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Secret, confidential interviews, binding witnesses and their counsel, to silence, while the members walk outside to all of you, the media, and the public, and selectively leak from those interviews to tell you what they want you to hear. >> martha: thus glenn simpson's attorney version of this. >> glenn simpson took the fifth today. you take the fifth if you believe you have some kind of criminal liability. that's the only reason you take the fifth. i think that's why he did that, because of he's doing it just to obstruct a congressional investigation, that's wrong, is also. i think he did it ...

Inside the legal system? >> it really doesn't help the president. and although i'm sure giuliani thought he had a strategy last night when he went on television, it's real hard to discern today what that strategy was and how it helped the president. giuliani seems to play the role of almost comfort food. i guess he's the attorney version of comfort food for the president here. someone who is consistent with how the president likes to babe, someone who is consistent with his style. but who isn't doing a lot to help his defense here. >> what about the initial thing of trying to get him off the c...