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You used that analogy so that i didn't have to. >> i'm not saying it's true, i'm asking. >> i would not resist that analogy. giuliani is beclowning himself day after day, week after week, and it's actually sad because he is somebody with a serious history of public service. and including, by the way, a history as a u.s. attorney that is nothing to sneeze at and as associate attorney general, you know, i would not have expected him to be playing this role at this time. on the other hand, you know, he's doing what he's doing and he's making an idiot of himself. >> guy lewis and ben witis, gentle...

He has a whole range of witnesses. for example, if you're mueller right now, you want to talk to reince priebus, you want to talk to everybody who was in the room asked to leave so he could talk to comey alone and you want to ask, well, were you there? did he in fact ask you to leave and what did he tell you after about that conversation? >> eric, how do you prove this case? not prove this case, how do you look for the facts? >> well, i think you start at the bottom and you work your way up. you've got people who in addition to the ones who adam mentioned, you've got the people who jim comey a...

That gives me a problem. if russia or china or any other country has those e-mails, to be honest with you, i would love to see them. >> the question remains what this news will mean for monday's scheduled summit in helsinki between president trump and vladimir putin. it puts added pressure on the president to confront the russian leader over his role in the interference of the presidential campaign. joining me now, ken delanian, nbc legal correspondent and host of "the beat," ari melber, ben witis, legal analyst and editor in chief at law fair and from brookings institution and chuck rosenberg...