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He's not involve the special counsel cases but he is here with me tonight jessi i'm glad to see you thank you. i'm sure you've been asked a great deal but what the other lawyers are saying about the defenses. i don't question on the trial team but you know these cases quite well. there was one from one of your colleagues who made the comment that look pin his comments regarding vice president pence the word he used was aspirational. listen to this. >> what president trump did not do is direct vice president pence to do anything he asked him in an aspirational, way asking is covered by the firs...

So i'm giving you that look it doesn't really look like i put this person to make me look good. first of all i think it's important to say what he said that and that's when his lawyers came and talked him about. >> as the vice president said the lawyers came and asked him to do that everything vice president trump did it was under the advice of counsel and talking about the 12th amendment actually requires something that is up to legal debate and has been something that has been debated legally for over 125 years almost 150 years. so there are certainly questions about the 12th amendment and i...

More than the assembly clause. the first amendment has the petition for -- . and so in this case that means you can always ask a government act or to do something. that is something that is a key amendment right. it's not just mentioned in the first -- it goes right to the heart of what the founders were looking at when they decided to set up a constitution and our first amendment rights so doesn't matter if you're the president of the united states you can always ask government officials to do x or y. >> exactly right there is a grievances portion of it on us as you really can consult you can...

From him if you could share? >> i think it is important? his assertion that he has protection under the speech or debate clause is pretty weird. the constitution does provide that the vice president serves as the president of the senate. of course the 12th amendment has the president of the senate opening the office of the show than be counted. even if you assume serving as president of the senate somehow makes him a legislative branch officer, which i think is quite a stretch, opening the avalos and reading the results is not a legislative act. this ploy is not going to work in my judgment. h...

I am? i know your ball trained in the law? >> this is wrong headed at many levels. first, geologist stand up and tell the truth and not try to evade the. it looks very bad. number two, this is unprecedented. i don't think there's any case on this, but it's not that hard to decide that speech or debate does not apply in this case. all you need to do is look at article one section three, article one section six and the 12th amendment. basically those sections say the vice president's president of the senate, that the 12th amendment says the vice president shall open the envelopes and the votes s...