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Promises and pledges and no matter how heartfelt and absolutely emphatic and pounding the table he was. they all of a sudden don't seem so important a little later when the key audience has changed and there's no someone in his ear, someone saying you need to keep your word on this. >> i think i have a slightly more cynical theory. i think any liberal or left wing candidate running pore president of the united states in the center right country, inherently is forced into making statements and representations he's not going to follow through on if he's true to his core convictions. >> absolutel...

Engage you. and i think that obama was so convinced that he could push washington into a better era that he did not think he should engage the debate in the kind of hard-edged and sharp and even ideological way, for example, that ronald reagan did in his very difficult first year and to his own benefit. >> it's interesting you brought that up. i was very struck in reading the article last night when the magazine came out you make comparison to the reagan year, which i covered back in those days. >> right. >> you say he had core convictions and somehow president obama has not communicated his c...

President. >> who is mike pence? i don't know. he doesn't seem to have core convictions or beliefs beyond whatever donald trump decided they are. >> he'sth striking this balance, trying to be the man that will inherent the mantle of trump. >> there are two kinds of vice presidents, those accused of being so out for themselves and nursing their own ambitions, they are not serving the president who picked them and those accused of being loyal lap dogs. mike pence decided to be the latter. >> he is a titanic. i mean, titanic fraud. he is the most of all of trump's cultists in the cabinet. we have...

The biggest, devils in the details. not holding their breath and organizing. the fact these young d.r.e.a.m.ers with a week after dacaresircinded and able to mobilize. walk over to 1600 pennsylvania wab this, talks how impactful it is not just for democrats but the republican side. >> the current then -- donald trump's base sees that happening. see he's responsive to the activism of the same people that barack obama was responsive to. that's got to enrage them. >> again, for them -- there's no going back. the difference between donald trump and his supporters and base is that they are absolute...

The other piece of it is he wants to maintain some flexibility. he actually prides himself in not being an ideological purist and on this issue of nafta, it's the one piece where he's had core convictions for like decades. he's been against these trade deals and yet he changed his mind this week because he was influenced by some of his cabinet officers and by his counterparts in canada and mexico. i think in his mind, he's buying himself a little bit more time here to continue the negotiations, and he feels like he has leverage with canada and with mexico. but it certainly is a shift in his po...