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I'l ally. its topsy-turvy. he throws him under the bus. the putin relationship is interesting to watch. it's like there's something about putin that he likes. maybe it's his personality or the air around putin, not so much his governing or the russian meddling. but it's something with putin as a man. >> something he likes. i saw your eyebrow go up. >> i'm wondering if we would see helsinki 2. what i saw when he stood up and said putin strongly denies interfering in the u.s. elections, i don't see why it would be russia. i pulled out my federal code book. i checked the elements of a crime calle...

Rudy guiliani, by the president's legal team and said over and over and over again. the president seems to delight in the brilliant simplicity of that term. help us understand that debate here. over collusion. the way this is being framed by the president and his legal team. >> well, i think what the president is trying to do is bam boozel the american people. and he can't fool all of the people all of the time. the word collusion -- what they're trying to say is the word collusion is not a crime. it's true that that's not a crime. but collusion means, basically, to work with another person to...

Contrary, i can see him being concerned. >> they report the president latched on to his attorney rudy giuliani's talking point that collusion is not a crime and tweeted that earlier this week. is that a smart legal move by president trump and his team? >> that's a hodgepodge. everybody's gotten it right. collusion is not in the code book as a federal crime. collusion is an anti-trump term. it is irrelevant. if conduct amounts to, they are purely hypotheticals, payments, bribery, lying to investigators, then it will be the appropriate label and you have heard people throw the term conspiracy ar...

>> sure. >> and you see there, i was doing a preelection mission, and you see the heavy hand of russia always in the background. i mean, they're not playing in this election as much as they have in past ones. but the kinds of things that we're seeing today, the fake news, the influence that they're peddling, the fear mongering that they're doing, it's very reminiscent of what we see happening in this country, and it's very, very disturbing if you care about the united states of america. >> you're a former republican, elected official. >> i am. >> the party has long touted itself on national se...

You had an indiscretion is. >> the point is, you have to differentiate thing that you disagree with, you think it's unseemly very susa crime. the point is, the parent company of the inquirer paid mrs. mcdougal money for her story. okay? the president's team was going to purchase the story. that's not a crime. sounds like i'm being political. it's not a crime. >> trish: let's go to the russian lawyer then. >> yes. >> trish: junior took a meeting with the russian lawyer. is this a crime? there's many, by the way, that say total collusion. this is the smoking gun we're looking for. they have this...