian one hour and now she lives in the city she has worked in the city loves the city and like I'm hearing from so many other people as well really concerned about this new ordinance that will make some really big changes to tenants and landlords are owned by the way. As I'm looking at this and talking to other people who are in this business if you are a renter in Wilmington. It could raise your rents easily by about a 100 bucks. More with Richardson coming up from the Golden brothers' heating and cooling studio 117 f.m. 11 50 am. And you know an ad from dad. Here saved my own car insurance when you. Save money on car insurance really save money on car insurance when you bundle home and auto with progressive. Some pretty. Progressive can save you from becoming your parents but we can save you money when you. 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