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For charity because they think god's going to take care of it. >> the data on this is very clear. religious people do give more money to charity. conservatives versus liberals give more money to charity. >> a lot of that is going to churches. >> i want to believe that but in fact religious people give more money than secular people do to secular charities. >> that's true. >> jamie with a conversion. >> one of the things that atheists are, and i believe truly is a value of atheism is honesty. i'm not going to sit here and pretend -- by the way, secular conservatives are much more stingy than se...