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Opposed to cardiac activity. but allowing people to sue and therefore enforce the law as kind of like a civil arrest kind of situation, what do you make of that? >> it's -- it's supposed to be the chilling effect, right? it's supposed to be the harassment. the cruelty is the point. the point is to stop us from doing the work, harass us to no end so that we can't do the work, that we can't fight because we don't have the dollars to do it anymore, that we're tired, that we get exhausted. that's the point of this law. the point is to continue to bully and harass until we won't do anything anymore...

Takes them there, someone who pays for the gas, someone who helps with travel, the person or the clinic that does the procedure. my next guest works with an organization that does just that. anna ripani is her name. she's the co-executive director of fund texas choice. they keep using the word, anna -- and thank you for joining us -- "pernicious," that this law was drafted in a pernicious fashion, meaning sneaky harmful. do you agree? >> yeah. i mean i will say it was sneaky, but i think if you were following the texas legislature earlier this year, we all knew it was coming. we were all fight...