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Against them. it's not just john bolton driving that. i think there's pretty strong agreement between bolton and mike pompeo on that, the famous 12-point speech was co-written by the two of them. >> but to what end? what i'm a little unsure of, it feels like a reflex more than a strategy. is the goal regime change, to get them back to the negotiating table? is the goal simply to inflict pain? it seems to me it's pressure without a strategy behind the pressure. >> i think there is a strategy. but i think it's fair to say that it's conflicted. the president, obviously, wants to have new negotiat...

The famous 12-point speech was co-written by the two of them. >> but to what end? it feels almost like a reflex more than a strategy. is the goal regime change? is the goal to get them back to the negotiating table? >> i think there is a strategy but i think it's fair to say that it's conflicted. the president obviously wants to have new negotiations. i think it's fair to say that john botten believes that would be a mistake. i think pompeo probably is more in the direction of john bolton, that he doesn't really believe that diplomacy is going to work with the lislamic republic but e is the se...