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Emphasis that francis is putting on this could help barack obama. >> yes, sometimes i think catholics fight more fiercely with each other than they fight with anyone else, but kate, first of all, is right that when you look at pope francis, it's very much about both the personal and the political. he brings the two together, and i think you're seeing a francis effect even on conservative catholics. now, those of us who are more progressive look at what some of the conservative republicans are proposing and say this doesn't go far enough, this isn't the kind of change we need. however, it's ver...

The plane back from brazil? unlike other popes, he'smedia. >> even though we're not hearing spivly the name rush come out of his name, we know who he's responding to. do you think he should be responding? do you think it diminishes his stature? >> i don't, because i think what people like about him is his willingness to respond. rush isn't the only one who has said similar things, by the way. if he's going to critique global capitalism, which he has, and he says it's not equitable, people say, what do you believe? he has a responsibility then to say what he believes, and he's saying it. >> it'...

Almost as if these people who are resisting this type of family are saying, you're stuffing it down our throats. even though it's already always been here. >> i want to -- i have a full screen of something that was said about gay marriage and i was talking about with e.j. dionne saying i think maybe we've been out-marketed sometimes. we have been caricatured about being anti-gay. if the pope and the cardinals and the catholic church are, you know, taking some steps back from trying to be seen as not being seen as so anti-gay, the gop, who they got left to vote for them? there's nobody left. >>...

To do and what a pope ought to do, i think. >> e.j. two more points to get in with you. one is the gop. right? because, you know, paul ryan considers himself, you know, a good catholic. we are, you know, awaiting, you know, this budget process, december 15th. i do not believe that it is going to be consistent with the kind of theory that the pope is talking about. and yet, you know, on the right over and over again they use the bible, they sort of throw it at democrats. they throw it out to justify a lot of things and for once i feel like here we have the pope actually backing up what we have ...

So you're quite right and it is not anti-capitalist as such to believe that working people should be compensated adequately for the work they do. >> right. >> i should say, you know, conservative catholics have been saying if you look at the document, the pope does reaffirm the church's opposition to abortion and he does and what's interesting is he also leaks that back to the need for economic justice. and i think what you're seeing here is not a change in the church's position on abortion. but a return to the priorities of the church, say, of 20 or 30 years ago where abortion was part of wha...