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Is that how this was being used? >> well, i would not define this as a back channel. a back channel is something that governments do for below the radar conversation so that you can get some things accomplished that might be more difficult to accomplish should the channel be exposed, be made public. anderson, i flew into islamabad to confer with the president. we went in secretly. we left secretly. president bush wanted us to share a certain message. this is what governments do. that's fine. you have good people in the administration, secretary kelly, secretary mattis, h.r. mcmaster, defending...

Accomplish should the channel be exposed, be made public. anderson, i flew into islamabad with mike mcconnell, the director of national intelligence, after benazir bhutto was killed to conifer with president musharraf. we went in there secretly. we met secretly. we left secretly. president bush wanted us to share a certain message with president musharraf. i mean, this is what governments do. that's fine. and you've got good people in the administration, secretary kelly, secretary mattis, h.r. mcmaster, defending the principle of back channels. i agree. but i don't think that's exactly what th...